[SA Chris]

Grimer, I think combined tactics were the common way of starting WoH, before JB did the direct.

[r-man]

what about railway slab? got to be a contender for one of the easier graded ones??

Could be, but I can't find a date. It gets E1 5c in the rockfax database, though elsewhere it's E1 6a.

Bonjoy wrote:Velvet Silence E6 6c was originally claimed as a 6a boulder problem by Johny Woodward! Not sure what year

climbed before Jonny by Gabe Regan, on sight!

The rockfax database lists it as 1987, so doesn't quite make it as the other V7s are much earlier (on the dangerous site it's graded as ft7a+). Oddly though, planetfear and other sites have it as an onsight repeat in 1986 by Johnny Dawes.

oh n pebble wall had more pebbles on it

Right, I've moved it down a grade. Is that fair, or would it have been much easier than that?

But Syrett's roof and Wall of Horrors Direct are a good start for V4 and V5. Either the traverse at Shipley Glen is incredibly ahead of it's time, or there should be something else at V2.

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - early 1950s ?
V5 ?
V6 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - ? - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Syrett's Sauter - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s?
V9 - Cental Wall Direct - Dib Scar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1982
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Careless Torque - Stanage - Ron Fawcett - 1987
V12 - Superman - Crag X - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Superman ss - Crag X - Ben Moon - pre 1999?
V14 - Leviathan - Kyloe in the Woods - Malcolm Smith - 1994
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

Hmmm, it also seems logical that if Joe Brown was onsighting V4, he was probably capable of doing something much harder...

[r-man]

notice how a lot of it is in yorkshire?

Yeah, that does seem a little strange. Like I mentioned earlier, bouldering must have been going on for just as long in places like Pex and Helsby, and as training for routes in Wales, The Lakes, Northumberland etc. The problem is just finding people who remember...

[Graeme]

AT the risk of being pedantic, syrett's roof is considiered to be V5 by many, not by me cos I haven't done it so don't know.

[r-man]

Just wondering if this will jog anyone's memory - someone already said that Superman ss was done before Isla de Enchanta (1999), but was it done before Leviathan (1994)?

Or, put it this way, given that Superman was done in 1988, roughly how many years later was the sit start done?

[a dense loner]

if you're trying to take list's seriously move syrett's with pebble

[Andy Harris]

How,s about the following

Vienna (original method, before holds bigger) 8a Pete Curtain 1981?
Unrepeated dyno Bowderstone 7c+/8a Pete Curtain early 80,s
Quintescence Tom,s roof Pete Curtain 8a early 80,s
Brad Pitt original Jason Myers 8b 1995

When was inertial reel traverse done?

Sole Power Froggat Moffat 7c 1981?

[Andy Harris]

How,s about the following

Vienna (original method, before holds bigger) 8a Pete Curtain 1981?
Unrepeated dyno Bowderstone 7c+/8a Pete Curtain early 80,s
Quintescence Tom,s roof Pete Curtain 8a early 80,s
Brad Pitt original Jason Myers 8b 1995

When was inertial reel traverse done?

Sole Power Froggat Moffat 7c 1981?

[Andy Harris]

How,s about the following

Vienna (original method, before holds bigger) 8a Pete Curtain 1981?
Unrepeated dyno Bowderstone 7c+/8a Pete Curtain early 80,s
Quintescence Tom,s roof Pete Curtain 8a early 80,s
Brad Pitt original Jason Myers 8b 1995

When was inertial reel traverse done?

Sole Power Froggat Moffat 7c 1981?

[r-man]

AT the risk of being pedantic, syrett's roof is considiered to be V5 by many, not by me cos I haven't done it so don't know.

Pedantic is good. It's what lists like this are all about. Passionate pedantry.  :wink: Yorkshiregrit.com also says V5, so I'll move it down a notch.

Vienna (original method, before holds bigger) 8a Pete Curtain 1981?
Unrepeated dyno Bowderstone 7c+/8a Pete Curtain early 80,s
Quintescence Tom,s roof Pete Curtain 8a early 80,s
Brad Pitt original Jason Myers 8b 1995

When was inertial reel traverse done?

Sole Power Froggat Moffat 7c 1981?

Sole Power is a good un. And Vienna.

 Quintessence is an eliminate, and it would all get a bit daft if we used eliminates. Same with Myer's Brad Pitt method, although it was hard, it was contrived, albeit unintentionally.

if you're trying to take list's seriously move syrett's with pebble

Ok...

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - ? - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s? (originally had more pebbles)
V7 - Syrett's Sauter - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Sole Power - Frogatt - Jerry Moffatt - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Superman - Crag X - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Superman ss - Crag X - Ben Moon - pre 1999?
V14 - Leviathan - Kyloe in the Woods - Malcolm Smith - 1994
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

I'm still not convinced everything up till the 80s happened in Yorkshire.

[webbo]

red baron.f.a. mike hammil

[r-man]

red baron.f.a. mike hammil

Good stuff.

When was inertial reel traverse done?

Moffatt, 1980s. So it's vying for position with Superman:

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - Mike Hammil - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s? (originally had more pebbles)
V7 - Syrett's Sauter - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Sole Power - Frogatt - Jerry Moffatt - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Inertia Reel Traverse - Jerry Moffatt - Roaches - 1980s?
V12 - Superman - Crag X - Jerry Moffatt - 1988
V13 - Superman ss - Crag X - Ben Moon - pre 1999?
V14 - Leviathan - Kyloe in the Woods - Malcolm Smith - 1994
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[cofe]

was gonna suggest sole power but thought it was '85... need to get a library of guides at work.

also, quintessence is mentioned as an eliminate but i'm sure leviathan is too...as is superman n'est pas beaucoup? sacre bleau.

[r-man]

also, quintessence is mentioned as an eliminate but i'm sure leviathan is too...as is superman n'est pas beaucoup? sacre bleau.

Didn't know that about Leviathan. Yeah, I wondered about Superman, but forgot to ask. Can't be having any eliminates or we might as well start listing problems in the School. :roll:

So Gaskins is back in force for the time being, though there must have been something between Inertia Reel and Isla? ...

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - Mike Hammil - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s? (originally had more pebbles)
V7 - Syrett's Sauter - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Sole Power - Frogatt - Jerry Moffatt - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Inertia Reel Traverse - Jerry Moffatt - Roaches - 1980s?
V13 - Isla de Enchanta - Trowbarrow - John Gaskins - 1999
V14 - Kaizen - Woodwell - John Gaskins - 2001
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[Ru]

I thought Sole Power was '83?

Inertia Reel Trav was done in the mid 90s

I think the Superman SS was first done by Malcolm

[r-man]

was gonna suggest sole power but thought it was '85... need to get a library of guides at work.quote]


I made a mistake there. It's 83, so Rob Gawthorpe is back in with the Dib Scar Direct - V9 at least, according to rockfax database.

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - Mike Hammil - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s? (originally had more pebbles)
V7 - Syrett's Sauter - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Cental Wall Direct - Dib Scar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Inertia Reel Traverse - Jerry Moffatt - Roaches - 1980s?
V13 - Isla de Enchanta - Trowbarrow - John Gaskins - 1999
V14 - Kaizen - Woodwell - John Gaskins - 2001
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[cofe]

when did JA do WSS?

[r-man]

when did JA do WSS?

1985

[Johnny Brown]

Syrett's saunter has lost a lot of pebble's over the years, only a few years back it was about a grade and a half easier than it is now. I'm sure it was much easier when first climbed - I'd say V8ish now, hard V6 nineties, prob V5 eighties and before???.

Dunno which you mean by pebble wall? Do you mean the start to True Pebble wall on the webster's whinge block? Or No pebble wall on the New Jerusalem block? Either way both early eighties not mid seventies, and have got harder. Or do you mean Pebble wall at almscliffe, for which the same applies plus the fact it's not V7 even now...

[r-man]

Syrett's saunter has lost a lot of pebble's over the years, only a few years back it was about a grade and a half easier than it is now. I'm sure it was much easier when first climbed - I'd say V8ish now, hard V6 nineties, prob V5 eighties and before???.

That's off the list then...

Dunno which you mean by pebble wall? Do you mean the start to True Pebble wall on the webster's whinge block? Or No pebble wall on the New Jerusalem block? Either way both early eighties not mid seventies, and have got harder. Or do you mean Pebble wall at almscliffe, for which the same applies plus the fact it's not V7 even now...

I think it's this Pebble Wall at Caley isn't it?

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - Mike Hammil - 70s?
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V7 - Pebble Wall - Caley - Al manson, Andy Brown, Jerry Peel - mid to late 70s? (originally had more pebbles)
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Cental Wall Direct - Dib Scar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Inertia Reel Traverse - Jerry Moffatt - Roaches - 1980s?
V13 - Isla de Enchanta - Trowbarrow - John Gaskins - 1999
V14 - Kaizen - Woodwell - John Gaskins - 2001
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[Johnny Brown]

I think it's this Pebble Wall at Caley isn't it?

That is Syrett's Saunter. Jeez - you people :roll:

So we'll stick with Red Baron for V7 then...  1976

[r-man]

I think it's this Pebble Wall at Caley isn't it?

That is Syrett's Saunter. Jeez - you people :roll:

So we'll stick with Red Baron for V7 then...  1976

Woops.
Desert Island Arete is still in contention for V7 though.

V1 - The Crack pictured in the Yorkshire Grit Guide? - Simon's Seat - ? - 1900ish?
V2 - Parr's Crack - Brownstones - Eric Parr and friends - 1948-49
V3 - Traverse? - Shipley Glen - ? - 1920
V4 - Wall of Horrors Direct Start - Almscliff - Joe Brown (onsight) - 1950s?
V5 - Syretts roof - Almscliff - John Syrett - early 70s?
V6 -
V7 - Red Baron - Shipley Glen - Mike Hammil - 1976
V7 - Desert Island Arete - ? - ? - 60s/70s?
V8 - Super Bald Arete - Ilkley - ? - ?
V8 - Jerry's Arete - Bridestones - Jerry Peel - 70s? (originally had better footholds)
V9 - Cental Wall Direct - Dib Scar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1982
V10 - Unrepeated dyno - Bowderstone - Pete Kirton - Early 1980s?
V10 - Walk on by - Curbar - Rob Gawthorpe - 1983
V11 - Vienna - Bowden Doors - Pete Kirton - 1981 (before holds got bigger)
V12 - Inertia Reel Traverse - Jerry Moffatt - Roaches - 1980s?
V13 - Isla de Enchanta - Trowbarrow - John Gaskins - 1999
V14 - Kaizen - Woodwell - John Gaskins - 2001
V15 - Walk Away ss - Fairysteps - John Gaskins - 2002

[Jim]

the clue was in the stick syrett's with pebble bit :wink:

[r-man]

Anyone done The Fly It's listed here as being V9, and was climbed in 1979 by Ron Fawcett. Precedes the Dib Scar route if it is V9.

Or this one:

Pedestal Arete Sitting Start V10 / 7c+ Caley Adam Wainwright 1980s

[r-man]

the clue was in the stick syrett's with pebble bit :wink:

Yeah, too many names and grades and not enough common sense, that's my problem. That, and I've never been to Caley. Ah well.