[Danny]

My max hanging routine currently revolves around the standard 20 mm edge and some two finger pockets. I have a couple of aspirational projects that require a significant bump in crimp strength, and I'm tentatively considering incorporating some full crimps into my routine. I'd be keen to hear whether anyone here is doing crimpy max hangs? Is it usefully distinct from the more weight in the half crimp position approach? And is the approach the same as for the other grip types, or more conservative?

[kingholmesy]

I thought the received wisdom was that training in the half crimp position would give just as good results in strength gains (transferable to when crimping on your projects), with less risk of injury. 

Hopefully someone who actually knows about such things will be along shortly to give a more informed view.

[Ged]

From my sample size of 1, training in full crimp makes a difference if that's what is on your project. A big difference for me.

Anecdotally, I'd say its also good injury prevention, as long as you don't overdo it. Strengthening that position in a controlled manner can only be good for it, rather than only unleashing it in extremis on a cold wet crag.

[Nibile]

Your approach should be far more conservative than with half crimp training.
A lot of the business comes down to pain tolerance also.
I personally tend to avoid full crimp training and leave it just for the climbing (board), which is training anyway, but I seriously put a lot of effort into half crimp training, trying to flex the fingers and force the hang into a crimp while hanging.
Try to actively hang the hold.

[Eddies]

You could do some max hangs on smaller edges using half-crimp grip and save the full-crimps for climbing outside.
No point trying to make gains at the expense of injury.
I used to full crimp everything, but now, after years of strict half-crimped training, I find I never full-crimp whilst training or climbing inside, and only ever full-crimp occasionally outside.

[tomtom]

Just to add confusion - I find fingerboarding with the half crimp really hurts my PIP (my fingers are normally pretty injury free) with a day or two of aching right in the joint afterwards. I now fully crimp or open hand - and have no such problems.

[Doylo]

I wouldn’t fancy full crimp max hangs myself.  Would rather bone up on the board if needed to improve full crimp.

[tomtom]

I wouldn’t fancy full crimp max hangs myself.  Would rather bone up on the board if needed to improve full crimp.

Yeah - see what you're saying. Mine are on a BM - where you can't really fully crimp the slopey small holds anyway...

[Doylo]

Or the 8 or 10mm micros might be ok. Certainly preferable to hanging a load of weight off you and boning.   

[Monolith]

Have personally always found half crimp and open hand the best means of training contact strength on things like a beast maker/small campus rung etc. Having some well crafted very thin holds allows you to train full crimp in a controlled fashion.

[Danny]

Lots of useful points here. Much appreciated. I think on balance I might initially try half crimp max hangs on a smaller edge, and then maybe mix it up with some full crimp repeaters. The idea of adding weight and then going full crimp is, I admit, 

I think my contact strength is improved from consistently doing my current max hang routine but, contrary to received wisdom, I'm not sure all this half crimping has really improved my full crimp strength.

[Danny]

Or the 8 or 10mm micros might be ok. Certainly preferable to hanging a load of weight off you and boning.   

I think I'll be getting some of them.

[tomtom]

Have personally always found half crimp and open hand the best means of training contact strength on things like a beast maker/small campus rung etc. Having some well crafted very thin holds allows you to train full crimp in a controlled fashion.

Good point on the contact strength Mono - you have to hit stuff half crimp then wind it in to the full crimp...

[Monolith]

If you wanted to get better on micro crimps, you could add a footboard in front of whatever fingerboard you're using. Experiment with size of foot holds/smears etc.

I also found training back two half crimp to be very beneficial to overall finger strength. Can then try that on one arm but with shallow mono dish drags on the other etc. In this context, the loading conditions are as controlled as they can be and you can be very systematic with your sets.

[AMorris]

I have always had a rule to never full crimp while I am hanging, always half crimp or open depending on the set. Because of that I very rarely full crimp if I can avoid it. My philosophy on it is that full crimp is only useful when your fingers are too weak to half crimp a hold and perform the necessary movement. No one would full crimp anything if they could half crimp everything, because of the increased chance of injury.

Having said this, if I find myself full crimping hard outdoors I often find that my little fingers complain because they simply are not used to the position they are in, which is essentially a half crimp, since during half crimp they are effectively dragging.

Disclaimer: this is a combination of my n=1 and some general observations I have made about crimp/half crimp, it may be nonsense 

[jwi]

The thumb is also a finger, so a crimp with thumb is stronger than a crimp without, obviously. Closing the crimp is often useful to stabilise the position and pull inwards. Crimping doesn't come natural to me, so on redpoints I have to memorise which holds are better as full crimps.

[tim palmer]

Surely only full crimping whilst on a project or whilst climbing on a board and not whilst on a fingerboard is a bit counterintuitive and inviting injury. I think it is inevitable on most boulder problems of reasonable difficulty you will full crimp so why not train it and build up confidence in that position and pain tolerance in the most controlled way i.e. on a fingerboard. 

Again n =1 but i have only ever had finger tweaks half crimping/ half crimp pinching and i regularly do weighted hangs and pull ups full crimp. I would start doing hands without weight on holds significantly smaller than 20mm if you want to get better on small holds.

[Murph]

Good thread this. Very useful. Personally I never train full crimp or even half crimp. Everything on the fingerboard is open. I try to do some of the easier hangs half crimp but am not very disciplined about it. Then when I’m outside I open hand everything still. Pretty much never crimp. Even the crimp on my project I open hand.

So the question, hopefully someone knows...are there some problems where you have to crimp, is this something that really comes in at the higher grades? Trying to find an excuse to get back on my fingerboard as suffering withdrawal.

Strengthening that position in a controlled manner can only be good for it, rather than only unleashing it in extremis on a cold wet crag.

Totally. If I was going to use one in the real world it would make sense to have practiced it a bit first.

[tim palmer]

are there some problems where you have to crimp, is this something that really comes in at the higher grades?

Every problem on peak limestone except Powerband?

[tomtom]

Crimping allows you to move further up past the hold - as the focus of the pressure is at the very back of the hold rather than towards the lip.

[AMorris]

Crimping allows you to move further up past the hold - as the focus of the pressure is at the very back of the hold rather than towards the lip.

thats a helpful bit of wisdom, diolch

[Bradders]

Good thread this. Very useful. Personally I never train full crimp or even half crimp. Everything on the fingerboard is open. I try to do some of the easier hangs half crimp but am not very disciplined about it. Then when I’m outside I open hand everything still. Pretty much never crimp. Even the crimp on my project I open hand.

I've seen you say this a few times and it's confusing me; could you explain exactly what you mean by 'open'? Or take a photo of how you have the holds when fingerboarding?

The reason I ask is this is so completely alien to me! I just can't imagine open handing anything on peak lime!

[Murph]

Alright Bradders lets give this a go. I’m going to try to link to a couple of pictures of two climbers on the same hold on a Peak Lime mega classic 7C+. One is holding the crimp in a full crimp, the other is holding it “open”.

https://imgur.com/gallery/iTQFRa2

[webbo]

Or dragging.

[Murph]

Yeah or dragging.

Anyway, when world + dog are all saying the same thing maybe it’s time to conform. Time to put the micros up and start crimping the little f*@£&ers.