[Jaspersharpe]

I never liked him anyway.

[Barratt]

Blockhead - list em mate and i'll get em listed.

I may have to separate out the Minus 10 left problems and the Georges Wall problems onto another page - getting a bit full on this page as is. Same system though, image top probs beneath.

Going through the probs now, will post up.

Hope to have Minus Ten section done by weekend.

[Barratt]

Here's the new problem list. As I said, the one to the left might be listed on another page depending on the amount of problems - let me know.

I could do with Zippy's (variant 1) being a bit more clear, any ideas?

Also, Blockhead - can you give me that prob with numbers please?

Oh, and I've put in a couple of unlisted probs that we did last night on the right, nice stuff but not qualified to give grades... speaking of which, anyone want to propose conversions for the B grades (can of worms anyone!?)

[Jaspersharpe]

This might be the publication that makes me start using 8a.nu.

[slackline]

This might be the publication that makes me start using 8a.nu.

You mean you're going to crash their db by recording all of the eliminates at -10 in there 

[Jaspersharpe]

Ensuring that I give a different name to each one.

[blockhead]

Also, Blockhead - can you give me that prob with numbers please?

If you mean the arete problem there are no numbers or letters in any of the guides associated with it. Its basically the left arete on the megatron block.. using handholds on the arete only (no sneaking round the corner) eliminating the first finishing ledge (which looking at your above guide you may be refering to as G?) by slapping past it onto the slopey ramp and finishing at the high ledge.

Hope to be out at stoney fri, will take a bit more notice of easy elims on left wall and work out how to describe them and get back to you.

Think zippy's PROBLEM var 1 as you are describing it doesn't exist.. you are trying to give it the description for zippy's SIDEPULL var 1.

Zippy's prob var 1 is normally the 7c version you have down as var 3.

Var 2 is normally 7c+ you have as var 2. The Ru's PDB guide has pretty clear descriptions.

That makes var 4 into var 3 and var 5 into var 4? Eh?

[r-man]

As Dense pointed out, the final moves of the Pinch 2 problems need clarifying. They should be:

   Pinch 2     Left edge 36, RH pinch 42, outside edge LF 41. Sloper 44 with LH, swap feet on 41. Left toe smear 37, pull through to RH pinch on lip 50, fully weighting smear. Keep LF on smear 37, RF smear 43, dyno to LH sloper 51, the edge is out. Top 52.     
   
Jason's Variant    Left edge 36, RH pinch 42, outside edge LF 41. Sloper 44 with LH, swap feet on 41. Jump off this foothold to get RH pinch on lip 50. RF smear 43, dyno to LH sloper 51, the edge is out. Top 52.

[etjoset]

Zippy's Problem(s) - Not sure if this has been mentioned previously but you really need to emphasize that you have to use the lowest, poorest of the three downward slanting footholds as per the Harris foothold eliminator in Ru's book. If you use the larger of the footholds then all these problems become a grade easier.

I thought Odd Thing was really only 7a+ if you use your right heel to stay in balance. Probably worth 7b if you do it with both feet in the low break, though.

Harris Problem 1 - I agree worth 7b if you cram your fingers to the very back of hold 27 but a useful variant is to only take the outer part of 27, which might bump it to 7b+ (not as contrived as this description sounds).

Looks like good work.

[blockhead]

Rocketman - have sent you a pm with regards to the left hand side eliminates.

[fiveknuckle21]

 Was out at Tom's today and was getting a little bored. Ended up doing the usual eliminates and also Figure of 8 in reverse... I thought this problem was cracking and definately warrants a mention. Reckon about 7c? Has anyone had a tinkle on this before?

 A friend was trying Pete's Power Pull, there and back, has this had an ascent? Any ideas on the grade? Cheers.

[Barratt]

Hi all,

So this little guide is coming on, see below.

Its heavily compressed and reduced dpi to ease burden peoples downloads times, this is most telling in the imagery which looks well ropey!

Obvious missing element is the left section (blockhead, i've emailed you fella). I'll probably squeeze Georges Wall into this section as well.

Next on list is Toms Roof and Carls Walk...

Comments or amends welcome.

http://clients.rckt.co.uk/stoney/Stoney1.pdf

[Kingy]

Excellent! Great work Rocketman, looks like a real pro job. 2 tiny points:

1. Gav's problem is at least 7a+ probably 7b, not 6c.
2. Please for hold 55 put "always use poorest and lowest of 3 edges" to avoid any misinterpretation. I used the second one down for years thinking it was the bottom one as I thought the lowest one could not be a foothold until somebody showed me the proper one!

I see that Zippy's problem variant 1 is going in as 7c, 1 grade harder than Zippy's problem. I mentioned this earlier on in the thread that the grades should if anything be swapped. Am I the only one who thinks the variant is easier than the original?

[blockhead]

I see that Zippy's problem variant 1 is going in as 7c, 1 grade harder than Zippy's problem. I mentioned this earlier on in the thread that the grades should if anything be swapped. Am I the only one who thinks the variant is easier than the original?

No.. i agree. Zippy's problem is a lot harder for me than either variant 1 and 2. Thought it was fair enough at 7b+ before the foot hold eliminator was introduced. Variants 1 and 2 didn't get much harder using the very small low edge for feet but the original version got much harder for me. For me zippy's.. 7c, var 1... 7b+, var 2.. 7c.

Rocketman have e mailed left wall stuff to you.... and the description for zippy's problem var 1 is still wrong... see my previous post...

Think zippy's PROBLEM var 1 as you are describing it doesn't exist.. you are trying to give it the description for zippy's SIDEPULL var 1.

Zippy's prob var 1 is normally the 7c version you have down as var 3.

Var 2 is normally 7c+ you have as var 2. The Ru's PDB guide has pretty clear descriptions.

That makes var 4 into var 3 and var 5 into var 4.

Does that make sense? Think you also need to get rid of the B grades. Would suggest the B6 is about 6c. The B7 about 7a or 7a+.

On the right wall B3 is about a 5+ish. The B4 .. 6aish. B6 is 6b. The B5 also worth about 6b? These are just guesses. Have done all of these many times but find grading them font stylee very tricky. anyone?

[Steamboat Stello]

Good work with the guide. Has made me keen to get down there again. I agree with blockhead on the B grades and I reckon you might have missed a hold off the "B6 problem" on the central bit. "B6 RF Guidebook - LH 17, RH gaston 21. Egyptian low edges. RH 30. Top 33". Think this has hold 19 for lh as well after RH gaston 21? Could be wrong though as its been a while.

Anyone think it will be dry this evening after yesterdays downpour?

[Andy B]

yes, It'll be dry.

[Eifeler]

Typo on Megatron, should be A to F on the topo.

[blockhead]

"B6 RF Guidebook - LH 17, RH gaston 21. Egyptian low edges. RH 30. Top 33". Think this has hold 19 for lh as well after RH gaston 21? Could be wrong though as its been a while.

Think rocketman has this right. The B6 described in the rockfax went from pocket with left and slopey sidepull with right, feet egyptianed... then popped right hand to massive sidepull. There may be some easier version using edge 19. Minus 10 manages to stay dry even in winter... unless there's a pretty long sustained period of rain. Will be dry.

[dave]

topo looks good, but would it not make sense to actually number holds which weren't in the last guide instead of having all this "small edge/sidepull 30/40cm above 5." etc?

[Barratt]

Here's the revised version - now got left, right and georges wall.

Only two areas remaining... might have this done and dusted by Thursday.

Tried to pick up most of the comments but the ones on Zippys are a bit confusing.

Blockhead, could you write them out and post/email me - would be really helpful!

Cheers for the help all 

http://clients.rckt.co.uk/stoney/Stoney2.pdf

[r-man]

There are two dynos on George's wall. The grade of Quent's is a guess (I don't know anyone who has done it), but it's certainly much harder than the dyno to the break.

7C     Quent's Legendary Dyno     From the large jug, dyno to the large sloper below the break.         
7B+ (soft)    George's Wall Dyno    From the large jug, dyno to the break.

Also, you still need to include Blockhead's Arete on the Megatron wall.

[dave]

probably also worth mentioning the original version of the Quent's dyno (at the base of Minus Ten the route). As per the description in one of the old OTE books, this has rules for feet - left foot on the pollished edge of the crack, right foot on a cluster of tiny spikes half way between the floor and the break. This basically turns it from a 7b that everyone does where you just have to stand up fast on jug footholds into something in another league. i've not really tried it or seen anyone on it but would imagine its pushing 7c. as we're being anally prescriptive about all the popular ellmintaes makes sense to be anally prescriptive about the unpopular ones too.

[blockhead]

Blockhead, could you write them out and post/email me - would be really helpful!

Think the Zippy's problems go a bit like this...

Zippy's problem.. 7b+ (or 7c?)..  just as you describe it.
Zippy's problem var 1.. 7c ( or 7b+?).. As for Zippy's problem but use pinch 50 instead of sidepull 48 for LH, then finish RH 53. Feet 41,55 and 43 .
Zippy's problem var 2.. 7c+ (or 7c?) .. As for var 1, but miss out edge 53 and dyno for jug 52 with RH. Feet 41,55 and 43.
Zippy's problem var 3.. 7c..  As for Zippy's problem but use undercut 49 instead of sidepull 48. (Have never done this so no idea about grade)
Zippy's problem var 4.. 7c+.. As for Zippy's problem to RH 47, then LH 54, RH 50, LH 51, finish RH 52. Feet 41,55 and 43.

Think thats about right. The grades as always are open to debate. I have always found var 4 to be the hardest and have not yet done it.. not sure if this means its 7c+ or not. Have never tried var 3,

[highrepute]

http://clients.rckt.co.uk/stoney/Stoney2.pdf

Beautiful!

Was out at -10 last eve. Guide very good. Only gripe, and a little nit-picking, is the number 2 hold looks to be in the wrong place. It's on the small edge/sidepull for harris problem and should be a bit further left to be on the sidepull.

[dave]

all looks good, few more thoughts:

i'm not convinced its a great idea to give things names unless they're actually unique names or ones that actually came about outside of the writing of the guidebook. I don't think there's much point calling 2 consecutive problems "RF guidebook" or "harris problem", "harris problem 1", "harris problem 1.003", just leave em without names i recon, not everything needs a name. Plus historically it seems that names made up just for a guide statistically don't tend to stick anyway(see loads of boulder problems in the BMC guides as examples), especially when its just someone's name and a number, hardly very memorable ("odd thing" being an example of a name that not really worth having).

Given that one armed bandit is the same grade with either hand, why describe it twice?

do the problems "slopey sidepull" and "odd thing" not finish with right on 31 after you've caught that little edge?

sean's problem - mention thumb round the edge of the sidepull.

lucian's undercut seems to be missing unless i'm blind
if its going generally left-to-right, shouldn't zippys sidepull and variant be before seans?

zippy's - mention sloper 47 is the bit on the edge, not the deeper bit at the back.

there's also some more eliminates on the megatron wall but you'd really need a better detailed photo of that main pocket-system hold to describe them really.