[r-man]

get your 89 stanage guide out yoof.

Good idea.    

"of note". my arse.

Really? When was it first done. And by who?  

steve foster used combined tactics on walk on by not rob gawthorpe.

Combined tactis? Please explain to the ignorant (me)...

pebble wall,bald pate super direct and d.i.a are all mid to late 70s.

Sorry, I'm ignorant of all of those. Where, when, how hard, who?   :?    


V1 ?
V2 ?
V3 ?
V4 ?
V5 ?
V6 ?
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - ? - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Syrett's Sauter/Pebble wall - Caley - al manson,andy brown, jerry peel - mid to late 70s?
V9 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Careless Torque - Stanage - Ron Fawcett - 1987
V12 - Superman - Crag X - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Superman ss - Ben Moon - ?
V14 - Leviathan - Kyloe in the Woods - Malcolm Smith - 1994
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

Of note:
V11 - Slingshot - Frogatt - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Hubble - Raven Tor - Ben Moon - 1992
Cofe's arse

[a dense loner]

I was told by a local wad that the SS shelf to the right of Isla de enchanta hasn't been repeated (V8?

not wantin to slate gaskins stuff, but it really is in the most part shit n uninspiring. a couple of things i think look really good, read very good. however the majority is not n nearly every strong person i know is totally uninspired to go to the lakes with good reason imho. unfortunately this is fact. the only probable repeats will come from bob dylan with a shrunken body, or any of the welsh crew since they have to travel to get half decent rock. :wink:

[Jim]

I was told by a local wad that the SS shelf to the right of Isla de enchanta hasn't been repeated (V8?)

Do you mean shallow goove? better make that 8a (or V11)

[r-man]

Ok, so there's now a rough list from V7 upwards, albeit with a little confusion below V10. The gist seems to be that Yorkshire was the forcing ground untilthe 80s, when it (or all the best climbers) moved to the peak. I had a look at the Stanage guide and problems like NTBA and Crecent arete were apparently only climbed in the mid 70s, well behind Yorkshire standards. Why so? Were they climbed earlier and not recorded?

And what about bouldering in other places? Northumberland has a long history of bouldering, doesn't it?

What about easier stuff. I know this will be harder to pin down, and perhaps the starts to routes will be needed, but we should be able to get a rough idea.

I'll start with Brownstones, this one is probably not a first, but it's pretty early:

V2 - Parr's Crack - 1948-49

What about Pex, Frodsham and Helsby:

 

The standards at Helsbywere exceptionally high, compared to other climbing areas in the British Isles.

And Menlove Edwards guide to the Helyg boulder (1935)...

according to Perrin, one or two of the moves are of technical grade 6a

..though it does sound like lots of these problems might have been eliminates.

And there's Oscar Eckenstein (ca. 1885) and his boulder below the Pen Y Pass youth hostel in North Wales:
A bit about Eckenstein though I can't find anything more about him or the Eckenstein boulder.

Here's the early history of British bouldering as summarised by John Gill:

1. The British Path:  Commencing about 1885 in Great Britain, with the first documented advocate, Oscar Eckenstein. The words 'bouldering' and 'problem' were coined and the idea of seeking greater difficulty on boulders began to emerge. The first eliminate problems appeared. By 1900 or so, some climbers were trying problems of greater difficulty than that found on lead climbs - by 1910, Siegfried Herford and a few others, in particular, pushed quite hard, initiating crag climbing as a sport unto itself.  There was continued enthusiasm and activity by an assortment of climbers through the years, though not consistently well-documented. Crag climbing, particularly on gritstone formations, became quite popular during the 1920s and 1930s. Bouldering may have lost much of its identity in the process, being subsumed by a general focus on very short climbs, some done with top-ropes, some led, and others done ropeless.  High-balls going all the way back to the 1890s remain a feature of the sport.

 (Photo of Pat Kelley at a resting place on the Scoop in the late 1920s, from Climbing Days by D. Pilley, 1935)


Mantlepiece at Low Man (Climbers Club Journal No. VIII, 1905)

[r-man]

Oh, and I just noticed, Careless Torque was climbed before Slingshot, so the toprope thing is moot.

Also, if Leviathan was climbed in 1994, according to the planetfear list it was a world first, beating Klem Loskot's Nanuk by 3 years and Fred Nicole's Slashface by 4.

[Graeme]

That also depends if your actually gonna include traverses.

[SA Chris]

There is a photo in the back of the Yorkshire Gritstone Guide of some bloke soloing a short crack up at Simon's Seat, dated turn of last century. Not sure what grade the crack gets, but could be firts V1. Will check at home, if I remember.

Although I'm meant to go out bouldering tonight AND pack for font, so I will probably forget.

[andy_e]

the joker, V7, font, 1950's?

[andy_e]

something at shipley glen(i think), a traverse, V3 6a was done about 1920. it says in the Yorkshire grit bouldering guide in the introductuion

[squeek]

la joker is Font 7a, which is V6, non?  Besides France isn't in the uk  

[andy_e]

la joker is Font 7a, which is V6, non?

D'oh!

Besides France isn't in the uk  

Really?

[a dense loner]

la joker is Font 7a, which is V6, non

besides if you read the small print, holds have come off the joker. it sounds good to have font 7a way back but this is not true. the same with biceps mou. but we are on about britain, which also takes jerry's arete out of the equation cos the footholds where much better, back in the day

[Mr.Burns]

The problem squeek is talking about is the sit start to the V1 (standing start up the ledges) right next to IDE on the shelter stone (i.e. in between IDE and Shallow Groove), Gaskins gave it V8 but its way harder IMO.

Most of the proper hard Gaskins probs have not been repeated and although some are shit to look at things like Walk Away SS are some of the best looking probs i've seen.

[Jim]

just look't at wheelbarrow topo, gets V9/10 according to topo. is it any good? never looked at it.

[Mr.Burns]

Yeah I think it was up graded from the first topo. I think it is a good problem, its a pretty straight line with a cool sloper on it. I guess some might think its not that good a problem next to IDE but worth the effort if you ask me... I might go and try it again soon.

[r-man]

Ok then, here are a few more grades filled in. There are probably earlier things, but these are a good start.

That also depends if your actually gonna include traverses.

Good point. What do you reckon? Are there any traverses on the world list? Traverses do represent an improvement in standards, even if it's linking together already climbed problems and not actually doing any harder moves...

which also takes jerry's arete out of the equation cos the footholds where much better, back in the day

Right, Rob Gawthorpe is back in there then, but how much easier would Jerry's arete have been? Could still be a contender for first V8?

V1 - Simon's seat Crack - ? - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 ?
V5 ?
V6 ?
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - ? - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Syrett's Sauter/Pebble wall - Caley - al manson,andy brown, jerry peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s?
V9 - Cental Wall Direct - Dib Scar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1982
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Careless Torque - Stanage - Ron Fawcett - 1987
V12 - Superman - Crag X - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Superman ss - Ben Moon - ?
V14 - Leviathan - Kyloe in the Woods - Malcolm Smith - 1994
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[Bonjoy]

V8 - Syrett's Sauter/Pebble wall - Caley - al manson,andy brown, jerry peel - mid to late 70s?

Surely Syrett's Saunter was put up by John Syrett!?

[andy_e]

notice how a lot of it is in yorkshire?

[webbo]

syretts saunter was climbed and named by al manson.all the problems with a name i.e. bobs bastard,websters winge were named after his climbing partners / friends of the time.however syretts roof was climbed by john syrett in the early 70s v6.the start to wall of horrors v4/v5 allan austin 1950s

[tommytwotone]

what about railway slab? got to be a contender for one of the easier graded ones??

[Bonjoy]

Velvet Silence E6 6c was originally claimed as a 6a boulder problem by Johny Woodward! Not sure what year

[grimer]

the start to wall of horrors v4/v5 allan austin 1950s

According to a chat i had with Dennis Gray one time (choose yourself how much of a guarntee of facts that is, but... ) AA did not do the now common start to WoH, but instead came in from, I think, the left. However, DG was at Almscliffe one time with Joe Brown before AA did FA of Wall of Horrors. JB did the direct start, on sight, and got to the break. Just then, someone else at the crag fell off and was badly injured, and JB had to come down and give him a lift to hospital, as he was the only person there with transport.

[grimer]

Velvet Silence E6 6c was originally claimed as a 6a boulder problem by Johny Woodward! Not sure what year

climbed before Jonny by Gabe Regan, on sight!

[Bonjoy]

Velvet Silence E6 6c was originally claimed as a 6a boulder problem by Johny Woodward! Not sure what year

climbed before Jonny by Gabe Regan, on sight!

 That might be the ascent I was thinking of.

[a dense loner]

oh n pebble wall had more pebbles on it