UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => bouldering => Topic started by: fatneck on July 15, 2015, 06:39:07 am
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So off the back of the route climbing thread I thought it would be good to have a bouldering one. Five year cut off?
Off the top of my head (and I've been awake for an hour already and am really fully unqualified to do this);
Madams
Jonny Argue
CJD?
Doyle?
Danny Cattel?
James Squire
Ellis Barker-Butler
Rich Hession
Ben Freeman
Dave Mason
Ty Landman?
Alex Barrows
Liam Fyffe?
Ned
Ste Watson
Dan Varian
Pete Robins
Dave MacLeod
There must be loads of others...
Also, I feel I should set up a women's thread but what grade should this start at?
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Hamish Potokar
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Tom Newman (loads)
Dan varian (loads)
Ned (loads)
James noble (fat lip, Louis A, serenity?, prob more)
Ethan walker (belly of the beast, dandelion mind)
Dan Turner (loads)
Dave jones (loads)
Tom Williams (loads)
Elliot Stephens (riverbed)
Mike hart (riverbed)
Hamish Potaker (voyager)
Dan knight (mooiste maise)
Alex gorham (riverbed, mooiste maise)
Mark Katz (high fidelity, rhythm + others?)
Pete robins (Isles of wonder)
Jordan buys (high fidelity)
That's off the top of me 'ed
+ Micky page (loads)
Dom (ropes of Maui)
Ollie ground fall (ropes of Maui)
James Thornton (the ace)
Liam desroy (prob done a couple within the cut off)
Ryan Pasquale (likewise)
Nathan Phillips (slashface)
Keith Bradbury (several)
Prob best to tidy it up into top ascent: 8C / 8B+ / 8B
Looks like 8B is the new 7C+/8A :weakbench:
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PEDANTRY ALERT.
The title actually says UK men who have climbed less than or equal to 8B recently.
Would be a long list
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Here was me thinking that at last there was a UKB list I could be included on.
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ME!! \o/
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I never paid much attention at maths but thought the same. Does that mean my maximum 6C this year that I'm way out in front of everyone compared to the threshold?
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Some Obvious ones:
8B+/C wads
Dave Macleod: new base line, mystic stylez
Malc: that 8B+ at dumby
Simon newstead: the island
Dave barrans (gecko assis)
More 8Bers:
Tom Peckitt (patina turner + others)
Paul carruthers (working class ss)
Phil rose (keen roof)
Tom newberry (keen roof)
Nodder: (keen roof, wrestling with an alligator)
Tim Palmer: keen roof, dandelion mind? (8B+?)
Wiz fineron (the vice, one Summer in paradise, riverbed)
Joe Wilson (bloodsport LH)
Bransby: bonatrocity?
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Polish Dave - Serendipity 8B+
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Would be a long list
But so far probably correct.
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PEDANTRY ALERT.
The title actually says UK men who have climbed less than or equal to 8B recently.
Would be a long list
:-[
I failed maths GCSE twice and it was early... Could a mod modify please?
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Ha - I'd have been top if this list. Can't we leave as is?
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Alex Barrows
Much to my disappointment, I'm not on the list unless we're counting long boulder/route hybrids of >40 moves.
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PEDANTRY ALERT.
The title actually says UK men who have climbed less than or equal to 8B recently.
Would be a long list
:-[
I failed maths GCSE twice and it was early... Could a mod modify please?
Done ;D
Sorry Kelvin
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I think Beastly Squirrel got a mention on the significant repeats thread on a Swiss 8B?
Edit - here it is, from Duma in the Effort Youth thread:
James Squire (beastly squirrel on here) is in magic and did his first 8B, Riders On The Storm today.
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I think Beastly Squirrel got a mention on the significant repeats thread on a Swiss 8B?
James Squire
;D
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only including one example
8B+/8C
dave macleod (new base line)
dan varian (the rail)
ned feehally (jour de chasse)
simon newstead (the island)
dave barrans (gecko assis)
micky page (from the dirt grows the flowers)
8B/+
(dandelion mind is a problematic one for this)
dan turner (dandelion mind)
tim palmer (dandelion mind)
dave jones (dandelion mind)
ethan walker (dandelion mind)
ben freeman (dandelion mind)
Dan knight (mooiste meisie)
Alex gorham (mooiste maise)
dave mason (king of limbs)
8B
Tom Peckitt (patina turner)
Paul carruthers (working class ss)
Phil rose (keen roof)
Tom newberry (keen roof)
Nodder: (keen roof)
Wiz fineron (the vice)
Joe Wilson (bloodsport LH)
Bransby: (bonatrocity?)
ellis butler-barker (fatman)
Elliot Stephens (riverbed)
Mike hart (riverbed)
Hamish Potaker (voyager)
michael bleazard (steppenwolf)
james squire (riders on the storm)
Tom Newman (voyager)
Pete robins (Isles of wonder)
Jordan buys (high fidelity)
jonny argue (fat lip)
james noble (fat lip)
tom williams (ropes of maui)
Dom (ropes of Maui)
Ollie ground fall (ropes of Maui)
James Thornton (the ace)
Nathan Phillips (slashface)
Ty landman (smiling buttress, surely more??)
Mark Katz (high fidelity)
keith bradbury (annagamma)
???
malcolm smith (has he done anything in the time frame?)
mark mcquade (not sure if he did sanction after 2010)
Liam desroy (prob done a couple within the cut off)
Ryan Pasquale (likewise)
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Tyler Landman did a couple of 8B+s last year .
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I thought Malc did some link-ups at Dumby recently but can't find any info on it!
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I haven't done (or tried) dandelion mind
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Tyler Landman did a couple of 8B+s last year .
namely?
I thought Malc did some link-ups at Dumby recently but can't find any info on it!
ah yeah thought they were older but firefight was 2010
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Can't remember the names, in Colorado. Mirror Reality rings a bell.
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Danny Cattell did Le Dernier Atrocite in Parisellas although he didn't think it was 8B.
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Nigel Callender - Monk Life?
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Rob Sutton: has done one of the 8Bs at Dumby.
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Did Will do any 8Bs prior to becoming a fisherman?
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Don't think he did but would love to be wrong...
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Afraid not, close but no cigar :'(
My problem at Dumby could well be 8B, but that was 6 years ago. Still needs a repeat.
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James Squire's (very) recently done Riverbed too.
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Ryan did eight ball, think that's still considered 8b to anyone with sense. Only dragging bransby seemed to find it 2a!
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James Squire's (very) recently done Riverbed too.
Synchronised posting...
You must be on the ball, he only posted it 30mins ago.
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So..
8B+/8C
Dave Macleod (new base line)
Dan Varian (the rail)
Ned Feehally (jour de chasse)
Simon Newstead (the island)
Dave Barrans (gecko assis)
Mike Adams (serenata)
Micky Page (from the dirt grows the flowers)
8B/+
(dandelion mind is a problematic one for this)
Dan Turner (dandelion mind)
Dave Jones (dandelion mind)
Ethan Walker (dandelion mind)
Ben Freeman (dandelion mind)
Dan Knight (mooiste meisie)
Alex Gorham (mooiste maise)
Dave Mason (king of limbs)
Nige Callander (monks life)
8B
Rich Hession (louis armstrong)
Tom Peckitt (patina turner)
Paul Carruthers (working class ss)
Phil Rose (keen roof)
Tom Newberry (keen roof)
Dave Noden (keen roof)
Wiz Fineron (the vice)
Joe Wilson (bloodsport LH)
Ben Bransby (bonatrocity?)
Ellis Butler-Barker (fatman)
Elliot Stephens (riverbed)
Mike Hart (riverbed)
Hamish Potaker (voyager)
Michael Bleazard (steppenwolf)
James Squire (riders on the storm)
Tom Newman (voyager)
Pete Robins (Isles of wonder)
Jordan Buys (high fidelity)
Jonny Argue (fat lip)
James Noble (fat lip)
Tom Williams (ropes of maui)
Dom (ropes of Maui)
Oli Grounsell (ropes of maui)
James Thornton (the ace)
Nathan Phillips (slashface)
Ty Landman (smiling buttress, surely more??)
Mark Katz (high fidelity)
Keith Bradbury (annagamma)
Rob Sutton (Dumby Prob?)
Ryan Pasquill (8 Ball)
Danny Cattell (Le Dernier Atrocite)
???
Malcolm Smith (has he done anything in the time frame?)
Mark McQuade (not sure if he did sanction after 2010)
Liam Desroy (prob done a couple within the cut off)
I haven't done (or tried) dandelion mind
Tim, pretty sure you should be on the list though?
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Alex Barrows
Much to my disappointment, I'm not on the list unless we're counting long boulder/route hybrids of >40 moves.
But if it doesn't fit on the routes list, and it doesn't fit in the bouldering list...perhaps we need 'UK Men who've recently climbed 8B/8b on long boulder problems that aren't really boulder problems but where you don't have to tie in either, kneebars allowed'.
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It's such a shame that some people, who previously had shown some prowess at bouldering, have faded away into obscurity as they've got older. People like Ben Moon. I mean, whatever happened to him?
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I did mandala ss a couple of years ago but I am not really sure what the grade is, probably 8b
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OK - some discussion about where the cutoff for this list should be.
I think it should be based on a percentile of the distribution of how hard ALL people climb. If we use the survey from last year:
http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=25325.0
We can see that 2.4% of people climbed 8B+ or higher, and 3% 8B or higher... If you want to catch the top 5% then its going to be in the 8A+ or higher range.
All this comes down to what percentile (or percentage of us all) do you think is a top or elite (maybe?) climber?? I'd suggest 5% is a reasonable figure - if you want the top 1% then its 8C... (of course the survey is 'global' not just UK but not sure if that really matters..).
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James nobble up to 8b+ for dandilion mind
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I wouldn't be on the list even if i had managed working class ss, back when i was close to doing it, since it only adds one (or two if you're taller) easy move(s) to the stand start. the only recent 8b reference to this problem is in that video of Nick's where shaggy does it
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re: ellis butler-barker (fatman)
I thought Fatman was unclimbable in its current state?
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It is.
Where's cheekbones? He's done half the 8b's on the list. Actually didn't notice shaggy on list, supermans considered 8b now isn't it?
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People like Ben Moon. I mean, whatever happened to him?
He went back to climbing 9a.
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I did mandala ss a couple of years ago but I am not really sure what the grade is, probably 8b
Megos gave it 8B+... (http://www.rockandice.com/lates-news/alex-megos-sends-mandala-sit-start-v13)
:strongbench:
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Hocking?
My spies tell me that Super Yum Yum is probably 8B
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Ed hamer (Louis Armstrong, keen roof)
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Tim Clifford?
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Sam Davenhall. At the heart of it all/kaizen, maybe others as well however he doesn't seem to publicise what he has done.
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James thornton - the ace
dom bridgewood - ropes of maui
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8Ball 8a+ shirley
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List update...
8B+/8C
Dave Macleod (new base line)
Dan Varian (the rail)
Ned Feehally (jour de chasse)
Simon Newstead (the island)
Dave Barrans (gecko assis)
Mike Adams (serenata)
Micky Page (from the dirt grows the flowers)
Sam Davenhall (at the heart of it all)
8B/+
Dan Turner (dandelion mind)
Dave Jones (dandelion mind)
Ethan Walker (dandelion mind)
Ben Freeman (dandelion mind)
Dan Knight (mooiste meisie)
Alex Gorham (mooiste maise)
Dave Mason (king of limbs)
Nige Callander (monks life)
Tim Palmer (Mandala ss)
Tim Clifford (The Room Project ((possibly 8b+?)) but also Mandala ss)
8B
Rich Hession (louis armstrong)
Tom Peckitt (patina turner)
Paul Carruthers (working class ss)
Phil Rose (keen roof)
Tom Newberry (keen roof)
Dave Noden (keen roof)
Wiz Fineron (the vice)
Joe Wilson (bloodsport LH)
Ben Bransby (bonatrocity?)
Ellis Butler-Barker (fatman)
Elliot Stephens (riverbed)
Mike Hart (riverbed)
Hamish Potaker (voyager)
Michael Bleazard (steppenwolf)
James Squire (riders on the storm)
Tom Newman (voyager)
Pete Robins (Isles of wonder)
Jordan Buys (high fidelity)
Jonny Argue (fat lip)
James Noble (fat lip)
Tom Williams (ropes of maui)
Dom Bridgewood(ropes of Maui)
Oli Grounsell (ropes of maui)
James Thornton (the ace)
Nathan Phillips (slashface)
Ty Landman (smiling buttress, surely more??)
Mark Katz (high fidelity)
Keith Bradbury (annagamma)
Rob Sutton (Dumby Prob?)
Ryan Pasquill (8 Ball)
Danny Cattell (Le Dernier Atrocite)
James Thornton (The Ace)
Martin Smith (Superman)
Ed Hamer (Louis Armstrong)
Malcolm Smith (Firefight)
???
Mark McQuade (not sure if he did sanction after 2010)
Adam Hocking (can't find anything apart from what tc said about it being 8b so not sure whether to include)
Also, Dense, who is cheekbones and have you got an example problem please?
Has Ding Dong done any 8bs in the last 5 years?
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Malcolm Smith (has he done anything in the time frame?)
Thought we'd decided Firefight 8B was 2010, therefore in?
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Ding Dong and Desroy haven't in the last 5 years AFAIK.
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Cheers, modified...
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Malcolm Smith (has he done anything in the time frame?)
Thought we'd decided Firefight 8B was 2010, therefore in?
It was in April 2010 - He did Grande Tour (hard 8B) about half an hour before Firefight. Pretty productive afternoon at the Rock
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Beast!
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is the room project the thing in Squamish?
If so was that not done closer to ten years ago?
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yeah, The Room Project = The Singularity.
Done 2007 just after Tim moved to Squamish.
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And still unrepeated...
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If only there were some software available that allowed a web-page editable by anyone to be created and updated as required for these lists to save reposting a growing list repeatedly.
I've set up the structure and started filling in from the different threads (got work to do so don't have time to do it all now)
UK Cream of the Crop (http://ukbouldering.com/wiki/index.php/UK_Cream_of_the_Crop#Bouldering)
Anyone bothered with copying the rest over and/or updating might find the information on spanning rows in Wikimedia mark-up (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Table#Combined_use_of_COLSPAN_and_ROWSPAN) useful, because without using rowspan for the cells in the grade column its tricky to start a new line within a tables cell for multiple entries within a grade.
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Cheekbones is monkey boy
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Are you nickname dropping now dense?
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I can't catch a break, you guys are all over it ;D
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Ben West - Mooiste Meisie 8B
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Thanks Slackers! Have edited to include cheekbones and Ben West but for some reason I've ballsed up the table! Can't make it work - code punter...
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I think 8 Ball is considered more 8A+ than 8B now but I haven't done it.
James Noble needs to be in the DM club although he thought it was 8B.
Mooiste Meisie is definitely not 8B/+ more like 8A+/B if your tall and all the ascentionists you have down are tall. Keep them in the 8B list but not the slash list.
Polish Dave needs to be on the list too. Not sure what he has done but definitely some 8B's.
Tom Newberry has done Serenity which is 8B.
On the women's list Sarah SS is considered 8A I think and everyone takes 8A for Chablanke. It got a silly slash grade in the guide but not sure why. It's a tough 8A but one of the few problems that is easier for the short.
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yeah, The Room Project = The Singularity.
Done 2007 just after Tim moved to Squamish.
Yorkshire dark horse moves to Canada and inflicts more dark horseyness on the Canadians - always loved this story. But is there any footage? (sorry)
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Not to my knowledge, however everyone I know or know of that's climbed with or seen Tim climb has all said the same thing. Same with the other dark horse Matt. Just a pair of monsters prowling around doing most things they set their minds to, normally very easily and with excellent style.
These are not to be confused with wannabes.
I've seen Matt climb a few times, one of the most impressive people I've seen. Great to watch. Never seen Tim climb.
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Polish Dave needs to be on the list too. Not sure what he has done but definitely some 8B's.
Serendipity, 8B+ and several 8Bs at home and abroad.
Ryan did Cypher in 2011, nevermind 8 Ball. http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=60695
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Polish Dave needs to be on the list too. Not sure what he has done but definitely some 8B's.
Serendipity, 8B+ and several 8Bs at home and abroad.
Ryan did Cypher in 2011, nevermind 8 Ball. http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=60695
Oh yeah I forgot about Cypher. I was thinking Spectre but that was ages ago.
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I'd say Farrar as well, the bed of procrustes is 8B. Never mind it's only had one repeat from carlisle slapper and got downgraded when they used to downgrade everything
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Not to my knowledge, however everyone I know or know of that's climbed with or seen Tim climb has all said the same thing. Same with the other dark horse Matt. Just a pair of monsters prowling around doing most things they set their minds to, normally very easily and with excellent style.
These are not to be confused with wannabes.
I've seen Matt climb a few times, one of the most impressive people I've seen. Great to watch. Never seen Tim climb.
I was only being flippant, don't think anyone doubts the ascent. I'd love to know a liat of those that have tried it and failed. Lived in Leeds for a while and heard nothing but good things about both of them. Generally talked about in hushed tones with raised eyebrows! I guess their lack of publicity seeking says a lot.
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I didn't think you were being serious shurt, I wrote that since ukb gets a lot of traffic and I doubt most of the younger peeps coming through would have heard of either of them really. This is the downside of asking for video or other proof of people that are widely doubted etc, to some people it then becomes a blanket statement that everyone needs it. Like our friend has shown talking about people doubting V3's. Someone explain that grade to jasper when he gets back off his hols. More breaks than kit Kat that guy!
Anyway roll on another significant repeat!
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Polish Dave needs to be on the list too. Not sure what he has done but definitely some 8B's.
Serendipity, 8B+ and several 8Bs at home and abroad.
Ryan did Cypher in 2011, nevermind 8 Ball. http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=60695
Oh yeah I forgot about Cypher. I was thinking Spectre but that was ages ago.
he's done The Ace too.
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"Yorkshire dark horse moves to Canada and inflicts more dark horseyness on the Canadians - always loved this story. But is there any footage? (sorry)"
Not very dark horse really. He's just an older generation, so the new kids on the block never saw him climb.
He very rarely climbed alone. Has footage of quite a lot of hard problems. I've personally witnessed him climbing vast amounts of extremely hard stuff in the UK. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in Font or Switzerland was done with the likes of Randy Puro and various other well known people. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in the US has been in front of hoards of americans (as tends to be the way in places like Bishop).
The Singularity wasn't climbed alone - it was in front of one of the locals. He wasn't even remotely a dark horse in Canada - he was pretty much running a climbing clothing company, so got to know most of the locals pretty quickly.
No video, but plenty of pictures. e.g:
http://house-under-a-rock.tumblr.com/post/65102109201/tim-clifford-fa-on-the-unrepeated-singularity-v14
The reason it's unrepeated is because it's frickin hard. And almost certainly harder than the vast majority of 8C's out there. As I understand it, the likes of Paul Robinson have sunk quite a bit of time into it without success.
Basically he's a wad. And probably the most honest rock climber I've ever climbed with. To the extent that the tinyest dab on a spotter, where anyone else would just take it - Tim would be back around doing it again...
In fact he ended up doing lots of problems twice - he had a nasty habit of losing concentration and dropping the very last move on lots of really hard problems - I pretty much guarantee that noone else has fallen off 8 ball at the point he did. He slipped off on the 2a move with both hands matched on the ledge at the end!!! 5 minutes having a quick word with himself and then did the whole problem again, this time without the punter fall at the end.
The more amusing Clifford story isn't The Singularity anyway. It's Dipende in Switzerland. Tim was told by locals it was a project - did it and gave it 8A+. Turned out Fred Nicole had done it a while earlier and completely unknown to Tim given it 8C!!! Not sure how that went down...
Anyways, I'm sure The Singularity will get a repeat some time in the not too distant future - it sounds like it's hard, but not silly hard. And there's a sit to it and a project to the left which both sound amazing, so plenty for uber wads to go visiting for.
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Never seen that photo before. Nice one!
Does Tim have any interest in the sitter?
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He did have - think he spied and tried loads of pretty amazing looking projects when he first got out there... He's now getting on a bit though with two kids so dunno... Think cross country skiing is now the sport of choice, living that close to Whistler etc....
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"Yorkshire dark horse moves to Canada and inflicts more dark horseyness on the Canadians - always loved this story. But is there any footage? (sorry)"
Not very dark horse really. He's just an older generation, so the new kids on the block never saw him climb.
He very rarely climbed alone. Has footage of quite a lot of hard problems. I've personally witnessed him climbing vast amounts of extremely hard stuff in the UK. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in Font or Switzerland was done with the likes of Randy Puro and various other well known people. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in the US has been in front of hoards of americans (as tends to be the way in places like Bishop).
The Singularity wasn't climbed alone - it was in front of one of the locals. He wasn't even remotely a dark horse in Canada - he was pretty much running a climbing clothing company, so got to know most of the locals pretty quickly.
No video, but plenty of pictures. e.g:
http://house-under-a-rock.tumblr.com/post/65102109201/tim-clifford-fa-on-the-unrepeated-singularity-v14
The reason it's unrepeated is because it's frickin hard. And almost certainly harder than the vast majority of 8C's out there. As I understand it, the likes of Paul Robinson have sunk quite a bit of time into it without success.
Basically he's a wad. And probably the most honest rock climber I've ever climbed with. To the extent that the tinyest dab on a spotter, where anyone else would just take it - Tim would be back around doing it again...
In fact he ended up doing lots of problems twice - he had a nasty habit of losing concentration and dropping the very last move on lots of really hard problems - I pretty much guarantee that noone else has fallen off 8 ball at the point he did. He slipped off on the 2a move with both hands matched on the ledge at the end!!! 5 minutes having a quick word with himself and then did the whole problem again, this time without the punter fall at the end.
The more amusing Clifford story isn't The Singularity anyway. It's Dipende in Switzerland. Tim was told by locals it was a project - did it and gave it 8A+. Turned out Fred Nicole had done it a while earlier and completely unknown to Tim given it 8C!!! Not sure how that went down...
Anyways, I'm sure The Singularity will get a repeat some time in the not too distant future - it sounds like it's hard, but not silly hard. And there's a sit to it and a project to the left which both sound amazing, so plenty for uber wads to go visiting for.
Hey, it was an off hand comment (maybe ill advised) but thought there was humour in these hills... For the record I was not requesting footage or casting any doubt.
I have nothing but admiration for Tim (thought my comments about life in Leeds were testament to that) and was really pleased to hear about The Singularity when it was done. Im a fan of dark horses in general; people climbing hard and not seeking sponsorship etc.
I was really interested to read your thoughts and info about Tim, the ascent and other people who had tried it so nice one for that.
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"Yorkshire dark horse moves to Canada and inflicts more dark horseyness on the Canadians - always loved this story. But is there any footage? (sorry)"
Not very dark horse really. He's just an older generation, so the new kids on the block never saw him climb.
He very rarely climbed alone. Has footage of quite a lot of hard problems. I've personally witnessed him climbing vast amounts of extremely hard stuff in the UK. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in Font or Switzerland was done with the likes of Randy Puro and various other well known people. A lot of the hard stuff he's done in the US has been in front of hoards of americans (as tends to be the way in places like Bishop).
The Singularity wasn't climbed alone - it was in front of one of the locals. He wasn't even remotely a dark horse in Canada - he was pretty much running a climbing clothing company, so got to know most of the locals pretty quickly.
No video, but plenty of pictures. e.g:
http://house-under-a-rock.tumblr.com/post/65102109201/tim-clifford-fa-on-the-unrepeated-singularity-v14
The reason it's unrepeated is because it's frickin hard. And almost certainly harder than the vast majority of 8C's out there. As I understand it, the likes of Paul Robinson have sunk quite a bit of time into it without success.
Basically he's a wad. And probably the most honest rock climber I've ever climbed with. To the extent that the tinyest dab on a spotter, where anyone else would just take it - Tim would be back around doing it again...
In fact he ended up doing lots of problems twice - he had a nasty habit of losing concentration and dropping the very last move on lots of really hard problems - I pretty much guarantee that noone else has fallen off 8 ball at the point he did. He slipped off on the 2a move with both hands matched on the ledge at the end!!! 5 minutes having a quick word with himself and then did the whole problem again, this time without the punter fall at the end.
The more amusing Clifford story isn't The Singularity anyway. It's Dipende in Switzerland. Tim was told by locals it was a project - did it and gave it 8A+. Turned out Fred Nicole had done it a while earlier and completely unknown to Tim given it 8C!!! Not sure how that went down...
Anyways, I'm sure The Singularity will get a repeat some time in the not too distant future - it sounds like it's hard, but not silly hard. And there's a sit to it and a project to the left which both sound amazing, so plenty for uber wads to go visiting for.
I love comments like these, very interesting, thanks for sharing :). And thanks for the picture of The Singularity, I can't believe I hadn't seen it until now.
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Tim Clifford is a hero! Great photo.
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Another pic of The Singularity:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2qx9jj6.jpg)
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Would be very suprised if Tim Doyle hasnt repeated the singularity. As hes done pretty much everything in squamish, including loads of unrepeated fas.
Ultimate dark horse, mows lawns in squamish in the summer, lives in a van the rest of the year, done this most of his adult life. One of the best climbers I've seen, must have 100s of ascents in the v13-14 range that hes never publisized.
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good to see a long list of british men climbing this hard !! giving british climbing a good name !!
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Would be very suprised if Tim Doyle hasnt repeated the singularity. As hes done pretty much everything in squamish, including loads of unrepeated fas.
Ultimate dark horse, mows lawns in squamish in the summer, lives in a van the rest of the year, done this most of his adult life. One of the best climbers I've seen, must have 100s of ascents in the v13-14 range that hes never publisized.
I think that problem has sent the best boulderers in the world packing since it was done. I seem to remember landman blogging about trying it back in his pomp, I can't imagine Jimmy Webb didn't try it when he made that video there and someone told me Paul Robinson and Sean mccoll had made several trips out there to try it with no success (but that could be an overactive imagination on my part)
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McColl on the Singularity in 2011. (http://seanmccoll.com/ask-sean-mccoll/comment-page-1/#comment-4083) No idea if he's been back on it.
Well “The Room Project” has been done from a move in by Tim Clifford and he called it “The Singularity”. I personally don’t know why he didn’t start from the obvious jug rail, but I’ve been told he just did it from the first move in and decided to call it the problem. I’ve tried it for about an hour and the first move is pretty easy. If it’s not soaked in the next month, I might be able to try it again. If I ever did it from the rail, I’m not sure whether it merits a different name. Maybe Singularity is V14, and the sit is V15?
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according to his twitter thingy he was still trying it in February this year: https://mobile.twitter.com/mccollsean/status/570754256489353217 (https://mobile.twitter.com/mccollsean/status/570754256489353217)
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All this is second hand, because I haven't been there, so take with a slight pinch of salt...
Yeah, the only slight fuss around The Singularity is the starting position.
Tim wasn't trying to climb eliminates. He just reached what he could reach from the ground and climbed to the top. As I understand it he started LH on rail and RH on the crimp up and R.
Others had envisaged a crouching start with both hands on the obvious rail.
Apparently, as Sean says in that blog, the diffence in difficulty between those two starts is pretty trivial. The way Tim did it, you've got a tricky move to get L heel onto rail. The other way you put L heel up first and then have a tricky move to get the RH crimp. Again apparently, it doesn't make more than a half grade difference either way... The really hard moves start after that point.
Yet again, apparently, there is also a proper sitting start which is way way harder and adds a substantial amount of hard climbing (although I don't know how much of a rest is possible on the rail).
Pretty sure that Sean McColl, Paul Robinson and Tim Doyle have all spent quite a bit of time on it without success (unless they've done it very recently or been very quiet about it). And obviously lots of others (Landman etc) have had brief plays on it.
Think half the trouble is it's hard. And half is that getting good conditions (especially for visitors) is pretty tricky.
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I find Sean McColl extremely boring and presumptuous.
Am I too old for the climbing media circus?
Better get back to my board and lock me in, you never know what lies outside.
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can I come with you?
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;D
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I find Sean McColl extremely boring and presumptuous.
Am I too old for the climbing media circus?
Better get back to my board and lock me in, you never know what lies outside.
seems a bit harsh, I don't think he is less interesting than 99% of other pro climbers (Dave Graham being a prominent exception). They are professional climbers, they are unlikely to be great intellects if they spend all their time training......
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No you can't moo you've spent a lot of money to be able to climb on sand :wall:
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I find Sean McColl extremely boring and presumptuous.
Am I too old for the climbing media circus?
Better get back to my board and lock me in, you never know what lies outside.
seems a bit harsh, I don't think he is less interesting than 99% of other pro climbers (Dave Graham being a prominent exception). They are professional climbers, they are unlikely to be great intellects if they spend all their time training......
Hey Tim, I don't mean he's stupid or something. To the opposite, anyone who lives on climbing must be very smart!
I just find him boring, or more boring than most of the other climbers. Maybe it's also because every punter couldn't stop talking about Sean McColl's campus training, etc. when thousans of climbers have done much better, much earlier.
Plus, he's made a fool of himself on Hubble, pretending he had a chance.
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Beach holidays can be nice :shrug:
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This might be :worms: for some, but JG said he had (in the last 18 months) climbed a bunch of problems in the 8B range in his interview. Absolutely no specifics but there it is
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This might be :worms: for some, but JG said he had (in the last 18 months) climbed a bunch of problems in the 8B range in his interview. Absolutely no specifics but there it is
What interview?
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Are you reciting old news from an interview with a bumbling grey-haired be-spectacled old man?
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This might be :worms: for some, but JG said he had (in the last 18 months) climbed a bunch of problems in the 8B range in his interview. Absolutely no specifics but there it is
What interview?
Are you reciting old news from an interview with a bumbling grey-haired be-spectacled old man?
That would be the one ;) I believe it was around the time where he was comparing his strength to 7 or 8 years back and he said he couldn't touch any of the problems he was lapping back then despite having climbed a handful of problems around 8B in the last year or two.
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My dick used to be so much bigger
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That was two years ago
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That was two years ago
that brings it within the 5 year cut off
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That was two years ago
that brings it within the 5 year inch cut off
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that brings it within the 5 year inch cut off
I wouldn't cut 5 inches off.......
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that brings it within the 5 year inch cut off
I wcouldn't cut 5 inches off.......
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Fresh from his Euro win, Aidan Roberts (https://www.facebook.com/#!/nathan.phillips.399?fref=nf) did Steppenwolf 8B yesterday.
(sorry if link doesn't work, it's to Nathan Phillips post reporting it on FB)
Edit: I think Ive added it to the wiki...
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Did he actually do steppenwolf or did he miss out the crux first move like Nathan was trying?
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he did it the RH over method for the first move
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Starting off the two undercuts?
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Starting off the two undercuts?
Yes.
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Good lad! Beast!
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Good man, I say man ;)
Don't you all live in the south west? 2 of you replied within half hr of each other to defend young Aidan, but no ones spoke up for the stronger guy. Weird.
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Dense, if you're thinking to change your name to Holmes; have a cup of tea and run the deduction again.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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John Holmes? AKA Johnny Wad?
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Good man, I say man ;)
Don't you all live in the south west? 2 of you replied within half hr of each other to defend young Aidan, but no ones spoke up for the stronger guy. Weird.
Aidan lives near Ambleside.
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Even better
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Did I hear Big Sam Whittaker recently did 8b?
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I don't know did you? But he did ;)
Dirty cave, dernier atrocite. Something like that
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Ah yes...
http://vimeo.com/136923693
Surely Crouch's next 8b there!?!?
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No it's got a hard move on it ;)
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How hard is the first part of La derniere, before joining Rock Atrocity?
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Hardest move in the cave, apparently
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So a four moves 8a?
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No idea, doylo will know
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Not sure how hard that move is but there's not too much pump factor into RA.
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Ah yes...
http://vimeo.com/136923693
Surely Crouch's next 8b there!?!?
I like the way he spanks himself for encouragement. Seems a good motivational technique.
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:offtopic:
I was just curious to know the grade of the added start, to have some reference for home projects. Must be a hard start to bump the grade from (hard) 7c to 8b.
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It must be an 8A move with a few tricky shuffles right into RA. If you've done RA lots the end will be fine, it's only 5 moves into it. Sam's got massive biceps so the hard move went pretty quick for him, he just needed to get the PE.
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Good work Sam. Great psyche in that vid!
Sent from my SM-G800F using Tapatalk
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Can't believe that we've managed to get 6 pages into the thread and leave the beast that is CJD off the list!
8b+ My Own Private Idaho (Feb 2011)
Also La Dernier Atrocity, Lou's Crucial Service and Cerulean Salt the latter two of which are unrepeated (despite some beastly attention) and may well be knocking on the 8b door...
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You put cjd in the opening post fatneck. It's not our fault you put a question mark then a mth or so later started reciting all the things he's done :P
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No prizes for guessing who's been messaging Fatneck :lol:
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Can't believe that we've managed to get 6 pages into the thread and leave the beast that is CJD off the list!
8b+ My Own Private Idaho (Feb 2011)
Also La Dernier Atrocity, Lou's Crucial Service and Cerulean Salt the latter two of which are unrepeated (despite some beastly attention) and may well be knocking on the 8b door...
What's Lou's Crucial Service? And I thought Cerulean was given 8A+.
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http://www.northwalesbouldering.com/newsitem.asp?nsid=615
Cerulaen Salt was originally given a split grade of 8A+/B and Chris said Mike Adams had a play on it and thought it hard...
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Now then all. Only brief from me - I'm enjoying being forgotten. I thought Cerulean was 8b, but am trying to be more conservative these days. Mike couldn't find any holds.
Dave, Lous Crucial Service is Lou Ferrino Ramp into Crucial Times, finishing up Lip Service. It's kinda arbitrary, but does climb very well.
See you all in another few years.
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working title is "Fat Lip and Keen Roof List" https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Nice one on the listification, Remus.
A few corrections/suggestions:
- I think Dandelion is considered 8B nowadays?
- Turner, Mason and Varian have done Bewilderness, which is 8B+ by all accounts?
- Aidan Roberts has climbed Oliphants Dawn, not Aidan Dunne.
- I think Noble has done Mike Adam's Bordello SS, 8C
- Varian has a host of other 8B+'s under his belt...
- Tyler Landman has done Practice of the Wild
- Micky Page has done The Story of Two Worlds, 8C (I think that's consensus?)
- Toby Saxton has done the Finnish Line 8C according to his 27 crags logbook.
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Sam Whittaker has done Le Dernier Atrocity
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A few corrections/suggestions:
- I think Dandelion is considered 8B nowadays?
- I think Noble has done Mike Adam's Bordello SS, 8C
- Correct on the first one AFAIK.
- Noble said 8B+ for Bordello, I think Ned did too? Has also done Golden Shadow (8B/+?) and Jour de Chasse (8B/+/C??)
- IIRC Dawid has done Serenata (8C) too
- Perhaps controversial, but I don't think the list should contain #biggradesforbadbeta, so Mortal Immortal should be on at 8B, Pilgrimage at 8B.
- Belly of the Beast is not 8B+ for me so you can downgrade me to 8B, unless The Wheel counts as a boulder in which case I think it could be lower-end 8B+. I would just downgrade Belly to 8B for simplicity ;)
- Elliot Stephens has done Golden Shadow (8B/+), plus maybe more? Not sure, would need to check scorecard
You might be better off starting at 8B/+ and the routes at 8c+/9a to make things more manageable!
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Nathan Phillips has presumably done something hard - he's done at least 8B
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He has done 8B+ in Switzerland I think.
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-Polish Dave's full name. Dawid Skoczylas. As Alex said, he should be on there for Serenata.
-Eliot Stephens - New Base Line and Golden Shadow 8B+
-Nathan Philips - Mystic Stylez 8B+
-Tom Newman - Serendipity 8B+
-Orrin Coley - Ladybird Orgy 8B+
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Max Milne recently did the long term project at Clashfarquar - Lord Farquar and gave it 8B+. He's still in school though, so not sure if he qualifies in "UK men" though. I'll try find the vid.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/_V7JNYN8rE8
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John Gaskins - Walk Away 8C
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Max Milne recently did the long term project at Clashfarquar - Lord Farquar and gave it 8B+. He's still in school though, so not sure if he qualifies in "UK men" though. I'll try find the vid.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/_V7JNYN8rE8
Is this a video to prove the ascent of said problem or "UK man"?
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working title is "Fat Lip and Keen Roof List"
Is Keen Roof still considered 8B?
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Maybe just create a completely separate ‘Barrows’ list. :shrug:
A few corrections/suggestions:
- I think Dandelion is considered 8B nowadays?
- I think Noble has done Mike Adam's Bordello SS, 8C
- Correct on the first one AFAIK.
- Noble said 8B+ for Bordello, I think Ned did too? Has also done Golden Shadow (8B/+?) and Jour de Chasse (8B/+/C??)
- IIRC Dawid has done Serenata (8C) too
- Perhaps controversial, but I don't think the list should contain #biggradesforbadbeta, so Mortal Immortal should be on at 8B, Pilgrimage at 8B.
- Belly of the Beast is not 8B+ for me so you can downgrade me to 8B, unless The Wheel counts as a boulder in which case I think it could be lower-end 8B+. I would just downgrade Belly to 8B for simplicity ;)
- Elliot Stephens has done Golden Shadow (8B/+), plus maybe more? Not sure, would need to check scorecard
You might be better off starting at 8B/+ and the routes at 8c+/9a to make things more manageable!
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Is this list ever, or just within the last 5 years? Gaz has done Isla de Encanta and Anaesthesia and possibly some others. Didn't know Jerry had done Voyager. 8 Ball now gets 8A+ doesn't it? Ryan's done Spectre though and probably loads others. Andy Earl is missing from your list. I'm also another Keen Roofer.
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Is this a video to prove the ascent of said problem or "UK man"?
Whatever you want it to Gav. He's 16.
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jack palmieri - silk cut, triggertrocity uppercut, pilgrimage
mike heart - also has pilgrimage
eli cartwright did riverbed I believe last year?
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Pete Wilkinson - Fragile Steps, Rocklands
Paul Bennett - Voyager, well you know where that one is!
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Is this list ever, or just within the last 5 years?
It's all time now, easier to maintain.
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Hasn't Micky Paige done Big Paw?
And David Fitzgerald's done New Base Line, Big Paw and Voyager SS?
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barrows -Perhaps controversial, but I don't think the list should contain #biggradesforbadbeta, so Mortal Immortal should be on at 8B, Pilgrimage at 8B.
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What about taking 8B for Keen and Louis Armstrong missing out the cruxes? ;)
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Micky has done Big Paw but not Story of Two Worlds, he's also done Monk's Life, Kheops Assis, Dirt Grows the Flowers (left exit), Black Eagle, and Entlinge, all of which are 8B+. He did the FA of King of Limbs and thought it harder than anything he did that trip.
I personally think grades are more dependent on what the majority of people will do rather than one person doing something differently and downgrading. Malc, Mike and Jack all did Pilgrimage with no knee bars, compared with just Alex using knees and so it should be considered as 8B+ still. Time will tell with Mortal but for now two people have done it with no knees compared to one with knees.
Ned said 8B for Bordello but I think James thought 8B+.
People seem to consider Golden shadow 8B now and Fragile steps as 8A+.
Earl and Ryan have both done loads of 8B's, both have done Cypher and The Ace.
Like Ben said Varian, Turner and I have done Bewilderness.
I thought Keen Roof was 8B, I think it just gets ascents because of how accessible it is and mostly in ok condition.
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Micky has done Big Paw but not Story of Two Worlds
Oops, I was thinking of the Dagger.
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Hasn't Micky Paige done Big Paw?
And David Fitzgerald's done New Base Line, Big Paw and Voyager SS?
Dave Fitzgerald is not a UK man.
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- Aidan Roberts has climbed Oliphants Dawn, not Aidan Dunne.
Aidan Roberts ought also to be bumped up from 8B+ having done Monkey Wedding 8C in June/July.
Tom Peckitt did Amandla 8B+ a couple of years ago.
Potentially controversial, but should Bransby be in for Lanny at 8B? One repeat by Varian who said later that he thought it harder than High Fidelity (without actually stating a grade).
Billy Ridal has done a few others at 8B, The Vice being the main one that comes to mind/Instagram.
And David Fitzgerald's done New Base Line, Big Paw and Voyager SS?
He has, but he isn't from the UK...
Pete Wilkinson - Fragile Steps, Rocklands
With the greatest of respect to Pete, I think this has been downgraded to 8A+ now.
Is Keen Roof still considered 8B?
I'm not aware of anyone who's done it who has proposed a downgrade. I'd suggest that it gets done so regularly more because it's a) fairly basic, b) often in condition and c) in close, accessible proximity to a large population of strong climbers.
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Bransby’s done BonAtrocity anyways.
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Good updates, thanks all https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
For simplicity I've tried to stick with guidebook grades.
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Tom Williams did the sit to The Tracks (Dead and Bloated). Is that not 8B?
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-Polish Dave's full name. Dawid Skoczylas. As Alex said, he should be on there for Serenata.
Isn't he Polish though?
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-Polish Dave's full name. Dawid Skoczylas. As Alex said, he should be on there for Serenata.
Isn't he Polish though?
What makes you think that?
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Desroy did RA Clyde while trying the full line. May have done more 8bs but that's one I know of.
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-Polish Dave's full name. Dawid Skoczylas. As Alex said, he should be on there for Serenata.
Isn't he Polish though?
I dont think it's worth being super strict on the nationality thing. Currently I've been using "Is british or has lived in the UK for quite a while" as the criteria.
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8B
Tom Williams: (Lots) Hourglass, Ace, Louis Armstong etc.
Liam Desroy: Vecchio Leone, Riverbed etc
Eli Cartwright: Riverbed
Alex Moore: Isla d'encanta
Liam Fyfe: Ropes of Maui (and some FA's in Wales I think)
Will Buck: Rhythm (some consider 8A+, but I personally think 8B for sure)
Alex Waterhouse: Merlin's Beard
Dave Cowl: Real Keelhaul
8B+
Steve Dunning: Super Furry Animals, Dreamtime (pre break)
Dave Jones: Warpath
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I dont think it's worth being super strict on the nationality thing. Currently I've been using "Is british or has lived in the UK for quite a while" as the criteria.
Then does Nacho Sanchez qualify??
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I thought Keen Roof was 8B, I think it just gets ascents because of how accessible it is and mostly in ok condition.
I'm not aware of anyone who's done it who has proposed a downgrade. I'd suggest that it gets done so regularly more because it's a) fairly basic, b) often in condition and c) in close, accessible proximity to a large population of strong climbers.
Cheers, I was just asking because of the UKC grade votes and was wondering if knee pads had lowered the grade or something.
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Excellent Knowledge as per Dan https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Cheers, I was just asking because of the UKC grade votes and was wondering if knee pads had lowered the grade or something.
It is a bit all over the place on UKC actually isn't it, e.g. Will Smith using an extremely lanky sequence. Who knows. I'm sure the consensus is still 8B though.
If we're wanting to get together all the boulders people have done at their max grade then Ash WH has also done Keen Roof, Vecchio Leone, Ropes of Maui and Light Saber in Rocklands.
Luke Fletcher did Ropes of Maui the other day but proposed 8A+ :worms:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BnzKDR3jj4p/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1n9cz24g4wuu4
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Hiya Remus.
I have done Vice President, Flor de Loto, (and Bindu, but that's 8b in one guide and 8a+ in the other).
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Hamish Potokar recently did Sanction and Pressure, both 8B at Dumby.
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Thanks Andy, added you. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Luke Fletcher did Ropes of Maui the other day but proposed 8A+ :worms:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BnzKDR3jj4p/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1n9cz24g4wuu4
Let's hope he wasn't trying to avoid inclusion in the list as he's been added.
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Hamish Potokar recently did Sanction and Pressure, both 8B at Dumby.
Good knowledge Bradders, list updated.
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For the sake of accuracy,
-Alex Waterhouse did the FA of Merlins Beard
-Will Smith did the FA of Fat Lip SS and Weeding The Lip (Weedkiller into Fat Lip) but proposed 8B for both as he claims "I Can't climb 8B+)
-I did the FA of Ladybird Orgy (but its a trav so should that even count?)
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Some young scottish kid did a number of 8B+s a few years ago. Cant remember his name though.
Evan?
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Phil Rose did Keen Roof a few years back
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Strong FA knowledge Orrin, updated https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md Phil rose added.
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James Pearson did the FA of Keen Roof didn't he? Can't see him on there.
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Good spot. Couple of contributions from an anonymous source too https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Cailean Barker did The Ace in February.
Ellis Butler-Barker did Dark Matter stand 8B+ a few years ago and also has a clutch of 8Bs on his logbook including Fatman and Fou Rire in Fontainebleau, plus a couple of first ascents in Devon.
https://m.youtube.com/user/EllisButlerBarker7/videos
Some young scottish kid did a number of 8B+s a few years ago. Cant remember his name though.
Evan?
That'll be Euan MacFadyen. According to UKC he's done Helicopters on Beaches in Albarracin (not sure if that's been downgraded now but was 8B+), King of Limbs and Golden Shadow (both of which I think are 8B/+?).
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:worms:
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:worms:
:lol:
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[
[/quote]
That'll be Euan MacFadyen. According to UKC he's done Helicopters on Beaches in Albarracin (not sure if that's been downgraded now but was 8B+), King of Limbs and Golden Shadow (both of which I think are 8B/+?).
[/quote]
Thats the fella
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:worms:
Haha I knew someone would pipe up. I'm not expressing an opinion either way.
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Will Smith thought Keen 8a/+ with the lanky sequence. Maybe he underestimates his bouldering prowess because he’s predominantly a sport climber.
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Will Smith thought Keen 8a/+ with the lanky sequence. Maybe he underestimates his bouldering prowess because he’s predominantly a sport climber.
I think I used a hybrid beta but still thought it was 8B. Whichever way you do it, it's definitely not 8A. Will also thought climbing Weedkiller into Fat Lip made no difference to the grade :lol:
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Good spot. Couple of contributions from an anonymous source too https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
I think a lot of people think Practise is 8B+, I remember Ty saying he thought it was when he did the second ascent.
James and Ned thought Bordello was 8B+ and 8B respectively, not 8C.
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Now we start getting in to the details https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Cailean: added
Euan: added
Lanky sport climbers with a rubber fetish: grading opinions ignored
Bordello: gone in the middle with 8B+
Ellis: :worms: indeed. Lots of doubt over the FAs. Does fatman even exist any more? I've heard doubts over Dark Matter too (Ellis' ascent, not the problem itself). Verdict: gonna leave him off for the moment. Happy to add back in if there's unequivocal evidence.
practice of the wild: concensus on 8a.nu is soft 8C so going to leave it at that for the moment.
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Oooh just noticed we're missing a real dark horse...Matt Birch! First ascents of The Swarm 8B+ in Bishop and Somewhere in Time 8B/+ in Palm Springs plus ascents of Mandala Sit (which I think is 8B/+?) and a few others at 8B in the US.
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I'm pretty sure Tim Clifford has done way more 8B's than just the singularity :)
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Oooh just noticed we're missing a real dark horse...Matt Birch! First ascents of The Swarm 8B+ in Bishop and Somewhere in Time 8B/+ in Palm Springs plus ascents of Mandala Sit (which I think is 8B/+?) and a few others at 8B in the US.
Slashface?
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Will Smith thought Keen 8a/+ with the lanky sequence. Maybe he underestimates his bouldering prowess because he’s predominantly a sport climber.
I think I used a hybrid beta but still thought it was 8B. Whichever way you do it, it's definitely not 8A.
I only thought Keen Roof was 8A/+ as I lanked past the one move from which most of the difficulty comes. I'm in no way down grading it for the normal method though. I can't touch it that way!
Will also thought climbing Weedkiller into Fat Lip made no difference to the grade :lol:
:lol: Yeah it's a bit harder but I would look like a right tool if I took 8B+ when I still can't get up most 7B+s. The move I fell off most whilst trying that link was the second move of Weedkiller!
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Oooh just noticed we're missing a real dark horse...Matt Birch! First ascents of The Swarm 8B+ in Bishop and Somewhere in Time 8B/+ in Palm Springs plus ascents of Mandala Sit (which I think is 8B/+?) and a few others at 8B in the US.
Slashface?
High fidelity too
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Will Smith thought Keen 8a/+ with the lanky sequence. Maybe he underestimates his bouldering prowess because he’s predominantly a sport climber.
I think I used a hybrid beta but still thought it was 8B. Whichever way you do it, it's definitely not 8A.
I only thought Keen Roof was 8A/+ as I lanked past the one move from which most of the difficulty comes. I'm in no way down grading it for the normal method though. I can't touch it that way!
Will also thought climbing Weedkiller into Fat Lip made no difference to the grade :lol:
:lol: Yeah it's a bit harder but I would look like a right tool if I took 8B+ when I still can't get up most 7B+s. The move I fell off most whilst trying that link was the second move of Weedkiller!
Genius :lol:
I think for wads like Clifford and Birch you can't list every hard problem they have done.
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Slashface?
High fidelity too
Think Slashface has come down to 8B now hence not mentioning it and High Fids as being his max efforts but yes quite right!
Likewise for Clifford I think Singularity is his hardest effort but not representative of depth at easier grades.
Although that's perhaps an interesting subject in itself; climbers who've managed loads and loads of hard but slightly sub-maximal problems on all rock types and styles are arguably more impressive than people who lay seige to a particular problem/area/style in my humble opinion even if they don't end up doing quite as big a 'best ever' number.
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It's all about the pyramid! Good depth
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It's all about the pyramid! Good depth
Couldn’t agree more. To climb an 8B does not make you an 8B climber.
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It's all about the pyramid! Good depth
Couldn’t agree more. To climb an 8B does not make you an 8B climber.
When do you become an 8B climber?
I think this cuts both ways. I know people who should maybe, er, have climbed a grade up from what they have but perhaps they don't have the confidence/will to try. Yes we all admire those who can cut it on all rock types/styles, but equally you're not a fully rounded climber IMO if you haven't ticked anything close to your potential.
Sorry :off:
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When do you become an 8B climber?
Yes we all admire those who can cut it on all rock types/styles, but equally you're not a fully rounded climber IMO if you haven't ticked anything close to your potential.
Ste Mac once told me he thought you had to do 3 of a grade, though I can't remember whether that was "to be a grade x climber" or to "have really climbed grade x", but kinda the same thing (ish)
Interesting second point, I like it.
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When do you become an 8B climber?
I think this cuts both ways. I know people who should maybe, er, have climbed a grade up from what they have but perhaps they don't have the confidence/will to try. Yes we all admire those who can cut it on all rock types/styles, but equally you're not a fully rounded climber IMO if you haven't ticked anything close to your potential.
Fair point, although what even is an 8B? Or 8A? Or 7B? Etc. This is the whole trouble with grading in that one climber's grade x could be something completely different for another climber based on all sorts of factors, which effectively makes it all a bit of a nonsense.
I can think of plenty of problems where I've done loads at the same grade elsewhere but still can't touch them. Sure we all can.
That's why I think those who can consistently operate at roughly the same given level across all styles are most impressive. I'd argue that that is far greater evidence of a fully rounded climber than having done one or two things at a slightly higher level than your average.
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When do you become an 8B climber?
Yes we all admire those who can cut it on all rock types/styles, but equally you're not a fully rounded climber IMO if you haven't ticked anything close to your potential.
Ste Mac once told me he thought you had to do 3 of a grade, though I can't remember whether that was "to be a grade x climber" or to "have really climbed grade x", but kinda the same thing (ish)
Interesting second point, I like it.
I recall reading on here that the 3 should to include one on grit and one in font for true mastery.
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I agree with you there TB, I like the idea of a good pyramid over lots of rock types, styles and areas but I also think there is a lot to be said for pushing your comfort zone too and batting on something at your limit.
To spend sessions/weeks/months/years trying something shows as much, if not more, dedication compared with going round and ticking lots. It's also far more rewarding when you do finally/hopefully top out!
Both are equally impressive skills but I think you can achieve both and that's where the magic is.
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It's all about the pyramid! Good depth
Couldn’t agree more. To climb an 8B does not make you an 8B climber.
When do you become an 8B climber?
When you can hold down a full time job and still tick 8B?
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I recall reading on here that the 3 should to include one on grit and one in font for true mastery.
Percy's original criteria
OK, its reached the stage where its time to ask the experts.... I'm in the midst of researching an article about who are currently the UK's strongest climbers. I need to compile a list of strong people, and I'm going mad trying to pull names from my useles memory. List criteria are below.
"To be counted as one of the UK’s strongest climbers you need to have ticked at least one, more or all of the following criteria:
A Climbed Font 8b+ (there is no point in including route climbing in here as moves on routes are never as hard as those on boulder problems.)
B Climbed Font 8b at home, in Font and at least one other country abroad "
So far in list A I have Malc, Johnny G, Tyler, Earl, Micky Page and possibly Liam Desroy
In list B I have no-one yet, as thats when I started to go mad. Seeing as I know how some of you love a list, I would appreciate any light anybody can throw on more names for either list. Please note that when you add a name I could do with some big numbers to back up the claim - a few swiss problems that have dodgy grades might not qualify you, although obviously confirmed Swiss dirt (Dreamtime, La Proue, Mithril, etc, etc all count cos the grades are right!)
Amazing how many people there will be on list B these days!
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Percy's original criteria
OK, its reached the stage where its time to ask the experts.... I'm in the midst of researching an article about who are currently the UK's strongest climbers. I need to compile a list of strong people, and I'm going mad trying to pull names from my useles memory. List criteria are below.
"To be counted as one of the UK’s strongest climbers you need to have ticked at least one, more or all of the following criteria:
A Climbed Font 8b+ (there is no point in including route climbing in here as moves on routes are never as hard as those on boulder problems.)
B Climbed Font 8b at home, in Font and at least one other country abroad "
So far in list A I have Malc, Johnny G, Tyler, Earl, Micky Page and possibly Liam Desroy
In list B I have no-one yet, as thats when I started to go mad. Seeing as I know how some of you love a list, I would appreciate any light anybody can throw on more names for either list. Please note that when you add a name I could do with some big numbers to back up the claim - a few swiss problems that have dodgy grades might not qualify you, although obviously confirmed Swiss dirt (Dreamtime, La Proue, Mithril, etc, etc all count cos the grades are right!)
Amazing how many people there will be on list B these days!
[/quote]
More like amazed at how few there will be. Will the font 8B not be a issue for a majority.
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Loads of people have climbed 8b in font now compared to 2010, I think Between the Trees was a great catalyst for this.
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Ben West joins the pack with Steppenwolf https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Ben West joins the pack with Steppenwolf https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
He’d climbed 8B before in Africa.
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Huffy should be on the list for ‘You Can Go Now’, that’s been repeated by Jonny Kidd, Nathan Phillips and James Squire, all confirming grade I believe.
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Thanks Adam, had a niggling suspicion he should have been on the list but couldn't think what problem it was.
And Huffy of course!
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Andy Earl has climbed Monk Life 8B+
A selective list showing lots more 8B’s is here
http://www.climbonline.co.uk/andy_earl.htm
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Thanks Steve, updated the list https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Fairly sure Vickers did Anaesthesia as well as Gaz, if not more 8Bs!
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Has steve Mc not done one?
Neil Dyer ?
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Steve McQueen close of business and fat lip to name a few
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The name’s Earl, Andy Earl.
:please:
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Sorry Steve, corrected. Added Mr McClure too. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Neil Dyer seems like a candidate, something in the cave of justice perhaps?
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Neil Dyer seems like a candidate, something in the cave of justice perhaps?
Ding Dong did the FA of Silk Cut 8B (maybe 8B+) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDaGw_sYlCM
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Cheers Ally. Seems to get 8B+ in most places so i've added him at that https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Jacob Handyside did Riders on the Storm, Riverbed and Charity Bouldern this summer
https://www.facebook.com/jacob.handyside/posts/10157217056459298
Had forgotten about them until seeing his cracking new vid last week, being a dirtbag is quite useful for climbing hard stuff
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gl9uyzr0Hg
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Good knowledge https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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TYPO.
The name’s Mikey... Mikey Cleverdon.
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Good spot, can't believe that blunder slipped through the net! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Browsing the non-quality vids thread and was reminded of this self-proclaimed "fat lad from Yorkshire", who needs adding to the list based on this incredible looking thing:
https://vimeo.com/268975880
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Good call Bradders. Apologies for being slack on the update.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Matt Wright did Serenity at impossible roof last week .
https://youtu.be/FpeB5wnILaY
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Matt Wright did Serenity at impossible roof last week .
https://youtu.be/FpeB5wnILaY
Nice one, emotional.
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Mega, been a while since we've had any new entrants.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Sam Prior did Voyager a few weeks back. He's calling it A+/B (https://www.instagram.com/p/Bs55bOoBid9/), is that now the consensus or just him being charecteristically modest?
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David Mason also gave it 8a+/8b.
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Feels a bit like 'Lots of people have done it so needs downgrading'. Maybe soft at 8B but then there's always going to be some variation within a grade.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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This is the Peak. It'll be 7b+ in the next guidebook ;)
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Sam Hunter climbed Elephunk in spring last year
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Sam Hunter climbed Elephunk in spring last year
Is that still considered 8B? I'm sure I heard 8A or 8A+ suggested by some, but I may have imagined it!
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Thanks for the update. Getting close to the 100 mark, currently at 98 if you include a couple of question marks towards the end. Any dark horses hiding in the woodwork who might tip it?
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Sam Hunter climbed Elephunk in spring last year
Is that still considered 8B? I'm sure I heard 8A or 8A+ suggested by some, but I may have imagined it!
Most people on 8a.nu take 8B for it.
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Thanks for the update. Getting close to the 100 mark, currently at 98 if you include a couple of question marks towards the end. Any dark horses hiding in the woodwork who might tip it?
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Peter Wilkinson has done Fragile Steps.. a couple years ago
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Thanks for the update. Getting close to the 100 mark, currently at 98 if you include a couple of question marks towards the end. Any dark horses hiding in the woodwork who might tip it?
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Peter Wilkinson has done Fragile Steps.. a couple years ago
That got the DG.
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Why is greasy penisfingers Rich Hession not on the list? Louis Armstrong.
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Cos he’s a dark horse.
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I am amazed people still take 8B for Elephunk, it's definitely not. It's very good though
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I am amazed people still take 8B for Elephunk, it's definitely not. It's very good though
Even BigJimmy.
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I am amazed people still take 8B for Elephunk, it's definitely not. It's very good though
Even BigJimmy.
Didn't he flash it very casually? Assume he was being polite about the grade.
Ah yeah 6:45, looked like he was trying a little bit
https://vimeo.com/109761664
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Louis Parkinson has done Riverbed.
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Thanks for the update. Getting close to the 100 mark, currently at 98 if you include a couple of question marks towards the end. Any dark horses hiding in the woodwork who might tip it?
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Peter Wilkinson has done Fragile Steps.. a couple years ago
That got the DG.
:slap: :whistle:
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Ian Vickers, Anesthesia, I know it's a trav but still a boulder problem. And I suspect he's done more just not told many people. Seems to be every boulder I talk to him about he's done :bow:
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Hasn’t that got the downgrade too since people realised they can use the back of their feet?
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Hasn’t that got the downgrade too since people realised they can use the back of their feet?
Ah not sure but I'll take your word for it. Don't see anything about it anymore do you, nearly as out of fashion as the cave.
Not sure if he's done any others. Did Mandala pretty soon after Sharma had speculated big numbers, but that's come down a lot grade wise since then.
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I feel like Ian should at least be on the list in an honourary capacity, like a Doctorate, for services to hard climbing.
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Asked Ian, he said he doesn't know. Couldn't make it up, what a hero.
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Even Pasquill knows that.
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Asked Ian, he said he doesn't know. Couldn't make it up, what a hero.
8)
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Excellent knowledge as per https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md 100 wads on the list!
Much as I'd like to add Ian in an honorary capacity Im not the queen, so unless someone can dredge their memory for some Vickers waddage he's off the list for the moment. Apparently Mandala is considered low V12 these days, though there's been some hold breakage so could be a contender if somebody wants to make the case? In the spirit of fairness I've also struck Anaesthesia from it's place next to Gaz Parry's name.
Seems like the consensus for Fragile Steps is 8A+ these days?
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Just out of interest, what are we classing as recently?
I was thinking we could start a new list, one I could maybe get one. UK men who have watched someone else boulder >=8B recently.... 🤣
Ironically I haven't seen anyone do it, but I reckon I've got more chance!
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The thread title is out of date, it's all time now.
Originally it was 'last 5 years' but it's a pain from a list building perspective as you need to know the date and the list needs constant maintenance to make sure people dont sneak on there.
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Robins either wants bumping to 8B+ or Dyer dropping to 8B. They've both done Silk cut but ended up in different lists. It could be 8B I'm really not sure, just seems daft to have them in different places on the list for the same problem. That said I doubt it's the hardest thing Pete did in the cave and he was just a bit shy in giving the other ones he got the FA on a higher number, he isn't exactly renowned for chucking around big grades. If I ever repeat them I'll be in a position to offer my view on the grades of them.
There are people missing still, maybe they are controversial ones and that's why they haven't been mentioned, or maybe it's just an oversight. :shrug:
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Good spot Jack, I've bumped Pete up to 8B+ for silk cut. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
If there's people missing feel free to mention them, more than happy to add them (or explain why they're not on the list already if there's a reason).
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Thanks for the update. Getting close to the 100 mark, currently at 98 if you include a couple of question marks towards the end. Any dark horses hiding in the woodwork who might tip it?
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Peter Wilkinson has done Fragile Steps.. a couple years ago
That got the DG.
:slap: :whistle:
Still a slashy in the new guide and a lot of climbers have taken 8B for it, apparently folk are now using a different hold to the original.
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Ok I'll go there since others haven't. Ellis Butler Barker for one, I don't think it's any secret that some of the things he claimed were doubted but he has vids of some stuff, an 8B named Occam's Razor for example, it is a low start to a Mike Adams problem at ash hole.
Who knows what happened with the other ones, probably only Ellis, but this one he climbed in what looks like one shot to me and the grade he proposed is 8B.
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Oh and Jamie Cassidy, first ascent of Directors Cut, pipping Malc in the race.
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Ellis Butler Barker
He came up a while ago in the thread. Decision was made not to include him ;)
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Mat Wright has recently climbed both Serenity at Impossible Roof & Keen Roof at the tor (though he's suggesting 8A+/B for that).
https://www.instagram.com/p/Btq_F-qhq5y/ (https://www.instagram.com/p/Btq_F-qhq5y/)
https://www.instagram.com/p/BuCdhEPBuxo/ (https://www.instagram.com/p/BuCdhEPBuxo/)
Chapeau! :beer2:
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Ellis: :worms: indeed. Lots of doubt over the FAs. Does fatman even exist any more? I've heard doubts over Dark Matter too (Ellis' ascent, not the problem itself). Verdict: gonna leave him off for the moment. Happy to add back in if there's unequivocal evidence.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC2q9dEGGLo
FFS you have Max Milne on there with an unconfirmed 8B+, seems a bit churlish not to put Ellis on the list. The guy's a beast.
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Ok I'll go there since others haven't. Ellis Butler Barker for one, I don't think it's any secret that some of the things he claimed were doubted but he has vids of some stuff, an 8B named Occam's Razor for example, it is a low start to a Mike Adams problem at ash hole.
Who knows what happened with the other ones, probably only Ellis, but this one he climbed in what looks like one shot to me and the grade he proposed is 8B.
A friend of mine has repeated a few things at Ash Hole and was very skeptical of grades claimed. Im prepared to be convinced otherwise if there's opinions or consensus otherwise.
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FFS you have Max Milne on there with an unconfirmed 8B+, seems a bit churlish not to put Ellis on the list. The guy's a beast.
There's no doubt that Max has climbed the things he says he has climbed. I'll take him off the list if his line gets repeated and downgraded to 8A+.
On the other hand there is plenty of doubt around what Ellis has climbed. He's obvioously a beast, but that doesn't make you an 8B climber. I'd actually be really psyched if there's a video of him on a confirmed 8B (or harder), but at the moment all we've got is unconfirmed grades or unwitnessed ascents.
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Thanks for the updates as per https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Jamie Cassidy is on the list. Mat wright was on there already but I've added his recent ascent of Keen Roof.
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I guess if Ellis was on the Lettuce team he’d get a bit more leeway! ;D
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Stop hating on the geez.
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I guess if Ellis was on the Lettuce team he’d get a bit more leeway! ;D
Yeah but if he were on the Lettuce team there'd also be a bazillion social media posts about his dedication and an overly edited video of his ascents. :lol:
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Ellis Butler Barker
He came up a while ago in the thread. Decision was made not to include him ;)
Cheers Nick. Well spotted, I either missed that or forgot about it. I do think it's a little strange he's omitted with some of the inclusions.
Anyway I'll offer another one up, Chris Davies.
Also bulbhaul or whatever the link is called, is that 8B?
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Yes. Shit, is Dan Warren on the list?!
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Now there's a point, if Bulbhaul is 8B then Andy Jackson needs including (he says 8B/+ on this post but I'm sure I spoke to him about it and he said it didn't actually feel much harder than Keelhaul which is consensus 8A):
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1h3ackv92ap6h
Either way, I honestly think that's one of the slickest ascents I've ever seen. He just flows through every move. Awesome stuff.
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I note from his instagram he's just done another eliminate at the cliff. Superb work!
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Yeah, I was going to suggest him. He’s pretty handy when I see him at the wall down south...
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I note from his instagram he's just done another eliminate at the cliff. Superb work!
Are there any eliminates already at Almscliff then? :)
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Now there's a point, if Bulbhaul is 8B then Andy Jackson needs including (he says 8B/+ on this post but I'm sure I spoke to him about it and he said it didn't actually feel much harder than Keelhaul which is consensus 8A):
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1h3ackv92ap6h
Either way, I honestly think that's one of the slickest ascents I've ever seen. He just flows through every move. Awesome stuff.
he does start 2 moves in though :worms: (although I have no doubt he'd cruise it anyway)
The original method for bulbhaul might be 8B, but I doubt the high heel beta gets that. I personally find the bulb with the high heel easier than the keel.
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FFS you have Max Milne on there with an unconfirmed 8B+, seems a bit churlish not to put Ellis on the list. The guy's a beast.
There's no doubt that Max has climbed the things he says he has climbed. I'll take him off the list if his line gets repeated and downgraded to 8A+.
On the other hand there is plenty of doubt around what Ellis has climbed. He's obvioously a beast, but that doesn't make you an 8B climber. I'd actually be really psyched if there's a video of him on a confirmed 8B (or harder), but at the moment all we've got is unconfirmed grades or unwitnessed ascents.
Tb just posted a video of him adding 7 moves into a problem that Mike Adams thought was 8a+. If that doesn't make the cut then quite a few folks need taking off the list.
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FFS you have Max Milne on there with an unconfirmed 8B+, seems a bit churlish not to put Ellis on the list. The guy's a beast.
There's no doubt that Max has climbed the things he says he has climbed. I'll take him off the list if his line gets repeated and downgraded to 8A+.
On the other hand there is plenty of doubt around what Ellis has climbed. He's obvioously a beast, but that doesn't make you an 8B climber. I'd actually be really psyched if there's a video of him on a confirmed 8B (or harder), but at the moment all we've got is unconfirmed grades or unwitnessed ascents.
Tb just posted a video of him adding 7 moves into a problem that Mike Adams thought was 8a+. If that doesn't make the cut then quite a few folks need taking off the list.
:clap2:
Also Eliot Stephens is on the list twice. I mean he's pretty bloody good but surely once is enough.
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I thought the Bulbhaul is 8A+ (with new method) and the Real Keelhaul is 8B.
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If the UKB hive mind is satisfied with that video then he's on the list. Chris Davies, what an omission! He's on now, though any details on other stuff he's done gladly accepted https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Elliot Stephens' twin has been purged. Seems like consensus is 8A+ for bulbhaul then? What's Dan Warren done?
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Now there's a point, if Bulbhaul is 8B then Andy Jackson needs including (he says 8B/+ on this post but I'm sure I spoke to him about it and he said it didn't actually feel much harder than Keelhaul which is consensus 8A):
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1h3ackv92ap6h
Either way, I honestly think that's one of the slickest ascents I've ever seen. He just flows through every move. Awesome stuff.
Never mind the smoothness, he's brought back the "Gaskins on Anaesthesia" fleece + leggings look! And for that, chapeau.... :bow:
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Ellis: :worms: indeed. Lots of doubt over the FAs. Does fatman even exist any more? I've heard doubts over Dark Matter too (Ellis' ascent, not the problem itself). Verdict: gonna leave him off for the moment. Happy to add back in if there's unequivocal evidence.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC2q9dEGGLo
FFS you have Max Milne on there with an unconfirmed 8B+, seems a bit churlish not to put Ellis on the list. The guy's a beast.
That looks like it needs a route grade... Bulbhaul too! Max Milne has also done an 8B FA called Tension (also unrepeated).
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What's Dan Warren done?
Bulbhaul original method followed ten minutes later by Real Keelhaul at the very least.
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Max Milne has also done an 8B FA called Tension (also unrepeated).
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=487447
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Max Milne has also done an 8B FA called Tension (also unrepeated).
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=487447
casual "Sent O/S" 8B FA.
Fred Nicole would be proud.
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David Fitzgerald? Pretty sure there's some video evidence of him climbing above 8B ;)
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David Fitzgerald? Pretty sure there's some video evidence of him climbing above 8B ;)
That dudes non-UK.
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.
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Although he's basically American now, Alex Waterhouse climbed Meadowlark Lemon. Not sure what grade it settles at now after the breakage though. So maybe he gets bumped up to 8B+? Maybe not.
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I think it's considered 8B now due to how much the crux sloper has changed from aggressive brushing, people now thumb crimp it, which never used to be possible. Great effort Alex :strongbench:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BvCq9eyF98d/
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Dave’s always lurking to piss on someone’s bonfire :lol:
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A speedy ascent whatever the grade is is pretty impressive, I don't know having never tried it but it has changed a lot since the FA.
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I'll leave Alex where he is for the moment unless someone wants to make the case for Meadowlark being 8B+.
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https://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,10607.msg583597.html#msg583597
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Up the list he goes! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Stu Littlefair
Jean Claude Van Lamb 8B
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bx-x3qFjl__/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
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Up the list he goes! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Minor point, but the problem at Rocklands is called Mooiste Meise, as per Ben West, not Maise, as per Alex Gorham & Dan Knight. In case people thought they were different problems.
(It's Afrikaans for Nicest Girl, in case anyone was wondering).
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Big ups Stu, assuming this is his first 8B?
Great inspiration for those of us getting longer in tooth
:bow:
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Yep, first of many I hope. Been a long time coming!
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Nice one SLf.
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Excellent work Stu - though I'm amazed to hear you'd not climbed 8B before!
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likewise. what a punter.
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The real question is have you done Stuey's yet ;)
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I hate you
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I hate you
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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James Garden did the thing Stu did a week or so ago. Done other 8Bs too. Mega strong, content with what he does but could climb a fair bit harder if he wanted too imo. :weakbench: :weakbench: :weakbench:
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Waddage Stu! Strong work. And to James too of course.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Question for the knowledgeable: What's the thinking on golden shadow these days? Euan McFayden is down at 8B/+ for it and Elliot Stephens was down at 8B+ for it (Elliot has also done New Base Line so to keep things consistent I've taken GS off for him).
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I'll check the new rocklands guide when I get home...
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I hate you
This must be a mental thing.
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The real question is have you done Stuey's yet ;)
I hate you
Hasn't Barrows done that now?
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Stu Littlefair
Jean Claude Van Lamb 8B
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bx-x3qFjl__/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
meh
I'm pretty sure that's too many moves for a boulder problem
(nice one Stu!)
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Waddage Stu! Strong work. And to James too of course.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Question for the knowledgeable: What's the thinking on golden shadow these days? Euan McFayden is down at 8B/+ for it and Elliot Stephens was down at 8B+ for it (Elliot has also done New Base Line so to keep things consistent I've taken GS off for him).
Golden Shadow is 8B in the new guide. And Eliot is 'L' ;)
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Pete Wilkinson (Peewee of this parish) did Diluvian at Kilnsey today. It might be a dirty drop-off under a world class sport crag,but it's 8B. Get the featherweight fucker on the list.
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Good effort Pete you skinny bastard.
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Strong work! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Yes Pete, well done!
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Added a few extra ascents for people and a few notes based on chatter in significant repeats https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Is there a concensus on practice of the wild? The 'Brits who have climbed 8C' counter is going to take a dive if it's down to 8B+!
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Most people who do Practise now say it's 8B+. I remember Ty saying he thought it could be 8B+ when he made the second ascent.
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Sam Prior has joined the 8B+ club.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
https://www.instagram.com/p/B1__wFLjTeB/
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Billy Ridal has done his first 8B+ with The Never Ending Story in magic wood today. Bump him up the list!
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I don't see Matt Birch on the list.
(The Swarm, Mandala and probably several more...)
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Ah..."recently" - my mistake.
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Don't think that applies anymore tbh - several on there which definitely aren't recent. Quite surprised he's not already on there.
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I'll get Matt on the list and bump Billy up when I'm next at the computer.
As Bradders said, the 'recent' part is no more as it makes the list a pain to maintain.
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Ridal joins the 8B+ club and Birch joins the list after a long absence https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Missing a Northern Irish contingent I think!
Ricky Bell did the first ascent of Gentlemen's Arete 8B at Fairhead
Rob Hunter on Intergalactic 8B at Glenmalure
Wouldn't be surprised if they had some other ticks as well
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Excellent knowledge, I'd assumed they were Irish for some reason. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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What's the thinking on Big Paw these days? Eliot Stephens has just done it and taken 8B+/C whereas Micky P has it on the list at 8B+.
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8B+ / 8B+/C , obviously ::)
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All slash grades everywhere should be given the lower grades.
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Does that mean Colt (7A+/7C) is getting downgraded
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Think it's been considered 8B+ for a while now.
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Think it's been considered 8B+ for a while now.
Thanks, 8B+ it is. I've also purged a few slash grades: Singularity has gone from 8B+/C to 8C and King of Limbs has gone from 8B/+ to 8B.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Power of Goodbye and Dandelion Mind are considered 8B.
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Good knowledge, thanks https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Chris Davies has gone down to 8B with the change, unless anyone knows of any 8B+s he's done?
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My own private idaho is still on ukc as 8B+, I think ned said 8B but tbh the vid of his ascent looked to be pushing the definition of crouch start.
... from armchair.
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Done a bit of swatting up and it sounds like the original start was kind of funky (a bit of big grades for bad beta). I've put Chris down at 8B for the moment, unless someone wants to make a strong argument for 8B+.
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East Coker?
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Joe Lawson has done Hourglass 8B
https://www.instagram.com/p/B3KbxCOD4fZ/
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Good knowledge Andy, I've put him back up to 8B+ and added Joe in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Eliot needs a bump:
https://www.instagram.com/p/B5Vjhh1D8_2/?igshid=1cwd26bcx8ygb
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Don't think Rory Fowler has been added for Wadzilla back at the end of September?
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Eliot needs a bump:
https://www.instagram.com/p/B5Vjhh1D8_2/?igshid=1cwd26bcx8ygb
Excellent, 8C is the big boys club in the UK. Also added Rory for WADzilla, thanks for the heads up Duma.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Buster Martin needs adding for The Vice (and others?)
https://www.instagram.com/p/B6ON7dnJnhG/?igshid=13cxtv14s28rc
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Cheers bradders, good spot https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Nothing major but a few extra problems added in for some people, largely based on ascents from significant repeats https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Joe Lawson did The Hourglass.
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Joe Lawson did The Hourglass.
That's the kinda knowledge we need! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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It doesn't really make sense for me to be on at 8B+ for Belly of the Beast. If I'm on at B+ it should be for The Wheel, or if that's a route then bump me down to 8B...
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Alex Waterhouse gets 8B for the Kraken but the guy who did the FA doesn't make the list?
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Alex Waterhouse gets 8B for the Kraken but the guy who did the FA doesn't make the list?
Excellent spot! Consider Randall listed https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
It doesn't really make sense for me to be on at 8B+ for Belly of the Beast. If I'm on at B+ it should be for The Wheel, or if that's a route then bump me down to 8B...
I'm generally trying to stick to consensus grades for stuff to avoid confusion and as far as Im aware most people take 8B+. If there is consensus at 8B happy to downgrade it but it has to be actual consensus, not just you saying it's easy cause you can milk the knee bars :lol:
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Alex Waterhouse did New Base Line 8B+ last year. So needs a bump up. He's also Done Meadowlark Lemon but I think that's considered 8B now.
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Good knowledge Orrin, I've bumped Alex up the list https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Noticed Greg Chapman is missing for Walk Away at Fairy Steps.
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Good shout, added him in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Rob Hunter needs a bump for FA of Blondie sit to 8B+ as per the UKC article today
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Liam Fyffe needs a bump
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CBsYJMCjJV6/?igshid=131amvm3ou83a
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Good shout, thanks guys https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Are Michael Duffy and David Fitz not included because they are Irish?
Also Tom Greenall has climbed Mintberry Crunch (8A).
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Are Michael Duffy and David Fitz not included because they are Irish?
Also Tom Greenall has climbed Mintberry Crunch (8A).
Guess that's why they aren't in.
8B is the requirement for the boys Dave.
Possibly worth thinking about removing Ropes and maybe Keen since i'm not sure either is really regarded as 8B now? Anyone?
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Are Michael Duffy and David Fitz not included because they are Irish?
Also Tom Greenall has climbed Mintberry Crunch (8A).
Guess that's why they aren't in.
8B is the requirement for the boys Dave.
Possibly worth thinking about removing Ropes and maybe Keen since i'm not sure either is really regarded as 8B now? Anyone?
Oh yes!! Idiot!
I think Michael and David should be on the list. Thoughts?
I personally thought Keen Roof was 8B, Ropes might be low end but I've definitely done 8B's that were easier for me.
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Possibly worth thinking about removing Ropes and maybe Keen since i'm not sure either is really regarded as 8B now? Anyone?
:worms:
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Si Moore did Nuthin but Sunshine and I think one or two others. He’s Northern Ireland so it counts ;)
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Are Michael Duffy and David Fitz not included because they are Irish?
Also Tom Greenall has climbed Mintberry Crunch (8A).
Guess that's why they aren't in.
8B is the requirement for the boys Dave.
Possibly worth thinking about removing Ropes and maybe Keen since i'm not sure either is really regarded as 8B now? Anyone?
Oh yes!! Idiot!
I think Michael and David should be on the list. Thoughts?
I personally thought Keen Roof was 8B, Ropes might be low end but I've definitely done 8B's that were easier for me.
Ropes is 8A+ in the upcoming guide if that's worth anything. Yeah i've done 8Bs that were easier for me too, so it is a tricky one. Probably had 20 ascents though now, and a lot have said soft. I just find it hard to see it as the same grade as a lot of the 8Bs I've tried.
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Ropes is 8A+ in the upcoming guide if that's worth anything.
Didn’t we just get a new N Wales bouldering guide?!
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Added Si Moore in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
As has been said, no Duffy or David Fitzgerald as they're Irish. Bit of an arbitrary rule, but gotta keep the list under control.
Im going to leave Ropes and Keen Roof in at 8B for the moment, the UK needs a few more 'soft at the grade' problems :lol:
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Ropes is 8A+ in the upcoming guide if that's worth anything.
Didn’t we just get a new N Wales bouldering guide?!
Nearly sold out...
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Ropes is 8A+ in the upcoming guide if that's worth anything.
Didn’t we just get a new N Wales bouldering guide?!
We did yes, out of print I believe. Mad when people made do with the one before last for so long, but hey ho. It's compeletely different too, one book each for the coastal and hill stuff.
Im going to leave Ropes and Keen Roof in at 8B for the moment, the UK needs a few more 'soft at the grade' problems :lol:
Not sure about this but will leave it with you, having 8B mean almost anything in the Uk just seems mad to me sometimes. I'm also not that convinced UK grades are that hard at all really. Certain areas have soft and hard things, like anywhere.
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Let's stick to the remit of this thread. Jackpal can start his own list of UK men who have climbed problems that he thinks are >8B.
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Yeah fair do's. Was just my ponderings. Like I said I found Ropes tricky, took me a few sessions, I just took what seemed to be becoming the consensus, or so I thought. I'll leave it with those more experienced to figure out what's what. Do you think an ascent of ropes is similar to Aidan's ascent of Shallow Groove or someone doing little women though?
Just wondering Remus how did Will get on with Dandelion mind?
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Yeah fair do's. Was just my ponderings.
Thanks for your input, always appreciated Jack. To be fair I agree they may well be soft or 8A+, I'd just prefer to wait for the call to be made elsewhere rather than using this list to do it.
Just wondering Remus how did Will get on with Dandelion mind?
I haven't got any inside knowledge, sorry!
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Pleasure as always Remus, suppose I was just using the occasion to highlight how messed up I think the grading is at the top end. I mean look at poor Varian right below a proper punter on the list haha. I couldn't dream of touching any of those thing's he's on the list for. I know he's head and shoulders above everyone else but does everyone else know that? Same for Aidan, do they just see Shallow Groove 8b and think 'oh that's like someone doing Ropes/Keen/Fat lip' or whatever.
Will didn't do Dandelion for the record.
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Let's stick to the remit of this thread. Jackpal can start his own list of UK men who have climbed problems that he thinks are >8B.
To be fair to Jack, the current consensus is that Ropes is 8A+. That's what it will get in the next edition of the NWB guide.
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Grades are a complete cluster. Each problem is so different and each person is so different. Even if you just take 8A+-8B near Ropes you've got a complete mix. Malc's, Dead and Bloated, Pools, Wedgie Wall, Mr Fantastic. Obviously Ropes isn't the hardest but it isn't the easiest either.
Regarding Keen I think it's more opportunity than it being easy. It's very easy access and it's in ok condition a lot of the year, it's always going to get more ascents than other's of the grade in the Peak.
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To be fair to Jack, the current consensus is that Ropes is 8A+. That's what it will get in the next edition of the NWB guide.
Thanks for the confirmation. I've trimmed Dom Bridgwood, Oli Grounsell and Luke Fletcher from the list https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
If anyone know any other 8Bs they've done I'll add 'em back in.
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Dom has done Keen Roof and Luke has done Dead and Bloated and also the FA of Mr Spantastic which he gave 8B.
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I know nothing about the distinction between 8A+ and 8B, but using Shallow Groove (clearly at the top border) in the context of discussing RoM (clearly at the bottom) is a bit of a red herring.
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Also has Barrows done Ropes? In which case surely it's just a route in a hole...
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Dom has done Keen Roof and Luke has done Dead and Bloated and also the FA of Mr Spantastic which he gave 8B.
Cheers Dave, I've added them back in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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I know nothing about the distinction between 8A+ and 8B, but using Shallow Groove (clearly at the top border) in the context of discussing RoM (clearly at the bottom) is a bit of a red herring.
Not really sure why it’s a red herring if they are both given 8B. 95% of those doing ropes have taken or said 8B for the record. But by all means take different problems from my example.
Barrows probably got the FA but was just too nice to tell folk. He’s done a fair few of the 8Bs on the list, stronger than he lets on, doesn’t just go to the crag to bitch like many believe. It’s about a dozen moves to very easy ground for what it’s worth.
I do think it’s interesting. And I reckon 99.99% of the climbers can’t distinguish between the two things.
That’s cause of the messed up grading imo.
8B for me can mean anything from a couple of hours, to a lifetime project that I’m probably wasting my time on really and that’s even if the style suits me. Just depends who put it up.
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8B for me can mean anything from a couple of hours, to a lifetime project that I’m probably wasting my time on really and that’s even if the style suits me. Just depends who put it up.
That happens across the grade range though, as there are so many variables at play. I've done 7Cs in a couple of goes but have several others that are currently multi-season projects. Doesn't necessarily mean the grades are wrong.
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:lol: :lol: :lol:
Routes grades barely make sense, and boulder grades make even less sense. Especially in the UK...
P.s. no I've not done Ropes
P.p.s. I also have that same thing with every grade from 7B+ to 8A!
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Both Greg Chapman and Ian Vickers have done Anesthesia, 8B at Woodwell.
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Both Greg Chapman and Ian Vickers have done Anesthesia, 8B at Woodwell.
Isn't that down to 8A+ with the invention of heel hooking?
ed. apologies if it looks like I'm being a bit hypocritical here regarding downgrades, but my impression is that anesthesia was fairly uncontroversial at 8A+? Happy to be corrected.
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Felt 8B to me and I like to think I can heel hook..
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I know nothing about the distinction between 8A+ and 8B, but using Shallow Groove (clearly at the top border) in the context of discussing RoM (clearly at the bottom) is a bit of a red herring.
Not really sure why it’s a red herring if they are both given 8B. 95% of those doing ropes have taken or said 8B for the record. But by all means take different problems from my example.
Barrows probably got the FA but was just too nice to tell folk. He’s done a fair few of the 8Bs on the list, stronger than he lets on, doesn’t just go to the crag to bitch like many believe. It’s about a dozen moves to very easy ground for what it’s worth.
I do think it’s interesting. And I reckon 99.99% of the climbers can’t distinguish between the two things.
That’s cause of the messed up grading imo.
8B for me can mean anything from a couple of hours, to a lifetime project that I’m probably wasting my time on really and that’s even if the style suits me. Just depends who put it up.
Hey Jack, sorry wasn't meaning to have a go, apologies if it came across like that. I do think saying "they are both given 8B. 95% of those doing ropes have taken or said 8B" is a bit misleading though. SG has had 3 (or 2) ascents in as many decades, lots of the FAs other things have turned out to be really hard, Ryan is notoriously understated, and Aiden said 8B/+. Ropes on the other hand is one of the most ticked 8Bs in the country, and is going in the new guide at 8A+. They are clearly at the opposite ends of the grade, and assuming we all subscribe to a linear grading scale, could be legitimately as different in difficulty as a mid 8A+ and a mid 8B. Keen roof is a better comparison I agree.
Re lifetime project to a couple of hours, I agree with Bradders and think this is noticeable for everyone when near their limit.
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one of the most ticked 8Bs in the country
Another quick thought on this; just because a few people have done something doesn't mean the grade is wrong and should be reduced. I think sometimes popularity gets misconstrued in this way.
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Dem grades are Wide Boyz.
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Sorry, typed out a long winded reply and got timed out. Will I ever learn haha.
I agree with a lot of what’s been said, number of ascents doesn’t necessarily reflect difficulty etc. Agree with Alex grades on uk boulders make zero sense, especially if you travel around a bit.
Just baffles me is all.
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They are a lot better than they used to be. 80s/90s the difference from area to area was huge.
Wales was always piss easy though so I guess nothing changes.
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Wales was always piss easy though so I guess nothing changes.
Hope Panton doesn’t check this thread again or there might be some mass downgrading on the way after that one. Like when Vickers and Parry used to come in early 00s and said everything piss..
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They are a lot better than they used to be. 80s/90s the difference from area to area was huge.
Wales was always piss easy though so I guess nothing changes.
Nothing changes indeed. Still at least it’s not too far for some holiday grades.
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Grades are a complete cluster. Each problem is so different and each person is so different.
:o next you'll be claiming they're subjective and all.
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They are a lot better than they used to be. 80s/90s the difference from area to area was huge.
Wales was always piss easy though so I guess nothing changes.
The idea that grades are only inconsistent from area to area is just chest puffing bollocks, and you know it Gav/Jack. Truth is that all areas have inconsistencies within them too. There are definitely hard 8Bs in North Wales - if anybody doubts that then go and try Madame Allure in the Ogwen Valley or Das Pumpenhausen at Porth Ysgo, both very high quality and unrepeated. I dare say you'll be coming back with your tail between your legs, rather than shooting your mouth off about holiday grades.
Or just go and try DC's Wedgie Wall up the Pass, a mere 8A+, which has repelled all comers. Talk to me about holiday grades once you, or anybody, has repeated that.
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Come on Simon you know I was taking the piss.
Can’t do much over 7B these days. Maybe I need a trip over when you allow visitors to improve on that.
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Come on Simon you know I was taking the piss.
Can’t do much over 7B these days. Maybe I need a trip over when you allow visitors to improve on that.
Sorry Gav, I shouldn't have bitten. You are more than welcome to come and sample our wares anytime, and get a doss in the spare room!
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They are a lot better than they used to be. 80s/90s the difference from area to area was huge.
Wales was always piss easy though so I guess nothing changes.
The idea that grades are only inconsistent from area to area is just chest puffing bollocks, and you know it Gav/Jack. Truth is that all areas have inconsistencies within them too. There are definitely hard 8Bs in North Wales - if anybody doubts that then go and try Madame Allure in the Ogwen Valley or Das Pumpenhausen at Porth Ysgo, both very high quality and unrepeated. I dare say you'll be coming back with your tail between your legs, rather than shooting your mouth off about holiday grades.
Or just go and try DC's Wedgie Wall up the Pass, a mere 8A+, which has repelled all comers. Talk to me about holiday grades once you, or anybody, has repeated that.
Sorry if i caused offence Simon. You are right there is definitely hard for the grade stuff too. The jibing was just that, a joke.
I'd love to try MA and Das pumpen, just awkward logistically as i'm sure you know, and i can imagine are still really hard even when you get the right set up pad wise.
All i was saying in earlier points is that stuff like Ropes imo isn't 8B, i wasn't the first to propose this. And it isn't even the easiest i've done at that grade in the hills.
And yeah re Wedgie, Danny breaks all the rules, i reckon that lad could sandbag even the biggest of sandbaggers.
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As an example of inconsistencies in the same area - Ropes of Maui "8B" and Dead and Bloated 8B.
They definitely aren't the same. D&B is at least a grade harder. There's a reason it gets significantly less repeats than ropes (and that's not just because it's sharp!)
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Saying North Wales is full of holiday grades is the same as saying Switzerland is. There are definitely problems that are easy for the grade, but like Simon says there are also problems that are hard for the grade (Paper Birds and Danny's sit to it is another example of this). Every area has easy, bang on and hard problems.
The point I want to make is that most Brits climb indoors or on a board a lot and therefore when we go on rock types that are like indoors (NW, Swiss, Rocklands, even lime to some extent) we climb harder grades faster. It shouldn't be surprising to us and it doesn't mean that it's easy. It just shows your training is working.
Everyone harks on about the grit being difficult but it's just massively conditions dependent and a strange style that most people don't practise on much. If you climb on grit a lot you learn how to move on it, combine that with a (rare) good day and problems don't feel any harder than problems elsewhere.
Regarding Ropes and D&B, I agree that the moves on D&B are a little harder but I would it's sharpness is the main reason it has had less ascents.
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All morphology. Dave finds Paper Birds hard, Jack thinks it’s soft and can lap it but is too short for the one move sit .... Jack thinks Compact and Isles are paths cos he’s tiny but can’t do Malcs, Wedgie ... Someone go and try Neon Handshake for 8a+.. Soft and hard just like anywhere.
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Stuperman (https://www.instagram.com/p/CB_uaLFDiy8/?igshid=hbd1qyrq33ef)
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All morphology. Dave finds Paper Birds hard, Jack thinks it’s soft and can lap it but is too short for the one move sit .... Jack thinks Compact and Isles are paths cos he’s tiny but can’t do Malcs, Wedgie ... Someone go and try Neon Handshake for 8a+.. Soft and hard just like anywhere.
Agreed! I still think Paper Birds is one of the hardest problems I've ever done.
I keep saying I'll go look at Neon but never made it there. Looks a lovely wall, but sharp I'd imagine?
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Probably sharp yes. CJDs nicest line. Looks insane to me...
Also still don’t get too many people waltzing up Pools even though it’s 10cm from the road. Even Varian, Landman didn’t do...
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I thought that one was easy ;)
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Exactly. Everyone’s different . :tease:
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I’m not.
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Stu well done. I've never tried Superman but from what I hear it's a good tick that.
:weakbench:
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Saying North Wales is full of holiday grades is the same as saying Switzerland is[...] Every area has easy, bang on and hard problems.
It's interesting when you think about what other areas are like, and how our (or at least my) perceptions are distorted by memories of what we've done vs what we've tried. When I think about Rocklands or Australia I think of them as being soft, but a fair amount of what I really mean is that the problems I did were ones that I felt were soft... because, near my limit (which is the problems I remember more), I failed to do the harder ones or sacked them off! So my instinctive memory for Aus is doing 8A+s and 8Bs, but I have to think harder to remember the 8A+s I spent multiple sessions failing on or the 8Bs I couldn't touch. Similarly with Rocklands - I think about stuff like Black Shadow and think "soft", but "forget" that I couldn't get close on the first few moves of Pendragon (which others think is easy). Plus bouldering grades don't make sense, obviously.
P.S. Nice one Stu!
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Strong work Stu! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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It's funny that! One of the best route climbers in the UK finds power endurance boulder problems "soft" and shorter crimpy problems "hard" :lol:
Also nice one Stu!
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Good work Stu!
All true, I can't touch Wedgie, or the first move of Paper birds sit. And Pools is above my pay grade.
Still at least I can do some stuff, I can't touch 8B at all in the lakes.
Sam Blackwell did Keen Roof this morning it appears, think he skipped 8A and 8A+. Great effort.
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back on track. Great effort and great shot.
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Sam Blackwell did Keen Roof this morning it appears, think he skipped 8A and 8A+. Great effort.
Thanks for the nudge Jack, spotted that in the UKC logbooks but forgot to update the list here https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md Skipping from 7C+ to 8B is proper waddage!
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Finley Wood joins the list with ascents of WADzilla and Godzilla Sit on consecutive days https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
Good shout Jack, I've added him in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
I've also added Leo Skinner for his ascent of Louis Left last year.
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Finley Wood joins the list with ascents of WADzilla and Godzilla Sit on consecutive days https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Small correction, he actually had a day's rest in between doing these according to UKC (slacker ::) )
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
Pretty sure pump up the staminaband is considered 8B+ by most.
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
Pretty sure pump up the staminaband is considered 8B+ by most.
Shirley Pedigree Chum is at least 8B too?
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
Pretty sure pump up the staminaband is considered 8B+ by most.
Cool, moved him up to 8B+.
Bit of a weird one, ideally it'd be good to avoid adding people for long travs as I dont think they're very comparable to up problems. I can't think of a good way of distinguishing between short and long travs though, so will keep people on the list for the moment.
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Paul Smitton did Pump up the Staminaband. Only skimmed the list but didn’t see him.
Pretty sure pump up the staminaband is considered 8B+ by most.
Shirley Pedigree Chum is at least 8B too?
Will be but everyone who’s done it have just said give it 8c+. I was messaging Smitt recently . Sounds like he’s getting keen again. Strong fingers that chap.
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Same grade as Kaabah and you don’t even need a belay. No wonder it get so many repeats.
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I can't think of a good way of distinguishing between short and long travs
No doubt suggested before somewhere but we clearly need an ancillary 'grade density' (d) rating for boulder problems. I'd suggest a scale of d0 through to d3 to provide optimal granularity.
d0 is where essentially all of the difficulty of the problem is accrued in a single move. Some examples: The Joker 8A d0. The Ace 8B d1. Weedkiller 7A+ d2. Keen Roof 8A+ d2 (assuming it's d2 here, I don't really know but heard it's def 8A+ :smirk:). PUTSB 8B+ d3. You get the idea.
the rounded climber should aim to build out similar grade pyramids across the d scale of course.
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Nice idea. You could also have the number of moves and the standard deviation of move difficulty. 😃
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Martin Smith should be on for superman shirley ?
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Martin Smith should be on for superman shirley ?
And General Disarray
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Good knowledge both, thanks https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
You'll have to forgive my ignorance as I don't know Martin, but did he do superman pre or post break? And what's the knowledge on pre/post break grade of superman? I've got 8A+ to 8B in my mind but not sure if that's right.
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Superman was post break, think it is generally thought of as 8b now
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Thanks for clarifying Ben, I've added in superman for him too https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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James Squire making the 3rd ascent of the Giuliano Cameroni new 8C Power of Now. Not picked up by UKB/C yet?
https://www.instagram.com/p/CEUMnzEjQr8/?igshid=h8qlosnbq26e
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Pretty sure it was on significant repeats?
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ah yes √
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Henry Henderson has done Keen Roof bypassing 8A and 8A+
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also Pete Dawson did Pilgrimage some time ago so should be bumped up to 8B+
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And Kieran Forest needs to go on for having done Pilgrimage too.
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Lewis Roy did Supersize Me 8B at Dumby the other day. 2 years ago he was struggling on 6As!
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Thanks for the updates everyone, much appreciated https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Barrows, while I agree in principle the list is broadly based on consensus grades. Bit of a shame, as otherwise I'd give you V16 for Wheel of Life and put you at the top of the list of the UK's strongest boulderers ;D
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Tim Blake did Ilse of Wonder a while back so needs adding
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Good knowledge, I've added him in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Craig Ducko (idk his real one) did Compact Culture at Sheep Pen this morning. https://www.instagram.com/p/CEwZjo-jAFo/?igshid=jjviym2kk5sp
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Craig Ducko (idk his real one) did Compact Culture at Sheep Pen this morning. https://www.instagram.com/p/CEwZjo-jAFo/?igshid=jjviym2kk5sp
Davies
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Craig Ducko (idk his real one) did Compact Culture at Sheep Pen this morning. https://www.instagram.com/p/CEwZjo-jAFo/?igshid=jjviym2kk5sp
Davies
David?
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Craig David Davies it is then. The rap/politics mashup we've all been waiting for ;)
More seriously, great effort! Looks like an ace line https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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#selecta
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Sam Blackwell recently did Spaceship at Biblins cave for his first 8B+ https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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does Aidan need bumping up with Superpower as its 8C/+? not sure with slashes if you're using upper or lower end grade on this or allowing for slashes?
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does Aidan need bumping up with Superpower as its 8C/+? not sure with slashes if you're using upper or lower end grade on this or allowing for slashes?
Good question. Im kinda keen to avoid the ambiguity of slash grades. Perhaps we just wield the collective power of UKB and unilaterally upgrade it to 8C+...
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does Aidan need bumping up with Superpower as its 8C/+? not sure with slashes if you're using upper or lower end grade on this or allowing for slashes?
Good question. Im kinda keen to avoid the ambiguity of slash grades. Perhaps we just wield the collective power of UKB and unilaterally upgrade it to 8C+...
I vote for taking the lower grade of slash grades. If he wants the plus he'll have to commit properly.
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I vote for taking the lower grade of a slash grades. If he wants the plus he'll have to commit properly.
This sounds like the most British was of dealing with it 😄
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I vote for taking the lower grade of a slash grades. If he wants the plus he'll have to commit properly.
This sounds like the most British was of dealing with it 😄
At some point, however, Aidan will have to stop using "I haven't really tried enough hard boulders to be able to say" line - not a dig at all, just more amusing Britishness.
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does Aidan need bumping up with Superpower as its 8C/+? not sure with slashes if you're using upper or lower end grade on this or allowing for slashes?
Good question. Im kinda keen to avoid the ambiguity of slash grades. Perhaps we just wield the collective power of UKB and unilaterally upgrade it to 8C+...
Either way it's currently the hardest problem in the UK so would be a shame not to have it noted as such...
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does Aidan need bumping up with Superpower as its 8C/+? not sure with slashes if you're using upper or lower end grade on this or allowing for slashes?
Good question. Im kinda keen to avoid the ambiguity of slash grades. Perhaps we just wield the collective power of UKB and unilaterally upgrade it to 8C+...
Either way it's currently the hardest problem in the UK so would be a shame not to have it noted as such...
That’s only because Gaskins didn’t know that 8C+ existed :popcorn:
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8C? It's an old grade...
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Armchair grade opinion here - unless he missed something it'll be 8c+ and a hard one at that.
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Short of a commitment from the man himself to the big 8C+ I've put Superpower down as 8C, but more importantly I've moved Aidan to the top of the list as it seems like Superpower is likely the hardest problem in the UK at the mo and probably the hardest problem climbed by a Brit https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Jim Pope has done 3 8Bs at Kilsney today. What a way to enter the list.
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Jim Pope has done 3 8Bs at Kilsney today. What a way to enter the list.
Waddage! For some reason I assumed he had a few 8Bs under his belt already. Anyone know exactly what he did? His account is hidden on UKC so not totally clear. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Jim did:
The last dance, f8B
Antediluvian, f8B
End Game, f8B
Primitive Notion, f8A+
Diluvian, f8B
There's a lot of common ground on them but it was still impressive stuff to see - all very nonchalent and unaffected.
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Jim did:
The last dance, f8B
Antediluvian, f8B
End Game, f8B
Primitive Notion, f8A+
Diluvian, f8B
There's a lot of common ground on them but it was still impressive stuff to see - all very nonchalent and unaffected.
Note that one or perhaps two people have suggested 8A+ for Diluvian recently but the general consensus before that was 8B. Hence the above report being 3x 8B not 4...(4!!!)
If it is downgraded then poor Pete Wilkinson will lose his place on the list for a 2nd time! His other possible contender being Fragile Steps in Rocklands.
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I just cut-and-pasted the names and grades from UKC (it was hard keeping track of what he did). I didn't hear Jim making any claims re grades himself. I got the impression he neither knew nor cared about the names or grades of anything he did - casual success at whatever he was pointed at.
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Diluvian is for sure 8A+ in my eyes. No harder than Primitive was the consensus at the crag.
A top haul by Jim. He was so close to doing all 6 of the problems above 8A+ too.
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Aye what a total monster either way.
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If comparing Yorkshire limestone problems I thought Diluvian was easier than Goyden Gold, so may 8A+ for both but who knows. The beta has slightly evolved on Diluvian too, which no doubt makes a difference. Jim showing his fitness, good training session for him :dance1:
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The beta has slightly evolved on Diluvian too, which no doubt makes a difference.
I didn't know about the beta for using the hold above the crimp, i think using the small crimp makes the move out left harder. Either way I'm still taking 8B for it, likewise Fragile Steps, the sequence used was the original sequence before something changed which made one of the holds bigger.
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Diluvian is for sure 8A+ in my eyes. No harder than Primitive was the consensus at the crag.
let's just make Primitive 8B and call it a day
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Diluvian is for sure 8A+ in my eyes. No harder than Primitive was the consensus at the crag.
let's just make Primitive 8B and call it a day
Haha that’d be nice, but very generous. I think with my beta, Jim and I both thought primitive was maybe the harder exit but still not 8B.
I did Antediluvian this morning, and even though I found a few more tricks I reckon that one to be fair at 8B. Great crag for between the school runs, pity there isn’t some more hard stuff, reverse Mandela trav Into the boulders anyone haha.
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I didn't know about the beta for using the hold above the crimp, i think using the small crimp makes the move out left harder. Either way I'm still taking 8B for it
#biggradesforbadbeta
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Funny the concept of ‘taking a grade’. Punter tops out boulder problem: ‘effort mate what you taking ??‘ , ‘dunno pal gonna sleep on it, taking the Mrs out tonight, don’t wanna take too much in one day. might take 8b for it Tomoz tho. See how feel in morning, maybe the day after though cos I’m taking the dog for a walk tomoz ’.
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A giver not a taker huh :lets_do_it_wild:
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It’s sad how grades are getting objectified. Grades have feelings too.
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The beta has slightly evolved on Diluvian too, which no doubt makes a difference.
I didn't know about the beta for using the hold above the crimp, i think using the small crimp makes the move out left harder. Either way I'm still taking 8B for it, likewise Fragile Steps, the sequence used was the original sequence before something changed which made one of the holds bigger.
You didn't know about that beta cause I had to come up with it cause my skin was too weak to use that horrific crimp :lol:
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Funny the concept of ‘taking a grade’. Punter tops out boulder problem: ‘effort mate what you taking ??‘ , ‘dunno pal gonna sleep on it, taking the Mrs out tonight, don’t wanna take too much in one day. might take 8b for it Tomoz tho. See how feel in morning, maybe the day after though cos I’m taking the dog for a walk tomoz ’.
Indeed (http://fiendophobia.blogspot.com/2017/06/taking-grade.html)
Taking The Grade.
What a ridiculous concept. If I take the grade, what am I going to do with it? Stamp it on a medal? Tattoo it on my bellend (suitably enlarged if the grade is a BIG NUMBER) and wave it around to pick up hot chicks (or hunky blokes)? Superglue it onto my ego and see if it increases my sense of self-worth? Maybe I could make a little hutch for it, feed it kale and quinoa or steak pie and chips and see if it grows into a bigger grade? Do I need to take it on walkies? What about pet insurance? Worming tablets?
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'UK Men Who Have Bouldered Recently'... doesn't quite have the same cachet.
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Well of course the real purpose of taking a >=8B grade is to make the cut in this thread, as any fule kno. No-one's arguing with the validity of that except maybe people who's 8Bs keep getting downgraded to 8A+
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There’s no taking on this thread you get what you’re given.
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It's with sadness that I've downgraded Diluvian on the list https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
However I've added Pete as a special mention, as being bumped off the list by downgrades twice seems harsh.
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What is the Benchmark 8B in the UK?
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The Ace, surely?
*shuffles around in his armchair*
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George Newham did Keen Roof recently. But is Keen Roof actually regarded as 8B? An awful lot of downvotes on UKC and an awful lot of punters getting up it...
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Interestingly, I never actually gave Diluvian 8B (see my insta from 2014).
Good effort Jim Pope on a rope, What I did in 5 years you did in 5mins...... Ebikes, ladders and liquid chalk have ruined bouldering.
Anyway, I thought one of the harder links might be 8B+ (Or maybe I wanted it to be after spending so much time wasting my life on a shitty bit of limestone at the bottom of an amazing crag) but after various beta improvements maybe low to mid 8B. Who actually cares anyway?!
Don’t worry Jordan, I think Isla de encanta is pretty benchmark..!!! Flashing that thing is just taking the piss. :o
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George Newham did Keen Roof recently. But is Keen Roof actually regarded as 8B? An awful lot of downvotes on UKC and an awful lot of punters getting up it...
Sweet, on the list he goes. https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Let's not get in to the Fat Lip/Keen Roof debate. If they get downgraded it'll send shockwaves through the list (about 1/10 entries on the list are ascents of one of those problems)!
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What's wrong with losing 1/10 of the list? Surely when people started taking 8A+/B for RoM a similar number went off the list?
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Also Hamish McArthur needs adding to the list having done Sideshow on the Bowderstone. What a problem to join the list with! 3rd ascent after Varian and JackPal?
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It's with sadness that I've downgraded Diluvian on the list https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
However I've added Pete as a special mention, as being bumped off the list by downgrades twice seems harsh.
Big grades for bad beta is obvs nonsense, but if Fragile Steps has changed, and was 8B at the time, then I think peewee should definitely still be on.
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Interestingly, I never actually gave Diluvian 8B (see my insta from 2014).
the post (https://www.instagram.com/p/pHLKtJEQTD/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet)
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What is the Benchmark 8B in the UK?
The Sheriff :D
(ducks and runs away fast...)
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Big grades for bad beta is obvs nonsense, but if Fragile Steps has changed, and was 8B at the time, then I think peewee should definitely still be on.
Im not familiar with the grade change so will defer to others. What's the knowledge on fragile steps?
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Also Hamish McArthur needs adding to the list having done Sideshow on the Bowderstone. What a problem to join the list with! 3rd ascent after Varian and JackPal?
Good shout, he's in https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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What's wrong with losing 1/10 of the list? Surely when people started taking 8A+/B for RoM a similar number went off the list?
Nothing really, I was just joking. Ropes of Maui going down to 8A+ meant 3 people off the list (whereas Keen Roof/Fat Lip would equate to 13 people off the list) https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/commit/638b88bc03d8c32aa89253a2859d2cce498687c9#diff-451f9583b02bbaa99fa5968c28410027
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The list is supposed to be elitist. If there's a load of chancers who have done a thing that was once given 8B but has settled to less than that then they should be zapped. At some point standards will progress to a point where 8B won't get you onto the list at all.
I honestly have no idea how hard Keen Roof is as it is at the Snor and I therefore don't know or care about it, but it has the hallmarks of something in need of a downgrade.
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I think there's something to be said about "easy access" climbs getting lots of repeats. Take Keen Roof and Fat Lip for example, its a 10 second walk in, there's always someone there with extra pads and you can work any move from the ground. These all add up to make them super "easy" to repeat and see lots more ascents than a lot of other hard climbs.
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[Keen roof/fat lip] has the hallmarks of something in need of a downgrade.
Might as well get it out the way...anyone else got an opinion on this?
My current thinking: they're popular because they're probably a little soft, but also because they're at one of the busiest hard crags in the UK and the beta has been dialed in as they get a lot of traffic. Does that mean they need downgrading? I suspect other problems on the list would get similarly dialed in if they got as much traffic. Does that mean Keen roof/fat lip need to go down, or just that they're well worked out?
ed: what Orrin said.
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If there's a load of chancers who have done a thing that was once given 8B but has settled to less than that then they should be zapped.
Inconceivable that anyone would do a problem because it's got good climbing on it, or any if the other reasons described above. They are clearly all "chancers" and must have all done it just so they can make it onto remus's EliteList.
FWIW I've never been there either and for all I know it could be a load of log moves.
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Very fair points. I have no skin in the game, but I thought the grade vote profile on UKC was an alarm bell so thought I'd ask.
If there's a load of chancers who have done a thing that was once given 8B but has settled to less than that then they should be zapped.
Inconceivable that anyone would do a problem because it's got good climbing on it, or any if the other reasons described above. They are clearly all "chancers" and must have all done it just so they can make it onto remus's EliteList.
FWIW I've never been there either and for all I know it could be a load of log moves.
Chris, it's the fucking Tor. Of course it's shit. A convenient project but shit nonetheless.
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Interestingly, I never actually gave Diluvian 8B (see my insta from 2014).
the post (https://www.instagram.com/p/pHLKtJEQTD/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet)
Turnip edited that last night :lol:
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The grade I have no idea on, its beyond me and almost certainly always will be. But anyhow keen roof has twice as many ascents (on ukc) as fat lip which suggests something about it is easier in some capacity than fat lip despite them being at the same crag.
As this is a slow Tuesday in the (home) office another similarly busy roadside crag for bouldering is the bowderstone surely, but flip flopera (3 ascents), sideshow
(3 ascents) etc seem to not get many repeats. Pretty sure only 4 people have climbed 8b on the bowserstone (Varian, Aidan, JackPal, Hamish McArthur??? ). How does that compare to Parisellas or the Tor for roadside venues?
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Does have something to do with Fat lip been done in 2007? And keen roof 2009?
There no videos or very little info of Bowderstone problem. I couldn’t even tell you where flip opera starts.
Shut up doylo, I only edited the ones with slash grades ;D ;D
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But anyhow keen roof has twice as many ascents (on ukc) as fat lip which suggests something about it is easier in some capacity than fat lip despite them being at the same crag.
It's because Fat Lip wasn't done for years until a new sequence was worked out. I don't think anyone uses Steve's method anymore (it may not even have been repeated using his method either).
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Keen: 8A+? 8B? Fuck knows. Bouldering grades have never and will never make sense. Belly is not 8B+ anyway, even if keen stays at 8B.
Fat: it's harder and easier than keen depending on how big a hook the anasazi you bought has on it and how many goes you get before it starts peeling. Very hard to grade as when it works it feels quite easy - so it's not hard per se, but it's very easy to fall off again and again... If I had to vote I'd vote 8B for it but at the same time if you told me it was 8A I'd believe you.
Hope that clears up all the confusion nicely.
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As this is a slow Tuesday in the (home) office another similarly busy roadside crag for bouldering is the bowderstone surely, but flip flopera (3 ascents), sideshow (3 ascents) etc seem to not get many repeats. Pretty sure only 4 people have climbed 8b on the bowserstone (Varian, Aidan, JackPal, Hamish McArthur??? ). How does that compare to Parisellas or the Tor for roadside venues?
Although the bowderstone is close to the road I'd say it isn't particularly close for a lot of people i.e. it's not close to many big cities.
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I think Fat lip is probably fair at 8B. It’s knacky and it costs you a lot of pairs of shoes, or at least the heels on them. Alex is right though, it doesn’t feel hard when you do it.
It does tell you how messed up UK grades are though.
Get Keen Roof done and you’re all set to try Bombadil, The Rail, The Boss and get that plus grade.
Fragile steps wise when did the new beta emerge?
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As this is a slow Tuesday in the (home) office another similarly busy roadside crag for bouldering is the bowderstone surely, but flip flopera (3 ascents), sideshow (3 ascents) etc seem to not get many repeats. Pretty sure only 4 people have climbed 8b on the bowserstone (Varian, Aidan, JackPal, Hamish McArthur??? ). How does that compare to Parisellas or the Tor for roadside venues?
Although the bowderstone is close to the road I'd say it isn't particularly close for a lot of people i.e. it's not close to many big cities.
Agree with this, the stone is busy by lakes standards but nowhere near as busy as the Tor, where there’s always someone with their phone on a tripod filming themselves on Keen Roof. Hell Lettuce Training even did a keen roof specific training plan!
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From the outside it looks very odd that nobody wants to acknowledge the fact that Keen Roof isn't done as it was originally (I tried this with Keenus during his backpack/plate phase), yet in the same breath, a sequence which avoids the crux move (of a limestone boulder problem) is ripe for the downgrade.
...and if you think this is me sticking up for Pete because he lives less than a mile away, you don't understand our "relationship" :lets_do_it_wild:.
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...and if you think this is me sticking up for Pete because he lives less than a mile away, you don't understand our "relationship" :lets_do_it_wild:.
I think Pete should go and try it to give us a definitive answer; if he can do it, it's 8A+, if he can't it's 8B. Until he can do it, then it'll be back to 8A+ ;)
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JackPal, have you done Keen Roof? How does it compare with all the other 8B's you've been on?
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...and if you think this is me sticking up for Pete because he lives less than a mile away, you don't understand our "relationship" :lets_do_it_wild:.
I think Pete should go and try it to give us a definitive answer; if he can do it, it's 8A+, if he can't it's 8B. Until he can do it, then it'll be back to 8A+ ;)
:D superb.
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Also, didn't Steve originally grade Fat Lip 8A+/B? So it wouldn't even be a downgrade, just a continuation of the same uncertainty that Steve had.
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JackPal, have you done Keen Roof? How does it compare with all the other 8B's you've been on?
Not done it. Only things I’ve done at the tor are bens and fat lip really.
I bet between us on here we could propose some good benchmark 8Bs though. But it would have to be ‘some’ I don’t think one is appropriate. Can’t compare a 2 move one to a 12 move one.
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
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I bet between us on here we could propose some good benchmark 8Bs though. But it would have to be ‘some’ I don’t think one is appropriate. Can’t compare a 2 move one to a 12 move one.
Can we just have a list of the softies instead please? Asking for a friend.
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It's quite funny to me. I've always felt that boulder grades tend to have an average distribution around the mean with .5 grade being the SD. :)
So about 68% would fall within the normal grade range, 13.5% would be "soft", 13.5% "stiff", and the rest simply given the wrong grade. And that's all fine and well... It'll never be perfect, so why worry about it and just let the wrong grades stay. :worms:
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
:agree:
I've heard 8A mentioned for Keen Roof for those in possession of knee skills, especially if combined with lank. :worms:
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
I take it you've compared Mecca with your extensive portfolio of 8b and 8b+ ascents to arrive at your conclusion on grades? Not that anyone knows the difference between hard 8b and easy 8b+ anyway, since they're basically the same thing.
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Don’t worry Jordan, I think Isla de encanta is pretty benchmark..!!! Flashing that thing is just taking the piss. :o
I'm not bothered what makes benchmark status I'm just interested what the boulderers come up with as it's good to know the mark in the sand.
In fact I remember Isla feeling fine ( tried it on the Thursday, fell slapping the jug on the Saturday, went back and did it pretty chilled on the Sunday).
In fact the boulder that made me give up hard bouldering during that run of form was little women and that might have been given 8A+ at the time. I just could not make sense of it and got sick of sliding down the slope on my pads and getting a wedgie........... :o
Other 8Bs since have taken me bloomin ages but I was definitely less of a boulderer by then.
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
I take it you've compared Mecca with your extensive portfolio of 8b and 8b+ ascents to arrive at your conclusion on grades? Not that anyone knows the difference between hard 8b and easy 8b+ anyway, since they're basically the same thing.
Not to mention my extensive knowledge of the Snore, a crag which (thanks be to God) I have not visited - an eighth circle of hell where vainglorious climbers are eternally tortured by vanlifers and Bluetooth speakers.
(Mecca comments are based on the knee pad thread from a couple of years ago).
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Even I liked the Tor.
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:tumble:
So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
The irony of this statement from someone who would upgrade Illywacker despite it being much easier with a pad........
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Not to mention my extensive knowledge of the Snore, a crag which (thanks be to God) I have not visited - an eighth circle of hell where vainglorious climbers are eternally tortured by vanlifers and Bluetooth speakers.
This is like the climbing equivalent of those Fox News reports that describe British cities as Sharia “no-go areas”.
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
I take it you've compared Mecca with your extensive portfolio of 8b and 8b+ ascents to arrive at your conclusion on grades? Not that anyone knows the difference between hard 8b and easy 8b+ anyway, since they're basically the same thing.
Not to mention my extensive knowledge of the Snore, a crag which (thanks be to God) I have not visited - an eighth circle of hell where vainglorious climbers are eternally tortured by vanlifers and Bluetooth speakers.
(Mecca comments are based on the knee pad thread from a couple of years ago).
Spoken like someone who knows the Tor is too hard for them ;)
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To add to the downgrade debate, Andy Jackson did Keen Roof today and said it felt 8A+ with 'tall beta'.
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So basically, Keen Roof is 8A+ with new beta in the same way that Mecca is 8b with a kneepad but they each have to stay as 8B and 8b+ respectively because there are lots of people in Sheffield whose livelihoods or self-worth depend on them being able to tell their sponsors/mums that they've done an 8B/8b+?
I take it you've compared Mecca with your extensive portfolio of 8b and 8b+ ascents to arrive at your conclusion on grades? Not that anyone knows the difference between hard 8b and easy 8b+ anyway, since they're basically the same thing.
Not to mention my extensive knowledge of the Snore, a crag which (thanks be to God) I have not visited - an eighth circle of hell where vainglorious climbers are eternally tortured by vanlifers and Bluetooth speakers.
(Mecca comments are based on the knee pad thread from a couple of years ago).
Lovely autumn day, come over. I dare say you'd enjoy it :kiss2:
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To add to the downgrade debate, Andy Jackson did Keen Roof today and said it felt 8A+ with 'tall beta'.
Came on here to mention this.
On paper Andy ought to be on the list already for Bulbhaul, but I think this is another one where there's a sequence based grade debate?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?igshid=1arr58mvb66a
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36C reckoned Bulbhaul was 8A/+ when he did it. I told him to take the tick, but he channelled his inner Will Hunt and went for the monumental downgrade. :worms:
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Wasn't that more because he finds the move on The Keel harder than the Bulb finish though?
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When Tom P did Bulbhaul originally it was with the old school Bulb sequence (going again from the bulb hold with your RH to the flatty out right) and I bet that was fucking nails after all the other climbing. With the new Bulb sequence it’s not much harder than The Keel, so I can’t imagine the adding ‘haul’ bumping it much more than half a grade above Keelhaul (from my comfortable well worn armchair).
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To add to the downgrade debate, Andy Jackson did Keen Roof today and said it felt 8A+ with 'tall beta'.
Came on here to mention this.
On paper Andy ought to be on the list already for Bulbhaul, but I think this is another one where there's a sequence based grade debate?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?igshid=1arr58mvb66a
and he started two moves in :worms:
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For me there's not much in it between the keel and the new bulb beta, especially being too short to do the Keel any of the usual ways. I find the moves more reliable (and better) on the bulb so I didn't even bother trying Keelhaul. Couldn't touch Peckitt's original beta last time I tried.
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To add to the downgrade debate, Andy Jackson did Keen Roof today and said it felt 8A+ with 'tall beta'.
Came on here to mention this.
On paper Andy ought to be on the list already for Bulbhaul, but I think this is another one where there's a sequence based grade debate?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BT2THfJj-yl/?igshid=1arr58mvb66a
and he started two moves in :worms:
Ha, hadn't noticed that before! Back around Andy.
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I agree with 36c, even if you start in the right place, bulbhaul maybe props up the grade at 8a+ with the high heel beta. It is a good problem though (in the spectrum of odd link ups).
For what it is worth the original beta has only had one repeat to my probably incorrect knowledge (Dan Warren) about ten years ago. I think that sequence probably is worth 8b.
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There we go, official word from the reigning King of the Cliff 🤴
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There we go, official word from the reigning King of the Cliff 🤴
Ha ha tom still wears that crown, I can't even do canine
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For what it is worth the original beta has only had one repeat to my probably incorrect knowledge (Dan Warren) about ten years ago. I think that sequence probably is worth 8b.
He then did Real Keelhaul ten minutes later (or maybe the other way around?)
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I can't even do canine
That's good to know, saves me the bother trying it :2thumbsup:
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I can't even do canine
That's good to know, saves me the bother trying it :2thumbsup:
Haha I thought the same thing :lol:
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I can't even do canine
That's good to know, saves me the bother trying it :2thumbsup:
Haha I thought the same thing :lol:
It is easier for the tall, Nick, you will be fine
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I can't even do canine
That's good to know, saves me the bother trying it :2thumbsup:
Haha I thought the same thing :lol:
It is easier for the tall, Nick, you will be fine
Back around Bradders :P
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Andy J is on the list for his ascent of Keen Roof https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
On a related note, pending a clear consensus for a downgrade Im sticking with Keen Roof at 8B on the list. Doesn't seem to be much controversy about fat lip so gonna leave that at 8B too.
Currently no one is on the list for bulbhaul so Im going to keep it that way.
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If Superpowers isn’t 8C+ then you can remove me from the list as I haven’t climbed 8B yet. To think of that thing as just one grade harder than benchmark stuff like bewilderness is crazy. Just don’t see how it could get repeated. Woods is busy in the states getting schooled on something Aidan put up in a few hours over 2 very hot sessions.
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If Superpowers isn’t 8C+ then you can remove me from the list as I haven’t climbed 8B yet. To think of that thing as just one grade harder than benchmark stuff like bewilderness is crazy. Just don’t see how it could get repeated. Woods is busy in the states getting schooled on something Aidan put up in a few hours over 2 very hot sessions.
That's enough of an endorsement for me. 8C+ it is https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Interesting to compare Woods (https://www.instagram.com/p/CGQEC6apc9A/) and Aidan (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfA7Ay3ix-I) on Railway. Woods ain't no punter, but Aidan makes it look like a different problem.
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Also a classic comparison between UK and US celebrations!
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Bold claim, but I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out to be 9A if anyone is ever able to repeat it...
But thats a whole other kettle of fish :worms:
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Interesting to compare Woods (https://www.instagram.com/p/CGQEC6apc9A/) and Aidan (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfA7Ay3ix-I) on Railway. Woods ain't no punter, but Aidan makes it look like a different problem.
Yeah, Woods has clearly had to find all sorts of little tricks to make it work - adding half a dozen extra moves by the looks of it - whereas Aidan is so strong he can just go bish-bash-bosh-top.
And Woods falls of the move to the lip whilst Aidan just makes that look like a non-event. Cool comparison.
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The contrast is incredibly impressive - Daniel has to match the rail, RH then LH, and then use another LH intermediate to get a gaston / crimp in the groove. Aiden just hit the rail with his RH, swung around for a bit, and pulled straight through to the gaston / crimp. I think Daniel used an extra hold to get to the lip too. And as you said, whilst Aiden'stop-out looked a tiny bit fraught, it seemed more a matter of nerves than the moves being hard (coincidentally I watched the video of him doing Jade today - he was definitely not impressed by the rock quality for the upper parts - the spotters felt the need to reassure him that the post-crux holds would not fall off!).
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Here's a video of Matt Fultz doing it, seemingly with the same beta as Aidan. It is quite surprising that Woods is messing around so much with his beets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGp1cG-Qb9E
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Here's a video of Matt Fultz doing it, seemingly with the same beta as Aidan. It is quite surprising that Woods is messing around so much with his beets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGp1cG-Qb9E
Non-sit sit start. Good link go.
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Here's a video of Matt Fultz doing it, seemingly with the same beta as Aidan. It is quite surprising that Woods is messing around so much with his beets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGp1cG-Qb9E
Non-sit sit start. Good link go.
Bloody Yanks and their ethics...
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i'd assume the reason for woods beta is reach for the second move.
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i'd assume the reason for woods beta is reach for the second move.
He's not that small is he? Basing that entirely on him being able to do Sleepwalker with the same beta as Jimmy Webb whilst Nalle struggled to reach on those moves.
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Think he’s a similar size to me (5’7”) but with a ludicrous ape, think it’s +7” or so.
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Woods’s wants Aidans fingers for Christmas.
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Yeah DW isn't much smaller than Aidan but with longer arms than me. He's a really good build for most climbing. I was really surprised to see him struggling on this but whatever. I'm sure some of Aidan's new problems could be 9A.
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:popcorn:
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Please say he's not going to do a Dan Varian and keep most of the footage to himself :P
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Please say he's not going to do a Dan Varian and keep most of the footage to himself :P
He will take it off private on his Flickr account for 5 days over Christmas but not tell anyone 😄
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Not sure if the FA itself was filmed but we (i.e. lattice) are doing a film about Aidan's recent stuff. Bit of filming happened over the weekend, should include some interviews with Dan V, Jack and a few others.
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Fucking Flickr
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Not sure if the FA itself was filmed but we (i.e. lattice) are doing a film about Aidan's recent stuff. Bit of filming happened over the weekend, should include some interviews with Dan V, Jack and a few others.
ah brilliant, looking forward to that coming out
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Not sure if the FA itself was filmed but we (i.e. lattice) are doing a film about Aidan's recent stuff. Bit of filming happened over the weekend, should include some interviews with Dan V, Jack and a few others.
Fingers crossed that Gaskins is one of the few others :whistle:
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Yes, there's footage of all the harder stuff. Carlisle slapper confirmed on the Aidan thread. Really hope a video is put together and released, would be incredible to see.
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Can someone remind me, did Aidan film all his recent FAs and are we expecting a video to come out at some point?
Not sure if the FA itself was filmed but we (i.e. lattice) are doing a film about Aidan's recent stuff. Bit of filming happened over the weekend, should include some interviews with Dan V, Jack and a few others.
Oh god, who let Jack speak? Bad idea.
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I couldn't find Solly Kemball-Dorey on the list and his dad will not be impressed if I don't point out he's done 8Bs at Tintagel https://www.instagram.com/p/CFpUD-2gu2q/ and Hartland https://www.instagram.com/p/B2mjcQZg84G/ ; https://www.instagram.com/p/CDJn86LAw5Q/
Edit: misspelled
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Put his own 8b FA up recently too, as well as various other 8+ FAs in the South West.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CFSBeXSgcpB/?igshid=d2cinqpqbady (https://www.instagram.com/p/CFSBeXSgcpB/?igshid=d2cinqpqbady)
The lad's a machine but (refreshingly) he's also got taste, has a like for a decent line and is out there seeking them out. (Dad raised him well!) He declared Godzilla at Biblin's as being a bit :shit:. Don't expect him to turn up at the tor anytime soon.
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Hamish Mcarthur did Traci Lords SDS yesterday
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I couldn't find Solly Kemball-Dory on the list and his dad will not be impressed if I don't point out he's done 8Bs at Tintagel https://www.instagram.com/p/CFpUD-2gu2q/ and Hartland https://www.instagram.com/p/B2mjcQZg84G/ ; https://www.instagram.com/p/CDJn86LAw5Q/
Ace, love seeing the young guns getting involved https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
I assume Traci Lords SDS is considered 8B+ now? I know the original 8B from the G was meant to be whack, but Jack's left some comments on UKC suggesting there's a much easier sequence on the stand after hold breakage.
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I think 8B? But I'm not sure. Just thought Hamish should have it by his name too as it's a top tick!
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Hamish did some kind of sit to Shyla Stylez. I talked to him and he wasn’t quite sure on the grade but he didn’t repeat Aidans Traci sit sequence or bother going as far rightwards as him, but that’s probably cause it’s now quite contrived what Aidan did. Certainly in the fact that he did the stand the original ish jump way. Since the emergence of the new hold on that face the whole way it climbs has changed. Some of it is a bit eliminate in nature.
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What he did is obviously fairly hard as Max Milne who is another weapon was with him and he didn’t do it. Hamish said it might be one for the longer gent.
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I think Fat lip is probably fair at 8B. It’s knacky and it costs you a lot of pairs of shoes, or at least the heels on them. Alex is right though, it doesn’t feel hard when you do it.
It does tell you how messed up UK grades are though.
looks from the other channel like bridal did it in solutions? or was that just for sponsors...
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I actually bought a pair of whites to do fat lip from weedkiller as I thought it would give me the edge I needed. Found it worse than my instincts. Megos did it in tenaya. Pete did it in sportivas and I've also seen lots of other shoes doing fat lip too. I think it just depends which shoes fit you.
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Conversely, I hate the whites for everything (because they're flat clumpy shit, and don't fit me that well) but needed a pair for that problem because it feels 6 grades easier with an anaszi heel (for 3 sessions until the shoes start falling apart)
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Solly needs bumping up to 8B+ with his first ascent of Speed of Light on carnage wall. I watched him try this on 3 separate occasions and it definitely looks hard. It starts up the vault (8A+/B) does some hard moves and links into Autobahn (8A). Nice one Solly!
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Solly needs bumping up to 8B+ with his first ascent of Speed of Light on carnage wall. I watched him try this on 3 separate occasions and it definitely looks hard. It starts up the vault (8A+/B) does some hard moves and links into Autobahn (8A). Nice one Solly!
Waddage! FA for your first of the grade is well cool!
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
Thanks for the details on Hamish's ascent Jack. I've added some notes in to clarify what he did and put it down as 8B+ pending any other info on the line/grade. Sounds like it's a bit of a mishmash on that face now.
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Hamish has given the problem on the Traci Lords face 8B, calling it Tracky Lords. I'd disagree that the face is now contrived, Hamish's ascent was the logical line
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Hamish has given the problem on the Traci Lords face 8B, calling it Tracky Lords. I'd disagree that the face is now contrived, Hamish's ascent was the logical line
Making Traci Lords Sit another contender for #biggradesforbadbeta?
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Making Traci Lords Sit another contender for #biggradesforbadbeta?
I believe a crucial hold is now better than when Aidan did the sit
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Hamish has given the problem on the Traci Lords face 8B, calling it Tracky Lords. I'd disagree that the face is now contrived, Hamish's ascent was the logical line
Like I said below, what Aidan did is contrived, the hold was already there when Aidan did the sitter but maybe the easiest beta hadn't emerged yet. But for the record and what anyone knowledgable of that faces history who has climbed on it will tell you, is that there are simply too many problems up there now, with no room inbetween them. Hamish didn't use any extra holds that Aidan didn't but it's been given a new name, which I think proves the point.
Hamish did some kind of sit to Shyla Stylez. I talked to him and he wasn’t quite sure on the grade but he didn’t repeat Aidans Traci sit sequence or bother going as far rightwards as him, but that’s probably cause it’s now quite contrived what Aidan did. Certainly in the fact that he did the stand the original ish jump way. Since the emergence of the new hold on that face the whole way it climbs has changed. Some of it is a bit eliminate in nature.
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Hamish didn't use any extra holds that Aidan didn't but it's been given a new name
Apologies Jack I wasn't aware of the chronology of the hold breaking. The new name came about because Traci Lords SS is gone forever, and in its place is Tracky Lords. Anyway, props to Aidan for hunting the myth in the first place and Hamish for fixing the face.
I've got footage of the ascent which will be out before too long.
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I can only guess that the scouse boulderers must have been up there on the same day to inspire that name.
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Thanks for the clarifications everyone. I've put Hamish back at 8B given that's what he's taken for it.
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Buster has done belly of the beast, but suggested it's 8B
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Given that me and Buster have now both given it 8B I think it's safe to downgrade
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Seems reasonable. I've moved it down to 8B, only person adversely affected is Ethan Walker (unless he's got any other 8B+s to his name?)
https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Whether this is a testament to the climb or how bad I am, I find it freaking tough. Had countless attempts where I get through the crux and fall off the "easy" end section. Even with every knee bar trick I can pull. I'd argue that compared to similarly length "boulders" its comparable in difficulty. That being said my only comparison are Never Ending Story in Magic and my only link up fa's in Forest Rock.
Its a proper nemesis problem for me is what I'm saying and I'll likely take the bigger grade.
Also not to throw him under the bus, but Billy had a right nightmare with Keen Roof alone, having spent numerous sessions over years being stupidly close but never finishing it (until recently that is). Not sure if either of these points make it more valid for being harder or that the both of us have just been a bit spanked really.
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Hamish did some kind of sit to Shyla Stylez.
https://youtu.be/e_asyZWxH0o
Looks like a low start rather than a sit, not sure whether Aidan started in the same place or lower?
Edit: looks like he started on same holds but hard to tell
https://www.instagram.com/p/BRJTDvjD8iO/?igshid=137oubnuo5e2w
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Seems a bit bizarre to call that a first ascent, or change the name. Surely it's just a different sequence / repeat after hold break?
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In the 2nd vid he starts sat on something with his arms straight/ full stretch. In the first vid he pulls on with his arms bent almost in locked position.
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Seems a bit bizarre to call that a first ascent, or change the name. Surely it's just a different sequence / repeat after hold break?
Because it's not Traci Lords. That problem doesn't really exist since the hold break, leaving the face somewhat confusing as evidenced by this thread. Hamish fixed all that by climbing the one logical, easiest line. The person who suggested taking it as a FA was Aidan.
Hamish started on the same holds
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I love it. The original FA and the new FA talk and it all makes sense to them. The armchair guys can't figure it out.
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Seems a bit bizarre to call that a first ascent, or change the name. Surely it's just a different sequence / repeat after hold break?
Pretty sure the hold was broken (as he uses it for his left hand to do the stand) when aidan did it, he just opted to climb it that way, which is why it's contrived. Could be wrong
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I love it. The original FA and the new FA talk and it all makes sense to them. The armchair guys can't figure it out.
Haha fair enough, I didn't know it was Aidan's recommendation. Still seems weird to me given how close the lines are and shared /skipped holds etc. but whatever.
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Lewis Roy - Sanction - Dumby
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Lewis Roy - Sanction - Dumby
Didn't he only do supersize me recently? Good consolidation if so! https://github.com/bourbonspecial/UKStrongPeople/blob/master/men_boulders.md
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Sam Mawson did Cypher today. Great to see, been on the cards for a while, and couldn't happen to a nicer chap. Plus he has some of the strongest fingers in Yorkshire!
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Sam Mawson did Cypher today. Great to see, been on the cards for a while, and couldn't happen to a nicer chap. Plus he has some of the strongest fingers in Yorkshire!
https://www.instagram.com/p/CHqgmhpDJ-s/?igshid=d1hp0epjfo0p
Pics and vid in the link above. Love the top out! No sound but felt like a oh fuck I’ve done it what do I do now moment!!
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Sam and I were trying to work out who's now done Cypher- We got to B Moon, S Dunning, D Varian, R Pasquill, T Newman, B Freeman, N Ceria ......
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oh and D.Mason
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Andy Earl
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Plus he has some of the strongest fingers in Yorkshire!
That's good, because from the vid he's clearly trying to not wear out his shoes! ;)
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Plus he has some of the strongest fingers in Yorkshire!
That's good, because from the vid he's clearly trying to not wear out his shoes! ;)
To be fair, there is only really one foot hold on the whole problem.
Great effort Sam, super cool to see another local youngster coming through and climbing hard on the Grit. Its been really cool to see a few of the younger Yorkshire climbers (Will Buck and James Turnbull) developing over the years. Interestingly, I guess they have all taken similar paths, being brought up climbing outside with their dads. Awesome.
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Thank you for the kind words ;D and yeah that's exactly what went through my mind TomTom - was quite a shock to hold it haha! As for the footwork at the top it wasn't my finest work but makes a good laugh looking back at it - I think I was in a bit of a daze :lol:
Thanks all :D
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To be fair, there is only really one foot hold on the whole problem.
Yep, but this ascent is even less footsome than others I've seen (sits back in armchair, adjusts slippers, draws on pipe).
CD, you looked surprised to be at that point, and were making it up! Great effort.
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Thank you for the kind words ;D and yeah that's exactly what went through my mind TomTom - was quite a shock to hold it haha! As for the footwork at the top it wasn't my finest work but makes a good laugh looking back at it - I think I was in a bit of a daze :lol:
Thanks all :D
Bloody awesome. Well done. A massive tick.
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Thank you for the kind words ;D and yeah that's exactly what went through my mind TomTom - was quite a shock to hold it haha! As for the footwork at the top it wasn't my finest work but makes a good laugh looking back at it - I think I was in a bit of a daze :lol:
Thanks all :D
Bloody awesome. Well done. A massive tick.
Exactly. Perfectly captured that oh shit I've done it moment for me. And great to see that someone working super hard 8B experiences the same as punters on easier stuff :)
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Mat Wright has just climbed Serenata 8C at Impossible Roof
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Waddage! Funny as I was just reading a post of his yesterday where it sounded like he was a way off getting it done.
https://climbing-history.org/
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I see you’ve added keen roof to Joe Lawson’s haul, he thought it to be 8A+ for the record.
The nesscliffe thing is a there and back and then an up? And that gets on the list?
Didn’t Smitton get left off cause it was a trav into an up?
Oh and The Boss got a repeat a good while back. Pretty cool I thought.
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I see you’ve added keen roof to Joe Lawson’s haul, he thought it to be 8A+ for the record.
The nesscliffe thing is a there and back and then an up? And that gets on the list?
Didn’t Smitton get left off cause it was a trav into an up?
Oh and The Boss got a repeat a good while back. Pretty cool I thought.
Fair point on Smitton, I'll add him in. Barrows is on there for Wheel of Life which is a more trav, and seems kinda hard to separate travs from boulder problems.
Who was it who repeated The Boss? Strong work whoever it was.
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I heard it was will hunt and he recons 6C+
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Oh and The Boss got a repeat a good while back. Pretty cool I thought.
Fucks sake Jack spill the beans, who repeated it? Very cool but the people need details.
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I heard it was will hunt and he recons 6C+
6C+/7A...
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I heard it was will hunt and he recons 6C+
Got it in one haha.
Unfortunately for The Boss it isn’t a link at the tor so I didn’t think you guys would care. ;) Otherwise I’d have blown Micky’s cover a month ago.
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To drag things back on topic, is there a concensus on the grade for Steve Dunning's Super Furry Animals? It was on the list at 8B+, then 8B on eliteukbouldering and 8A+ on UKC.
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To drag things back on topic, is there a concensus on the grade for Steve Dunning's Super Furry Animals? It was on the list at 8B+, then 8B on eliteukbouldering and 8A+ on UKC.
Has this even been repeated?
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I'm not sure it's part of the Lattice cash for grades scam so 8A+ is fine.
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I'm not sure it's part of the Lattice cash for grades scam so 8A+ is fine.
What’s this refer to? :shrug:
Sounds interesting :popcorn:
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8B sit, 8A+ stand, I think.
Probably one of those that is impossible to grade, I think you would have to be quite tall.
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I'm not sure it's part of the Lattice cash for grades scam so 8A+ is fine.
What’s this refer to? :shrug:
Sounds interesting :popcorn:
If you pay Lattice a load of money they'll put you on their "Wannabe to 8B" training programme, guaranteed to get you up that magic grade. It's geared to getting people up Keen Roof. Remus (Lattice number cruncher and keeper of the list) can't downgrade Keen Roof as there'll be a load of people asking for their money back.
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Didn’t Smitton do that thing at Dog’s Dinner Buttress? Or is that considered a route?
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Didn’t Smitton do that thing at Dog’s Dinner Buttress? Or is that considered a route?
Pedigree chum at Dog's dinner buttress gets an 8c+ route grade as its so long. Steve McClure's version, which differs by staying low at the end gets 9a+.
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8B sit, 8A+ stand, I think.
Probably one of those that is impossible to grade, I think you would have to be quite tall.
Good knowledge, thanks Dan.
Didn’t Smitton do that thing at Dog’s Dinner Buttress? Or is that considered a route?
Been meaning to add him to the list, will do it shortly. He's done another hard trav at the tor as well hasn't he?
I made the (fairly arbitrary) decision to put travs on the boulder list rather than the route list.
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I'm not sure it's part of the Lattice cash for grades scam so 8A+ is fine.
What’s this refer to? :shrug:
Sounds interesting :popcorn:
If you pay Lattice a load of money they'll put you on their "Wannabe to 8B" training programme, guaranteed to get you up that magic grade. It's geared to getting people up Keen Roof. Remus (Lattice number cruncher and keeper of the list) can't downgrade Keen Roof as there'll be a load of people asking for their money back.
Capitalism at its worst.
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I'm not sure it's part of the Lattice cash for grades scam so 8A+ is fine.
What’s this refer to? :shrug:
Sounds interesting :popcorn:
If you pay Lattice a load of money they'll put you on their "Wannabe to 8B" training programme, guaranteed to get you up that magic grade. It's geared to getting people up Keen Roof. Remus (Lattice number cruncher and keeper of the list) can't downgrade Keen Roof as there'll be a load of people asking for their money back.
Don't worry I'm keen to go and try it, they'll have to if i do it, seems the done thing.
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Been meaning to add him to the list, will do it shortly. He's done another hard trav at the tor as well hasn't he?
Staminaband / PUTP link?
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Been meaning to add him to the list, will do it shortly. He's done another hard trav at the tor as well hasn't he?
Staminaband / PUTP link?
Ah yeah that's the one, thanks. https://climbing-history.org/climb/152
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Cool to compile people's hard climbs but list doesn't really make for great reading in my opinion. I know it may be in it's infancy but some of the folk with more listed climbs than people like Ned is farcical, myself included. He has done over 100 8B's!!!! You are never going to compile or know how many of each grade someone has done, especially someone like Ned or Micky. Never mind keep track of the folk who choose to bullshit about ascents.
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There you go remus. Since JackPal's been sacked as a UKB news reporter, he's now your new list co-curator!
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Cool to compile people's hard climbs but list doesn't really make for great reading in my opinion. I know it may be in it's infancy but some of the folk with more listed climbs than people like Ned is farcical, myself included. He has done over 100 8B's!!!! You are never going to compile or know how many of each grade someone has done, especially someone like Ned or Micky. Never mind keep track of the folk who choose to bullshit about ascents.
8B+ and higher list instead that way less people like Jack and I can cheat our way on it with link ups or easy climbs.
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There you go remus. Since JackPal's been sacked as a UKB news reporter, he's now your new list co-curator!
Ah this is excellent news, delighted with the new role. First bit of business is removing keen roof from the list, get that work load cut in half straight away.
Off on annual leave for a couple months now. Those links aren’t going to climb themselves.
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Cool to compile people's hard climbs but list doesn't really make for great reading in my opinion. I know it may be in it's infancy but some of the folk with more listed climbs than people like Ned is farcical, myself included. He has done over 100 8B's!!!! You are never going to compile or know how many of each grade someone has done, especially someone like Ned or Micky. Never mind keep track of the folk who choose to bullshit about ascents.
An exhaustive list of stuff people have climbed has never been an aim and never will be because it's way too much work, and most likely totally infeasible even if you had all the time in the world (for the reasons you've mentioned).
The new site is just a more convenient way of logging interesting ascents. At the moment this is the hardest stuff people have done, though I've been thinking about expanding it out to include more hard FA details and ascents in particular styles e.g. hard flash/onsight ascents, first of the grade stuff etc.
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Ed Hamer is on the list for Louis Armstrong, but he also did keen roof in 2012 https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.269983799759184&type=3&comment_id=270364529721111
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Also, James Pearson is on the list as 'James Peason' with 8B for keen roof. He did his first 8B+ in January, Master and Cifuentes in Alcañiz, Spain https://www.climber.co.uk/news/news/master-and-cifuentes-font-8b-for-james-pearson/
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Ed Hamer is on the list for Louis Armstrong, but he also did keen roof in 2012 https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.269983799759184&type=3&comment_id=270364529721111
Thanks, I've added this one in but generally Im not gonna bother keeping an exhaustive list of everything that's been done at 8B and above as it's too much work. Will probably stop at around 2-3 ascents per person in future, though seems sensible to record more if they're interesting ascents (flashes, early ascents at a grade, FAs etc.)
Also, James Pearson is on the list as 'James Peason' with 8B for keen roof. He did his first 8B+ in January, Master and Cifuentes in Alcañiz, Spain https://www.climber.co.uk/news/news/master-and-cifuentes-font-8b-for-james-pearson/
Good shout, I've added that in.
https://climbing-history.org/
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Matt Cousins topped The Ace at the plantation earlier today, a good effort!
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What with?
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Never mind keep track of the folk who choose to bullshit about ascents.
Oof, did I miss something? :worms:
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Liam Halsey did Cypher a couple of weeks back. In a session apparently. He's probably already ticked 8B but he'd be the last person to tell anyone.
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Liam Halsey did Cypher a couple of weeks back. In a session apparently. He's probably already ticked 8B but he'd be the last person to tell anyone.
Waddage! Cypher is such a cool line.
https://climbing-history.org/list/3
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Adam Watson has done few, Master of stone and Ammagamma + cherry picking in the grampins I think. probs more
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Joe Lawson did tomahawk this morn, much deserved and 8B+ according to Ned, Bosi and Orrin. Get him bumped up.
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Joe Lawson did tomahawk this morn, much deserved and 8B+ according to Ned, Bosi and Orrin. Get him bumped up.
Effort. I It felt crap on the Maglime today
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Joe Lawson did tomahawk this morn, much deserved and 8B+ according to Ned, Bosi and Orrin. Get him bumped up.
Effort. I It felt crap on the Maglime today
That's the secret to good mag lime connies, don't go spreading it
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Good knowledge all, thanks!
https://climbing-history.org/list/3
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New name in the frame I think?
https://www.instagram.com/p/CMfsgN2D_TG/?igshid=1ouchxbdrg0wq
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Shame about the dab on that chalk bag his mate is holding ;)
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Good spot Bradders. Always good to have another new entrant on the list.
https://climbing-history.org/list/3
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Did he start in the right place? There is about 4 or so moves before where the video starts
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he talks about the start position in the vid text
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Ah yes...
That sounds a bit dubious, surely missing out the first section of a traverse means you haven't done the problem?
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He's done A problem that is apparently still 8B...
Superpong Me 8B
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He's done A problem that is apparently still 8B...
Superpong Me 8B
Ha ha indeed, I wish I knew I could just miss out the start when I was trying it.
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New name in the frame I think?
https://www.instagram.com/p/CMfsgN2D_TG/?igshid=1ouchxbdrg0wq
He has particularly nice and floaty movement. Like I'd imagine moving if I woke up 50% lighter one day.
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He's done A problem that is apparently still 8B...
Superpong Me 8B
Ha ha indeed, I wish I knew I could just miss out the start when I was trying it.
Huh, yeah that doesn't sound legit :-\
New name in the frame I think?
https://www.instagram.com/p/CMfsgN2D_TG/?igshid=1ouchxbdrg0wq
He has particularly nice and floaty movement. Like I'd imagine moving if I woke up 50% lighter one day.
Yes I thought that too. Nice to watch.
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Shame about the dab on that chalk bag his mate is holding ;)
So close to the end too, he must have been gutted...
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He has particularly nice and floaty movement. Like I'd imagine moving if I woke up 50% lighter one day.
Or 50% stronger. Or both..
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He has particularly nice and floaty movement. Like I'd imagine moving if I woke up 50% lighter one day.
Or 50% stronger. Or both..
Hah that's a good pick up and thanks for calling me out on the lighter is better thing.
I meant more in relation to suddenly defying gravity for a brief moment. Waking up on the moon might be a better analogy.
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Except that big but strong people rarely look floaty, it's the waifs that do
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I look floaty. In the pool. in fact some people mistake me for a floaty
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Except that big but strong people rarely look floaty, it's the waifs that do
I would have said the opposite. It’s the big strong people that look floaty.
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he talks about the start position in the vid text
a certain msmith5067 has commented upon the video
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he talks about the start position in the vid text
a certain msmith5067 has commented upon the video
Was that you, Tim5067?
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he talks about the start position in the vid text
a certain msmith5067 has commented upon the video
Hah!
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Flinn Mcinerney did flip flopera at the Bowderstone today https://www.instagram.com/p/CSMR1hlDWOa/?utm_medium=copy_link
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Flinn Mcinerney did flip flopera at the Bowderstone today https://www.instagram.com/p/CSMR1hlDWOa/?utm_medium=copy_link
Waddage! Am I right in thinking that's his first of the grade?
https://climbing-history.org/climber/1003/flinn-mcinerny
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That's correct, think he only did his first 8A+ a few months ago
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Remus, I think you've missed an e near the end of Flinn's surname :)
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Remus, I think you've missed an e near the end of Flinn's surname :)
Good spot! Sorted
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Andy Hutchinson did Mr Lambtastic (8B at griffs) today. His first of the grade, really good scenes at the crag.
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Great knowledge as per Jack, and congrats to Andy! Big news getting on the list ;)
Out of interest, where does Mr. Lambtastic go? Looks like it's written up on peakbouldering.info but the site is down.
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It climbs Rich’s traverse into bovine, so a big left to right traverse finishing with some sapping moves up to the top of bovine. Proper power endurance test piece, probably less than a minutes climbing but not one easy move on it.
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Beast! Nice one Hutch. Beefy link that one
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Out of interest, where does Mr. Lambtastic go? Looks like it's written up on peakbouldering.info but the site is down.
The pages from Peak district bouldering can still be viewed on the Wayback machine
http://peakbouldering.info/areas/5-central-limestone/crags/109-blackwell-dale/boulders/534-griff-s-buttress/problems/6301-mr-lambtastic
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Rhys Langlands climbed Zero at the weekend. What a champ. It's getting more repeats than all of Dave's Nevis cave lines combined!
https://www.instagram.com/rhyslanglands1/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_mid=0055A71D-70A0-4E0A-98BD-AECBE741F087
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Was about to say Leo skinner has bouldered 8B+ with Louis High Society at Bacon Hole but you've beaten me to it!
Adam Smith has done the vault and combination at carnage wall both 8B
If the Rail and Bombadil are going to be upgraded for Dan V then surely so does Crescendo, and if that goes up then Flipnic maybe starts to make more sense at 8B+?
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Oh are they getting upgraded then? That'd be cool
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On the list remus has made the other 2 have been changed to 8C without a repeat... I would guess bombadil hasnt been tried, the rail. Idk but I'd imagine crescendo has had a few attempts over the years?
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Was about to say Leo skinner has bouldered 8B+ with Louis High Society at Bacon Hole but you've beaten me to it!
Adam Smith has done the vault and combination at carnage wall both 8B
Good knowledge, I've added him in.
If the Rail and Bombadil are going to be upgraded for Dan V then surely so does Crescendo, and if that goes up then Flipnic maybe starts to make more sense at 8B+?
Obviously my opinion on Bombadil + The Rail is total guess work, but just basing it on Dan's idiosyncratic use of 8A+/8B/8B+, how long the problems took him and his mega tick list of problems >8A in the UK and abroad. If/when people start repeating them I'll obviously adjust the grade on ch based on their opinions.
What's Crescendo? On the bowderstone presumably but I can't find much mention of it. Happy to go with what other people think for that and Flipnic, I've got no opinion.
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That's fair, I honestly can't say re crescendo but it seems like another of the problems capped by Dan's system to me, and I think it's the cause for bowderstone grading being confusing...
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Ben Gladstone got the second ascent of an 8B called "Lost In The Moment" at Forest Rock not long ago. Sam Blackwell got the third ascent a couple of weeks later.
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Obviously my opinion on Bombadil + The Rail is total guess work, but just basing it on Dan's idiosyncratic use of 8A+/8B/8B+, how long the problems took him and his mega tick list of problems >8A in the UK and abroad. If/when people start repeating them I'll obviously adjust the grade on ch based on their opinions.
Obviously this is just my opinion, but I don't really see how you can have an opinion on the grade of any problem you've never tried... he said 8B+ for them both, in the absence of any other view from actual repeaters (or at least people who've tried them), I think they should stay at what he said.
Notwithstanding that I completely agree with you that Dan's approach to grading makes no sense whatsoever.
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You can't have an opinion on whether Dan's grading makes any sense unless you've tried the problems in question :chair:
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Pointing out that "these are a grade harder than 8B+s I've done but I didn't give them 8C because I've not done Shadowplay," in a world where Shadowplay never got done, does not make logical sense does feel like a fair point though.
Ahh the spectre of Gaskins looms large even now...
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Obviously this is just my opinion, but I don't really see how you can have an opinion on the grade of any problem you've never tried... he said 8B+ for them both, in the absence of any other view from actual repeaters (or at least people who've tried them), I think they should stay at what he said.
I think what you've described is a good rule of thumb, but as a hypothetical imagine you had a climber who graded all their first ascents a number grade lower than what they then settled at (e.g. they grade 6A, it settles at 7A, they grade 6B+ it settles at 7B+ etc.) If this pattern stuck for the last 100 problems they put up I think you could take a decent guess that a problem they just gave 6B was likely to be harder than that.
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Obviously this is just my opinion, but I don't really see how you can have an opinion on the grade of any problem you've never tried... he said 8B+ for them both, in the absence of any other view from actual repeaters (or at least people who've tried them), I think they should stay at what he said.
I think what you've described is a good rule of thumb, but as a hypothetical imagine you had a climber who graded all their first ascents a number grade lower than what they then settled at (e.g. they grade 6A, it settles at 7A, they grade 6B+ it settles at 7B+ etc.) If this pattern stuck for the last 100 problems they put up I think you could take a decent guess that a problem they just gave 6B was likely to be harder than that.
The difference there though is that presumably by "settled" you mean various repeaters suggested the higher grade which became the consensus. How many of Dan's problems have actually been repeated AND upgraded by those repeaters?
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We're assuming people would upgrade problems which isn't something which happens in the UK lots imo... Particularly in the 8s
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Leos gone and done another 8b+ this week!
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What a beast! He's on a good run of form at the mo.
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Jon Freeman has done Steppenwolf.
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Thanks for the update, I've added him to the listhttps://climbing-history.org/list/3/strong-british-male-boulderers
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Joe Lawson has done Mortal Immortal at 8B+ (think tomahawk gets a slash?)
Rowan Page has done Flip Flopera at 8B
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Joe Lawson has done Mortal Immortal at 8B+ (think tomahawk gets a slash?)
Rowan Page has done Flip Flopera at 8B
Good knowledge, added them both. Did Joe do Mortal Immortal recently? I see a tantalising hidden log on UKC from a few days ago.
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Today I believe
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Luke Dawson has done steppenwolf too (and I think Pete did too) it presume they are both already in the list for other things?
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Luke Dawson has done steppenwolf too (and I think Pete did too) it presume they are both already in the list for other things?
They were indeed already on the list, airways good to add in a couple of extra ascents though in case something gets downgraded.
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Looks like Rhys Langland did it too, sorry can't access his IG on work laptop.
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Yes he did, more to come from Invereminem too hopefully.
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He's been busting out a few 8s in quick succession, looks like a good trip. Taken the DMac hair chopping strategy.
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He's been busting out a few 8s in quick succession, looks like a good trip. Taken the DMac hair chopping strategy.
Pablo is still there though... :-\
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Pablo is to Rhys what hair was to Samson (unfortunately for us)
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Pablo is to Rhys what hair was to Samson (unfortunately for us)
I disagree in the strongestly way possible, Pablo "The Blade" TescoBar is truly a living wonder of the world. Do they Not say "See Pablo and then Die" ?
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Luke Dawson has done Tigris which is apparently 8B+? (his logbook comment sounds dubious?)
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Luke Dawson has done Tigris which is apparently 8B+? (his logbook comment sounds dubious?)
Good spot. His first of the grade I believe? I think he'd be pretty safe taking 8B+ for it if he wanted, the five ascents on 8a have all gone for 8B+.
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Aidan dunne has gone from 7c+ to 8b with superman
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Aidan dunne has gone from 7c+ to 8b with superman
Mega, that's quite the jump!
https://climbing-history.org/list/3/strong-british-male-boulderers
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Levan Rowan has done Keen Roof. Looks like he spanned to the lip off a knee and the big left jug! Is that a :worms: ?
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You can go (if tall) to an edge on the lip (not the big hold) with the knee then drop out lh to undercut then flick rh to good hold. That was my method and I think Ed Hamer used something similar before that
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You can go (if tall) to an edge on the lip (not the big hold) with the knee then drop out lh to undercut then flick rh to good hold. That was my method and I think Ed Hamer used something similar before that
I think Will Smith used this method too and reckoned 8A/+ or so (from memory).
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Pretty sure from Levens stories before (but could be wrong) he did it he was going again to the good hold by taking the knee out and bumping, then dropping to the bad undercut on the way to match the stand starting hold
Might be that he uploads a vid of the send which would confirm.
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Will used the hold on the lip but then went LH to the good hold, not sure if anyone else has done it like that? https://youtu.be/U33vrtq1NU4
Dawid did something going all the way to the good hold IIRC but it seemed a long way to me even as a tall guy!
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From watching that, pretty sure Leven bumped again, must be a big lad!
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Brad Bushell has done Isla De Encanta at Trowbarrow today
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Marco Giudice has done Eagle Huntress Sit at Mardale Head. Pretty incredible looking thing!
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Thanks for the heads up, added him to the list.
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Marco Giudice has done Eagle Huntress Sit at Mardale Head. Pretty incredible looking thing!
Hero! 🤘
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Marco Giudice has done Eagle Huntress Sit at Mardale Head. Pretty incredible looking thing!
Was a pleasure to witness this, what a legend!!
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Awesome work, does the list include people who are now based in the UK permanently but were originally from elsewhere then? Sorry if this is discussed elsewhere I just didn't realise, if it is true then Sara Dusza needs adding to the ladies list for doing Little Northumberland. Have noticed that Polish Dave is also on the mens list so I assume that is the case?
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I know the south seems like a foreign country, but Marco is from High Wycombe 😄
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Awesome work, does the list include people who are now based in the UK permanently but were originally from elsewhere then? Sorry if this is discussed elsewhere I just didn't realise, if it is true then Sara Dusza needs adding to the ladies list for doing Little Northumberland. Have noticed that Polish Dave is also on the mens list so I assume that is the case?
Yeah, it's much more 'people who currently live in the UK' than people who were born in the UK. Admittedly it's not very rigorously applied though (e.g. Ayesha Khan is apparently from Canada but seems to live in the UK at the mo).
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I know the south seems like a foreign country, but Marco is from High Wycombe 😄
I heard he was originally Italian before I posted... Apologies if that's false.
But yeah Sara has been UK based for 10+ years then if that means she should be on the ladies list
Ayesha was my next suggestion haha
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no taxation without representation
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You leave that tea where it is
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Zed Oliver-Jones did Dernier Atrocity at parisellas cave the other day as his first 8B
Nevermind he's on the list doh!
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Kyle Whitehand has climbed The Vault at Hartland which I believe is his first 8B
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Matt Helliker did it too I believe
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Good knowledge, thanks both.
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Matt Helliker did it too I believe
That’s a good effort climbing your first Font 8b in your forties.
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Very much the in vogue 8b down these parts.
Kyle's first 8b, him and Matt have been working it together.
Mikey Cleverdon repeated it in the autumn too and a visiting Dave Barrans (cruised it in very short time.. good/humbling to witness I'm still battling away with the 7c!)
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Keen roof is 8A+ in the new peak bouldering guide apparently... Is the list about to get much shorter? :popcorn:
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Loool
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The funniest change is Truffle Pig gets 6B+ now. Absolutely brutal.
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The funniest change is Truffle Pig gets 6B+ now. Absolutely brutal.
Tbf that got downgraded like 8 months ago so not a surprise to most people lol
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Thoughts and prayers for Sisyphean Lattice staff who are now working overtime to come up with a Wannabe To 8B programme that will actually get the desperate Sheffield try-hards up an 8B.
The EA have just issued a flood warning as the River of Tears flowing through the streets is threatening to breach the levees of the Sheaf and Porter Brook.
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Thoughts and prayers for Sisyphean Lattice staff who are now working overtime to come up with a Wannabe To 8B programme that will actually get the desperate Sheffield try-hards up an 8B.
The EA have just issued a flood warning as the River of Tears flowing through the streets is threatening to breach the levees of the Sheaf and Porter Brook.
You sound more salty than the people who’ve climbed keen roof mate :lol:
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The only thing I'm salty about is people targeting patently misgraded climbs (you see it in trad and sport too) so that they can claim to have climbed a particular grade.
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Some data nerds (Remus!) should make a graph of the rate of logged ascents of given climbs over time, with markers indicating when the grade was officially reduced, and maybe also when beta videos were publicised, to locate the point at which the softie chasers identified their target.
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The only thing I'm salty about is people targeting patently misgraded climbs (you see it in trad and sport too) so that they can claim to have climbed a particular grade.
Climbing something that is soft for the grade to try and work towards breaking through into a new grade isn’t unheard of. Ok so it’s soft, why has it taken 7 years or however long since the last guidebook to “confirm” this?
You can’t blame people if the majority are saying it’s a certain grade and then you have 5 wads saying it’s soft. Maybe if we’re going by majority voting then it’s not soft? I don’t have much of a stake in it personally as I’m not even close to climbing those sort of grades, but seems pretty reductive to just say it’s people trying to grade chase as if you haven’t probably done the same but with easier grades :lol:
P.s. please consider the fact that not everyone is 6 foot and can lank the fuck out of it?
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I don't disagree with Keen going down to 8A+, but the idea that it was "patently misgraded" at 8B doesn't really hold much weight given that some people who've done loads of 8Bs think it's 8B :shrug: that doesn't mean it is necessarily 8B, but it does mean it's not "patently misgraded"
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The only thing I'm salty about is people targeting patently misgraded climbs (you see it in trad and sport too) so that they can claim to have climbed a particular grade.
Climbing something that is soft for the grade to try and work towards breaking through into a new grade isn’t unheard of. Ok so it’s soft, why has it taken 7 years or however long since the last guidebook to “confirm” this?
You can’t blame people if the majority are saying it’s a certain grade and then you have 5 wads saying it’s soft. Maybe if we’re going by majority voting then it’s not soft? I don’t have much of a stake in it personally as I’m not even close to climbing those sort of grades, but seems pretty reductive to just say it’s people trying to grade chase as if you haven’t probably done the same but with easier grades :lol:
P.s. please consider the fact that not everyone is 6 foot and can lank the fuck out of it?
Trying something that's soft is very different from trying something that's had kneebars added to it bringing the grade down.
When looking at grade votes on these things which are popular easy target, a lot of the votes confirming 8B/7a/7A/whatever are from the people for whom the climb represents their only tick of the grade, thus they have the most to lose by a downgrade (and also the least experience of the grade).
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Keen roof is to UKB as three pebble slab is to UKC.
Also, plenty of people with experience at the grade logging it at 8B https://www.8a.nu/crags/bouldering/united-kingdom/raven-tor/sectors/raven-tor/routes/keen-roof/
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Yes but don’t you guys know? Will absolutely and positively KNOWS that they’re all taking 8B cause they want to inflate their egos or something along those lines :lol: you should go get it done and let us know if it’s 8B will.
Definitely has nothing to do with the climb being morpho or anything lmao
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Ok so it’s soft, why has it taken 7 years or however long since the last guidebook to “confirm” this?
You can't have it both ways. If it had only been a year since the last guide you'd be saying it wasn't enough time to have a consensus. 7 years is plenty, and there are comments saying it was 8A+ basically from when knee pads became widely used. One even suggests 8A!
Also “grade votes" are bollocks and if that's the best argument for it being 8B it should be downgraded on the spot. You and I can go and vote on them and we haven't climbed it! By a distance the dumbest, most reductive feature of ukc.
Remus is right, this discussion is endlessly hilarious and I'm here for it. Perhaps ascentionists should unionise and picket the UKC offices.
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Ok so it’s soft, why has it taken 7 years or however long since the last guidebook to “confirm” this?
You can't have it both ways. If it had only been a year since the last guide you'd be saying it wasn't enough time to have a consensus. 7 years is plenty, and there are comments saying it was 8A+ basically from when knee pads became widely used. One even suggests 8A!
Also “grade votes" are bollocks and if that's the best argument for it being 8B it should be downgraded on the spot. You and I can go and vote on them and we haven't climbed it! By a distance the dumbest, most reductive feature of ukc.
Remus is right, this discussion is endlessly hilarious and I'm here for it. Perhaps ascentionists should unionise and picket the UKC offices.
The guide book point was tongue in cheek. Why is the rockfax guidebook or even ukc the end all of grading anyways. Like you said the voting feature is dumb as fuck as anyone can vote grades and even bin vote stuff when they haven’t stepped within 5km of it ;)
But we can look at multiple sources (ukc, 8a.nu, Instagram green ticks) and see that there are numerous wads including Bosi who have taken 8B for it, I find it laughable that Will Hunt even has an opinion on whether something is 8B, I prefer to stay in my lane and let people who climb those grades hash it out among them, even if someone has gone to do it cause it’s a bit soft what does that matter, they’re still climbing much harder than most of us are and could probably do it even without kneepads. Also going back to what I said before, the problem is quite lankable and I feel like you can’t take an 8B from someone if they can’t lank the shit out of it because to them it’s probably still felt 8B.
Finally, what about all the mega beasts who are obviously WAY stronger than the problem. We can look at Mr Palmieri who pretty much cruises every climb from 8A to 8B, can his gradar even really be trusted? :-\
Can yours… -looks into camera-
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Grade fight, grade fight :boxing: :punk: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
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Every time I've met Jack he's mentioned that he hasn't got a clue about grades any more.
Bosi isn't going to proffer a downgrade because that would be like Messi turning up to a kid's football match and protesting to the ref that a goal was offside.
I have considered going to the Snore to climb Keen Roof but it would end my 30-something year streak of not visiting the crag. Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
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Every time I've met Jack he's mentioned that he hasn't got a clue about grades any more.
Bosi isn't going to proffer a downgrade because that would be like Messi turning up to a kid's football match and protesting to the ref that a goal was offside.
I have considered going to the Snore to climb Keen Roof but it would end my 30-something year streak of not visiting the crag. Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
Yeah my point made then. How can we trust the mega wads!
Also Bosi is out and about downgrading everyone’s projects, he’s no stranger to upsetting the kids!
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To my knowledge there is no other up to date guide to peak bouldering than ukc/rockfax? So I guess that's why they are considered the final word on grading, if only by default.
They exist precisely to get rid of the tiresome bollocks of "taking" a grade for something. To butcher the meme, one does not simply give the problem the grade one likes. The problem is graded and everyone gets in line and accepts it, or teeth are gnashed and in time it goes up or down until the wailing and gnashing is minimised.
Anyway, philosophical discussion aside, the concept of staying in ones lane and kowtowing to the opinion of "wads" is, imo, hierarchical nonsense. It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing. The info is there to be interpreted by those who wish to. From the info available, I'm perfectly comfortable saying if I was writing the guide it would be in at 8A+. You've got some guy on ukc who did it 6 sessions (should have been 4 apparently...) having never done an 8A before. Nah, sorry! Other views are of course valid (albeit wrong) :)
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Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
Amusingly I distinctly remember my first visit to Malham including a thought along the lines of "is this it"? :lol:
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Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
Amusingly I distinctly remember my first visit to Malham including a thought along the lines of "is this it"? :lol:
Fucking hell. Boulderers, there's no hope!
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To my knowledge there is no other up to date guide to peak bouldering than ukc/rockfax? So I guess that's why they are considered the final word on grading, if only by default.
They exist precisely to get rid of the tiresome bollocks of "taking" a grade for something. To butcher the meme, one does not simply give the problem the grade one likes. The problem is graded and everyone gets in line and accepts it, or teeth are gnashed and in time it goes up or down until the wailing and gnashing is minimised.
Anyway, philosophical discussion aside, the concept of staying in ones lane and kowtowing to the opinion of "wads" is, imo, hierarchical nonsense. It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing. The info is there to be interpreted by those who wish to. From the info available, I'm perfectly comfortable saying if I was writing the guide it would be in at 8A+. You've got some guy on ukc who did it 6 sessions (should have been 4 apparently...) having never done an 8A before. Nah, sorry! Other views are of course valid (albeit wrong) :)
Grades are very subjective a lot of the time though. I understand the need for them as a vague guide as to the difficulty of the climb but a lot of the time that’s all they are.
10 people can have very different experiences on a climb and depending on soooo many variables such as height, weight, size of their pinkies, length of shins, whether mercury is in retrograde can all have effects on the perceived grade. I personally don’t believe in grades and think they’re a load of bollocks but I get why people like them.
How can you have an opinion on the grade of something you’ve not even seen in person :lol: I understand a general consensus might guide your opinion but what if that opinion is also 50/50?
Also that guy (Henry) who did it in 6 sessions has climbed like 6 8As, and 8A+ since then and regularly crushes classics on the school room board so not exactly like he wasn’t strong enough to do it
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Bosi isn't going to proffer a downgrade because that would be like Messi turning up to a kid's football match and protesting to the ref that a goal was offside.
Gather around the fireplace and I will tell you the story of how Seb became the most notorious downgrader of Provance. When he was but a young boy he did a first ascent of a line that gave him much pride. The provençal elite at the time decided to cut him down a notch and all repeated his route and suggested a downgrade. Our young hero did not forget and did not forgive, and has since systematically suggested downgrade of every route 8c+ or harder that the old guard of Provence has ever ticked in all of Europe.
Seb's route from the time has been upgraded to its original grade in the latest topo.
This is all true by the way.
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How can you have an opinion on the grade of something you’ve not even seen in person
This is just how incredible I am at downgrading now. When you've been downgrading as long as I have, and not just casually but really committing to the grind, you don't even need to remember climbing something to downgrade it - in fact, you needn't have seen it at all.
I've been training my downgrading so hard that my brain is now like a mathematical grading model. I input the data I find on UKC - the number of ticks compared to other climbs of the same grade at the crag, the voting, the comments, who's ticking it, what crag it's at - and my brain just spits out the correct grade. Some nights when I'm well recruited I'm downgrading 50 Peak classics in a session. I once made a University of East Anglia minibus turn around on the M1 when they saw what I'd done to their goals for the weekend.
You too can learn this power, but are you prepared to put in the graft?
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Bosi isn't going to proffer a downgrade because that would be like Messi turning up to a kid's football match and protesting to the ref that a goal was offside.
Gather around the fireplace and I will tell you the story of how Seb became the most notorious downgrader of Provance. When he was but a young boy he did a first ascent of a line that gave him much pride. The provençal elite at the time decided to cut him down a notch and all repeated his route and suggested a downgrade. Our young hero did not forget and did not forgive, and has since systematically suggested downgrade of every route 8c+ or harder that the old guard of Provence has ever ticked in all of Europe.
Seb's route from the time has been upgraded to its original grade in the latest topo.
This is all true by the way.
:clap2:
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Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
Amusingly I distinctly remember my first visit to Malham including a thought along the lines of "is this it"? :lol:
Fucking hell. Boulderers, there's no hope!
The way everyone goes on about it I just thought it'd be bigger :shrug:
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Also, I can get to Malham in 35 minutes. Nobody, to my knowledge, has ever driven past Malham and gone "that can't be it, can it?"
Amusingly I distinctly remember my first visit to Malham including a thought along the lines of "is this it"? :lol:
Fucking hell. Boulderers, there's no hope!
The way everyone goes on about it I just thought it'd be bigger :shrug:
It feels much bigger when you have to do 10 moves for every metre of climbing
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Also, plenty of people with experience at the grade logging it at 8B https://www.8a.nu/crags/bouldering/united-kingdom/raven-tor/sectors/raven-tor/routes/keen-roof/
hardly any wads consistently downgrade things though, plenty only ever log the grade that's given (but say its the easier in the comments...)
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I think we are way past the point of needing a topic split (if only to begin down grading all our festering grading resentments - starting with Brean Down in my case!)
If the split happens can we have an explanation of what this was as I missed it?
It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing.
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I think we are way past the point of needing a topic split (if only to begin down grading all our festering grading resentments - starting with Brean Down in my case!)
If the split happens can we have an explanation of what this was as I missed it?
It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing.
Thats just my own hypothesis which is quite possibly bollocks, but the tldr would be that the 80s/early 90s period has retained an outsize/disproportionate importance in British climbing even 30 years later due to the size of the characters and egos involved at that time, combined with the rise of mags and comps etc as a way of publicising achievements. I'll try and flesh it out into something more coherent at some point but its not particularly relevant to Keen Roof, I was just adlibbing a bit.
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Thats just my own hypothesis which is quite possibly bollocks, but the tldr would be that the 80s/early 90s period has retained an outsize/disproportionate importance in British climbing even 30 years later due to the size of the characters and egos involved at that time, combined with the rise of mags and comps etc as a way of publicising achievements. I'll try and flesh it out into something more coherent at some point but its not particularly relevant to Keen Roof, I was just adlibbing a bit.
There were definitely some big characters, but the difficulty of what was being climbed and the style in which it was done also underwent a huge shift. In the early 80s stuff like Tequila Mockingbird was cutting edge at 7c+ (or E6 as it was given at the time), and by 1990 Ben had climbed Hubble and Jerry had done Liquid Ambar. Im sure bits and pieces have been exaggerated and gained inflated importance over the years, but overall I think it's hard to argue it wasn't a significant period in British climbing history, particularly through the lense of the modern climber.
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INNNNNDIANNNN FFFFFFFFAAAAACE :lets_do_it_wild:
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Yeah I would never argue it wasn't very significant, it definitely was. But I do think it kind of grew a life of its own which detracted from celebrating British climbing in eg 2000s the way it perhaps should have been. We're only just beginning to appreciate how good McClure was/is now for example. Andy has eloquently summed up my views in his post :lol:
This would be a good thread split.
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New one for the list, Dylan Soin with Isles of Wonder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QuFhX8ziNY
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Good scoping, but think he should be on there already for that ascent.
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Anyway, philosophical discussion aside, the concept of staying in ones lane and kowtowing to the opinion of "wads" is, imo, hierarchical nonsense. It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing. The info is there to be interpreted by those who wish to. From the info available, I'm perfectly comfortable saying if I was writing the guide it would be in at 8A+. You've got some guy on ukc who did it 6 sessions (should have been 4 apparently...) having never done an 8A before. Nah, sorry! Other views are of course valid (albeit wrong) :)
I think what Will and Spider are saying is: climbers are incentivised by big gradesTM. Anyone who's climbed Keen Roof is incentivised in this way, ergo the only people able to objectively proffer a grade for Keen Roof are those who haven't done it. :)
Also,
Anyway, philosophical discussion aside, the concept of staying in ones lane and kowtowing to the opinion of "wads" is, imo, hierarchical nonsense. It's how we ended up with the cult of the 80s in British climbing.
100%. Reminds me of something Grimer said on Jamcrack recently lamenting how climbing has lost its characters and 'narratives'. Maybe - but it also lost some cliqueness/sycophancy and gained some meritocracy.
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it also lost some sycophancy
10 minutes looking at comments on insta should be enough to assure you this isn't as true as you'd like it to be!
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Fair, I don't look at insta so unqualified to comment. The tribal force is a strong force!
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it also lost some sycophancy
10 minutes looking at comments on insta should be enough to assure you this isn't as true as you'd like it to be!
Word. Revolting.
Never sure if this is a cynical get-more-followers ploy or it's just plain (common or garden) fawning.
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Good scoping, but think he should be on there already for that ascent.
Surely invalidated due to music (sort of) at the crag! :spank:
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I was browsing this article on UKC https://www.ukclimbing.com/news/2020/01/obituary_of_ian_cummins-72177 and it mentioned a climber called Nick Clement who was on the GB team and had bouldered 8B, any idea what the problem(s) might have been?
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Anaesthesia, 2007, according to his ukc logbook
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Thanks! Can't believe I missed he had a UKC logbook, amatuer hour :wall:
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Thats just my own hypothesis which is quite possibly bollocks, but the tldr would be that the 80s/early 90s period has retained an outsize/disproportionate importance in British climbing even 30 years later due to the size of the characters and egos involved at that time, combined with the rise of mags and comps etc as a way of publicising achievements.
What’s missing here is the social context. Climbing and mountaineering in the uk wasn’t a culture of full timers totally focused on climbing without the need to work (or else like Victorian pioneers be incredibly privileged). There weren’t many Brown and Whillans about.
The successive Thatcher governments monetary policy tolerated high levels of unemployment in pursuit of controlling inflation and social security allowed an underclass of full time climbers to thrive. This, more than anything else, drove the growth in grades.
As for behaviour, I remember the values of the decade as frequently egotistical and generally quite ugly. Selfishness and arrogance were increasingly prevalent across society, albeit not without strong opposition. YMMV.
Edit- typos on phone
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Hayato Furusugi has climbed The Ace
Edit: I see now he is Japanese, but London-based!
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Good spot, I've recorded his ascent but not added him to the list.
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Is Jake Mason on the list? Think he's done The Ace
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Is Jake Mason on the list? Think he's done The Ace
Did you bother to check the list?
https://climbing-history.org/climber/1534/jake-mason
Never doubt the omniscient remus
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Is Jake Mason on the list? Think he's done The Ace
Did you bother to check the list?
https://climbing-history.org/climber/1534/jake-mason
Never doubt the omniscient remus
Ha, I'm definitely not omniscient. Suggestions always welcome!
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Is Jake Mason on the list? Think he's done The Ace
He downgrade the ace to 7C - so maybe we can’t count him