[ferret]

I just did a quick google of Phil gondoux ( as I had not heard of him) and he also seems to have a lot of doubters and controversy surrounding him.
Words such as “infamous” and “doubtful ascent” immediately  appear in the google searches.

Not seen Phil in years but he was a very well respected climber. Strong AF in the roof back in the day, utter shit on anything with a sloper on lol.
Original developer of Targasonne, most of the old school 8's are his. Good mates with most of the Spanish and French wads at the time. Personally never heard his word doubted and certainly seen him pull down.
Infamous I could see, nicest guy you'll ever meet but with a keen interest in religion and aliens and a very colorful sex life that he wasn't shy about!
If you really care you could try and contact him here.
https://m.facebook.com/phil.acromix?tsid=0.2623832847389096&source=result
Or
Acromix.fr
Maybe you'll get some answers

[gme]

Bit more digging it’s actually one of the 1st ascents you mention him doing that is disputed , Queen of hearts. He originally gave it 8A+ but no one could repeat it including Nacho. It was then done by Klem at 8B+.

You also say he suggests Akira is two 8Bs where as Fred suggests it’s an 8B problem into an 8b+ route to an 8a.

So the new info that got me interested is someone with big ? s next to his name, who’s 1st ascent is doubted, has infamous prefixing his name in another article,  is linked to Farman and Akira of which he suggests a much harder sequence than Fred suggests.

I still believe that Fred did the route, it was really hard at the time, as hard as anything in the world, but it wasn’t 9b it was 9a and it hasn’t changed much at all.

[gme]

Contacting him is the role of the media. I am just shooting shit on here whilst stuck working from home   

From the little I have read and what you have added to re religion, aliens and a colourful sex life that he likes to tell you about I can see why he wasn’t used to confirm whether Akira had been done.

[jwi]

Lucien Martinez is the editor of Grimper magazine... I wager that there will be a feature in the next issue...

[ferret]

Bit more digging it’s actually one of the 1st ascents you mention him doing that is disputed , Queen of hearts. He originally gave it 8A+ but no one could repeat it including Nacho. It was then done by Klem at 8B+.

You also say he suggests Akira is two 8Bs where as Fred suggests it’s an 8B problem into an 8b+ route to an 8a.

So the new info that got me interested is someone with big ? s next to his name, who’s 1st ascent is doubted, has infamous prefixing his name in another article,  is linked to Farman and Akira of which he suggests a much harder sequence than Fred suggests.

I still believe that Fred did the route, it was really hard at the time, as hard as anything in the world, but it wasn’t 9b it was 9a and it hasn’t changed much at all.

Maybe I have my route and boulder grades mixed up. It was 15 years ago and maybe he said 8B into 8b (as it says in the climbing article that Andrada thought the 2nd part 8b and he tried it not too long after him and they are friends).
I doubt the media would contact him he's a guy probably in his 50's now who lives in a small village in the mountains. He never made a big deal about trying it and was obviously unsuccessful in his attempts. He definitely put some serious effort in though which is a pretty rare thing, I guess why we are even discussing it.

[remus]

Laura Ragora has repeated Stefano Ghisolfi's The Bow, 9a+.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CH7kLYvjUZM/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

[jwi]

Laura Ragora has repeated Stefano Ghisolfi's The Bow, 9a+.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CH7kLYvjUZM/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

there you go. A real 9b climber does 9a+ like is nothing special.

Back to Akira. It's apparently a lot easier  if you use kneepads but both the 2nd and 3rd ascensionist refrained

[ferret]

Odd to think that Andrada couldn't at least come close to banging out a 7C into an 8b. Didn't he make some comments about Fred glueing the holds on the start to make them smaller? Maybe he just wasn't in to long boulders in caves with short routes at the end. No that doesn't seem right.
Also Phil Gondoux did the fa of Ali Baba the extension to which was Laura Ragoras 1st 9b, so it's all linked....!
Also also does this kneebar info mean we can add another 10 pages to the Hubble thread?

[remus]

Odd to think that Andrada couldn't at least come close to banging out a 7C into an 8b. Didn't he make some comments about Fred glueing the holds on the start to make them smaller? Maybe he just wasn't in to long boulders in caves with short routes at the end. No that doesn't seem right.
Also Phil Gondoux did the fa of Ali Baba the extension to which was Laura Ragoras 1st 9b, so it's all linked....!
Also also does this kneebar info mean we can add another 10 pages to the Hubble thread?

If Hubble climbed Akira Total Extension Plus but didn't use kneepads, does that make the grade Seb Bouin or Seb Bouin/+?

[gme]

Odd to think that Andrada couldn't at least come close to banging out a 7C into an 8b. Didn't he make some comments about Fred glueing the holds on the start to make them smaller? Maybe he just wasn't in to long boulders in caves with short routes at the end. No that doesn't seem right.
Also Phil Gondoux did the fa of Ali Baba the extension to which was Laura Ragoras 1st 9b, so it's all linked....!
Also also does this kneebar info mean we can add another 10 pages to the Hubble thread?

Its all irrelevant now as its been repeated and downgraded to 9a which sounds realistic and in line with world standards at the time. Good effort Seb as we can put to rest one of the great mystery routes of the last 30 years.

This and chilam done and sorted just one big ? route left to my knowledge and a long list of UK boulder problems all linked to the same person.

[ferret]

Good luck getting Seb Bouin over here to try Il Pirata!

[haydn jones]

Does this make mutation the 1st 9b in the world?   

[jwi]

I almost did it [Akira]. I fell at the last move of the boulder crux. I find that section hard for 7C as Bouin and Martinez have now proposed. It's a boulder of about eight moves, which can be 8A or 8A+ in my opinion. I think the proposal of 9a is correct taking into account that they may have made some moves with kneebars as well. I went 7 or 8 days to try it. The place is quite ugly and I had a hard time finding someone to accompany me. The route is in the same style as Ali Hulk in the Cave of Ali Baba, in Rodellar, but the spot is so ugly that it is difficult to motivate oneself to go there.

via: https://woguclimbing.com/seb-bouin-lucien-martinez-repiten-akira-opinan-9a/

[teestub]

I mean yeah there’s a big quarry opposite it by the looks of it but it’s not exactly West Vale! Grotte de Vilhonneur (Akira)
Grotte de, Rochebertier, 16220, France
https://goo.gl/maps/4MQAZaZDGgYHKEvj9

[jwi]

Andrada lives in Cornudella. He might have higher standards...

[dunnyg]

Oi! West vale is a little slice of heaven. If you must lay into a crag, make sure it is one of those lancashire pits made of seepage and burnt out cars (or mixenenden quarry), or that people infested shite that passes for rock in the peak.

[petejh]

I mean yeah there’s a big quarry opposite it by the looks of it but it’s not exactly West Vale! Grotte de Vilhonneur (Akira)
Grotte de, Rochebertier, 16220, France
https://goo.gl/maps/4MQAZaZDGgYHKEvj9

Does Akira sit within France’s equivalent of Leicestershire?

[webbo]

No it’s in the bit that was part of the English empire.

[jwi]

The difference in opinion a between Martinez/Bouin on one hand and Andrada on the other hand on the boulder grade of the hard bit of Akira is probably down to unclear communication via instagram...

Lucien Martinez has written a fairly long article on their ascents, with a lot of breakdown of the difficulty at https://www.grimper.com/news-25-ans-apres-akira-enfin-repetee-etions that seems to agree completely with Andrada's opinions.

[teestub]

Did he basically say the start is a 7B boulder straight into a 7C adding up to around 8A+ in 15 moves, followed by an 8b route or long 7C boulder (followed by some easy climbing)? Not got translate option on my phone!

Sounds like a great effort from Rouhling at the time.

[nai]

It starts with ten movements in 7B block followed by a very physical 7C block of 5/6 moves. The total could be worth 8A + block over about 15 moves. Small relaxation hung on a ferry and it left for a little fifteen moves, still in the ceiling, gymnastic but less hard, which could be compared to something like an 8b lane or a very long 7C boulder. Exiting the roof

They avoided knee pads but were prepared to use a ferry

[jwi]

Did he basically say the start is a 7B boulder straight into a 7C adding up to around 8A+ in 15 moves, followed by an 8b route or long 7C boulder (followed by some easy climbing)?

Yup.

[ferret]

Did he basically say the start is a 7B boulder straight into a 7C adding up to around 8A+ in 15 moves, followed by an 8b route or long 7C boulder (followed by some easy climbing)? Not got translate option on my phone!

Sounds like a great effort from Rouhling at the time.

So it turns out that Phil's breakdown of 8B to a crap rest to 8b (assuming I likely mis-interpreted/remembered the 8B-8b) was not far off the mark then

[Fiend]

On the subject of Rouhling Routes, this was at the bottom of the same article:



Drilled pockets, controversy, blah blah, still can't argue with the flamboyance of the route nor the shapeliness of the buttress.

[submaximal gains]

Seb Bouin repeated another of Red Rhouling's routes 2 days ago, The other side of the sky (De l’autre Côté du Ciel) 9a, also at les Eaux Claires https://www.instagram.com/p/CIIK9Rsj_sc/