UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => the blog pile => Topic started by: comPiler on June 24, 2010, 10:13:48 am
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Just another day at the Cornice. (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/just-another-day-at-the-cornice)
23 June 2010, 8:56 am
Today. Saturday. It was just another day at the Cornice. Ive been walking in and out of Chee Dale from Worm Hill for 25 years . Familiarity doesn’t always breed contempt but a warm home-from-home feeling. It was an early start by Peak st...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Over the Wall (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/over-the-wall)
24 June 2010, 8:59 am
I have a dog. A border collie called Pip. She's 12 now. I don't know how old that is in dog years, but its getting on a bit. I grew up with working border collies on a remote farm in East Devon and wouldnt consider any other breed. They ...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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:'( Poor Pip.
I remember hearing that she fell off the Catwalk a few months back, but its pretty amazing that she went away unscathed if she's as old as 12!
Re the point of your post I wish I'd discovered climbing younger when my body would have kept up a little easier! However, regarding Stevie its undoubtedly a major factor that he climbed to a high standard in his younger years. Starting from scratch at nearly 30 I'm nowhere near over the hill of course, but I'm not even sure whether it will be physically possible for me to reach, say, 8c-9a standard now. I can't think of any examples of anyone having done it but they would be few and far between I would have thought.
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Hi Chris.
Yes the dogslip incident was worrier.
There are some late starters who achieved like Livesey. Most of us wont bag 8c-9a however hard we try or however early we start. The point I think is to be the best you can be within the life you chose to lead making the most of what you've got. Who has achieved most - a natural climber who climbs 8a without effort or someone whose applied themselves and worked really hard to do 7c. In absolute terms the former but in relative terms the latter. You play the cards you are dealt with.
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The best climber is the one having the most fun (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/the-best-climber-is-the-one-having-the-most-fun)
25 June 2010, 8:44 am
My last blogpost elicited a response from my business partner Toby that my opinions were worryingly close to the oft quoted 'the best climber is the one having the most fun'. I like this quote not only because it winds up the literally-m...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I've noticed 27 crags does the above (cut-short blogs) on here and google reader / Feedly. A bit of a pain.
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I've noticed 27 crags does the above (cut-short blogs) on here and google reader / Feedly. A bit of a pain.
No doubt so that you have to go to their site to read the full thing, increasing traffic throughput and potential for revenue through click-throughs.
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I emailed Markus at 27Crags and he is adding a second feed (whatever that means) so the next 10 blogs will include all the text. Not sure what happens after that.
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That dog story (that will no doubt appear here later) is genius.
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Another dog story (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/another-dog-story)
27 June 2010, 8:24 pm
Saturday. To the Cornice again with Seb Grieve this time. Seb is always good for a laugh and a fun day out is virtually guaranteed. In addition to Pip the only others climbers’ dog at the crag that day belonged to Mark Westerman. I don...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I emailed Markus at 27Crags and he is adding a second feed (whatever that means) so the next 10 blogs will include all the text. Not sure what happens after that.
Maybe you need to add the second feed to your 'compiler' as it still requires click through (which is shit).
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K2.95 (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/k2-95)
25 July 2010, 8:59 pm
In the early 90’s when I was busy building my career I was always a bit envious of my longstanding pal Seb Grieve being a full-time climber and the achievements he was clocking up at the time. Not the grit routes for which he is now famous, but the ace limestone routes he was ticking like Predator, the Oak and his own route K3 at the Cornice.
Seb’s long term effort on what was to become K3 became a bit of a standing joke. In the guide the line was written up as “Seb’s Project. Due for completion sometime in the 1990’s”. The joke wasn’t lost on him. He had a school pencil case which had drill bits in and other climbing stuff which he used to leave on a low ledge below K3. It had a clear plastic sleeve for schoolboys to insert their name and address. Seb’s read: “Seb Grieve, The Cornice, Chee Dale, Peak District, Derbyshire”. There is a picture of him on it here (image 15): http://www.keithsharplesphotography.co.uk/galleries/Gal_SportsClimbing2.htm He was ripped then. Now the tables have turned – but only a bit. We are both older, probably no wiser. He is a hard working sales professional and put on a few pounds whilst I'm self-employed with greater freedom over my time to climb and train.
Naturally K3 has always been a route I’ve been drawn to. Notwithstanding the history K3 is a superb burly route worthy of anyone’s time. I put a lot of days into it 5 or 6 years ago but in reality was a long way off ticking it then. Subsequently I don’t think it has been dry or clean. I re-opened this old account this year – on the 22nd May to be precise. Although not my first 8a+ it is harder than the other two I have redpointed. Fortunately I still had a word document with the beta to refer back to which proved handy. Since then I have had 14 sessions on it. I had to check my diary as I had no idea. Like Nic Sellars is reported to have said – if it takes longer than 5 days then stop counting. All bar one of the sessions has been enjoyable. I love summoning up every bit effort to make progress. However, on one of the sessions the frustrations of long term redpointing got on top of me. I’ve got over that now especially as of yesterday when I got close to reaching the end of the crux section. In fact the position I fell off is the exact same position where Seb is in the photograph . From there you can get an unlikely kneebar rest in the feature of undercut rock dubbed ‘the pancake’. It smells good.
In the two months I have been on K3 a succession of strong climbers have passed through. They typically tick it in 1,2 or 3 sessions. That seems to be more the way of things these days. You could argue it either way – they should be putting the days in on 8c’s or I should be doing quick redpoints of 7c’s. It comes down to a matter of personal taste and perhaps fashion too. Despite the length of time I have, for the most part, thoroughly enjoyed the process - but will enjoy closure more. K2.95 is just not good enough.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Yesterday’s news (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/yesterdays-news)
7 August 2010, 7:11 pm
It was only 10 days ago that I redpointed K3, but it feels like months ago. On the drive out I was thinking that a hectic day being serially let down (by so-called professionals who should behave a lot better) was hardly good preparation for a lifetime hardest redpoint. We had gone out two evenings before and a mist had hung over the river. I’d felt strong but the humidity made it too hard. However, on the Thursday evening there was a small breeze blowing through the dale creating mint conditions. With not many teams out, it was quiet too.
After a couple of warm-ups and putting the clips in, it went first redpoint. I didn’t quite get the big undercut properly at the end of the crux but still managed to pull through to the kneebar rest for the first time. I shook out three times on each arm in readiness for the hard move above. Although lots of people fall off this move or above it I was pretty confident that I wouldn’t. So it proved to be. Even so I was in a bit of a daze at the belay – had I really, really done it?
I’m still chuffed but the elation has subsided. Yesterday’s news. The past week I have kicked back a bit - drinking and eating whatever I fancied. So, what next? I have a wistful goal to do 10,000 8a nu points. With K3 in the bag it has become a possibility. Doing a bit of number-crunching I have just worked out if I close out a few existing projects including the Oak before November I can do it...but only just. This is a big ask and will make it far and away my best year of sport climbing. I’d better pull my finger out.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Toys out of the Pram (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/toys-out-of-the-pram)
11 August 2010, 2:08 pm
*RANT ALERT* Last night I went down to Nettle Buttress in Chee Dale with Rob and Nic. It was the third evening visit for me and Rob. Nic tagged along this time. We had been trying a route called 'Toys for the Boys', a bewilderingly technical wall climb up a gently overhanging wall of fused limestone. It has a reputation for being impossible at first acquaintance then comes together quickly. Sounds good.
I had got through the crux twice on the second evening but then fallen off at an upside down pocket which I get with my right thumb (and then clip!) and then turn it into a 2 finger undercut. Turning it into an undercut requires pinching a polished crimp with the other hand. I can't hold the crimp long enough to smoothly take the thumb out and reinsert two fingers. Rob can. He demonstrated by doing just that..and blowing. Thanks Robin, nice touch. For me repeated attempts were 50% successful on the dog but cut my ring finger.
Anyway conditions were better last night and the cut had partially healed. I was hopeful. Screw that. I was having it - I would own the route and bag those extra 8a nu points, then discard the route like a used prophylactic. Except I didn't.
First go putting the clips I re-opened the gash on my finger on the undercut pocket despite taping up. First redpoint I made a foot fault so fell off. I then had a go at reworking the finger swap using the front two fingers instead to save the cut ring finger. It placed a huge strain on the tendon undercutting up but was worth the risk. Rob then redpoints the route. My turn again. Light starting to fail. Moves went well. Got to the pocket. Clipped the bolt. Deep breath 1,2,3 and..fail on the swap yet again. Swear LOUDLY. Its not as if its even a climbing move FFS. All the anger and frustration with the route and other frustrations of the week came out with me screaming C U N T S..on the end of a rope..in a leafy Derbyshire Dale ...with a river bubbling past ...and an undercut pocket of limestone that didnt give a shit.
It was also a scream against tensions that had been building during the week - a protest against car repair bills, workload, our innocent guinea pigs slaughtered by next door neighbours cat, a plumbers shoddy work, a flooring guy not turning up. In short I lost my rag, lost control and you know what? that makes me annoyed too. Arrrrgggghhh.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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On the plus side, I think that's your best blog post to date. ;)
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On the plus side, I think that's your best blog post to date. ;)
Ta Adam. Y'know I hesitated before I posted that as I thought it was self-indulgent i.e cathartic for me and and a whinging rant of no interest to anyone else. Just goes to show. Actually I don't what it goes show ... never second-guess your audience? publish and be damned maybe? Wash your dirty linen in public?
Confused of Sheffield :-\
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The question here is surely WWDD? ( :bow: ) ... fortuitously He addresses this in His latest blog (http://onlineclimbingcoach.blogspot.com/2010/08/5-ways-to-sabotage-your-training.html). Note point 5.
:lol: I thought that too but doesn't mean Dave sticks to it.
Come to think of it I reckon all top climbers probably do this so you're in good company Simon...
Witness Dave in E11, Ondra in numerous videos and best of all Jordan's comedy gold 'owwww' after kicking Widdop Wall in frustration on Grit Flick!
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The question here is surely WWDD? ... fortuitously He addresses this in His latest blog (http://onlineclimbingcoach.blogspot.com/2010/08/5-ways-to-sabotage-your-training.html). Note point 5.
Yeah but more importantly WWJD ? :bow: :bow: moan, bitch and curse, of course.
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...and an undercut pocket of limestone that didnt give a shit.
Quite brilliant. :)
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Tenacity (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/tenacity)
26 August 2010, 11:31 am
This seems to be the word of the moment. Dan Varian has written a good article on the subject in the latest edition of Climb magazine and it seems to come up increasingly in climbing conversation.
'Team Tenacity' is a phrase that has been mentioned a few times on UKB in the past and I recently learnt that it was invented by Dobbin. I had assumed that the members of the Team were Paul Reeve and Keith Sharples (and possibly Simon Reed) and I was pleasantly surprised to also learn recently I was on Team Tenacity too – though undoubtedly the weakest member of the team.
We are all united by being old skool long term siegers of sport routes. Also (if it existed) it is a team in the loosest possible sense - you would be hard pressed to find a group of more self-centred 'unteamy' obsessives. Admittedly we are friends who have been known to socialise and go on climbing trips abroad together. But when it comes down it is the mutual interest of happening to want to go to the same crag (usually Tor, Malham or Kilnsey) on the same day that binds us. Paul must be the team captain with levels of drive, energy and selfishness that are both admirable and appalling at the same time. He also scored a crucial TT goal by redpointing Unjustified this year.
Back to tenacity. I think there is a big difference between long term strategic tenacity which is the ability to come back year after year to a project without getting psychologically broken and the on-the-route tenacity that means that you throw everything at your attempt on a route - Jerrylike. Anyway Dobbin (if indeed you are to blame) strictly speaking it should have been 'Team Persistence' rather than 'Team Tenacity'.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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You fat bastard (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/you-fat-bastard)
10 December 2010, 5:05 pm
I'm 46 now and wear the same size jeans I had when I was 18, maybe smaller. In the normal world this would rate as some sort of minor miracle but through the looking glass of aspirational sport climbing it is nothing to write home about.
I weigh myself most mornings - before breakfast and stark bollock naked of course. Over the last 2 years my weight has fluctuated up to a Christmas max weight of 11.9 down to a minimum summer redpoint weight of 11.1 (sorry for being Imperial but that's how I still think).
Earlier this year inspired by Dave Macs thoughts on weight in 9 out of 10 Climbers I took advantage of a contact I had at the University sports science department (cheers Rob) and popped in to have my body fat properly measured. This included impedence testing and caliper measurements and putting the results through a few alternative fat distribution formulas. At a weight of 73.1kg I was carrying 11.7kg of fat according to the calipers and 11.1kg according to the impedence- so between 15-16% body fat. Taking the lower impedence figure my lean body weight was 62kg so if I lost just fat I could hit Dave's target recommended weight of 10% body fat by weighing 68.2kg i.e. below 10st 12lbs.
I did go on to lose up to 3kgs after the test a few times but even at my lowest I was still carrying 3lbs more than I need to. Even at that weight there is the opportunity to tactically knock of say another 3lbs pounds for a big redpoint.
Trouble is, and always has been, that I love to guzzle food, beer and wine. Just thinking about dieting makes me feel hungry. This time of year is especially difficult sailing into a bow wave of festive treats, parties and boozing. Also route climbing weather seems so very far away.
Cutting out chocolates and other treats got me down to 11.1-3 but a change in habits and attitude is going to be required to get into the sub 11 scrawny zone and stay there. Averaging a pound a week seems sensible. That should have me below 11stone by March. How hard can that be? Very, I think. Not hard in the sense of a big effort for a route but hard in the sense of the day-to-day drudgery of regular small denials of gratification.
The performance rewards are potentially big. If I can hit this target weight and gain the endurance I expect to from periodised training the combined effect should knock things up to another level. I feel a bit silly putting this out on a blog but by doing so it feels like I'm making more of a commitment to what in reality is just a contract with myself to actually achieve the target weight loss.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Cheat meals can help a lot.
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As in meals with no calories or skipping them altogether ?
Another tip I am going to follow is to spoil my appetite by having a snack 20 mins before a main meal.
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Its called a starter, you greedy bastard :lol:
(good luck with the above)
Stallion (on the downlow)
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Its called a starter, you greedy bastard :lol:
Ah - I realise why that tip appealed to me so much now. Must try harder.
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As in meals with no calories or skipping them altogether ?
No, its a meal (or sometimes a day even) where you purposefully allow yourself to stray from your diet in order to preserve will power. Obviously if you eat a black chocolate gateaux at each cheat you might as well not bother but allowing yourself something you can crave can help a bit.
I'm sure google might throw up some more eloquent articles on the subject.
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Periodisation (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/periodisation)
15 December 2010, 2:11 pm
“So how’s the periodised plan going?” is something I get asked. It’s not something I can really answer till after May 2011 but I have faith that its going well.
Personally I only know a few climbers who follow a periodised training plan – in fact precisely three – Stu, Jules and Tommy. Why is it so unpopular in climbing compared to other sports?
I can think of a few reasons but the literature on climbing training hasn't helped. Much as I love the ground-breaking "Performance Climbing" I think the byzantine complexity of its section on periodisation put climbers off the scent for a generation - well it put me off anyway. Since then "Self-Coached Climber" has again put people off by advocating a progressive approach and Dave Mac doesn’t mention it at all in "9 out of 10"(I think). David Macia who trains Patxi Usobiaga has written a book covering it but it is in Spanish and out of print. Whilst there is a mass of literature in other sports from where it is derived (along with a lexicon of jargon to swallow) the demands of other sports have different demands on physical variables such as oxygen consumption which have no bearing on climbing capability. To complicate matters further there are now multiple variations of periodisation with their own advocates from diffrent sports.
The net result is we have an approach to training that is hard to understand, harder to apply to climbing and from a behavioural point of view hard to follow. All a bit difficult and off-putting - yes?
Cry me a river, Where's my tiny violin etc etc. Delayed gratification and hard graft is a mark of an adult and a good athlete. Most importantly, applied correctly the SCIENCE says it works. To ignore it I felt, was making a choice to jeopardise my sport climbing aspirations. Bewildered by the info on the web I took the easy route and shelled out for a coaching session and training programme from Tommy.
I'm now 5 weeks into the programme but it was only on Monday that I felt like I put in my first decent training session. By decent I mean I got the levels of intensity right – concentrating on training rather than performing.
The session involved putting two blocks/units of training back-to-back and entailed 3 sets of 4 reps of an AnCap 15 move problem on the 40 degree board then a half hour rest then sweating my way through an Aerobic Capacity unit of 5 sets of 10 easy boulder problems. I was zonked out at the end.
Between rests I watched my mates having much more fun getting stuck in to some good looking problems on the steep section of the Wave. More fool me? or them?.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Benchmarking (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/benchmarking)
20 January 2011, 1:22 pm
After over a fortnight of flu I'm at last feeling well - its like being re-born.
Being ill scuppered following the training programme. Doing stuff like Power Endurance is a bad idea if you are ill as it stresses the whole body. Lower impact stuff like aerobic capacity training or localised strength training like deadhanging should be OK though. In fact I found I was getting a bit addicted to deadhanging with some noticeable gains with one handed hangs from a first joint edge and the belief that a one-armer on a first joint edge might be possible. Best not get to get sidetracked training for these party tricks.
In order to take stock and get back on track I had a session with Coach Randall on Monday evening. He took me through a similar set of exercises to my first assessment in August - a time when I was climbing well. I wasn't hopeful but it turned out that I had moved up a level in all the kety areas. The exercises included 4 repeats on a long V5 boulder problem, 4 repeats of a steep 6c+ route as well as 10 mins Continuous climbing on a bouldering circuit. Also some of the upper back stiffness that had prevented me doing cross-thrus had improved - although still some way to go here. Similarly I could hang an edge with my left that I couldn't touch last time.
When your nose is up against it week in week out with the training its hard to notice improvements especially when your memory is as fucked as mine. Having a session of benchmarking has given me a bit of renewed vigour. Mind you if it had turned out that I had gone backwards I would be slitting my wrists now.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Hour of Power (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/hour-of-power)
27 January 2011, 8:32 pm
I found myself on the receiving end of a bargain job lot of holds, boards and mats about 18 months ago. The thing is I then had to construct a shed at significantly greater expense to accommodate them. I'm useless at DIY. It went up wonky but watertight at least after a builder was drafted in to finish the roof and doors. I like being in there - its a den to escape to. A man and his shed - it's a primal thing.
One of my regular sessions in the shed as part of the programme is doing a session of ten reps of six single hard moves. It's a session I really enjoy. Four of the moves replicate moves on Austrian Oak - my long term project at Malham. I usually struggle on all of the moves - but not tonight. They were piss - at least a grade easier then ever before. I don't know what has made the difference but, for now, I'm ecstatic.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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You're not trying hard enough (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/you-re-not-trying-hard-enough)
9 February 2011, 12:22 pm
When I got into climbing in the early 80's at university I used to fall off - a lot - to the extent that I was awarded 'Lob of the Year' by the University Mountaineering Club. My motto was that "if you aren't falling then you aren't trying hard enough".
Clearly falling and decking out or hurting yourself is trying too hard, but the point is that if you are falling on a regular basis it is a sign that you are pushing and extending yourself at the crag. Of course these days you can push yourself physically a lot more safely with the development of bouldering and sport climbing, but even on trad there are a lot of safe test pieces.
Despite some pretty hairy falls in the past I have never had a big problem with falling per se and so find it intensely frustrating belaying when partners won't move above good gear despite being in a safe fallout zone. My eldest son Ben just can't do it. I now try to incorporate some falling or at least sagging on the rope each time we have a roped session. Furthermore its quite obvious that higher Ben gets, the worse the fear becomes, as his climbing movement becomes increasingly slow and clunky. It's going to be long haul before the fear of falling stops inhibiting his climbing performance.
Taking the "you're not trying hard enough" theme a bit further perhaps you can apply it to other apects of your life. You're not trying hard enough (to be the climber you could be) if you aren't falling out with your wife (over the time you spend climbing) but trying too hard if you end up banished to live in a shed on an allotment (like one notable climber recently). Conversely are you trying too hard with your career, DIY or other (self-imposed) commitment ?
Training or dieting (guilty) are others obvious areas where trying hard but not too hard are key. In a related way so is injury. If you aren't getting niggles then you probably aren't training or climbing hard enough, but you are trying too hard if you totally ignore them to extent they exacerbate to become debilitating injuries. Too hard or too stupid.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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:agree: Good post. I've only really appreciated the importance of falling off in the last coupla months and it was a proper revalation.
The shed story cracked me up! Anyone on here? :-\
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:agree: too. A timely reminder to try harder.
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You're not trying hard enough (to be the climber you could be) if you aren't falling out with your wife (over the time you spend climbing)
Oddly I am much much better at that than falling off routes :-\
:agree: :lol:
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You're not trying hard enough (to be the climber you could be) if you aren't falling out with your wife (over the time you spend climbing)
Frau M dragged me to the wall last Saturday when I was trying to recuperate from a bouldering session. I managed to avoid falling out with her over it, although I did skive off my practice falls for the session.
Persuading her to go outside where it's cold and the holds are the same colour as the rest of the rock is however a constant struggle.
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My eldest son Ben just can't do it. I now try to incorporate some falling or at least sagging on the rope each time we have a roped session. Furthermore its quite obvious that higher Ben gets, the worse the fear becomes, as his climbing movement becomes increasingly slow and clunky. It's going to be long haul before the fear of falling stops inhibiting his climbing performance.
"Come on Toby, you're just not trying!" :)
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/images/clip/p00ccqpg_640_360.jpg)
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:lol:
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Trip report Day 1 of 4 (Tarn) (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/trip-report-day-1-of-4-tarn)
15 February 2011, 1:56 pm
A long weekend away has worked well on a couple of trips now as it fits around my work and family. With such a miserable winter I was desperate for real rock and also my 8aSpew borecard needed fluffing up with 7b and 7b+ onsights. Karl Smith proprietor of the Shropshire Bouldering Centre aka Newport Rock (http://www.newportrock.com/Gallery/Wall_pics/) was up for it too. Cantobre (http://www.chadurif.fr/topo-5.html) caught my eye. The training was going well and flights to Rodez were cheap. The plan was formed. I pinned a tail on it and called it a fox.
I set off from Sheffield at 6am on Friday and met Karl at Stansted at 10am over a 'Farm Breakfast special'. We landed at Rodez airport early afternoon. Not much more than a bus stop it was a model of efficiency. We were processed and despatched to our underpowered Seat hire car in 7 minutes and 45 seconds, approximately.
We headed straight to the Tarn Gorge - approaching it from the top. A splendid sight. Perhaps 2,000 feet deep with crag after crag lining it high on the opposite side - all unclimbed. I'd not been before but Karl had. We parked up at the bottom. No one else there. Perfect temperature. We did a couple of 6's to warm up and then Karl pointed me at a fine looking 7a up a wall with a 7b+ extension up a headwall. I was determined not to overcook it by going on the extension. But you know how it is. The extension didnt look to bad when I got there. So what the hell. I went for it getting a flash pump moving left from the second bolt. I lunged left as my right hand uncurled in a finger jug and was off. Drat. Karl did the route and stripped the gear.
The light was starting to fade. Just time for one more. I picked a 40 meter 7a+ corner line that arched left at the top. It turned out to be muddy and damp to start with and some of the bolts were awkwardly placed. Higher up it got good where it arched left. It was exciting burling up on undercuts with smears for feet as it was getting dark. Suddenly the belay was there. Great. What a start to the trip. We hadn't expected to have time to climb the first day but got 4 routes in.
Our accommodation was a characterless hotel in the commercial district of Millau near a retail park with a Geant supermarket. Karl was excited to live out his Alan Partridge fantasy. The room was cramped. I thought the allocation of pillows and towels was miserly. Fortunately the laundry room was next door and unlocked so I exercised my consumer rights to correct the discrepancy.
We weren't hungry so went to bed early.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Trip report Day 2 of 4 (Boffi) (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/trip-report-day-2-of-4-boffi)
16 February 2011, 2:23 pm
It was foggy and cold outside the hotel. Bit of a downer after the good conditions yesterday. Over Petit Dejeuner an old French geezer predicted snow. We hung around for a bit then headed out into the gloom.
The Boffi crags are situated high on one side of the Dourbie Valley and are accessed from the top. All these deep cut valleys are seperated by higher stretches of ground called Causses. Millau was located low down where the Tarn and Dourbie rivers meet so to access Boffi we needed to drive up to the top of a Causse. Droving up the hairpins the mist thinned then cleared entirely revealing blue skies and sun. We cheerfully looked down on a cloud inversion that enveloped Millau.
The parking is in a forest and is about 30 minutes walk from the cliffs edge. When we got there we were treated to the spectacle of eight pterodacytls circling at the cliffs edge. These mighty bird-things are named after a brand of ice-axe and had enormous wingspans and had been extinct since the end of the Cretinaceous period. Karl claimed they were griffin vultures. I had my doubts.
We scrambled down to Secteur WarmUp which Karl declared was magnificent. Again I had my doubts as it looked a bit slabby. Karl identified a 6b and 6c to start with. I led up the 6b which had a hard first section and easy middle bit. At the last bolt it blanked out. I contemplated a retreat but ego took over and using a terrible edge and blind foot swap reached the belay. Karl went up and pronounced the move impossible.
Surely the 6c couldnt be harder than this ? Karl looked across whilst lowering and said it looked alright. Needless to say it was the living end and I couldnt even dog the last moves. Karl fared just as badly on top rope.I checked the guide. The first route was 6c and the second 7a+. Karl seemed relieved. I was appalled at his lack of remorse and told him. He was unmoved. I called him a cunt and we moved on..to the next buttress. Sector Damned.
There was French team there with a DFBWGC called Cindy I think. They had ropes and draws on a couple of the routes. Triple checking the guide we chose a 7a+ that was free. There was a tricky section which I faffed around on before commiting to a sequence. The rest was easy but good climbing. Success.
Karl's turn. The DFBWGC started up the 7b+ to the right of him. I was in a quandry. Would watching her derriere on the critical moves disqualify the onsight? What would Jens do ? I lowered my gaze.
Karl flashed the 7a+ and Cindy flashed the 7b+. Karl swung across and put some draws on the vacated 7b+. My go. I went for it but was spat off a hard move at 25 feet. Oh dear. It wasn't looking good for the borecard. I decided to have a go at 'Damned'. This was a 6c with a 7b extension in the middle of the secteur to a lower off at 42meters. It turned out to be straightforward runout steep wall climbing on superb rock - the sort of thing I love. No contest.
Time was getting on and sector Damned was now in the shade. We headed back to another secteur in what was left of the sun. A 7a left leaning groove looked appealing. I led to the 4th bolt which had a mailon on it. I declared that this was a bad sign. Karl said it was there to help strip the route. I had my doubts. The move was desperate and my feet slipped off the smears. Karl got to the same point and lowered off the mailon.
A tremendous day. I reappraised Karl's sagacity whilst we walked out in the dark.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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LOL. Good stuff. I approve of correcting the bedding distribution.
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Trip report Day 3 of 4 (Cantobre) (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/trip-report-day-3-of-4-cantobre)
17 February 2011, 5:10 pm
It was foggy outside the hotel again but we now knew this didnt necessarily mean it would be foggy at the crags. Today was Cantobre day. This was the crag that had attracted me to the area in the first place. Like Boffi it was in the Dourbie gorge but accessed from the bottom rather than the top. We drove up the valley and were surprised how far it was. The guide didn't help. Like a lot of french guides it was a triumph of style (fluff) over substance. I wasn't surprised when the map in it led us astray.
Cantobre is a village which is precariously balanced on undercut limestone knoll on a hill. The crag lies opposite. The temperature was 2degrees and there was a biting wind. As we walked up to the crag and I got a better view of it my spirits sank. The limestone was perfect but the routes all had powerful undercut starts on pockets. Noooo...I was going to get spanked, no doubt about it. We scuttled round the corner to Secteur Warm up and did a couple of nice 6's. I tried a 7a as well which had a gnarly crux on small shallow pockets over a bulge. It was too cold and too hard for me. After frigging that we couldn't put it off any longer and headed back to the main crag.
The right side wasn't so undercut and had a nice 7a+. We both did it. I then went on the crag classic Turbulence(7b+). From the ground it was obvious that there was a dyno at the third bolt. I wound myself up and putting everything into it climbed quickly to the dyno which I fell off. Never mind. The route may not have suited me but it was soooo good. Although I had no intention of trying to redpoint it I dogged my way to the top yarding on pockets and revelling in the moves and rock quality. Best route I've ever failed on - probably - (except the Nose maybe).
We then both failed on the start of a 7b. No spew points today. Back to Millau for a couple of consolation Hoegardens for Karl and Leffes for me.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Trip report Day 4 of 4 (Tarn again) (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/trip-report-day-4-of-4-tarn-again)
17 February 2011, 5:38 pm
Yet again it was foggy outside the hotel again but for variety this time it was raining too. We packed up and headed back to Tarn which being roadside suited our travel plans. Karl was going to drop me off before 1pm at Rodez to catch a flight back whilst he drove on to St Leger to join Twid Turner and family.
It was claggy and miserable driving up the Tarn Gorge though Karl seemed to think it was atmospheric. He was certain the crag namely Le Grand Toit (Twat)would be dry. He had a 7b+ in mind for me. The crag was dry as he predicted protected overhead by the huge roof (Toit). A couple of the warmups on the left had been de-bolted (some mysterious bad bolts issue) but a 6c+ was still kitted. Karl was just belaying to give himself a rest day.
After doing the warm-up I fancied a go at the 7b to the right. Karl had done it before and said it was onsightable. I gave it a blast getting to a shallow porthole which I desperately undercutted. My arms were too tired and the holds too far away. I slumped onto the bolt. Karl said that was the same point he got to and in fact everyone else he had seen try it fell at the same point. I pointed out that this didn't exactly tie up with his declaration that it was onsightable. I had a couple of goes dogging the move then threaded the bolt and stripped it. I decided that it was futile to attempt a 7b+ and instead did an immense 7a trad stylee corner to finish. We packed up with time to spare and headed to the airport.
That was end of the trip for me. In terms of performance not as successful as I'd hoped for but I'd had an ace time and it hadn't cost much time or money.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I think I know this route... the options are undercutting for grim death or sacrificing a tendon in a horrible mono (which the Mrs. comfortably stacked a few fingers in).
Didn't you nip around to L'oasif? There's some more Brit friendly onsightable stuff there.
I still think 27crags blogs are frustrating; out of all the blogs I read, YOURS is the only one which demands click-throughs and therefore won't work well on Smartphones/Feedly.
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I think I know this route... the options are undercutting for grim death or sacrificing a tendon in a horrible mono (which the Mrs. comfortably stacked a few fingers in).
Didn't you nip around to L'oasif? There's some more Brit friendly onsightable stuff there.
I still think 27crags blogs are frustrating; out of all the blogs I read, YOURS is the only one which demands click-throughs and therefore won't work well on Smartphones/Feedly.
Thanks for subscribing - I'll take up the click through issue with 27crags. They are quite receptive to changing stuff.
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I still think 27crags blogs are frustrating; out of all the blogs I read, YOURS is the only one which demands click-throughs and therefore won't work well on Smartphones/Feedly.
We already have full content feeds. You can access them with urls like this:
http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/content.atom (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/content.atom)
I guess I should make the full content feed the default and advertise both feed versions on the web page. The advantage of snippets is that they are faster to download so you can have a history of 100 links in your feed reader instead of 10 posts with full content.
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my life is more complete.
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Good work Monsieur Le Shark
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You skinny fucker (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/you-skinny-fucker)
24 February 2011, 10:15 pm
Follower of my blog (hi Paul!) may recall my commitment to gradual weight loss to achieve 10% body fat. The weight target was based on a thorough body composition test I had a year ago. Since the blog 3 months ago I have singularly failed to lose any weight to speak of.
This morning I headed back to the uni lab for a re-check. I went in weighing pretty much the same as last year i.e. just over 73kg. The lab now has a fancy new £7K impedance machine and Rob did the caliper measurements as well.
You could have knocked me down with a feather - not cos I was light obviously - but because the machine gave my body fat reading as 8.7% fat. YYFY ! but wait a sec...NNFN !
I had turned the equivalent mass of lard into prime British beef. Thus I had hit my body fat target without realising it. But I had also scored an own goal as my potential to reduce weight through fat reduction was severely diminished by nearly half a bloody stone.
Although I won't get the full results till next week it appears that most of the muscle has been in my abdomenal area. Whilst this hasnt given me a six pack it does explain a few things such as how I sudddenly found I could do a front lever for the first time in my life. In addition the weights and squats work have recently had a noticeable effect on my climbing. I now find it much easier to keep my feet on the 40 degree board at the Foundry when tired and bear down on them too.
Walking back from the lab other things began to click in my mind. When I had my assessment with Coach Randall 6 months ago one of the observations he made about my technique was that I had a tendency to climb with feet unnecessarily high doing moves bunched up. I have to admit I was a bit dismissive about this describing it as 'a signature move'. On Tuesday at the Edge I had watched as Randall did laps of a 7a with his feet a lot lower than the way I did the moves i.e. by climbing "tall". It now occured to me that my aversion to climbing tall stemmed from a weaknesses in(or ingrained lack of confidence from former weakness) in transmitting power and tension through my core and legs that meant my feet have a tendency to pop off. Consequently by having feet high I took the strain in my upper body which is better developed making the move less efficient but lower % in terms of failure due to feet popping.
My key aim in developing better lower body strength was to prevent the regular lower back injuries I incurred when overdoing the climbing or training - and there is no doubt that it has helped enormously. The challenge for me I now realise is to find ways to deploy this new strength by changing my climbing.
Overall the positive aspects of this lean mass gain have the potential to far outweigh the negatives. And no one can call me fat bastard anymore. SCIENCE says I'm a skinny fucker now.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I do like your blog mate.
There's some great stuff in there like "signature move" and "prime British beef"
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by having feet high I took the strain in my upper body which is better developed making the move less efficient but lower % in terms of failure due to feet popping.
Bloody ek, I do this all the time. One to work on then!
*wanders off muttering about coaching*
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Liking the blog Simon! Hopefully suffering the same with my weight stubbornly refusing to drop even a pound despite all the exercise...
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if the squats and deadlift work hasnt mostly added muscle bulk to your hamstrings/ quads/glutes and lower back also then ill plat shit mate.. :)
Cheers
Tim
p.s. hopefully the increased core stablility will help you out with your project?
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Thanks guys :hug:
p.s. hopefully the increased core stablility will help you out with your project?
Hope so - in theory it should as many of the moves rely on reasonable core and lower body strength particularly the big throw/reach but also keeping weight down on the feet on the smears when moving back left which is the redpoint crux.
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Walking back from the lab
(http://musicalatinaymas.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Eminem-Dr-Dre21.jpg)
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by having feet high I took the strain in my upper body which is better developed making the move less efficient but lower % in terms of failure due to feet popping.
Bloody ek, I do this all the time. One to work on then!
*wanders off muttering about coaching*
I'm not sure feet high is by necessity a bad thing and, without wishing to put words into coach Randalls mouth, I imagine he agrees. I've never had the delight of seeing Shark climb (or at least not that I'm aware of) so can't comment on his particular style but I'd suggest that perhaps his high footing style had become overly predominant and his repotoire of moves had been accordingly stifled.
I also regularly use a high foot, in common with lots of shorter climbers. It is often a very efficient way of climbing but along with pretty much all techniques can be over utilised and develop into a reliance.
Good technique isn't knowing HOW to flag/crimp/smear/egyptian/heel-hook/toe-hook/etc etc etc but rather knowing WHEN to flag/crimp/smear/egyptian/heel-hook/toe-hook/etc etc etc.
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I'm not sure feet high is by necessity a bad thing and, without wishing to put words into coach Randalls mouth, I imagine he agrees. I've never had the delight of seeing Shark climb (or at least not that I'm aware of) so can't comment on his particular style but I'd suggest that perhaps his high footing style had become overly predominant and his repotoire of moves had been accordingly stifled.
You're not wrong
To quote Tom's feedback on this point:
"Footwork and body positioning is one of the major areas in terms of technique that can be worked on for you. In terms of footwork – you could improve on your accuracy and timing. In terms of body positioning – you often will sit too high on moves, which means your hips come out from the wall too much and you involve you upper back muscles too intensively on many easier moves"
On training routes I am trying to re-educate myself to straight arm for holds where possible rather than bunch myself up. If you can reach a hold by straight arming it (and usually twisting) then usually it will be a more efficient way to do the move (but obviously if you can't reach the target hold then it isn't). There was a good illustration of this in Performance Rock Climbing where a burly overhanging route with a reputation for powerful moves was climbed by a relatively weak female climber by straight arming and twisting on all the moves. Can't remember the climers name or the climber.
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As part of your re-education you should wear a shock collar and have someone watch and zap you every time you get your feet too high. Quckly correct the problem.
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FFS you'll be resting your way up routes soon Shark. Where's the fun in that?
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I like Cezanne, Cezanne (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/i-like-cezanne-cezanne)
23 March 2011, 3:27 pm
Anyone recall the Innes Book of Records? Thought not. I used to love it. Twas a surreal sketch show from the late 70's on BBC2. One of the songs went "I like Cezanne, Cezanne with him I know where I am". Innes was right. You do know where you are with Cezanne. Its all laid bare on the canvas with his struggle to represent the 3d world on a 2d canvas and being honest without resorting to trompe l'oeil trickery. He wasnt too intersted in the subject matter I think but more trying to reconcile the unreconciliable. His finished works were probably never for him a perfect end product but just a stopping point when he had eventually reached some uneasy equilibrium. I feel like saying "FFS Paul - stop torturing yourself and take up sculpture instead".
This business of trying to reconcile the unreconcilable is of course the meat and veg of anyone trying to be the best they can be in diffrent parts of their lives typically as a dad, spouse, climber and insert profession. There is an unrelenting grind of daily compromises which can get you to generally score well enough in all areas with the occasional victory to celebrate or set back to brood over. There is always the constant nagging doubt you could do better. C'est la vie. Or as Cezanne said to me only yesterday "FFS Sharky take up walking instead"
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Stepping down (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/stepping-down)
28 March 2011, 10:09 am
Malham - yesterday. Beautiful day. A bit too beautiful for optimal conditions. It cooled down later though. Felt really bad and jaded on the warm-up. Head has been all over the place this week and find it hard to string two thoughts together let alone two moves.
I have recently been re-trying Baboo Baboo. The crux on it seemed as hard to me as it ever was. This is a route I have tried on and off for the last 15 years after doing Zoolook in 1994. Although Zoolook is graded harder (8a+ some would have you believe) the fingery brick hard crux of Baboo is something I can only just about dog.
The sequence I use is off a large sidepull to the left and a pinchy undercut for the right to go for a high crimp/pinch with the left. The normal sequence uses a high gaston for the left just under the bolt so you can snatch into a thin undercut with the right before going for the same high crimp/pinch. I had tried the normal sequence many times but it never worked and I concluded I just didnt have the finger strength for it. Today, on my second go up Andy Farnell encouraged me to try the normal sequence again as he was sure my sequence was whack. Same problem. Can't hold the gaston well enough to make the snatch. Doing this move I always use a high right foot (my signature move) but cannot put enough force on it to stop it popping whilst making the snatch. Then eureka. I tried it keeping the right foot low and pressing hard on it while standing tall and BOOM the thin undercut is mine. Using this undercut sets me up much better for the next long move for the high crimp/pinch.
It was funny in retrospect the rationalisation I used for not being able to make the move whilst up there on the dog - lack of finger strength, lack of shoulder strength etc all of which seemed plausible. The real reason was my ingrained habit of placing my foot high at any opportunity. I'd like to report that I redpointed it straght after but it didn't happen.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Cartoon time (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/cartoon-time)
17 April 2011, 5:16 pm
I wasn't especially looking forward to going to Font as the Malham season was in full swing and there were chains to be grabbed (I mean clipped)but it had been booked a year ago. We had spent last easter in Font and it had worked out so well that before we left we had booked the gites for this year as well - we being me, Rob Barker, Mark Hundleby, John Welford..and respective partners..and kids. This year with Andrea as well and her 3 kids that made a total of 21; 12 kids and 9 adults. Sounds like a nightmare but again it worked out superbly for everyone - no rain and good times all round.
In the past I never got on with Font and trips have left me fed up and frustrated. I like open spaces and always felt a bit hemmed in at forested venues like Font and the Frankenjura. Being shit generally at bouldering didn't help and specifically even shitter when it comes to bouldering at Font. But these last two trips have been different. First off they are family trips foremost - in fact it was Sonia who had made the arrangements. Consequently I had no particular expectations and consequently no self-inflicted pressure to perform and took each day out as it came. I left the evening planning to the others, Forest veterans to a man, and then was chaperoned each morning to typically esoteric quiet venues - I don't think wild horses could drag John to Bas Cuvier.
We got up at 7am each morning to avoid the worst (best?) of the heat returning around lunchtime. But it was a bugger to get up on the last morning. I felt done in from the climbing and was very tempted to lie-in as the morning sun started to poke through the sides of the curtains.
On the walk in we passsed an enticing and intimdating 7A crack line - obviously burly and a bit high for comfort. Further on we sussed out some warm-ups. It was a painful struggle just getting my swollen feet into my boots and I wondered again why I bothered leaving my bed when I obviously wasnt going to get anything done. But after a slow start the banter and beta started to flow and some keeness seeped back. Nothing hard was topped but some good fun was had from trying. We headed back to the crack we passed on the walk in and started to piece it together; two spotters on the ground and one on the boulder just behind. Rob got it first then John. Me and Mark struggled on the burly start. Then suddenly I was up there with the fingers of my right hand curled in the crack and thumb braced against the other side left foot on a sloper right foot trying to get purchase on a teeny weeny edge. With my whole body side-on facing right and with heart-in-mouth I arced my left arm over to reach for the for the jug. I touched it as the right foot slipped and was on the ground. Not a bad fall. I would do it.
The post match analysis identified that I needed to be more front-on to get better purchase on my feet and to be able to catch the jug better. We watched a pair of red squirrels. A few more goes and I grabbed the jug and yarded to the top of the best boulder problem I've ever done. Ever.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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What was it?
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Fissure facile, actually grade 4+ :)
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What was it?
I thought it was 'Cartoon' at Rocher d'Avon but looking it up on Bleau info it's actually 'La Fissure de droite' (http://bleau.info/avon/360.html).
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You got video evidence? I don't believe a word that Barker or Hundleby may tell me and Welford is such an enigma that we won't get to ask him.
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I'm amazed it was 'that' problem that changed your mind about Font, some people ... :tumble:
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I'm amazed it was 'that' problem that changed your mind about Font, some people ... :tumble:
We all thought it was superb - it's a great looking line, good moves and highball enough to be exciting. What more can you ask for ?
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The arete to the left looks fucking stunning:
http://bleau.info/avon/1114-1393.html (http://bleau.info/avon/1114-1393.html)
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The arete to the left looks fucking stunning:
http://bleau.info/avon/1114-1393.html (http://bleau.info/avon/1114-1393.html)
It didnt catch my uneducated eye unlike the big slab taken by Calamity Jane on the other side of the boulder which looked amazing but route-like. http://bleau.info/avon/361.html (http://bleau.info/avon/361.html) and even had a sling and crab in-situ. Worth taking a short rope next time. There were a few bolts at the top of boulders at Rocher Greau too - one for a really good looking sharp arete.
*Edit: looking in the comments looks like its been Johnny Browned - ground up no doubt
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You got video evidence?
There's not even an entry on Bleau.info
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You got video evidence?
There's not even an entry on Bleau.info
There is now OOFO ! :bounce:
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lists, lists, lists, its all about the lists ;)
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Shock of the Old (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/shock-of-the-old)
26 April 2011, 9:17 am
Malham again. Less hot than Friday but still hot. I brought the boys up again too and again left them to it with a top rope on Rose Coronary - bickering and baiting each other. They had sorted the moves on Friday I watched from the other side of the catwalk as Tommy then Ben top-roped it in a oner - a decent milestone for both of them - their first 7a outside.
Things where going less well for me on Baboo baboo. The working go went well enough but first redpoint left me an inch short on the crux stretch for the crappy pinch/crimp and I was off. The feeling was growing that this was going to take weeks and weeks despite the improved crux sequence. I hung around on the crux trying to work out what was the key thing that would make the difference on the stretch. I was looking for a single thing that I could concentrate on at the crux that would make the difference. I experimented in twisting my left knee. No great difference there. I worked out how close to the rock I needed to be and how much extra I could gain by lunging whilst aware that this was a low percentage option when your co-ordination is shot. I was groping for stability. Yes - I might have found it. By arching my upper back just before reaching off the thin undercut I seemed to gain extra stability through my legs and an extra inch of reach.
Second redpoint go. Adam Jee insisted on giving me knuckles before I headed off. This made me smile all the way to the rest where it departs from New Dawn. I messed around as usual trying to get a rest - working a jam in to the tufa and all sorts of shifting body positions - none entirely satisfactory.
The next moves always give me the heebie jeebies as it is reliant on a bad bolt which if it blows will leave you on the deck in a mess. Worse still the key foothold is a big smear. It went OK. Clip. I was getting lots of support from below. :-) .Left foot up. Gaston under bolt. Feet bridged out. Snatch into thin undercut. Arch upper back and bang. I had the hold. Really well. I stalled stretched out not daring to move. Then up with the right foot then left and snatch out right for a crozzly edge. Right foot pops off. Ive only got three fingers on the hold and need four. Replace foot adjust fingers feels greasy. Foot up and snatch into an undercut. Clip. Moving up I get a pinch - it feels greasy - too greasy to clip my extended clip. I decide to press on. Two more moves. Can I clip now? Yes. Clip. Bring my left foot up and in onto a finger jug. Feels awkward - off balance HOLD IT. Rock up for a thin fin and pinch it to hold the balance. Right foot on dreadful smear. Brain scrambles where do I put my left foot? Start to place it high in my mind then remember and put it low. Its not going to stick - lunge for the jug - I've got it. It's over ! Big smile and loud whoops. I don't want to leave the jug I want to savour being on the route and successful. I shake out longer than I need to. Time to leave. Two more moves and at the belay. The consumation of an on/off fifteen year courtship.
(Wad point for the first to explain the origin of the subject title)
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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The route was originally named "Shock of the new".
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Correct - you were beaten to it by Duncan (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,17626.msg313102.html#msg313102) but have a wad point anyway ;D
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Me and my back (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/me-and-my-back)
15 June 2011, 10:22 am
When I was a teenager I developed marks on my lower back which made me look like I'd been whipped. I think they where stretch marks from a growth spurt and have changed in number size and colour over the years but are still there. I am fairly sure this weakened my lower back but also made it quite flexible and I developed the habit of self cracking my lower back into place when it became sore. I also must have been round shouldered as my mum regularly exhorted me to "put my shoulders back". At times I put it out very painfully doing work round the farm.
At 19 I took up climbing and have been pushing myself at it ever since and am 47 now. Generally I think it was mainly positive for my back but by my late 20’s it was in a bad way. A physio in Manchester sorted a lot of things out. He identified that my lower back went in too much at the lower back and out too much in the upper back and also I had slight sclerosis with the spine twisted over to one side all of which combined to sieze up my back muscles.
In recent years during periods of training or climbing hard training it was typically my back that was the limiting factor on how much I could do – regularly seizing up when I upped the training load or after a big climbing trip. Typically I would go to a physio for massage to relieve it. This was really only dealing with the symptoms rather than the problem.
In the Autumn of 2009 I went to some yoga classes and bought some weights. The yoga was helpful and in particular made me realise how inflexible my shoulders where and introduced me to some excellent stretches. Excited by my weights purchase I went straight for heavy weight exercises. This was something of a risk but I referred constantly to youtube videos to ensue the form was OK and got away without injury. The powerclean and deadlifting greatly improved my back strength.
My back never felt so good. Then the following autumn it went again.
This time I went to a new physio and she demonstrated that the reason my lower back still went was because it did too much of the work and I needed to spread the load by using my upper back and legs more. This required gaining mobility in my stiff upper back and activating my lazy glutes for simple things like standing straight or getting up from a chair. Because my upper back and shoulders were hunched forward in order to stand straight I had to stick my lower back in. To get me to mobilise my upper back she had me imagine I had a torch attached to the middle of my chest and to move my upper back to shine the torch to the ceiling then floor then left side of the room and rightside then the upper and lower corners of the room.
These exercises along with spinal twists on the floor and squats have meant I haven’t had any significant back problems since despite packing in more training than ever.
However, I am still working on straightening the shoulders out which has revealed a tightness in my left shoulder which was hard to get past through stretching. A further visit to the physio revealed that this was largely due to tightness in the upper pectoral which pulls the shoulder forward. He also pointed out that I have a noticeable right side dominance in my back muscles which tends to mean that the right side contracts more. I expect this pulls the spine that way too.
I feel like I have gradually peeled away the layers of an onion. Everyone’s body has adjusts to what life has throws at it. Climbers almost inevitably have imbalances because of the specificity of the demands of the sport i.e. there is a lot more pulling than pushing. The body has amazing capabilities to adjust but if you have a history of these physical corrections it leaves you wonky and can mean that if you give attention to one area it can reveal or make worse an underlying problem in another.
The goals of being strong AND flexible AND posturally correct is tough one as they tend to offset each other. Stretches, self-cracking my upper back, Serpico's Bolton dumbell complex and visits to the Physio to deal with tweaks as they occur are my current tactics keeps this creaky old machine oiled and serviced.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Trinity (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/trinity)
6 August 2011, 11:49 am
Work/money, climbing and family. Not necessarily in that order.
If there was a graph of the things that mattered to me then nothing else would really feature. Everybody will have their own collection of things that matter. Doing well at all three at the same time constitutes something like happiness, well being or least contentment. However, concentrate on one too much or for too long then the others start to suffer. But because you are wrapped up in one area you don't tend to notice (or ignore) the signs of deterioration. This can lead to a nasty surprise.
I've been in a bit of a bubble lately. My life seems to have revolved around turning up at Raven tor two or three times a week and climbing at a gratifyingly decent level (for me) with no injuries and skin tougher than ever. Doesn't get much better than that. My main worries have been to find partners and how hot/humid it might be and progress on various projects.
Also because I've climbed at the tor in the morning to catch conditions this has been good for home life too which has been useful as Sonia has been working like a Trojan in corporate land. However, this has meant less time in the office for me and even when there and tired from climbing my mind has often been elsewhere.
As I had sealed a few business deals early in the year and done most of the work for them generating more work wasn't pressing or desirable as it would limit the time I could take out to go climbing or training. I had a few pieces of work to keep me ticking over.
Unfortunately a couple of weeks ago one of the deals unexpectedly unravelled. This week another bigger one went down the toilet too. As I had these deals "in-the-bag" I hadn't felt the need to prospect for new work. Consequently I am now in the position where my sales pipeline is empty. The melt down on the stock market last week has administered a similar kick in the balls to our finances.
Even though they represent substantial £sums with hard work and application are recoverable. The trouble is it requires hard work and application.
I am very lucky to be in the position to make these choices. Most people in salaried jobs don't have much control over their time. Being self-employed you have the freedom but precious little security. In my view the majority of the self-employed don't take as much advantage of this potential freedom because of this lack of security and end up working longer and harder that their salaried counterparts. I digress.
So the climbing bubble has burst :-( and it's time to be a grown-up again and generate some income.(Un)fortunately I can't get stuck in straight away as we are heading off as a family to Mallorca for two weeks. But when I get back and the kids go back at school then its back to the grindstone.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Mallorca is funky (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/shark-infested-water)
29 August 2011, 7:38 pm
"Aren't you a bit old for that sort of thing". "Cheers Rich". But I knew where he was coming from. Deep Water Soloing does seem like a young climbers game - there's just a bit too much fun, daring and frolicing for an old skool campaigner. Fashion considerations aside I was deeply apprehensive. A couple of years ago I went to have a look in at Diablo as we had a few hours spare before catching a flight back. It looked daunting.
Diablo was a crag to work towards. Mark took me to Cala Barques on the first day. Barques has a reputation as one of the friendlier DWS venues. Its an idyllic small cove with a lovely sandy beach. Even though it was 35 degrees as we walked across there was definitely a nipple in the air. The headland to the left has a sea cave at the base full of swimmers joined at regular intervals by a procession of jumpers launching themselves from various platforms including the lip at 14 metres. We geared up and swam in to the base of the cave with drybags and squirmed up to a ledge at about 5 metres.
The roof of the cave was covered in a disorientating myriad of stalactites and other weird and wonderful features. My chest was tight. Mark went first and I followed across and up a route called Big XXL. I hadn't been so frightened for years. Whilst I am used to soloing it is well within in my limit and never on radically overhanging ground. I couldnt convince my mind that the gaping air under my ankles ended at one big safety net. Even the evidence of punters jumping from the top just didnt sink in. Fortunately the route was a jug fest but it was a horrible, horrible, scary experience.
Kill or cure. We swam in again - this time to do Transversal. Although Mark had done it before he came off at the lip falling 10 meters into the drink. I followed. Again I was too frightened to enjoy this world class route. I got to the lip and clung on as though my life depended on it ..part of me genuinely believed that was the case. Following Mark's (crap) beta I crossed to the pocket at the lip but was off. Splash. Salt water went up my sinuses. But at least I had taken the fall.
Was I cured of the fear? Was I fuck. The next day when we went to Porto Colom I experienced the same chest tightening fear. By day 3 I had had it with DWS. The 6c warm went in a blur and I looked up at the headwall on "Bisexual" and thought - this is not for me. I hung around to look out for Mark whilst he fell off with butch abandon. Just for practice I experimented with jumping off gradually higher ledges until I could face 8 metres with indifference. By then the Bisexual headwall looked more amenable so I had a look. This time the climbing and the fall went without the gut wrenching anxiety and near-panic of before. I got it second go. :-). It still took time and familiarity over the next week to get to really enjoy DWSing though.
Yesterday was the last day of a great two week family holiday. Aquapark, go karting, swimming, canoeing, crazy golf and eating out interspersed with short climbing trips. This time I headed to Cala Barques on my own as Mark had left with his family in the morning. I still had Transversal to do. This time I was loving the climbing and the fall felt like an inconvenience rather than a near death expereince. It went second go but not without knee scraping tussle getting established in the offwidth. My lats are still aching.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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From small acorns (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/from-small-acorns)
15 September 2011, 10:29 pm
Anyone that knows me and quite a few that don't will be aware that my goal for the last 4 (hundred) years is Austrian Oak at Malham.
Formerly graded 8a+ and now formally graded 8b Austrian Oak was named by John Dunne in honour of Arnold Schwarzenegger and as might expected requires a deal of strength and power for its 30 feet of burliness. Consequentally it epitomised the type of bouldery route that I would ever never do. Consequently in a twisted way it is the perfect project as it forces me to work my weaknesses - and then some.
It is evocative too. I remember seeing Jon Cort busting a gut trying to reach the horn weekend after weekend. Even Neil (Nigs) Carson got spanked on it first go up. Seb had to admit defeat on the hairpoint and compromise his ethics and settle for a redpoint. Full marks to Lucinda (Whittaker) for doing it this year. Girlpower !
Currently I am feeling pretty confident about getting on it again this autumn. My main training over the last couple of weeks has revolved around doing a circuit on my home board that replicates some of the key moves and approximates the intensity/length of the route. With Tommy's advice the way I started working the circuit was to break it down into sections of 5 or more moves taking 15 secs rest between each section. The idea is then over successive sessions to reduce the rest between each section as a way of working towards completing the circuit.
This has worked a treat and tonight I made a breakthrough climbing through the first 18 moves in a oner on the second set. Here's the proof..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKAukdAuWNU
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Diary of a shark aged 47 and a half (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/diary-of-a-shark-aged-47-and-a-half)
25 September 2011, 4:40 pm
Fri pm: Drove to Malham. Crap traffic. Met Steve Shortround at catwalk. Shit. the Oak was dry(ish). Had psyched myself to redpoint Main Overhang. Quandry. Decide to go on Oak - first time since April. Yep it's still hard. Good session. Looking forward to go back on it on Sunday. Get home at 9pm. Sonia out. Kids still up.
Sat am. Sonia has decided that we've (she)has done too much and we miss the 9am Park Run so lie in till 8.30am. Weigh 11.7. Shit. Sonia takes Tom off to BMC talent day event at the Edge. 10am I telephone interview a candidate. 10.45am I take Poppy to gymnastics checking in on Tom and Sonia at the Edge on the way back. At home sort washing out and get Ben into the shed to put up a new problem ("The horde of ravenous, firebreathing bonecrushing demonsd of hell" no less). 12.30 pick up Poppy and bring her home. Check on Ben's progress (it's hard) and sort dinner for her, Ben and Kathleen our au pair (meatballs). Go in shed and try out a new aerocap protocol of Binney's that Sonia had noted down from the Talent day event. 4pm. Take Ben and Poppy down to the tennis club so Ben can teach her how to serve. I stay at bar. Oh dear. They have Deception on tap as opposed to the usual sport bar shite. Order a pint using Ben's key fob. I review accounts and surf using laptop until Poppy bursts through complaining Ben has been throwing balls at her. Go through and have a couple of games with Ben whilst Poppy settles down until Ben's racquet breaks. Go home. Poppy still in a strop - Sonia brokers resolution. Kathleen says she is ill. Finish making the dinner (mince, spag and cauliflower cheese). Eat excessive cheese sauce. Watch Dr Who and thrash Ben at chess three times. Get absurdly psyched reading Kalymnos guide. Last ditch efforts to find a partner for Malham unsucessful.
Sun 7am. Sonia gets up leaves me with list and disappears to go on some 10mile cross country relay race. 8am I get up. 11st 8lb. Disaster. Chivvy the kids. Put a washing load on. Print birthday party invites. Out the door at 8.45am. Drop Poppy off at Hockey at 9am. Get a paper. Drop boys off at rugby. Work on Sudoku. 10am Pick Poppy up from Hockey. More sudoku. 10.45am Walk with Poppy to tennis lesson. Nice bar. Admire picture of Anna Hornykova. Wait while Poppy has lesson. 11.30am On way back retrieve tennis balls from bushes. At rugby club get sausage sandwich for Poppy. Unable to resist a full breakfast. Finish soduku and get depressed reading about the economy. 12.30 eventually find boys and corale all of them into car. Start driving out of carpark with bootlid open. On drive home review plan of driving up to Malham on own in hope of cadging belay. Get increasing ratty with kids and depressed realising how stupid plan is. Fuckitfuckitfuckit. Get home. Have something to eat. Decide not to go to Malham and have a nap instead. Wake up at 4pm. Write blog. Contemplate training..
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I was just over a pound lighter than you this morning. Fatty.
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Update:
6pm Go in Shed and work Ben's problem with him. He burns me off and does it.
11.30pm Go back to shed to hang myself
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Winter training (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/winter-training)
31 October 2011, 11:32 am
The Grit has been called and winter is nearly upon us. Tis the time of year when this old man's thoughts turn to training.
Last year I followed a programme set by Tom Randall. In general I am delighted with my on-rock performance this year and I learnt a lot from the programme. But whilst I'm sure the programme gave me a good foundation I'm not sure how much can be specifically attributed to the programme as my best climbing performances didnt occur until well after the programme finished even though the programme was designed to lead to a peak.
I am currently inclined to go my own way this winter as I haven't got the stomach to follow a programme that seemed to dominate three months of my life. Another issue that I have with the Binney model/approach to training is that whilst it focuses a lot on energy systems there is little about isolating raw arm/finger strength and nothing on the psychology of training. For example if you are starting to reap the rewards of a certain type of training then you have almost certainly over-trained that component and be moving on to something else. Where's the fun in that?.
To be motivated to give 100% effort without even seeing training gains (let alone climbing gains) for three months or more is the stuff of the 1% destined for greatness. The rest of us need regular and measurable feedback to keep striving. All the more so if you are focussing on training a weakness - something that you perform so badly at that it is best trained in private!
So currently I am dreaming up activities that are measurable and motivating that will make training my weaknesses fun within a programme that fits in better with my life. Perhaps I'll need help with this. Tommy...??
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Winter training (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/winter-training)
31 October 2011, 11:32 am
So currently I am dreaming up activities that are measurable and motivating that will make training my weaknesses fun within a programme that fits in better with my life. Perhaps I'll need help with this. Tommy...??
Is going bouldering not a bit too obvious :doubt:
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Is going bouldering not a bit too obvious :doubt:
Oh yes. I intend to push my bouldering grade this winter - currently 7A+. Place your bets..
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6C?
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;D
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6C?
I'll take that bet :bounce:
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Come on Shark, you of all people know that you need more specific training targets than a grade. Name the 7Bs you're going to do before you turn your attention back to sieging The Oak.
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I think we should set the targets ;)
I'll start with Seans Arete..
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Get on the lime boulders: tor, kudos wall, crag x...
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Open to suggestions but Weedkiller traverse to start with - that gets 7B now. Had a couple of goes on Dick Williams last winter and that seemed do-able. T Crack is something I've had a few goes at over the years. There's so many inspiring problems in the new PBG so I don't especially want to get locked into a single project all winter. Although less inspiring the lime problems are going to be more beneficial as Barrows says.
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Get to Parisella's/Pill Box for a fierce day out! :yes:
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Get with the Programme (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/get-with-the-programme)
3 November 2011, 3:55 pm
After the consternation expressed in my last post I think I have got my shit together sorting out a training programme.
Referring to last year's programme out go some of the more inconvenient sessions (i.e Wall based 4x4's) and in go circuits which I can do at work or home. In addition I am adding more finger and arm strength type work. The structured bouldering sessions will be replaced by unstructured bouldering i.e having fun on the Foundry Wave or outside at weekends when the weather allows.
I'm going to take it a month at a time with 3 hard weeks followed by an easier week. Starting from next Monday I hope to do the following for the next 3 weeks:
WEEKDAYS
Mon AM Rock rings -Encores Session
Tues Short 1arm assisted hangs throughout day
Weds AM Rock rings - Assisted 1 arm session
Thurs AM Systems board AnCap
Fri REST
Evenings
Mon Eve Oak circuit AnCap session
Tues Boulder Wave
Weds Eve AeroCap in Shed
Thurs EveAeroCap in Shed
Fri REST
Weekend
Sat PM Boulder/AeroCap eve
Sun PM Boulder/AeroCap eve
The only caveat is that I'm still troubled by golfers elbow. I think it is on the mend but is still bloody painful. If there is no improvement next week I'll take myself down to Hallamshire physio. On second thoughts perhaps I should book now.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Thoughts:
6 hard days a week? That's hardcore. (I guess if you're taking a recovery week after 3 weeks that's maybe not as hard as it sounds, but I never seem to get around to actually having my recovery weeks! Maybe you're more disciplined.) Anyway, I can't imagine I'd be fresh enough to do 1 arm hangs on 5th day on and AnCap on 6th day on. Maybe I'm just pathetic, but it sounds optimistic to me...
No maintainance of PE/aeropower? I throw in 1 session a week (before a rest day), since I can get away with being a bit tired for this session, and I think it's worth maintaining it rather than letting it slide totally...
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Thoughts:
6 hard days a week? That's hardcore. (I guess if you're taking a recovery week after 3 weeks that's maybe not as hard as it sounds, but I never seem to get around to actually having my recovery weeks! Maybe you're more disciplined.) Anyway, I can't imagine I'd be fresh enough to do 1 arm hangs on 5th day on and AnCap on 6th day on. Maybe I'm just pathetic, but it sounds optimistic to me...
No maintainance of PE/aeropower? I throw in 1 session a week (before a rest day), since I can get away with being a bit tired for this session, and I think it's worth maintaining it rather than letting it slide totally...
Know what you mean about recovery weeks. I was going to have a one or two week complete layoff and managed 6 days before cracking. Yes - always optimistic - set the bar too high and constantly disappoint yourself is my motto. I'll PM you the session sheets when I get them typed up and see what you think - your sessions will be more intense or longer or both than mine. There's only one way to find out if I can't hack it. Re AeroPower sessions Tom didnt have them kicking in till Week15 of 27.
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How to put a plan together (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/how-to-put-a-plan-together)
17 November 2011, 3:51 pm
Given that I’ve just put together a periodised programme for myself I thought it would be useful to give some basic practical guidelines for anyone struggling to know where to start.
My only experience is with Binney/Randall model and approach and my thoughts have been directed in how to apply it for sport climbing. It’s not the only way to periodise. Maybe it’s not the best way. But it’s the way I’ve done it.
Start at the end
When do you want the programme to end – i.e. when is the weather likely to be good enough for you to put the training into practice. So that gives you how many weeks? Hopefully this is divisible by four. For me this was 16 weeks which neatly splits into 2 blocks of 8 weeks again neatly split by christmas. The first 8 weeks provide a base for the second 8 weeks where you are seeking to squeeze better performance from the foundation which I’ll refer to as “performance base”. Each block represents a “mesocycle”. It doesn’t have to be 4 weeks but that’s what I’m currently working with.
What are we training?
The key variables in training are personal intensity (how difficult you find the moves) , rest (between reps and sets) and volume (number of moves). As climbers we typically want a full armoury of capability to deal with the different intensities, rests and volume of moves presented by a variety of routes. The training of these energy systems is divided into Aerobic Capacity, Anaerobic Capacity, Anaerobic Power and Aerobic Power each concentrating on a certain combination of intensity, rest and volume within a given range with excellent guidance given on this document here: http://ukbouldering.com/media/pdf/principlestraining.pdf Roughly the focus is on AeroCap and volume for the base. AnCap and to a lesser extent AnPower can be trained throughout the programme whilst AeroPower kicks in at the end.
Where do we train ?
This depends on the facilities available to you. My advice is to refer to the charts in Dave Binney’s presentation and devise sessions that you think will work on the facilities available to you within his guidelines – typically home board, indoor bouldering wall and indoor lead wall – and just as importantly what psyches you. A perfect regime is no good if it is on a climbing medium or venue that doesn’t inspire you to give it your best effort. If bouldering circuits leave you cold draw up an alternative way of training for the same effect on the lead wall.
Sessions
For each type of training (AeroCap, AnCap, AeroPower,AnPower) devise and write down two or three alternative sessions appropriate to the facilities available and time you can set aside. Now for each 4 week block decide how many of each session you should do each week for the base phase and the performance phase. Each time you repeat a session try to beat the performance (increased intensity, more moves, reduced rest) of the previous session such that it still conforms to the parameters of the type of training. A hard circuit you have could be used to train both AnCap or AnPower or AeroPower depending on how you break down the rests and moves and as you get stronger and fitter through the programme. If this circuit replicates your project all the better. Hint.
Sequencing sessions
Personally I don’t get too hung up on this as there is conflicting views and experiences. Doing back-to-back sessions is OK if pressed for time though a break is better.
Week 1
Don’t be worried if for the first week you find getting back into the training sessions and generally getting used to having so many training sessions hard. You may also get frustrated in having to tweak the sessions to work well for you. Patience. You’ll soon get into the swing of it.
First 4 weeks
In the second week I will be looking to beat the session performances of the first week. This is quite motivating ie beating the previous session especially if training on your own and what it might lack in variety is more than compensated by psyche IMO. Over a three week period you want to build up and slightly overdo it such by the fourth week you are ready for a rest when you underdo it. In this “underdoing” week you might find you hit a performance peak so it could be a good time to do some benchmarking or tick off a board project or boulder problem.
Half a plan
Rather than the daunting task of setting out the whole programme save yourself some agonising and just plan the base phase. Once you have completed the base phase use the week off at the end to plan the “performance base” . By that stage you will have a better and more realistic feel of what you might achieve.
What about strength?
AnCap etc is generally about energy systems in your forearms but it is also climbing based and we all know – deep down – that climbing is the best training for climbing. It won't make you weaker - the L5 work will make you stronger. Anything else that is not climbing is supplemental – typically bar work, campus boards, fingerboards and weights take second place. So slot in the supplementary work according to your required needs or desires !
You now have a plan. That is vastly better than no plan. Go to it. It will be hard work. Keep the faith. Take notes. Refine. Report back.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Thanks for posting this and putting it out there. It's interesting to see what others do. I like the idea but to me it seems like an approach to improvement that cannot be sustained in the long term? Is it not inevitable that to get better sooner or later you just need to get stronger? After all strength improves endurance as a side effect and if you can't do the moves there's nothing to endure... Where are the weights, the assisted one armers, the system sessions, the max hangs, the campus sessions... I know you mention that these are extras but I guess I don't think that's enough. Why isn't the endurance training the extra? Once again, thanks for sharing the training knowledge, it's really appreciated.
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I believe the idea is that bouldering, ancap and hangs should combine to give good strength gains. (if you look at the old post shark's got a fair bit of bouldering and hanging planned)
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I believe the idea is that bouldering, ancap and hangs should combine to give good strength gains. (if you look at the old post shark's got a fair bit of bouldering and hanging planned)
Right, cheers. If AnCap is going to stimulate strength gains I would guess the circuit would need to be systematic in nature? ie all pinches, or all gaston crimps, or the 10 - 20 moves would just be too dilute? Just a thought but I've tried system bouldering and it has a fair degree of PE involved so I think I'll look at doing sytem stuff for some AnCap rather than AnCap and hope for some strength.
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If AnCap is going to stimulate strength gains I would guess the circuit would need to be systematic in nature? ie all pinches, or all gaston crimps, or the 10 - 20 moves would just be too dilute? Just a thought but I've tried system bouldering and it has a fair degree of PE involved so I think I'll look at doing sytem stuff for some AnCap rather than AnCap and hope for some strength.
One of my AnCap sessions is on a systems board - I just use the incut edges and its all about the forearms for that session which contrasts with the "Oak" AnCap session where the actual moves are hard. In fact you could probably to do most of the work Binney prescribes going up and down a systems board with a bit of creativity to get the intensities right as well as your single move strength work.
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Nice one. Cheers!
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You can't beat the system (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/you-can-t-beat-the-system)
7 December 2011, 10:30 pm
**Geeky training blog alert**
Last week I had a relatively light week to finish the first 4 week block of the programme. Overall it seemed to go well though I am having to work around golfers in the right elbow. I was hoping to crush my Oak circuit and Weedkiller at the Tor this week but it didnt happen which was mildly disappointing.
Monday was the start of my new block and I decided to up the ante with a big rock rings session(using pulley assistance). After warm-up and rehab exercises this started with an assisted one arm pyramiding set on my left. However, on the first pull on my right the instant pain from the golfers made me give up the set for that arm. Instead I moved on two armed encore work with 10kg pulley assistance.
The set comprised using the small crimps with all 4 fingers on one rock ring and back2 the other doing 4reps x8secs with 5 secs rest doing 8 sets alternating left and right combo with 1 min rest between sets as follows: Grab 1: Full Lock i.e. pull-up hold 8secs and release 5secs rest the Grab2: Grab 2: arms ¾ lock Grab 3: arms half lockrab Grab 4: arms ¼ lock.
This went OK so was up for more but had a client visit so had a break of over an hour. Once back did more deadhangs in a pattern recommended by Paul at Crusher holds. Again with 10kg assistance and two-handing doing 4 sets with Mid2 then 4 sets with Front2 as follows: 1x6sec, 1x9sec then 1x12 secs with 4 secs rest between reps and I min rest between sets. After that finished with some finger rolls using a dumbell.
As with a lot of sessions that go well and leave you on a high I expected to do more. That evening I tried an AnCap session on my Oak circuit and it was a disaster and had to throw the towel in and couldnt even do an AeroCap set.
I began to doubt whether I could fit a decent finger session in alongside the other sessions I planned to do.
Although I didnt mean to take Tuesday off what with Sonia being away and a nativity I ended up doing jack with my forearms aching most of the day.
Today (Wednesday) I decided to do an AnCap session on the systems board. The work is very forearm intensive compared to the AnCap session in the Shed. I had done three sessions on the last block gradually making each session harder by for example just using the poorest footholds.
The session is 3sets of 15moves x4 with 2mins rest between reps and 10mins between sets.
This time to make it harder I counted to 3 on each hold and using small footholds up and down. The first rep went so well that I decided to cut rest from 2mins to 90secs. The set went so well that I decided to cut rest between sets from 10 mins to 5mins. This led me to fade on the last move of the 4th rep of the second set and struggle on the third set.
I was elated and I felt I'd made a real breakthrough.
Below is a rep, or more correctly 14 of the 15 moves. Although its not obvious the footholds I'm using are pretty small but the edges are incut.Systems Board AnCap (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOu3vUYsYj8#ws)
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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You need to be a LOT stricter with your system boarding; your foot placements don't alternate with your hand moves, and you're climbing asymmetrically: compare the height of your left elbow, and the degree to which it's externally rotated compared to your right at the point at which you reach for the next hold.
The problem with high repetition exercises like system boarding is that if you do them with poor technique you will ingrain poor technique; focus on locking your elbow into your side, as if you're reaching further than you actually are, and throw your hips in more, they should be almost touching the board at the point you reach for the next hold.
If all else fails I recommend scones.
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Thanks for the observation Serps.
I didn't think it matter too much for what I am trying to achieve which is an AnCap forearm workout. The body/arm moves are fairly easy and I dont regard it as systems boarding it is just that board is available to me during the day. However I take your point if I am going to do this sequence regularly and will rescrew the footholds in a symmetrical formation - they are randomnly placed at the moment.
Had a scone last night for probably the first time this year. :)
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I don't think that it's just that the footholds are asymmetric that's causing the difference in arm position, I think you've got actual asymmetry in the way you climb, possibly down to imbalance between L-R scapula, long triceps head, other...
Doesn't matter that you don't regard it as system training, you're still reinforcing those movement patterns.
Try this pattern.
L1+R1, R3, L3, R2, L1, R1, L3, R3, L2, R1, L1, Repeat the entire sequence. Feet do the opposite; RF1, LF3, RF3, LF2, Etc.
I find it much easier to keep strict form and ensure that each side is worked equally this way.
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Strictly come systems boarding....
Why that dance routine ? I have 5 sets of holds and it only uses 3 which seems a waste and also the only laddering move is going back down. I can see using 3 holds would mean that a sit start wouldnt be necessary.
Also do you start with a foot move or hand move?
Any view on how far foothold 1 should be from handhold 1 etc ?
Re my climbing assyemtry you are certainly on to something as my physio always points out the right side being more muscley than the left with associated postural wonkiness.
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Why that dance routine ? I have 5 sets of holds and it only uses 3 which seems a waste and also the only laddering move is going back down. I can see using 3 holds would mean that a sit start wouldnt be necessary.
L1 - R3 (or higher) is a nice big move which trains locking down to the shoulder.
L3 - R2 is splitting the distance on the way down so that you're training a mid range lock and not having to absorb too much of a drop. It also means that you naturally then start the next rep with the other arm (R1 - L3), so you're stressing both sides of the body equally. By comparison count how many times you lead off, and how many eccentric contractions you do, with either arm with your current method.
Also do you start with a foot move or hand move?
If I'm leading off with my RH then I start with hands on L1+R1 and RF on. There's an easier version where you start with both feet on LF1+RF1 and don't move them at all.
Any view on how far foothold 1 should be from handhold 1 etc ?
This is one of the training variables. Wider footholds can make the locks more intensive.
Re my climbing assyemtry you are certainly on to something as my physio always points out the right side being more muscley than the left with associated postural wonkiness.
Next time video it with your shirt off (and maybe some baby oil) and watch for your scapula winging.
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Thank you
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Is that the world's shortest bachar ladder? We've got a 10 metre one installed down at abracadabseil if anyone wants a session fucking their elbows?
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Is that the world's shortest bachar ladder? We've got a 10 metre one installed down at abracadabseil if anyone wants a session fucking their elbows?
Its a bit longer than it looks as it goes down a stairwell but I was scared of falling down it so just do single move pull throughs on it and lock offs.
Will take you up on the offer once my elbow is better !
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Winter daydream (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/winter-daydream)
7 January 2012, 5:56 pm
No takers for climbing outside so headed out with Pip. Stopped at Stanage. Got out of car. Got back in car. Not a day for soloing. It was blowing a gale with threatening clouds on the horizon. I could have MTFUpped and pretended to be Heathcliff. But there weren't many potential rescuers visible if I had taken a tumble. Also I'd forgotten my chalk bag.
No rush, so I took a scenic route to the tor. It was deserted but Weedkiller was dry enough. You get a chance to soak things up and see the little things when you are alone at a crag. The way winter had drained the colour from the landscape. The clouds scudding. The bare trees and tall bleached marsh grasses nodding, as gusts of wind tracked across the brimfull, but still lazy, river.
Resting between goes I lay on the mats wallowing in uninterupted reverie and enjoying the surroundings. At one point the sun peeked over the hill. So I drew the duvet hood closed leaving just enough of a gap so the pale sunshine could light up my enclosed little world. Pip was beside me. She was sat on her haunches, looking inscrutable, and lost in her own doggy thoughts. Nice.
I stayed a couple of hours, tried hard, got some OK links and headed home.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Nice post. Hurrah for Pip.
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Pip Pip surely?
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really nice. just recently discovered the joy of a going climbing all alone with the dog.
mine sleeps all the one hour drive back home though.
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17 years ago (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/17-years-ago)
10 January 2012, 2:43 pm
The 3rd October 1994 was a Monday. Dressed in a suit and tie I left my desk and took a stroll down Oxford Street, as I often did at lunchtime, past the Palace Theatre and under the railway arch to Cotswold Camping. When I opened the door I just stood still in the doorway with my arms in the air. The guys at Cotswold knew what it meant. It meant I'd done Zoolook!
It was a triumph of obstinacy and persistence against the odds. I don't know how many days I spent on Zoolook that year but it was an epic struggle for incremental progress with the end of the year getting nearer and nearer.
That saturday I had driven up with Dave Marsh in clag and rain that detiorated the further North we got. At Malham I was prepared to just have a cup of coffe and head back. Dave persuaded me not only to walk to the cove but also take my rucsack and gear.
When we got there I recall Dave Thomas being the only other person at the Catwalk. What he was doing there on his own is anyone's guesss, but that's Dave for you. The rock turned out to be climbable despite the dismal weather.
On redpoint for the first time I got through the short traverse left near the top which marks the end of the difficulties but I was pumped out of my gourd. I quickly shaked and started moving back right up the tufa. Those casual static moves had turned impossible. Ridiculously I reversed to the shake to try to get a bit more back. My forearms remained solid. Shit. I wasn't going to do it. I moved back right and, now or never, I desperately threw my hand up the tufa. I got the good bit and clawed my way to the belay.
Around 1988 I felt I had well and truly plateaued at around E5 and 7b which made me quite glum at the time. I stopped being a climbing bum and started a career. Despite the demands of work somehow I ground my up gradually harder sport routes. However, even by the time I started trying Zoolook I only had a small clutch of 7c's and one soft 7c+ under my belt. All had required multiple day sieges with the outcome never certain. Going at least a grade harder wasn't sensible. But Zoolok was, and is, inspirational and I was prepared to throw my heart and soul into it. The main thing that was tipped in my favour was that being a technical long route it suited trad bred climbers of the time.
After the redpoint, the rush of success took at least a week to wear off. I woke up each morning with a grin on my face when I realised that "I'd done Zoolook" and that grin lasted all day.
It was a while before "What now?" seemed important. It was good question. For me climbing enjoyment was closely linked to progress. Settling at doing one 8a and being content wasn't me. Fortunately the next level of routes was equally inspirational. Predator, the Groove, Supercool. But it was obvious that to get there would require some backfilling on my part. I needed to be able to pull off harder bouldery moves with steelier fingers.
My tactic was to turn by attention to the shorter and for me much harder, Raindogs to work my weaknesses. That took even more effort and another 4 or 5 years. By then I had a family and started a business and somewhere along the way the tactic of doing short hard routes purely as a stepping stone for the end goal of doing the big classic 8a+'s got lost.
17 years later those routes remain untouched. I still want to do them. Badly. And will. Honest. But there is still the small matter of finishing the Oak....
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Nice one :2thumbsup:
Wish I'd been plateauing at E5 in 1988 :smart:
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Nice post Shark. Was this partially inspired by the 'when should I try an 8a' thread?
Interesting to read of your experiences. There is nothing quite like ending a siege!
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Awesome! :great:
The Oak this year! :)
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Nice post Shark. Was this partially inspired by the 'when should I try an 8a' thread?
Yes, well spotted (http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=488863&v=1#x6702599). It reminded me of the struggle I went through at the time. I think the modern way of building a pyramid of quicker ticks is more sustainable and progressive though I love a good siege.
The Oak this year! :)
Cheers Will. No guarantees but hopefully its game on in March. Still can't believe first time up you did THE move going for the horn with your left and thought it was OK.
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:clap2:
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Cotswold Camping. When I opened the door I just stood still in the doorway with my arms in the air. The guys at Cotswold knew what it meant. It meant I'd done Zoolook!
i'm amazed that the people in cotswold knew what sport climbing was, let alone zoolook!
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i'm amazed that the people in cotswold knew what sport climbing was, let alone zoolook!
There was a good bunch there then. Simon Marsh (Now with DMM and helped write the Ground-Up N Wales guide) and his girlfriend Lynne Williams who was a good climber. Pete Cole, the Manager, was a keen climber and had Ed Morgan and Dave Douglas as lodgers. Simon who is mainly a trad climber also later did Zoolook as did my partner on the day Dave Marsh (no relation).
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Boot camp (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/boot-camp)
8 February 2012, 1:40 pm
My training has gone a little awry over the last couple of weeks. This was rammed home last night on my regular tuesday visit to the Foundry. Everyone was training - circuits on the 40degree board (Tom and Adam) pulley set up on the beastmaker (Paul B) one arm training on the bar (Weak Steve) and then Wil, Bob, Barrows, Joe and others cranking on the steep section of the Wave. Most had ear pieces in. It was hard to tell whether this was because they were actrually listening to music or if it was a convenient way to avoid socialising. It was good to see the dedication and people concentrating on doing their own thing.
I was wrecked from being pummelled by John Ostro the night before and could scarcely pull on. Had a few goes on the 40 degree board but the body was sluggish to respond. Adam claimed it was because the massage released toxins. I was sceptical.
The kids were up for it though. I usually have Poppy and Ben with me but this time Tom too. We usually have about 90mins there. The kids feel comfortable at the Foundry - over the years its pretty much become home from home for them. Poppy (7) does a few top ropes and some traversing. Ben (13) just boulders now. We spent several sessions trying to get him used to leading and sagging onto bolts but it was an uphill struggle and in the end the frustration and trauma got the better of both of us. Its a shame as it will limt what we can do outside.
Poppy asked if she could try leading and clipped a few bolts. Tom (11) had a decent stab on top rope at flashing a 7a then another good go on a 7b. Before we left Ben insisted I try a problem on the Bleustone Wall that he'd done. I could scarcely get off the ground.
And he beat me at chess when we got home.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Before we left Ben insisted I try a problem on the Bleustone Wall that he'd done. I could scarcely get off the ground.
;D
I like this a lot. You should get him on the Oak.
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;D
I like this a lot. You should get him on the Oak.
Ben (13) just boulders now. We spent several sessions trying to get him used to leading and sagging onto bolts but it was an uphill struggle and in the end the frustration and trauma got the better of both of us. Its a shame as it will limt what we can do outside.
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I had read that too, I was trying to make a joke.
Must make better use of those emoticons in future..... :slap:
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:oops: :sorry:
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I had read that too, I was trying to make a joke.
Stick to the day job. Talking of which are you able to take this friday off again?
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Stick to the day job. Talking of which are you able to take this friday off again?
Unfortunately not, running out of leave days and want to save some for March when the left hand side might be drier. Sunday is a possibility providing the wife doesn't object (too much) to me climbing on the only day off she has this weekend......
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Seb (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/seb)
10 February 2012, 11:26 am
I first met Seb in October 1984. It was the start of my second year at Nottingham University. I had been climbing for a year and was by then Secretary of the Mountaineering Club.
It was freshers week and one of the duties was to man the Club's stall enticing Freshers to sign up to the Club and part with their cash. We usually got lots signed up but there was a high dropout rate of those that actually went on to take up the sport.
One of the club members, Pete Dalton (Dolly), brought a couple of his friends with him. One of them was tall and loud with a 9 inch rainbow coloured mohican. He rode in on a skateboard and signed up. His university membership card instead of the normal passport ID photo had a picture of an oilrig. He did a circuit of the hall and disappeared. I thought 'What a prat. That's the last we'll see of him'.
I was, of course, wrong. Seb went climbing with Dolly and got the bug. It was severall weeks before I climbed with him. We went to High Tor on the bus. It was a rubbish November day. I did Highlight and Original Route in horrible weather just to get something done. Although he admited later he got scared he didn't show it on the route and it didn't put him off climbing. He was incredibly determined, obstinate even from the outset. Once at Millstone we needed to get back for some do. Seb kept trying and trying Technical Master. Pissed off, we all went and waited in the car. We had to wait for some time before he trotted up beaming having done it and couldn't understand why we were annoyed.
Seb moved in diffrent social circles to me at Uni. He lived with Dolly and other whacky types in a large madhouse on Lenton Boulevard which seemed to revolve around clubbing and trendy parties. I was (and remain) unfashionable and a pub man. Dolly's bedroom was a windowless room in the basement. Seb got frustrated at trying to get Dolly up early in the morning to go climbing. One morning Dolly was woken to see breakfast being lowered to him from the ceiling on a tray. Seb had cut a hatch in the floor.
Seb and I climbed together a lot over the next few years putting up new routes in the Peak and had some great trips around the UK and a long trip to Norway. I distinctly recall the pressure of competition as he got better which spurred me to push myself to onsight my first E5 by the absolute skin of my teeth. (Jermyn Street though it was given E4 at the time).
I gave up competing with him shortly after.
We went to Froggatt and I tried to solo Heartless Hare which I'd led some time before with a siderunner. Seb stuck his head over the top of the crag and started pulling faces and making stupid noises to make me laugh. I backed off the route. Gritstone had never suited me, slabs especially, I reasoned. Seb soloed Heartless starting a campaign that led him to onsight all of the Great Slab routes over the next couple of weeks.
He was away...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I once burnt Seb off on a problem at a Foundry bouldering comp. Admittedly he was trying to do it stylishly and statically and I just lunged and scrabbled my way up...
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I really wanna see those fingers (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/i-really-wanna-see-those-fingers)
26 February 2012, 7:34 pm
Hold the front page, WTF, OMG, LOL etc It's official. I have stronger fingers thaqn Steve McClure!!
This isn't some random Steve McClure with a beer belly I met in a pub but the actual 58kg 9a Ste Mac of steel mutant finger strength fame. When I say I have stronger fingers I specifically mean my back two fingers on the Foundry beastmaker.
Yesterday during a lull in the Youth Climbeing series comp I was chatting to him comparing notes on our training besides the beastmaker. Without warming up I was able to comfortably hang the small pockets with my back 2 which is something he has been training towards but not done yet.
As I have always regarded my fingers as uncommonly weak for the grade I climb so this was a bolt from the blue. So what does it mean?
Me first. Further messing about revealed that my back2 were disproportionally stronger on the pocket than my mid2 or front2 combos. When using the back 2 there was also some kind of sidewise action going on that meant that in the pocket my pinkie was in a half crimp and almost hanging off the joint whereas for the the other two combos I was in an open position that was weaker. So lesson one. The relative lengths of diffrent fingers to each other in respect of diffrent holds matters not only because the fingers are forced into different angles but also because there are diffrent ways to hold the same hold. Take the final pocket of Powerband. I can get all 4 fingers in a half crimp on that whereas most mainly cam the front 2 in where there is a constriction or, if your Barrows, then a mid2 finger drag works best.
Turning to Steve his world class finger strength is based on his amazing ability to bone down on 4mm wide minging crimps which very few can hang let alone pull on - one after the other. However, his ability to use better first joint holds is not as good as many it seems. In addition he is also working other weaknesses by practicing one armers on slots. However, the fact he has got so far without addressing these weaknesses shows what leveraging stand out talents can do.
So rather than taking a general view of having weak fingers it would be more instructive to analyse the various facets of strength - contact strength, hang strength, foot-on, foot off, differing finger combos, grip types and the ability to either hang or pull on the holds. I'm sure in more developed sports they do this sort of thing as a matter of course.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Well go climb some 9bs then!
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Well go climb some 9bs then!
Know any that depend exclusively on shallow back2 pockets ?
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Nope. Try asking someone like Steve McClure, he might know?
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Finger strength on specific holds is definitely a weird one. Mark has a similar thing with back 2 - he seems to be able to lock his fingers somehow in the small (lower) pockets, and thus easily burn the likes of me and bob off on those holds. Even on holds which 'should' be the same it can be very specific to finger length/size etc I think - e.g. there are 4 finger edges which Bob can hang 1-armed and I can't, but there are 4-finger edges which I can hang 1-armed and he can't, all just depending on how the holds fit your fingers.
My conclusion is that whilst fingerboarding is good training, and getting better at hanging holds will help you climb harder, actual performance compared to others on any given hold is fairly irrelevant unless you can burn them off on all holds and grip types. Also, I think it points towards the fact that it's probably good to mix it up - if you're down the foundry then don't spend all the time hanging off the beastmaker, play around with the other boards too since the holds will put your fingers in subtly different positions and thus I think gains might be more transferable to 'real' holds.
Incidentally, I actually front 3 crimp the powerband hold, though many do mid 2 drag it.
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the fact he has got so far without addressing these weaknesses shows what leveraging stand out talents can do.
Are you suggesting Steve's stand-out talent is 'boning down on 4mm wide minging crimps'? Because I have heard, from a considerably higher authority, that it is in fact TENACITY.
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Well put - better than my blog post in fact which was a bit of a brain dump. Yes I recall it was you that told me about others doing the two finger drag rather than it being your way of doing it.
Also I'm not sure that geetting carried away with working the full variety of grip types is required if it distracts from training/applying full force to your main and preferred grip types is what will get you up the routes and perhaps work a wierd grip type if it is something that is causing you problems on a specific move.
As you once said (hopefully quoting you happy this time) "there is more than one way to skin a cat / crush a route"
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the fact he has got so far without addressing these weaknesses shows what leveraging stand out talents can do.
Are you suggesting Steve's stand-out talent is 'boning down on 4mm wide minging crimps'? Because I have heard, from a considerably higher authority, that it is in fact TENACITY.
I'm only interested in the physical aspects of talent.
Motivational/psychological aspects are in a box marked "difficult" next to another one marked "technique".
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I found out that to hang the small pockets back2, I needed to half crimp my ring finger and try and get the pad of the little on. not dragging them. also, I need to squeeze them together, otherwise the two fingers split, knuckles pointing out in opposite directions, and I lose grip.
it's happened to me on rock also. I remember that for a route I used to tape my mid2 together, otherwise a pointy undercling would split them and I could not pull.
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Soap (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/soap)
18 May 2012, 8:10 am
Setting: 8.30am on a friday morning in a kitchen in Sheffield,
Me: What are we doing next weekend ? I was thinking of going to North Wales. Someone I know is having a 50th birthday party there.
Her: (Checking calendar) Tommy is in Edale all weekend but Ben and Poppy aren't doing anything specifically other than the usual
Me: So it's OK if I go?
Her: (Pained look on face) I suppose so. I guess you will be leaving Saturday morning
Me: Or Friday night...
Her: We never get to do anything together.
Me: What do you mean? We've been to two black tie dos over the last two weekends.
Her: No, we never get to do anything spontaneous like other families
Me: Other families are boring
Her: What I mean is I come home on Saturday knackered and take all day to recover and by the time I think it would be nice to have a picnic or a bicycle ride you're off climbing or something
Me: So you don't want me to go?
Her: I didn't say that
Me: I don't mind not going. We can plan to do something else instead
Her: That's my point, its not spontaneous
Me: Shall we plan to do something spontaneous
Her:
Me: How do you fancy a weekend in North Wales next weekend...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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:lol: Brilliant.
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Soap (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/soap)
18 May 2012, 8:10 am
Me: Other families are boring
right on
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:clap2:
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Enjoy the party in Wales! :clap2:
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So are you going?
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So are you going?
Negotiations will resume later this evening
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Make sure you do, this is more exciting than waiting to see if you can sleep in a car with a sleeping bag in a carpark in Scotland without getting too cold. ;)
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(just) ;)
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Bravo :clap2:
Reads like an episode of my life :-[
:D
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Almost there (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/almost-there)
27 May 2012, 1:31 pm
It was a family trip. Sonia, me, Ben (13) and Poppy (8) and Pip our dog(14). We arrived at the catwalk at 6pm and had it to ourselves. No one there - not surprisingly. The blazing sunshine that day would have detered the informed or quickly seen the un-informed off. I had timed our late arrival in the hope that the combination of evening shade and easterly breeze would yield good conditions. The breeze had already died off and the crag was warm.
Putting the draws in I felt stronger on the moves than ever.
Sonia's belaying was rusty. Its always diffrent with the family. There are distractions aplenty. You end up marshalling the kids so they dont get hungry, argue, distract you, your belayer or harm themselves. Sonia seemed particularly distracted by Pip wandering along the catwalk. I encouraged Poppy to play stick with her by the Beck. She gave quickly gave up on this so we tied Pip up and I sent Poppy on an expedition to below the right wing where it was still sunny. She got excited spotting a rabbit but ended up in the nettles. Ben was put on camera duty.
The swifts were out in force. The peregrine kept a lofty vigil in the dead tree above Gorgon Direct.
My repeated goes at the start of the route where frustrating. The holds were were 10% worse than they could/should have been. Certainly the route was climbable if it didn't represent your limit. Therin lay the problem. I got to the throw once, fingers more tired than they should have been and right hand greasing slighty on the intermediate pinch. The throw was more of an upward sag.
Further attemptage led to foot slippage. It wasn't happening but I kept at it till after 9pm then finished by doing a big link of the upper part shouting as I went at Sonia for slack not realising that the rope had snagged behind a horn of rock.
On the walk out I treated my forerms and fingers to the cold water treatment in the chilly running water of the Beck. The kids then played a game seeing how long they could keep their hands in the water. Poppy won. They had been great that day and enjoyed themselves. Sonia too. I was grateful for their indulgence. It doesn't always or even usually work this well.
As for the Oak I know now that I can do it if I get the conditions. I'm light enough, strong enough, uninjured and psyched. How long can I stay that way ? Forecast looks promising for Thursday...
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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..but not quite (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/but-not-quite)
9 June 2012, 12:38 pm
Seems the optimism in my my last post was misplaced. I have had five further sessions on the Oak but no tick. Best conditions and attempt was last Sunday (clip below) where I equalled my lucky highpoint of a couple of years ago. This is to move 13 on the route. I have also linked from move 7 to the top (move 22).
The key issue for me is the throw to the horn after doing the initial fingery moves. Although I've got pretty slick on the start now those moves still take the edge off when making the throw and turning it into a low percentage gamble. I need to get consistent enough on this to allow me at least two redpoint attempts in a session where I access the upper section. Somehow I've got to get slightly stronger on that move and the fingery climbing to reach it. Interestingly quite a few people dont find this move that hard but then get shut down on other moves which I find casual such as the move right from the horn.
My last two sessions have gone downhill since Sunday. From being psyched out of my mind I'm now jaded - sick of the drive, the dieting, the stress and the failure. I've been on it 6 times in the last 14 days doing powerful moves at my limit so its not really surprsing except when you have tunnel vision. The route is also starting to get wet. Its almost a relief. Time for a week's layoff to recharge mind and body starting with a beer and curry last night.
Austrian Oak. Redpoint attempt (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwZ653MbUT4#ws)
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Keep the faith Shark, we all get like that with projects at some point.. Maybe leave it for a couple of months?
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From being psyched out of my mind I'm now jaded - sick of the drive, the dieting, the stress and the failure.
You're having fun though, right?? ;D
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Fun? Fun!
If you're having fun you're "just" bouldering... :rtfm:
You looked well strong on the bottom section the other week Simon, keep the faith and it'll be yours!
:D
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The thing i think its good to remember is that, after all this hard work, if/when you do it, all you'll have done is climbed a bit of rock.
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Do you do any weights Shark, particularily curls. As I remember (not done it but had a few sessions on it) the left arm/bicep gets quite a working early on as you go into the horn. Maybe targetting your left low undercut lock for a few weeks could up your power a touch enough to improve percentage on the move? Just knock out a few heavy weight negatives every other night.
Poss stating the obvious i know.
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From being psyched out of my mind I'm now jaded - sick of the drive, the dieting, the stress and the failure.
I know the feeling... Well apart from the drive...
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Unless you mean the Marine Drive :ninja:
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Thanks for the thoughts
Enjoying eating and drinking liking a normal human being again. Not touching weights, wood, resin or rock till friday at the earliest. Hopefully test myself on the Oak if dry then takle a view...
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Food and rest can make you a lot stronger. Tuck in, that's what I say!
Beck Hall cakes, that's what you need...
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It's important to keep it fresh, need to climb on other things. My problem is i've been keeping it a bit too fresh!
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From The Bible:
Step n. 10. Never, never quit.
Stick at it Shark, it's a mental battle first of all. Enjoy the battle. Enjoy the pain. Enjoy the struggle. Everyone is capable of taking it easy, but you are not eveyone. You are you. You are better than anyone else. Enjoy hell.
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That's some profound hippie shit right there
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Remember Sharky boy....less is more, keep the faith!
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My new hero - Lukas Rosol (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/my-new-hero-lukas-rosol)
29 June 2012, 12:14 pm
I was lucky enough to stumble into the TV room whilst the tennis was on last night and witness the final set where Lukas Rosol crushed Nadal.
I quite like tennis but as with most sport prefer to do rather than watch. But this spectacle was electrifying. This unknown ranked 100 had Nadal on the ropes and he was absolutely wired like he was on cocaine or speed. He couldnt stand still jogging back to the seats and not allowing Nadal to slow things down or get unsettled by his attempts to do so. Rosol just couldn't wait to get to his next service game hitting lightening fast aces and amazing backhand returns. He was unphased by the surroundings either, spitting regularly and unself-consciously on centre court (is that allowed?).
Where did this performance or confidence come from? In a way I dont care. The fact that he was able to raise his game and maintain it with unflinching self-belief against a titan of the sport was standalone magnificent. It is testament to the fact that we all are capable of a performance leagues ahead of what we ever dreamed possible and that is what was so inspiring.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Good post
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Venga (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/venga)
20 July 2012, 12:16 pm
According to the Beeb this year has been the wettest April and June on record. July's been shit too.
It has sent the climbing community demented. I gave up the struggle weeks ago as I've found I can burn up a lot of psyche scratching around for dry rock to the point that when the good conditions arrive I can scarcely be bothered.
Instead I have diverted my energies elsewhere. One thing I've been doing is experimenting with the deadhanging regimes recommended by Eva Lopez on her blog (http://en-eva-lopez.blogspot.co.uk/) and discussed extensively on a UKB thread (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,20341.0.html)
I have always felt that maximal finger strength has been a big weakness for me. It is one of those things that if you have it (Stu) you take it for granted. I can see that if you can hang an edge one-handed it would feel piss, but if you can't, then take it from me, it feels utterly impossible. There's very little middle ground. I tried to bridge the gap by using a counterbalance setup (pulley, string, etrier and free weights) but progress seemed slow.
Ultimately I aim (dream) to do a one-armer on an edge but doing this one armed work I ended up straining the tendon attachment to the inside of the elbow (golfers). That was about 9 months ago and it is still slightly tender. Naturally I stopped doing it.
Eva's studies have some intriguingly counter-intuitive advice on deadhanging. First that hanging a larger edge with weight on is better at stimulating strength gains than a small edge without weight and with ultimately better gains for hanging the small edge. More tricky to come to terms with are the actual sessions. There are 2 sessions a week (preceded by a day of rest). But each session is effectively only 3-5 hangs. That's it. Stop. Furthermore each hang (of 10seconds) is not even to failure. How can so little work and so little effort result in any gains?.
At 48 and having climbed a long time I covet even marginal gains. I wish I had properly benchmarked right at the start of trying this new deadhang regime so I could quantify the gains properly as they have been remarkable. 3 weeks ago I did a quick test on a small edge. Although I held it as a drag for 12 secs I could only hold it for 4 secs to failure in the recommended half crimp. Maybe the first hang tired me out but even so, yesterday, using the same hold half-crimped, I managed 4x for 10secs with with 2.5kg added. I felt I could add more weight. And I'm heavier than before.
It feels like cheating.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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So you're resting a lot for these really short maximal sessions and your performance in this exercise is getting better? That seems really obvious to me. Sounds like tapering and recruiting up - good for short term gains but not for the long haul.
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We'll see. These sort of gains I will be keen to hang on to and build on
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Venga, venga (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/venga-venga)
11 August 2012, 9:34 am
Following on from the last post I've now completed my first Eva Lopez style 8 week cycle of maximal hangs.
For those not familiar this involves 2 sessions a week of 3x10second hangs on a medium edge with a lot of weight attached for 4 weeks followed by the same session on a small edge with no weight attached for a further 4 weeks. At the start of the second 4 weeks I needed 2.5kg assistance to do the 3 hangs but by the last session I even managed a couple of hangs with 15kg attached !
This has blown apart my preconception that I was only capable of small incremental strength gains from fingerboarding. The excitement of adding more weight with each session has been tremendous.
Last night I popped into the Foundry with my pulley and a few weights to repeat a benchmarking exercise I did about 10 months ago on the Beastmaker doing one arm assisted hangs on the bottom rail. In some ways I was disappointed with the level of improvement compared to the big measured gains I'd had recently. The result was about 2-5% total improvement (ie including body weight) for the right and 8-9% for the left with a 2-3kg strength improvement for the right and a 5kg improvement for the left. This has shown that the big right-left discrepancy has been reduced but the absolute gains on my right have been limited - for this exercise at least.
I realised whilst doing it that as a benchmark the test was fundamentally flawed in two ways. Firstly one arm hangs can be compromised by shoulder instability being the limiting factor (rather than finger strength) especially as the counterweight gets lighter. The other thing I noticed this time was that the Beastmaker rail is a weird hold for my fingers that I have to use in what I can only describe as a 'chiselled drag'. This is not a grip position I have been training so you would expect that the crossover from other grips that I have been using (mainly half-crimp) would be limited.
At the end of the session I managed to one arm hang one of the beastmaker first joint slots for about 5 seconds with my right which was a big YYFY. I can hold the slot half-crimped and the clearance on the Foundry Beastmaker allowed me to do this side-on using my thumb on the side of the board which not only improves purchase but also assists with limiting rotation. Whilst it doesn't fully qualify as a one arm hang from a first joint edge, it's damn close.
Now my elbow seems to have recovered from last year's strain I might start dabbling with working back to being able to do a one-armer, then who knows...?!
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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I might start dabbling with working back to being able to do a one-armer, then who knows...?!
doing a one-armer will set you up nicely for being able to start training for doing two one-armers
that's £397 training consultancy fee please (at 10% off the Grade 8 Guidance Rate)
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set you up nicely for being able to start training for doing two one-armers
Pah ! I can do that already on both arms - at the same time !
:weakbench:
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For Doylo x (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/for-doylo-x)
11 January 2013, 12:46 pm
I achieved another PB yesterday doing 3 x 10sec weighted deadhangs on the 23m edge of the Wedge. The weight was 42.5kg which represents a collosal improvement from when I started last July. Unfortunately I didnt start straight away with the 23mm hold so I can't be exact on the improvement but factoring in winter weight gain it is over 20kgs.
Some people are understandably put off by the jargon stemming from Eva's blog and research paper. If you think these are complicated then take a butcher's at the training progamme that comes with her fingerboard. It is still at Bletchley Park for deciphering. Joking apart, content is more important than style and Eva has made a great contribution to our training knowledge.
For me there were a few simple things I took away from Eva's work that guided the way I approach weighted hangs. 1. Bigger results are achieved on a medium hold with bigger weights. 2 These hangs are good training for both hanging smaller holds and improving finger endurance. 3. Intensity is everything requiring sessions that are preceded by rest.
Whilst Eva suggests that going to failure isn't optimal I prefer to for a couple of reasons. Psychologically I am highly motivated trying to beat previuos sessions. Also what is 100% max to failure? even when I am psyched and think I am trying 100% am I really?. I'm sure if I was off my face on speed or there was a gun pointed at the head of my first born I would squeeze a couple more seconds out. Additionally I think climbing near my limit for 30 years my brain is accustomed to ignoring the regular messages it gets from my fingers to get stronger so extreme stimulus is required.
So Doylo its not complicated if you choose to do it my way. Usually I do 2 sessions a week for 3 weeks and have a break for a week. In each session I get fully recruited and allow as much time as I want between hangs (4-6minutes). Best if you start by finding an edge you can half crimp for around 3 x 5-7secs to failure with 20kg attached. When you have progressed to doing 3 x 10 secs then add 2.5kg for the next session.
HTH
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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One move (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/one-move)
12 May 2013, 7:08 pm
My longstanding seige of Austrian Oak at Malham is now a standing joke.
I started it on it in 2007 soon after redpointing Overnight Sensation. The sensible thing when trying to break into the next grade is to choose a route that suits you. For me that should have been a technical long route like Predator. The Oak on the other hand is a short, burly, bouldery route and I suck at bouldering. #
But that's what makes it such a compelling challenge. Also the moves are amazing which has helped me return year after year and directed my training to get strong enough to do it. And I have got stronger as a consequence - but clearly not strong enough. The main issue has been a stopper move at 10 feet pictured.
(http://i.imgur.com/ZmRjYO7.jpg)
Photo courtesy of Seb Grieve
From an undercut and sidepull you get a high right foot and cross in underneath with the left hand to a crozzly awkwardly angled undercut pocket and then reach out with the right hand to a polished intermediate sidepull. Left foot goes up and from a crouching position you dynamically straighten out and throw for an undercut brick shaped pinch with the right hand at full stretch with the left hand still holding the undercut pocket.
What is slightly galling is that some don't even find this to be the crux move. I have done the throw 7x in a row on the dog recently but as soon as I start linking the preceding moves into it I pretty much always fall off (with the exception of 2 redpoint attempts in the past). Despite being stronger this year 15 visits has failed to see me reach my highpoint in June last year which was captured on video here.
Austrian Oak. Redpoint attempt (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwZ653MbUT4#ws)
I can't blame the conditions this year either as the route has been dry since the end of February and the temperatures generally good.
Going back to the stopper move I reckon I need to be at something like 70/80% of my maximum capacity on the move rather than 90% currently. When I was in Font at Easter John Welford (who knows a thing or two about hard projects) said he usually found he had to do something different to get success on a hard project. It was good advice as clearly I have failed to grind it down with persistence.
Isolating the things that are likely to me help me I have come up with 5 things to focus on:
1. The undercut pocket is something I have to hold with 4 fingers to do the move and often my pinkie flips out which means I cant do it, yet many people do the move comfortably on their front 3 fingers. So I need to train that.
2. The step up on my legs is something which requires me to sag down before moving back up so some dynamic leg strengthening and core exercises will help.
3. Often I get to reach the brick but my contact strength isn't good enough to hold it in the instant when everything else is falling apart - so some weird pinch strengthening exercises and practice moves grabbing pinches or a beam may help.
4. In the past have trained for the move by replicating it on a home board which Im sure helped. Since moving house in October I have yet to put the boards back up so I need to find an alternative.
5. Looking back at my notes I was around a record low of 11stone 1lb when I did the redpoint in the video. Unfortunately that weight wasn't sustainable and I was burnt out on subsequent visits. Of late I have been 11stone 7-9 which is about 11% body fat. 11 stone 4/5lbs is a target weight that has been sustainable during the climbing season so I need to be that sort of fighting weight when I get back on it in the autumn.
Hopefully one or a combination of the above will give me a few more % on the move to consistently get through the move and who knows, the top one day
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
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Not an expert on sports psychology but it sounds like a head problem.Having watched the vid it obvious you can do it.
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I thought the traverse back left just after the bit you fell off in the video was the crux. Horses for courses i guess. Bonjoy's suggestion of doing The Maximum is a good one. Will give you some success, and also act as training for a very similar move.
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
It is a thought but funnily enough I had the opposite view that if I did the Oak I might be strong enough to do the Maximum!
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a. Apparently Bob Hickish reckons its the hardest move he's done at Malham.
Bouldery routes as training is a really good thought but the right side of the tor is far more handy from Sheffield.
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FWIW I've had a very brief play on both of these routes and I thought the Oak was the easier of the two. I seem to remember there was a move I didn't manage to do on the Maximum...
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Not an expert on sports psychology but it sounds like a head problem.Having watched the vid it obvious you can do it.
You may be right but the thing with PE routes like the Oak or Raindogs is that generally people look pretty smooth right up to the point they get shut down enough to be spat off
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FWIW I've had a very brief play on both of these routes and I thought the Oak was the easier of the two. I seem to remember there was a move I didn't manage to do on the Maximum...
It is notoriously reachy. Mind you so is the throw move on the Oak.
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
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Your foot position for the move you fell off looks a bit wierd. I dont remember having such a low left foot for that move (but I havent been to Malham for over 10 years so might not reliable comment...). You cruise the start so I reckon you should try to tweak your beta for that move and you should be in.
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Needs more angst!
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=12610 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=12610)
10 votes for easy 8a, 11 votes for hard 7c+ and 2 votes for mid 7c+
Anyway you put me off it when you clipped the third bolt and the hanger came off.
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Your foot position for the move you fell off looks a bit wierd. I dont remember having such a low left foot for that move (but I havent been to Malham for over 10 years so might not reliable comment...). You cruise the start so I reckon you should try to tweak your beta for that move and you should be in.
Point is I haven't been able to get to that point since.
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
Anyway you put me off it when you clipped the third bolt and the hanger came off.
:'( Oh yeah, forgot about that!
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Don't think the Maximum is 8a, it's just got a hard few moves near the start. Nor do I think it is reachy, i'm not tall.
You are correct, your long standing, and quite public, siege is a bit of joke (no offence intended). I must have talked about you over a dozen times down the crag/pub and I've not even properly met you!
Seems to me that this is mostly in your head. You seem to enjoy the long siege. Somehow you could do with removing that mentality from your climbing. Perhaps you need to see a sport psychologist? read the book Jerry read?
Practise being ruthless when sending.
Also, I find it tiring driving to Malham from Sheffield. Get someone else to do the driving.
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What about a peak 8b near home?
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What about a peak 8b near home?
There aren't many. And none that suit me. And its not about the grade any more. I just want to do the Oak.
Current Peak project is Anger Management at the tor which is a really ace 8a+ I was trying last year.
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I reckon you need to do something drastic. Either...
1) Send kids off to summer camp and wife on 6 week cruise with friends and camp out at Malham until it's done.
Or
2) Build proper replica in back garden, with realistic sika'd holds and spend more time training rather than sitting in car driving to Malham.
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Your foot position for the move you fell off looks a bit wierd. I dont remember having such a low left foot for that move
I thought something similar when I watched the vid.
Sack it for a bit and go on Magnetic, after all thats only 8a+ :lol: :lol:
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
Anyway you put me off it when you clipped the third bolt and the hanger came off.
:'( Oh yeah, forgot about that!
Was'nt I belaying?
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
Anyway you put me off it when you clipped the third bolt and the hanger came off.
:'( Oh yeah, forgot about that!
Was'nt I belaying?
Scarier still if you weren't :spank:
;)
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Have you considered using The Maximum as a training route? Same length (it being the route next door!), similar burly climbing and crux (easier obviously), plus it looks from your UKC log like you haven't done it. I think at tough bouldery 7c+ it would fit the job very well. The time it takes to redpoint will give you good info on how far off the level you need for the oak you are. Once redpointed you could attempt to do it multiple times in a session, w/wo set intervals.
I have belayed enough strong people on it (and Three Nine) to gain the view that it must be 8a.
One hard move doesn't make an 8a. I can think of plenty of harder moves at Malham. None of the 20+ people on 8a.willy waving have suggested 8a. Just 'hard' for the grade.
Anyway you put me off it when you clipped the third bolt and the hanger came off.
:'( Oh yeah, forgot about that!
Was'nt I belaying?
Was Arran i think! I still remember his worried face as i jumped off.
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Can the next person to reply remember to contain all the previous quotes as it seems I've stupidly forgot. Cheers
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Can the next person to reply remember to contain all the previous quotes as it seems I've stupidly forgot. Cheers
:P
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Hard 7c+/easy 8a. Either way seems like a good stepping stone to The Oak, given the similarity and proximity. I find it hard to believe anyone who’s done both routes would think the crux on TM is harder! It’s hard but it is way easier than the Oak. Just sounds to me like one of those popular Malhamisms that get bandied about, the ones that have a grain of truth but a lot more grains of bullshit. Other examples of the genre being the old trope that Zoolook is harder than GBH and the now disproved one that Bat Route was impossible since losing a hold. I reckon as often as not people write TM off as a sandbag when they go on it expecting to rinse it quickly because the grade doesn’t start with an 8, then get upset that it has a hard move and bag it off quickly as being not worth the effort because the grade doesn’t start with an 8. Forget the lowly grade and the ignominy of potentially struggling on a route three grades below the one you’re normally seen struggling on. If it has a chance of making the difference it’s got to be worth a punt. And if it turns into a stupidly epic siege then you’ve got to wonder if trying an 8b version of the same concept is such a good idea anyway.
I’ll stop goading you now. :jab:
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That be some good goading, arrrrr :D
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Totally agree with Bonjoy. Plus has this reputation that it is sandbag also grown from the fact that it was originally graded 8b with a duff sequence...?
Maybe lots of people have been trying this sequence and getting shut down?
FWIW I thought it was a hard move for 7c+, but then again, if you do the move you should do the route as it's a path in comparison afterwards.
I don't buy the short man card either as I know of at least two midgets who have done it and also found it steady at the grade.
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Closer to home, how about undercut-crimp-jug at tor. Timeless classic, what a line, might get you strong at big moves off left hand undercuts.
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Closer to home, how about undercut-crimp-jug at tor. Timeless classic, what a line, might get you strong at big moves off left hand undercuts.
:goodidea:
Coincidently I was giving Ed Brown a power spot on that yesterday.
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Undercut Crimp...maybe but the crux here seems to be body tension enabling you to not only hold an undercut with a pretty extended left arm but to also take a relatively small hold semi statically with the right. Nice skills if you've got them but not a game changer on the Oak.
IMHO to rectify his 'weakness' Shark needs to concentrate on problems terminating with a bigger hold for the right the kind of see it on the skyline and know you are in type hold no matter what the left arm is feeling like.
Buckstone Dyno
Attitude Inspector
Glass Hour
Continuing on the dyno theme I'd be interested to know how the Shark fairs on Help the Aged?
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Undercut Crimp...maybe but the crux here seems to be body tension enabling you to not only hold an undercut with a pretty extended left arm but to also take a relatively small hold semi statically with the right. Nice skills if you've got them but not a game changer on the Oak.
BTW Undercut crimp doesn't start on the undercut but the edges below I was reliably informed today.
Hopefully I will have ticked the Oak before the grit season comes round again. Mind you I've been thinking that for 4 years.
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Hopefully I will have ticked the Oak before the grit season comes round again. Mind you I've been thinking that for 4 years.
Today I made love for the first time with a girl who was in love with me 15 years ago, she told me. 4 years are nothing, she told me. Stick at it, she told me. You'll get it.
:)
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Mind you I've been thinking that for 4 years.
Thats way too long, give it a brake and try something else nearer home.
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Hopefully I will have ticked the Oak before the grit season comes round again. Mind you I've been thinking that for 4 years.
Today I made love for the first time with a girl who was in love with me 15 years ago, she told me. 4 years are nothing, she told me. Stick at it, she told me. You'll get it.
:)
I think this is the best advice on the Internet.
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What would Swiss Toni do?
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What would Swiss Toni do?
For me, climbing the Oak is very much like trying to make love to a beautiful woman whilst afflicted with erectile dysfunction
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For me, climbing the Oak is very much like trying to make love to a beautiful woman whilst afflicted with erectile dysfunction
More like trying to get off with a fit bird that is really not up for it. Set you sights a bit lower and you stand more chance of getting laid :bounce:
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More like trying to get off with a fit bird that is really not up for it. Set you sights a bit lower and you stand more chance of getting laid :bounce:
In this case though, she's well up for it, just playing hard to get.
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You just need to make eyes at some other routes. She'll soon put out....
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Continuing on the dyno theme I'd be interested to know how the Shark fairs on Help the Aged?
Is that a jibe? I would think he will get it done before he gets a free busspass. Maybe.
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Totally agree with Bonjoy. Plus has this reputation that it is sandbag also grown from the fact that it was originally graded 8b with a duff sequence...?
I remember the magazine headline "Is this the hardest route in Britain? The Maximum E8 7a". The answer was found to be "no" pretty quickly.
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Is that a jibe?
No but this is:
(http://www.climbandmore.com/upload/Image/training/Tribout.jpg)
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Fruit Ninja (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/fruit-ninja)
6 February 2014, 12:11 pm
I like board games like chess and scrabble and whilst far from being a gamer there are a few electronic games I've got hooked which in chronological order are Tetris, Donkey Kong, Snake and more recently Fruit Ninja.
The kids showed me a couple of games on the Iphone when I got it and the "classic" version is the one I play. Tommy tried to show me the "arcade" and "zen" versions of the same game but I wasn't interested. The challenge of the original was still motivating.
I thought about this in climbing terms (like I do for pretty much everything) and realised whether its games, holiday destinations, crag destinations or whatever I don't have a great need for novelty or variety. If something is proven as interesting or entertaining enough I am happy to keep repeating the experience rather than seek out something new.
When I was young I tried lots of sports and hobbies, some of which embarrassingly nerdy (antique bottle collecting anyone?). I always felt that I was searching for something that would sustain my interest long term. It was not until I was 19 that I found climbing. 30 years ago. Since then any other activities like ski holidays have been an unwelcome distraction usually to earn brownie points.
Consequently I suspect the reason I'm predisposed to getting locked into routes or problems (sometimes for years) is not because this is the best path to higher grades but is a personality trait or flaw. Maybe low level OCD.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Peak Limestone – time for a re-think? (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/peak-limestone-time-for-a-re-think)
10 August 2014, 7:14 pm
I’m old enough to remember queueing for routes at Chee Tor. Back then I worried for the future of the crag because as climbing became more popular (because it is brilliant!) then the place would be overrun and trashed in the future. Things didn’t quite work out as I predicted. Nowadays instead of the whistle clean and well chalked lines of yesteryear these routes invariably have a sad and dusty quality indicative of neglect.
This reversal of popularity is evident to an even greater extent at less impressive limestone crags than Chee Tor. If you want to do a bit of classic trad away from the honeypot crags then expect to encounter overgrown paths, vegetated routes and maybe an agitated landowner who isn’t used to having people climb their crags anymore.
So how did Peak Limestone trad lose its mojo? Thinking back to the mid eighties trad climbing was the only game in town. The choice was primarily gritstone or limestone trad climbing. I preferred limestone. Sport climbing hadn’t quite made it across the Channel. Climbing walls didn’t really exist. Bouldering on limestone was an oddity.
Lucky climbers now are spoilt by the proliferation of options. Want to do the hardest moves you are capable of? – go bouldering. Want to fill your pants? – go headpoint a grit route. Want to deliver a series of at your limit moves in relative safety? – go redpointing. Want to swing up 15 meters of jugs whilst it is raining? – go to Awesome Walls. Want to do limestone trad – well, err yes, go to High Tor or Stoney by all means but take care to dress appropriately for most other venues.
There are a lot of Peak Lime trad crags out there that are scarcely climbed on anymore – many of which through neglect we would struggle to reassert the right to climb on with landowners anyway. The approach paths are overgrown or even disappeared. Whilst the easier routes may still be attemptable if overgrown, the cleaner harder steeper routes are often reliant on situ pegs or threads that are now rotten. Small wonder climbers spend their limited time elsewhere.
About a year ago I was on the way back from bouldering at Raven Tor and passed the entrance to Horseshoe Quarry which was, as ever, rammed with parked cars. A few hundred yards on I stopped and scrambled up to Stoney West. There was no one there of course. The routes on the left still looked appealing and naturally cleanish (Tequila Tory, Twang, Northerners Cant Climb). Further right the rock quality deteriorated but was still climbable natural limestone which had the potential to be more appealing than anything else at Horseshoe Quarry (Main Wall routes excepted). I toyed with the idea of bolting these new lines and retro-bolting old lines and so got in touch with Simon Cundy who had done 4 lines in the E3/4 range back in the day. He was amenable to having them retro-bolted but said that Gary Gibson had already been in touch and had it on his list. Phew. That saved me a job.
Gibson subsequently took his industrial approach to Stoney West and put up 29 bolted lines – most new, some retro bolted. He did (at least one thing) I wouldn’t have done which was put up a bolt route very near an E5 called Northerners Cant Climb.
NCC is a route I aspired to do in the 80’s as it was recommended for being bold but on excellent rock with an exciting finale. Unfortunately I never got round to trying it at the time and so the moment passed. If NCC was on High Tor it would see regular traffic, but it isn’t and consequently probably hadn’t been repeated for 20 years. Nonetheless I think it is one that was worth preserving and with the increased attraction from the sport climbing at Stoney West might have got on peoples radar and potentially be climbed again. Gary bolted a line close to NCC which was I suspect close enough to interfere with that route’s independence. Incidentally the same situation occurred with Flycatcher on Garage Buttress. This sort of thing tends to cause disgruntlement for a minority rather than general outrage.
However, out of the blue Tony Walker mistakenly went and retrobolted NCC not realising that it had been done before. I don’t know Tony Walker well but was aware of him in my youth as an older, stronger and talented trad climber who notably took a groundfall attempting Ninth Life in the early 80s. I mention this to make the point that he is the opposite of a young wall bred climber unaware of traditional routes and ethics which is often presented as the archetypal retrobolter. The incident led to an online debate on UKClimbing and Walker reluctantly offered to remove the bolts. In some ways it was a storm in a teacup but it is illustrative of some changing trends on Peak Limestone.
If I was in charge (which I’m not) of a climbing governing body (which the BMC isn’t) then I would draw up and manage a definitive list of those classic Peak Trad routes that (I think) are worth preserving in their original form ie they shouldn’t be retro-bolted or spoilt by overly close adjacent bolted routes. Any attempt at bribery by First Ascentionists would be favourably considered. Furthermore the trad routes on The List should continue to be cleaned and climbed to continue to deserve their inclusion on the list otherwise they could be mooted as a potential target for retro bolting. Anything off the list is of course fair game for retro bolting.
Fortunately I’m not in charge which is certainly for the best. I know I would have railed against such overbearing bureaucratic interference in my youth and if the BMC Regional Meetings was similarly some sort of arbiter it would end up getting bogged down and distracted when there are more important issues such as Access and Land Management changes.
However, I do think that the bigger picture is worth at least rethinking. Whilst many from my generation have a lingering fondness for Peak Lime trad routes we should accept that the routes aren’t what they were and that however good Niall’s new BMC guidebook it is not going to be a DeLorean powered by a resurgent enthusiasm that will take us, the routes and crags back to the 80’s
That all said, in a sense nothing has changed. The real activity will be driven mainly by activists out on the crags doing their thing guided by history, peer influence and maybe an insatiable thirst for immortality. The occasional transgression will cause a more widespread hoo-hah on social media, in climbing magazines and even reaching the BMC Regional Meetings which may lead to counter action. Plus ça change.
However, where we are currently seems iniquitous insofar that a disproportionate amount of mid-grade sport climbing takes place on poor quality quarried limestone whilst on better (but still not brilliant crags) not a lot of climbing goes on at all which in turn causes self-perpetuating deterioration of those crags. It seems to me perverse and dog in a mangerish to argue that this deterioration is preferable to retrobolting.
Whatever does happen going forward it will unlikely to be carried out in a planned, strategic and sensitive way with the backing of an agreed consensus. Well that’s my prediction. But as you know I don’t have much success at prediction.
PS Word has reached me today that Gibson has applied his less than deft touch at Central Buttress..
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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There are a lot of Peak Lime trad crags out there that are scarcely climbed on anymore...
...on better (but still not brilliant crags) not a lot of climbing goes on at all which in turn causes self-perpetuating deterioration of those crags
Start listing them then. Vague allusions to the existence of these gets us nowhere.
many of which through neglect we would struggle to reassert the right to climb on with landowners anyway
Really? Without examples sounds rather like a baseless FUD campaign. Only one I can think of is Winnats.
Given the open enthusiasm of the 'oh, just bolt it all' camp on UKC & Facebook recently I think you can do this without fear of sticking your head over the parapet.
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There are a lot of Peak Lime trad crags out there that are scarcely climbed on anymore...
...on better (but still not brilliant crags) not a lot of climbing goes on at all which in turn causes self-perpetuating deterioration of those crags
Start listing them then. Vague allusions to the existence of these gets us nowhere.
many of which through neglect we would struggle to reassert the right to climb on with landowners anyway
Really? Without examples sounds rather like a baseless FUD campaign. Only one I can think of is Winnats.
Given the open enthusiasm of the 'oh, just bolt it all' camp on UKC & Facebook recently I think you can do this without fear of sticking your head over the parapet.
I dont know what a FUD campaign is but I'm going on what has been mentioned at the Peak Area meets - specifically John Peel Wall was mentioned at Dovedale, upper circle of Water Cum Jolly, Ping/Pong buttress, left end of Chee Tor where White Life is has been mentioned too and Dogs Dinner buttress I think and more recently Central Buttress.
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The Broomhill Complex (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/the-broomhill-complex)
25 March 2015, 7:58 pm
I devised a new training session today which I’m very excited about.
Of late my fingerboard training has focussed on max deadhangs with added weight. Between each deadhang I take a few minutes rest and typically played fruit ninja on my phone. Unfortunately I have plateaued for several weeks on fruit ninja and new stimulus is required.
Today after a progressive warm-up I experimented with doing the ironing. The protocol was one hard max deadhang followed by two or three pieces of laundry. This is obviously early days and I may tweak the rep structure but the initial results were impressive. 18 items ironed. Because I was slightly concerned that the ironing may have reduced my testosterone levels (studies on the subject are inconclusive) I finished off by doing a deadlift.
However, what if I get so good that I do the whole of the family’s ironing before the end of the session? I don’t think this is setting the bar too high as rapid gains are possible given that ironing is more technical than strength oriented. The obvious answer at that point is to apply my new skills outdoors in a competitive environment. This may sound like I’m getting ahead of myself but I think it is important to set a goal however unlikely it seems and work towards it. Dreams do come true if you work hard enough. The world of extreme ironing beckons. I gather Rich Simpson is the current World Champion.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Just don't forget to split the ironing time between your left hand and right hand, wouldn't want it to be detrimental to one hand...
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Smooth post Shark. Left me creased up with laughter.
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Absolutely brilliant.
And far more useful than it may appear!
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Going strong Shark. If pressed, would you say you're ready for extreme ironing? If so, it might be time to strike whilst the... never mind.
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This could be the start of a wonderful symbiotic work business relationship. Shark Laundry Services - coupled with your exclusive members only (high fee) specialist training facility featuring ironing.
I expect you have more pressing issues though...
Bugger. Beaten to it :(
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Yeah but how much did you deadlift, ya pussy?
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Yeah but how much did you deadlift, ya pussy?
He's busy pumping iron :whistle:
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Show us your board.
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Do you iron your boxers Shark?
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what's your technique for removing chalk from your hands before handling the clean clothes (without wrecking your skin)?
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what's your technique for removing chalk from your hands before handling the clean clothes (without wrecking your skin)?
Rubber gloves
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deadhanging in rubber gloves is cheating
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And a pinafore to stop hoodies covered in chalk being transferred to clean clothes.
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deadhanging in rubber gloves is cheating
Its probably allowed for ironing though.. they let it all go on there...
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what's your technique for removing chalk from your hands before handling the clean clothes (without wrecking your skin)?
Good question. I did make an error ironing a black top with chalky hands but personally I don't mind washing my hands between deadhangs as it gets rid of any grease. The other solution is to iron the clothes inside out which is good practice anyway and I think encouraged in the armed forces.
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Chalk, gloves and pressing hard against men's clothing. What's not to like?
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The other solution is to iron the clothes inside out which is good practice anyway and I think encouraged in the armed forces.
I once treated myself to a posh shirt from Gieves & Hawkes that came with a user manual, in which they also recommended ironing on the inside.
Also, I claim Prior Art on this training approach:
M: Middle-aged dad's shoulders/core/housework routine: iron a shirt, do a set of press-ups, iron a shirt, do a plank ...
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Are you not resting too much between hangs or are you some sort of speed demon when it comes to ironing. In my case if I was to iron 2 items between hangs that would be one hang every 40 minutes.
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MrsTT would think I was having an affair if I started ironing my clothes.
10 seconds later she would give me some of hers to do... ;)
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In my case if I was to iron 2 items between hangs that would be one hang every 40 minutes.
You need to work towards five minutes per shirt whilst remaining below your aerobic threshold.
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I don't believe any of this, did you get it on film Shark?
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Wha' eez zis "Iron" 'zing you speeek ov?
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Are you not resting too much between hangs or are you some sort of speed demon when it comes to ironing. In my case if I was to iron 2 items between hangs that would be one hang every 40 minutes.
With ironing being a stamina/technique activity quantity trumps quality every time - you don't have to do everything in control - though injuries (typically minor burns) are possible if too slapdash. Also a good % of the items are kids clothes in my case so the surface area to power ratio is quite low.
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I don't believe any of this, did you get it on film Shark?
:D
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I don't believe any of this, did you get it on film Shark?
I resent the implication. Get a grip. We are talking about training here not the real thing. Its not like I am claiming anything world class like a suit or a silk tie.
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Any iron manufacturers out there wishing to sponsor, contact -
shark@ladderwad.com
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I bet he used a trouser press.
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Is that the knee pad of the ironing world?
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Any iron manufacturers out there wishing to sponsor, contact -
shark@ladderwad.com
Being at one with the iron is where its at. I am not in it for the money - although everyone has their price.
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I bet he used a trouser press.
As you well know there is not a lot of money in ironing. Sure you see the High Ironers with their trouser presses and think maybe if I perform well enough I might get Corby to sponsor me but I dont think there is enough money in the industry with the rise of smart casual dressing. Also you have to not just be good but seen to be good. I'm not sure I'm that good at that self-promotion.
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Well the first step would be to write a blog about it.
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You need some video evidence to tie it all together. Morphy Richards won't be able to resist.
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I don't believe any of this, did you get it on film Shark?
I resent the implication. Get a grip. We are talking about training here not the real thing. Its not like I am claiming anything world class like a suit or a silk tie.
No need to get hot under the collar Shark, you did after all claim a staggering 3 items between hangs...
I'd personally recommend filming the training session to help iron out any flaws in technique...
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I don't believe any of this, did you get it on film Shark?
I resent the implication. Get a grip. We are talking about training here not the real thing. Its not like I am claiming anything world class like a suit or a silk tie.
No need to get hot under the collar Shark
He is getting a bit shirty, isn't he?
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Maybe he's starting to feel a bit hemmed in?
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I guess we better button it then...
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Maybe he's starting to feel a bit hemmed in?
Call it what ever you want! This is exactly why I dont want to be part of the ironing scene in Sheffield... Thanks everyone else for your support! It means a lot
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A coach could help with your style... I'd suggest my ex-wife.
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Call it what ever you want! This is exactly why I dont want to be part of the ironing scene in Sheffield... Thanks everyone else for your support! It means a lot
You should fuck off to North Wales then. They're impressed if you own clothes there let alone an iron.
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Call it what ever you want! This is exactly why I dont want to be part of the ironing scene in Sheffield... Thanks everyone else for your support! It means a lot
You should fuck off to North Wales then. They're impressed if you own clothes there let alone an iron.
So our ironing isnt good enough for you eh!
Some people eh...
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are able to iron with either hand?
that's E7 in its own right - technical with significant objective danger
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what's your technique for removing chalk from your hands before handling the clean clothes (without wrecking your skin)?
The other solution is to iron the clothes inside out which is good practice anyway and I think encouraged in the armed forces.
Ceremonial dress yeah, used to do this to avoid the risk of putting a fuck-off big stain or burn on the leg of your No.1s the day before some pompous bullshitathon
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I've tried what I'd dubbed "The Shark session" today.
After a set of one arm hangs with my weightvest on, I pushed so hard on the iron that I burnt the t-shirt and crushed a burning hole in the ironing board.
Unfortunately for you Shark, it was my favourite wolf t-shirt, that had an inestimable economic and sentimental value.
Given that you had't warned against such risks, I'm going to hire Ru as my lawyer to sue you.
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I've tried what I'd dubbed "The Shark session" today.
After a set of one arm hangs with my weightvest on, I pushed so hard on the iron that I burnt the t-shirt and crushed a burning hole in the ironing board.
Unfortunately for you Shark, it was my favourite wolf t-shirt, that had an inestimable economic and sentimental value.
Given that you had't warned against such risks, I'm going to hire Ru as my lawyer to sue you.
Whilst I am deeply sorry for your loss it should be self evident that deadhanging and ironing are activities with a danger of personal injury or death. Any judge (unless in the pocket of the mafia) would rule that participants in these activities should be aware of and accept those risks and be responsible for their own actions. Back to law school for you young man.
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Are you using one of those modern plug in steam irons. Ironing was originally done with a flat iron heated on an open fire and graded to suit.
Its about time that the reduced effort and risk required these days was reflected in the reporting of these feats.
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:clap2: Brilliant, Shark!!!
Unfortunately, your reply made me think, and at a deeper analysis, it's self evident that the combined practice of deadhanging and ironing falls outside of the boundaries of both the Bruxelles and Lugano conventions on international civil law jurisdiction.
In our case we will have to refer to the Italian civil procedure code, that in art. 18, paragraph II, states that when the foreign respondent has no residence in Italy, the jurisdiction is the Court of the plaintiff residence, which is my Court.
And therefore (unless in the pocket of the mafia)
you're screwed.
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P.s. I've also found this:
(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8732/16750700860_94267f23e6_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/pl/rwcHMf)image (https://flic.kr/p/rwcHMf) by Nibile (https://www.flickr.com/people/70381658@N00/), on Flickr
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;D
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There speaks Judge Nibile.
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This thread has had me in stitches.
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I creased up reading that.
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It left me feeling rather flat.
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That letter :lol:
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A burnt offering (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/a-burnt-offering)
28 April 2015, 12:03 pm
It is nine days since I set my hand on fire.
It happened about 6pm on Sunday evening, the day before my birthday. I was clearing up prunings in the garden and using a shredder. Sonia had called out that dinner was virtually ready so I was keen to finish up. A recalcitrant bundle of willow twigs resisted going down the slot so I decided to burn them. I set fire to some newspaper under the bundle and stood there with a petrol can in some doubt as to whether to liven it up a bit as the twigs didn’t seem to be catching. I paused with indecision but reverted to my default response of JFDI (just fucking do it).
The bundle instantly flared up into a fireball setting my right hand and shirt sleeve on fire. I dropped the petrol can which was also on fire and ran away screaming. I tried unsuccessfully to pat the fire out with my other arm which didn’t work. Still running I tried to unbutton my shirt at the same time but was impeded by my mind being engulfed with an unimaginable pain like I’d never experienced. The shirt wasn’t coming off and there was nothing else close by I could use to smother the flames with. In desperation I dived into the flower bed and rolled around. I didn’t expect this to work. But it did. Thank god.
The searing pain didn’t let up though. Later it came and went in waves. It was hard to talk when a fresh wave hit. There was glorious relief when a nurse put it under a cold water tap but the pain came back resurgent three seconds later when my hand had adopted to the fresh novelty of this experience. I left A&E with my hand covered in cream and in a plastic bag. The pain had largely gone by midnight so the sleeping tablet they’d given me wasn’t necessary,
I was re-bandaged the following day and trained on my board in the evening mainly doing moves off my left arm. I must have still been on an adrenaline high. Since then I have felt tired and listless and not forced myself back to the board. My appetite has been low and now so is my weight which is one good spin-off. Probably won’t last though. Last couple of evenings I have started to drink wine. It helps with the pain and cheers myself up.
My hand probably wouldn’t hurt too much except that I have been instructed to do some physio stretches. Curling my fingers into a fist using my other hand is a fight against the newly formed taut skin and then hurts for a couple of hours after. Maybe I’m forcing it too hard. Don’t want to lose my ability to crimp though.
The main affected areas are the back of my hand and the backs of my mid two fingers. There is now a nice new patch of pink skin on the back of my hand but the fingers are taking longer to grow new skin. I’m told it will probably be a further two weeks before bandaging is no longer required.
The bandage has to remain dry so showering is awkward. Washing my left armpit is a particular challenge. My tips are exposed so typing is fine. Writing and holding utensils is harder. My grip is fine and I can drive. Having an automatic is helpful.
Generally keeping my hand up is best - if I let it drop then blood rushes to it and it feels very uncomfortabe. Fortunately I had already been retraining myself to sleep on my back to alleviate shoulder issues. Going to sleep on my back with my hand on my chest seems to work for my hand as well. Sleep is a very welcome escape at the moment.
I have had a good number of crap-at-life moments and this is up there with the best. Abseiling off the end of my rope, buying Northern Rock shares days before it went bust. The list goes on. I try to learn from my mistakes. Throwing petrol on a fire has obvious risk so no great lesson there for me or anyone else. More illuminating is the human factors that led me to do such a stupid thing. Impatience coupled with a gung-ho attitude was the root cause. This sort of thing leads to go-for-it overtaking manoeuvres if stuck behind a slow moving vehicle. Whilst I have got away with this till now I am going to try to curb my impatience ‘going forward’. I’m sure this will come as something of a relief to my Malham passengers.
Talking of Malham my Oak campaign had been going well. I started early on February 10th as the route was unexpectedly dry. This was a month earlier than last year and meant enduring some Baltic sessions – a session with Ashley Lewis was the worst I think. I felt strong on the moves particularly the throw move but a shoulder issue seemed to inhibit me on some of the higher gaston moves.
There was a good team vibe and with some new faces joining the regulars including Ben Moon who I persuaded to go onto Rainshadow (he didn’t take much persuading). Later Mina joined the party trying the Oak and Bat Route. Paul Reeve held off initially making a strategic decision to stay indoors to continue his training before getting on the bus. Steve Mac was iffy with his shoulder but came good. It was great to see him and Ben climb together for the first time. Sam Harvie, Andy Cave and Dave Hesleden were other regulars in the car. Although I kept plugging away, the key link from the ground to the horn eluded me.
At the start of April I took a break spending a week bouldering indoors and then a week at Font. By the time I went back to Malham I was uncertain where I would be. The temperature was by now much better and planning around the sun and shade was required. First go on and the start moves suddenly felt a grade easier. I didn’t get the key link that day but could feel it was now on. Returning on the Friday I got the key link and reaching my all-time highpoint not once but twice. I was ecstatic and made arrangements to return on Monday 20th, my birthday. Obviously it was not to be.
I don’t know when my hand will be in a fit state to go back on the Oak but it is likely to be mid May at best. By then my skin and physical condition will have deteriorated and it will be too hot for optimal redpointing. If it turns out temperature is cool enough maybe I'll head up otherwise it would be more prudent to start climbing locally again and generally work towards being in condition physically and mentally for an Autumn onslaught.
Thanks for bearing with me if you’ve read this far – it’s been cathartic.
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
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Rest up and I hope the pain & discomfort subsides soon.
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That sounds nasty, get well soon mate!
The trick is to take the sleeping pill with the wine :alky: ;)
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A burnt offering (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/a-burnt-offering)
28 April 2015, 12:03 pm
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
[cliche]It's a bastard but it could've been much worse[/cliche] I burnt my hand once doing stupid things as a youngling, the waves of pain you describe above brings it back. ow.
If you want to go to Pembroke at somepoint before the autumn onslaught let me know, I promise not to kill you or attempt to!
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Sobering. I was extremely lucky to get away with the combination of petrol, fire and impatience. Cheers to a speedy recovery.
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If you want to go to Pembroke at somepoint before the autumn onslaught let me know, I promise not to kill you or attempt to!
Sounds good. Also howabout Fairhead ? sounds like a few are going across after the festival at the start of June.
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Must have been terrifying but I had images of Homer Simpson running around screaming when I read your description! Hope it heals soon.
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I know i've said this before, but I don't think you will do the Oak.
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I know i've said this before, but I don't think you will do the Oak.
Not to me you haven't.
Paul Reeve said Overnight Sensation was too hard for me. Glad I didn't listen. He at least had the good grace to prostrate himself before me at the Foundry after I did it.
I expect the same from you.
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If you want to go to Pembroke at somepoint before the autumn onslaught let me know, I promise not to kill you or attempt to!
Sounds good. Also howabout Fairhead ? sounds like a few are going across after the festival at the start of June.
I would be keen for that too but I'm going to Pabbay/Mingulay around then (yyfy)
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A burnt offering (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/a-burnt-offering)
28 April 2015, 12:03 pm
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
[cliche]It's a bastard but it could've been much worse[/cliche] I burnt my hand once doing stupid things as a youngling,
Not that old folks home in Hessle. :o
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Good luck with the recovery Simon, I find it inspiring reading about your exploits on The Oak so keep it up and I'm hoping you clip the chains.
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A burnt offering (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/a-burnt-offering)
28 April 2015, 12:03 pm
Source: The Shark (http://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog)
[cliche]It's a bastard but it could've been much worse[/cliche] I burnt my hand once doing stupid things as a youngling,
Not that old folks home in Hessle. :o
:worms:
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I definitely have, because you responded with that anecdote about Paul Reeve.
If you do the oak i will not only prostrate myself before you at the Foundry, but I will allow you to kick me square in the nuts and thereafter only speak of you as 'King Simon'.
I know i've said this before, but I don't think you will do the Oak.
Not to me you haven't.
Paul Reeve said Overnight Sensation was too hard for me. Glad I didn't listen. He at least had the good grace to prostrate himself before me at the Foundry after I did it.
I expect the same from you.
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Whilst I have got away with this till now I am going to try to curb my impatience ‘going forward’.
Know where you're coming from. It might have been the shot across the bows that you needed - hope it heals soon.
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thereafter only speak of you as 'King Simon'.
That's King Shark to you
(http://heroicuniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/king-shark.jpg)
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;D
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'king Shark more like.
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If you do the oak i will not only prostrate myself before you at the Foundry, but I will allow you to kick me square in the nuts and thereafter only speak of you as 'King Simon'.
Fucking hell I am definitely, totally, rooting for Shark now :punk:.
I think he probably will do it, but it will take forever and be a relentlessly boring and miserable experience that will vastly outweigh any shallow pleasures of finally ticking the damn thing :wall: :wall: :wall: (smiley accurately captures what every Oak-related Shark Club post sounds like)
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I think he probably will do it, but it will take forever and be a relentlessly boring and miserable experience that will vastly outweigh any shallow pleasures of finally ticking the damn thing :wall: :wall: :wall: (smiley accurately captures what every Oak-related Shark Club post sounds like)
You really don't get it.
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I think he probably will do it, but it will take forever and be a relentlessly boring and miserable experience that will vastly outweigh any shallow pleasures of finally ticking the damn thing :wall: :wall: :wall: (smiley accurately captures what every Oak-related Shark Club post sounds like)
You really don't get it.
If this article doesn't get through nothing will... http://eveningsends.com/climbing/the-day-i-sent-golden-5-14b/
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I tried to read that before, it seemed as gruelling as the long-term redpointing process, and I gave up. HTH :2thumbsup:
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skip to the last paragraph - it says that drinking lots of vodka will make you better at climbing
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Give me a shout if you're out for some lime boulderizing over the Summer Simon...
Work on the skin stretching - its really really important AFAIK...
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I appear to have fucked an elbow doing elbow-fucking parkour moves best suited to people half my age and weight with several times my skill and experience
I'd be happy to embarrass myself on hands free bouldering if you think it might help, Simon - it's pretty good for psyche
seeing as you're even older than me, you could use heels and knees (as long as I can use an ankle brace) - hands free, with knee pads has got to have some entertainment value
also - in the film, Sharkboy and Lavagirl only touch fingertips - I can only assume you took this affectionate action a bit too far and have had to make up the "gardening accident" story to reduce the chance of Red Sonja kicking the shit out of you
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Okay, read the article, so it's a straight forward mid-life crisis, fair enough. At least you're not buying a motorbike (thankfully, from your admission about Malham trip driving!).
BTW.... I do find the Oak....saga quite entertaining despite how bleak it all sounds. It adds character to Power Club etc. Also like everyone else I do hope you get better soon and your hand heals well :-*
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Okay, read the article, so it's a straight forward mid-life crisis, fair enough. At least you're not buying a motorbike
I bought two in eight months last year... :-\
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Okay, read the article, so it's a straight forward mid-life crisis, fair enough. At least you're not buying a motorbike
I bought two in eight months last year... :-\
Double Crisis!
:popcorn:
I'm 37 and looking for a motorbike with a sidecar. What does that mean?
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I'm 37 and looking for a motorbike with a sidecar. What does that mean?
You need to train more... ;)
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that you haven't been able to score enough Ronin Air Pads and need some way of transporting normal pads whilst razzing up and down the last frontier on a motorbike conquering new boulders?
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that you haven't been able to score enough Ronin Air Pads and need some way of transporting normal pads whilst razzing up and down the last frontier on a motorbike conquering new boulders?
I think the mid life crisis solution to that transport dilemma would be a Hummer. Or a 5 series BMW ;)
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that you haven't been able to score enough Ronin Air Pads and need some way of transporting normal pads whilst razzing up and down the last frontier on a motorbike conquering new boulders?
I think the mid life crisis solution to that transport dilemma would be a Hummer. Or a 5 series BMW ;)
Did that when I was 35...
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/04/28/b1aacef58cf75deb5e5e30e92a9b4e76.jpg)
45 this year, perhaps I need to start B.A.S.E or maybe I should try the Oak...
Or, more likely; find a good secondhand Zimmer frame.
Seriously (and despite the LSI comment on Grimers FB post), bad luck Shark!
Hope it heals quickly and the damage is all superficial.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Flaming heck Simon. Best wishes for a full recovery. The blog did make me laugh though. Sorry!
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Hang in there Simon. Remember Gin and Slimline Tonic have less calories than wine... ;)
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Aye, chin-up Simon, I'm sure you will return to the Oak stronger than ever. And, whilst it's no compensation, it there might have been an even worse outcome given that were using a shredder that day - burned fingers are better than none!
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Hope you get back on it soon! Give us a bell if your looking for mid week partners!
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I have yet to hear of a case where someone with an injury doesn't come back stronger. Good luck with it.
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I have yet to hear of a case where someone with an injury doesn't come back stronger. Good luck with it.
Jasper!! :)
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Christopher Reeve.
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The answer as always, is more power.
http://tinyurl.com/kvgnpvs
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Me.
[emoji30]
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Pip 1997-2015
I grew up on a hill farm in Devon. Cattle and Sheep. And naturally that meant I grew up with dogs. By dogs I mean border collies. If it ain't a border collie it ain't a dog. Dad's first dog actually lived in the house - Rosie. Family legend has it that she lay under my high chair then would knock my foot with her head so I would drop food. Clever dogs Collies.
It wasn't until I was married that I, or rather we, considered getting a dog. We viewed the prospect as a practice child - not that you should treat a dog like child - by being responsible for the welfare for another living thing and clearing up their shit.
As one of the dogs on my parents farm had an unexpected litter we went down and spent 20 minutes playing with the puppies. They were all cute but one was especially friendly. We picked her and named her Pip.
It was 1997 and I was having a year out climbing so had plenty of free time to train Pip. For me only three commands were important. Walking to heel, sitting when told and returning when called. I believe these should be commands that are deeply ingrained rather than obeyed at whim. That way you should be able to call them back if they start to run after livestock.
As part of her obedience training I used to hit a tennis ball and make her stay sitting until I said "fetch". God she loved fetch. Sometimes you would be sitting there and she would put something pathetic like a piece of straw on your knee to flick so she could fetch it.
Over the next few years the kids came along and we made sure that Pip was aware that her status in the pack was at the bottom. Pack psychology is quite interesting. I once noticed in the living room that Pip was standing astride over Thomas who was then relatively newly born and lying on a blanket. It occurred to me that she was asserting her authority over him in the pack order. To redress things I had Thomas ride around on her back for half an hour. Whether it was because of her friendly demeanour, or this sort of training, but she never made to bite the kids even under extreme provocation (ie having her hair pulled etc).
She was so much part of the fabric of my life that quite often I forgot she was there which, coupled with my forgetfulness, led to a few embarrassing leaving-the-dog-at-the-crag incidents.
Pip loved coming to the crag and usually found someone to play with. I later discovered on the forums that quite a few climbers are strongly anti-dog which has been an eye opener. It seems incredulous that having a reasonably well behaved dog is anything but a positive thing. Dogs and the countryside seem like such a natural combination.
If Pip is known by climbers for anything it is for falling off (ironically) the catwalk at Malham. She was below Raindogs and I think may have been chasing a small pebble that had been inadvertently kicked. She ended up following it on to a small ledge just below the lip of the catwalk in an irreversible position and so made a leap for it. When I ran down to the Beck I expected the worst, but she walked away with only a slight cut on her jaw.
I gather that the average life expectancy for a Collie is about 14. By the age of 17 she was definitely showing her age. Her eyes had gone cloudy and her sight was poor. Her hind quarters had become wasted. Quite often she was incontinent which upset her and a daily nuisance for us. She would frequently get stuck in corners unable to manoeuvre out again. Even the vet broached the issue of the quality of her life. We discussed this with the kids and they eventually all came round to the view that it was time for her to be put down. Of course knowing the right thing to do and doing it are two different things and I deferred the fatal day for a few more weeks.
I climbed at Raven Tor on Monday morning churning the issue over again and when I got home rang the Vet and got an appointment straight away. I was too choked up in reception to speak when another customer started asking me about her.
The injection went in and she went as limp as a rag doll - 18 years of life snuffed out in an instant. I took her home in the car and laid her by the copper beech at the end of the garden and set to digging a hole. Its a pretty spot. That was two days ago.
Obviously it was a gutting experience but her decline has meant we have all come to terms with it over a period of time. She'd been with me over a third of my life. What can you say? she was a good dog and she had a pretty good life.
(http://i.imgur.com/CZiCq9z.jpg)
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:( Sorry to hear this Shark - I'll miss Pip pottering about at the crag... Good words above.
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I wasn't ready for a heart wrencher! :'(
Was expecting an update on the hand/oak.
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One of the very best dogs there ever was. One week when you were away, and you said only give her her dog food, I fed her a can of corned beef every day.
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sorry to hear that she's gone, Shark
have a manly hug from me
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:'( Sorry to hear this Shark.
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Sorry to read this Simon. Lovely dog and as mad as the next collie! She was certainly a welcome visitor to the crag in my eyes.
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Sometimes you would be sitting there and she would put something pathetic like a piece of straw on your knee to flick so she could fetch it.
:lol: Met enough dogs who do this, I have to tell them off "what sort of stick do you think this is?!"
RIP Pip, great post Shark - it sounds like the ideal dog-owner life - and great picture. It's even brought out the best in 3-9.
And yeah can we have some particularly grumpy moaning about the Oak next time :)
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Commiserations shark, difficult time for sure. Collies are lovely, the bit about finding any ridiculous thing and presenting it to be thrown reminded me of a mates dog. Hope you're all ok
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Sorry to hear that Shark. She was lovely
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Sad news Shark.
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Commiserations Shark :(
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Tough times - such a nice write up tho.
Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk
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Nice words Si, sounds like she had a great life.
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Thanks guys
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Sad times
Nicely written Shark.
Sounds like a great life.
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Nice words Simon. Seemed like a lovely dog, and has become legend falling/jumping/slipping from the catwalk. I often find myself wondering how the hell she got away with it!
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That was a tear jerker. Well written.
She's running in the long grass now though.
Or panting in the shade.
RIP.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Crag27 feed doesn't seem to be working so here's a copy of my latest
https://27crags.com/climbers/shark/blog/it-s-fun-to-work-at-the-bmc
Having now had 5 months under my belt as a BMC employee I thought I would write a about my experiences so far.
I started in January in the new role of Commercial Partnerships Manager to identify ways to improve revenues or reduce costs against a background of potential reduced funding by Sport England. The broad job description meant that I was able to look at most areas of the BMC work. Having been a volunteer for the Peak Area and a representative on National Council I was well primed (in theory) for the role. The commercial skills I had where what was needed for the job. However, whilst I was going to work with people who shared a love of climbing and the outdoors there was a cultural mis-match between my entrepreneurial background and that of a bureaucratic not-for-profit organisation where caution tends to reign, and change and experiment is treated with suspicion. One of my business friends said I would leave after the first month. I thought it more likely I would get sacked for being a nuisance.
Because the BMC is engaged in a lot of activities with everyone having different ideas of what should or shouldn’t be done there was a risk of getting pulled this way and that, getting bogged down and end up not achieving anything. Given that the role was advertised as a 12 month contract at the interview I proposed that I would spend the first four months investigating potential commercial improvements and at the end of that period set out those projects where I felt I could make the most difference in the remaining eight months of my tenure.
In life generally, getting things done is my primary motivation. However, making changes or doing new things isn’t easy at the BMC. Most people in the Office where generous with their time to discuss their areas and offer views on how things might be changed for the better. As I explored things to get some ideas moving I realised I required backing from a Committee, the Exec or in one case National Council and the Membership. Quite often where I saw opportunities others saw difficulties. In retrospect this is hardly surprising when a lot of the ideas have already been explored years ago, typically enshrined in a half-forgotten committee paper, but then somehow never seeming to be followed through.
I’d be lying if I said there weren’t some very low points but I am pleased to report that things are much better now and the job no longer feels like a battle. Some changes I advocated (to anyone who would listen) are starting to happen and hopefully will snowball and encourage more changes. I now also have identified a set of achievable projects with tangible outcomes that I am now confident of putting to bed by the end of the year.
Recently I decided to modify my style a bit. After all, the BMC is not a business I run or own and the sense of mission that you tend to have as a volunteer needs to be tempered at times. Rab Carringtons sage advice “to calm down” is something that I have recently attempted to do both for my own sake and those around me.
So what insights can I share? First of all despite being involved with the BMC for 6 years it was still a bewildering task to unpick what the BMC does and how it works. Although the office only has 33 employees, as a volunteer organisation the real numbers working for the BMC runs into the hundreds and the total membership is 83,000. Not only do we have a relationship with the membership and volunteers but also a myriad of outside bodies most notably Clubs, Mountain Training and Sport England. Finally there is functional support from the Marketing and Communications, IT, Finance, and HR individuals and teams
Over the years the BMC has organically accumulated and developed varied work activities in an unstructured way. I think it is fair to say that its current makeup is the equivalent of half a dozen bodies melded into one. Mainly it is a representative body except in one area (indoor competition climbing) where it is a Governing body. It is also a Membership organisation, a Quality Assurance training body, a technical advice body, a campaigning and lobbying body, an events and competitions organiser, a publisher, a retailer, a specialist travel insurance business and a landowner. Did I mention we have three charities? And, I think, 23 committees. Phew! These varied activities are sometimes at odds with each other in terms of stage of development, priority, ambition, scope, pace, direction and goals and there are vocal adherents and detractors for the different areas in the membership who differ on where the priorities should lie.
Unpicking how decisions really get made through the Committees, the Executive board and National Council was a further puzzle. Putting it mildly the pace of decision making is much slower than I am used to. This is more a fault of the structure than the people. Dave Turnbull, the Chief Executive is the only salaried staff member on the Executive board and National Council. The rest of the Executive board and National Council members are dedicated volunteers that typically convene once a quarter. The volunteers should be applauded for giving up their time and there some amazing and accomplished people involved. Of course they interact between meetings but as part time volunteers can’t be expected to be immersed fulltime in all aspects of the workings of this complex institution.
I experienced this first hand as a National Council representative for the Peak when I was acutely aware that I was voting on a range of issues which I did not fully understand the context and implications, especially to begin with. Without fuller understanding, the quality of debate and decision making is hampered. Typically as an NC rep you are deluged with a variety of lengthy papers by email before the meeting to digest. The agenda was typically large and so time pressured. People naturally had their own personal hobby horses that were important to them (and why not!). There was a tendency to overly focus on procedural matters which, for me, was a turn off. It might be a democratic structure but was it the best and most effective way to decide things? I didn’t think I was achieving anything in the role and therefore stepped down after two years when there was somebody I could hand over to (thank you Dave Brown).
So, whither the BMC? We now have an independent governing review underway which is examining our decision making (ie governing) structure as well as the organisational structure. When the recommendations emerge I am hoping they will be bold rather than expedient.
My view is that an element of disentanglement is well overdue perhaps by a re-organising into semi-autonomous entities that can forge their own identities, goals, plans and destinies whilst still being supported by and reporting into BMC central. This should allow the overall organisation to grow and develop and achieve more and be better understood in a positive improvement culture where developing new ideas and making changes is not so bloody difficult. Overall the organisation should benefit from a structure that empowers local, nimbler decision-making based on clearer central goals.
I can only guess at what the specific recommendations of the Governing Review might be, but following investigation, my current hope is that we should aim to convert the BMC to a charity with different subsidiary bodies including a limited liability commercial subsidiary. Not only would there be potentially transformational benefits to our finances from charitable status but also it would crystallise our already predominantly altruistic purposes for the greater good of over 2 million climbers and upland hillwalkers above and beyond the narrower remit of representing member interests thereby raising our ambitions. If this was recommended I think the charity aims should include a pro-participation statement. These would be controversial matters, for at least some of the members, and consulting and communicating will be a big challenge if we are to successfully make the transition. Despite these considerable cultural hurdles if the benefits are so obvious for the BMC then we are just shirking responsibility not to try, otherwise we are holding back our potential to achieve greater things.
When I started climbing I was an avid reader of Mountain magazine where Jim Collins a US climber featured regularly. Aside from being an accomplished climber he wrote a hugely influential business book based on extensive research and analysis called “From Good to Great” which charted how companies transition from being good companies to great ones. The Governance review offers the tantalising hope that the BMC might also make a significant step towards this transition.
(This is a personal blog and not an official BMC piece. The views expressed are my own and it was written in my own time.)
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Can you explain a bitmorewhatthismeans:
" the charity aims should include a pro-participation statement"
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Can you explain a bitmorewhatthismeans:
" the charity aims should include a pro-participation statement"
To qualify for charitable status an organisation must state objectives that meet the requirements of the Charity Commission so an example would be Cycling Touring Club (now Cycling UK!) first charitable object being to: "Promote community participation in healthy recreation by promoting the amateur sport of cycling.." (http://beta.charitycommission.gov.uk/charity-details/?regid=1147607&subid=0) ie promoting participation in the sport for the sake of general health, enjoyment and well being.
The same sort of pro-participation object(ive) could apply for climbing and upland hillwalking and mountaineering and would be an obvious thing to state if going down the route of converting to a charity. Currently the rub is whilst we represent the general climbing and hill walking communities we are also a member organisation representing member interests. Which comes first when push comes to shove? Its not clear. Some members don't want to promote climbing and hillwalking to the non-climbing and non-hillwalking public and confine BMC activities to promoting member interest only, or mainly.
To commit to being a charity with honesty and integrity would mean subsuming member interests to the general good. I hope that makes sense? I don't think I have expressed it very clearly.
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No the explanation is perfectly clear. Unfortunately it's what I thought it might be.
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No the explanation is perfectly clear. Unfortunately it's what I thought it might be.
So not the route you want then
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No I think it's a terrible idea.
1. I see the primary role of the BMC is access, bringing more people into the activities is counter productive to that aim.
2. Why change the remit of the BMC? It serves a function (or a few functions) now you want to give it a different function. If a private company goes into new markets it's to make money for its shareholders who benefits from this move?
3. What's to stop the charitable remit taking over? I mean, there must be restrictions on what a charity can do so whilst the promotion remit will benefit from charitable status will other functions need to be ring fenced so won't benefit from that status anyway?
4. I'm sceptical how much 'good' a charity of this sort can do. You'll promote climbing etc by making it more accessible, who'll take it up as a result of this? A few more middle class people will tag it onto their other interests like triathlons and Tough Mudder. Will we have a healthier nation as a result? There's an obesity epidemic that needs addressing, something like this is window dressing at best.
5. Usual selfish reasons about there being too few decent crags so bringing more people into the sport will have a detrimental effect on my enjoyment.
6. What happens if this doesn't go ahead?
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You make a lot of assumptions there Teaboy, if you don't mind me saying. Other organisations successfully manage to balance what appear to be competing aims, in this case recreation and conservation.
I'll counter your point 4 by saying that research shows that exposing young people to the outdoors at a critical time in their development has a strong correlation with them remaining active for the rest of their lives, with big positive impacts on their health, and the value to them of wild spaces. Promoting that in itself would be a worthy charitable aim with benefit to society as a whole and to the individuals concerned.
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Thanks for taking the time to set out your thoughts. :thumbsup:
1. I see the primary role of the BMC is access, bringing more people into the activities is counter productive to that aim.
First of all you specifically asked about pro-participation and so I answered just that. Expanding on that a charity typically has multiple objectives. Cycling UK has four. If converting to a charity then yes, facilitating access would be top of the list for the BMC. I also see those two objectives as complementary rather than counterproductive. Facilitating access allows more choice of venues for participants thereby spreading the load and putting the BMC in a position to help educate participants in responsible recreational use of those environments and that includes education of awareness of options away from honeypot locations.
Pro-participation also seeks to reduce barriers (perceived of otherwise) to certain groups participate ie women, youth, race. Increasing more participants should also increase funds to care for those environments. Participation doesn’t just have to be on the crags but also at indoor venues too. At a more fundamental level if you enjoy an activity that you find life fulfilling why wouldn’t you want others to have the opportunity to enjoy that activity rather than just the lucky, select few.
2. Why change the remit of the BMC? It serves a function (or a few functions) now you want to give it a different function. If a private company goes into new markets it's to make money for its shareholders who benefits from this move?
Because the remit of the BMC has some contradictory elements which can confuse decision making. I think pro-participation is a good thing for reasons stated above. It doesn’t have to be one of the charity objectives but it could be. However, the acceptance that the BMC is working for the general good of all climbers and hillwalkers (as we in fact already state we do) rather than just members would have to be adopted to be accepted as a charity. As members are climbers and hillwalkers anyway the two by and large go hand in hand. Pro-participation is an area where there is arguably a divergence. As for the financial benefits in my proposed structure there is potentially £300Kpa of gift aid reclaim on member subscriptions, better VAT reclaim (potentially £50Kpa) and tax free gifting of commercially generated profits into the charity.
3. What's to stop the charitable remit taking over? I mean, there must be restrictions on what a charity can do so whilst the promotion remit will benefit from charitable status will other functions need to be ring fenced so won't benefit from that status anyway?
In effect we are already mainly a charity in the stated mission of the 2013-17 strategic plan in our stated aims. Of the current strategy the top three out of the four are charitable:
- Negotiate access improvements and promote cliff and mountain conservation.
- Promote and advise on good practice, facilities, training and equipment.
- Support events and specialist programmes including youth and excellence.
- Provide services and information for members
If converting to a charity (as a whole) the charitable remit (whatever remit is decided) would take over. Sometimes this fundamental aspect hasn’t been fully addressed by member organisations converting to a charity and has caused problems for the organisation and the Charity Commission. With a charity remit (whatever it might be) there is clearer direction for the BMC which isn’t the case now to say the least. In y view it takes the organisation and the members in the ‘right direction’ as a philanthropic, altruistic and public spirited organisation with a clearer mission for the future
4. I'm sceptical how much 'good' a charity of this sort can do. You'll promote climbing etc by making it more accessible, who'll take it up as a result of this? A few more middle class people will tag it onto their other interests like triathlons and Tough Mudder. Will we have a healthier nation as a result? There's an obesity epidemic that needs addressing, something like this is window dressing at best.
We can try with this aim. If we fail you will be if not happy, then content ;-)
5. Usual selfish reasons about there being too few decent crags so bringing more people into the sport will have a detrimental effect on my enjoyment.
I'm sure that Fiona would agree that you would be happier sharing the love rather than being a curmudgeonly misanthrope. :jab:
6. What happens if this doesn't go ahead?
There are many structural alternatives that would improve decision making perhaps leaving some fundamental issues unresolved. One such compromise is to leave the BMC as it is but channel more activity through our existing charity subsidiaries (ACT, Land & Property Trust, Mountain Heritage) but that would be a compromise not making the most of the potential. The structure I propose is what I perceive as the best way but politics is the art of the possible not necessarily what is best. I predict wholesale conversion to a charity wont go ahead as it will be perceived to be too difficult to persuade the membership of the merits. I hope I am proved wrong
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You make a lot of assumptions there Teaboy, if you don't mind me saying. Other organisations successfully manage to balance what appear to be competing aims, in this case recreation and conservation.
4 of my 6 points contained questions, the other two are my personal opinion so not that many assumptions
I'll counter your point 4 by saying that research shows that exposing young people to the outdoors at a critical time in their development has a strong correlation with them remaining active for the rest of their lives, with big positive impacts on their health, and the value to them of wild spaces. Promoting that in itself would be a worthy charitable aim with benefit to society as a whole and to the individuals concerned.
I don't doubt the veracity of this statement but do I think this is an inefficient and poorly targeted way of getting the country active. How strong is the correlation (when I was a kid I went on a couple of residential outdoor pursuits courses with school, as far as I know I was the only person out of 25 who carried on being active in the outdoors), so how much exposure is required and are the people who end up being active outdoors people who would have carried on being active anyway (in some sport or other).
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From memory, we're talking about around 75%, so a huge impact. From your personal anecdote, are you saying none of your classmates walk, run, cycle or do the gardening at all these days? If you asked them, would they put any value on the countryside and fresh air, and having access to it? The effects of having an immersive outdoor experience when young seem to be quite holistic, rather than generating a large volume of climbers, walkers or paddlers.
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Off the top of my head here is what a list of potential charitable objectives for the BMC might look like:
1. Work with other outdoor users, landowners and bodies to promote public access and the conservation and protection of the environment
2. Promote responsible, best practice in the hills and mountains and at indoor walls
3. Facilitate education and ensure high quality standards of training schemes related to hillwalking, climbing and mountaineering working with the Mountain Training Board
4. Promote participation in healthy recreation by promoting the amateur sport of hillwalking, climbing and mountaineering in all its forms and work towards removing barriers to participation faced by under-represented groups
5. To guide the work of a regional volunteer network of individuals and walking and climbing clubs to achieve the above
6. To represent the national interests of the walking and climbing community and influence legislation to achieve the above
How would you feel about a list of objectives like that?
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Thanks for the blog about your work at the BMC shark. I found it pretty enlightening as to what the structure is.
Afraid to say though that I disagree with having an objective of increasing participation. Mainly because I want to know that my subs go towards things I feel are important- mainly access etc... I understand that lots of people pay subs and we will all have slightly or possibly wildly different wishes but mostly they will be to do with that particular sub set of climbing and hill walking.
I struggle to see what benefit promoting climbing and hill walking has for me? I understand the benefit to the wider society but I pay taxes (and am happy to pay more in taxes) for that element. I think despite Danm's comments that it would mean a dilution of what the BMC does and would personally prefer to not have promoting participation as an aim.
Thanks Dave
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
For example.. Point 2. ''Promote responsible, best practice in the hills and mountains and at indoor walls''.
There's already an alphabeti spaghetti of organisations other than the BMC promoting best practice in the hills, mountains and indoor walls. BMG / MTA (for mia, mic, spa, ml)/ UIAA / IFSC / UIAGM / CWA / Ramblers assoc / National Parks / Long Distance Walkers Assoc / Fell runners clubs / numerous industry technical notices and best practice information - for e.g. the Petzl foundation / SAIS / Alpine Club / Climber's club / Scottish Mountaineering Club / Irish Mountaineering Club / local clubs / Mountaineering Ireland / Mountaineering Council of Scotland..
There's never been more information on best practice.
Regarding the BMC and access.. Lived in N.America for 4 years and found access issues usually dealt with quite successfully at a local level without an overseeing national organisation like the BMC. However in my experience Canada has more than it's share of practical can-do people, due in large part I think to the geography making it blatantly obvious to people that they have to be more self-reliant and reliant on each other. The typical climber in the UK in comparison seems more accepting of committees and waiting for someone 'in authority' to tell them what they can and can't do - makes sense in such a densely populated country, when you're often likely to be upsetting someone somewhere for recreating on the land.
Things I'd most like the BMC to do:
Organise international meets, exchange visits, youth meets,
Write good guidebooks
Provide specialist insurance
Lobby decision-makers
Deal with access issues - but increase the number of access staff for Wales (and England but I'm not familiar with the setup there) - but I'd just as happily see this responsibility transferred out to local groups.
Tech advice - probably worth keeping, but not growing
BMCtv - not bothered
Competitions - it's time to split away from the BMC and have an NGB for the organised competition side of climbing, and a members organisation representing the wholly different interests of the rest of climbing.
Promoting climbing/mountaineering beyond the scope of meets/exchanges/youth meets - I don't think they should.
So a members organisation rather than an NGB for me. Climbing isn't a sport is it. Except for the olympics and indoor comps, which are great and all but an anomaly and not representative of the rest of climbing.
Regards Dan's point about participation in outdoor recreation promoting health. I'm sure it does. But we have Public Health England funded by the taxpayer and they can't even get a proper sugar policy through government. It shouldn't be the BMC's role to spend money fighting an obesity epidemic. Part of the PHE report on obesity states the importance of banning advertising of junk food to children - especially drinks containing refined sugar.... How about the BMC play its part by refusing any sponsorship of R.e.d.b.u.l.l. via Shauna's latest beanie, chalkbag and sweatbands...?
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
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I struggle to see what benefit promoting climbing and hill walking has for me? I understand the benefit to the wider society but I pay taxes (and am happy to pay more in taxes) for that element. I think despite Danm's comments that it would mean a dilution of what the BMC does and would personally prefer to not have promoting participation as an aim.
Thanks Dave
Thanks for your views. Less of your taxes are going towards things like the National Parks. The third sector of which the BMC is part can play a part in making some shortfalls. The more people involved in our activities then the more voices we have.
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I've not been following this, just caught up.
I agree with Shark, for all the reasons he has laid out.
All the arguments against can be summed up with "overcrowding ".
I think you're going to get that anyway and the BMC, or a stronger, bigger version of it; is the best way of regulating and educating that growing population.
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I've not been following this, just caught up.
I agree with Shark, for all the reasons he has laid out.
All the arguments against can be summed up with "overcrowding ".
I think you're going to get that anyway and the BMC, or a stronger, bigger version of it; is the best way of regulating and educating that growing population.
Sorry, think you have missed my point about not wanting to promote participation! I dont see that all the arguments about not wanting to promote participation can be summed up with overcrowding at all.
Personally I just want my subs to be used in the most effective way to gain the most "bang for buck" to promote things I value in climbing. More people taking part is not something I value and therefore I don't want it promoted.
Dave
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Does bigger really mean more influential?
On a local level, fell running clubs seem to do OK securing access and working with landowners.
Indeed, as I've pointed out before, the Fell Runner's Association (6,000 members) do not promote participation (on environmental grounds):
The Environment
Fell running is perhaps unique amongst sports in that it does not seek to attract ever-greater numbers of participants. The reason for this policy is that we have to balance our sporting interests with the impact on the environment. The sad fact is that the hills of Britain simply will not cope with ever-increasing pounding of feet. Protecting the environment is one of our primary aims. We continually liaise with agencies and landowners over access and racing over environmentally sensitive areas. The Fell Runners Association will continue to protect your interests in these and many other matters.
http://www.fellrunner.org.uk/join-the-fra.php
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This is another form of Nimbyism. The Peak National Park (and presumably the other National Parks) was set up with the primary aim of providing open-air recreation for the public which is an implicitly pro-participation goal. That is the public - not a self-selected clique who would prefer that others didn't clutter their playground.
Getting more people in the hills is a good thing and if we do that then helping to manage the impacts is a complementary responsibility.
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This is another form of Nimbyism. The Peak National Park (and presumably the other National Parks) was set up with the primary aim of providing open-air recreation for the public which is an implicitly pro-participation goal. That is the public - not a self-selected clique who would prefer that others didn't clutter their playground.
Getting more people in the hills is a good thing and if we do that then helping to manage the impacts is a complementary responsibility.
It’s not.
There are loads of ways already, more than ever, to get involved in the outdoors. I don’t think there’s a need to promote it further and I can't for a second imagine why the BMC membership would want it.
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Wikipedia states that the two statutory purposes of the National Parks are "To conserve and enhance the natural and cultural heritage of the area, and to promote understanding and enjoyment of the special qualities of the national park by the public." I don't see this as being implicitly pro-participation, in fact it could easily be said the being pro-participation harms the first aim above. Same as in climbing.
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This is another form of Nimbyism. The Peak National Park (and presumably the other National Parks) was set up with the primary aim of providing open-air recreation for the public which is an implicitly pro-participation goal. That is the public - not a self-selected clique who would prefer that others didn't clutter their playground.
Getting more people in the hills is a good thing and if we do that then helping to manage the impacts is a complementary responsibility.
It’s not.
There are loads of ways already, more than ever, to get involved in the outdoors. I don’t think there’s a need to promote it further and I can't for a second imagine why the BMC membership would want it.
Well I have set out my reasons and I am a BMC member
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Wikipedia states that the two statutory purposes of the National Parks are "To conserve and enhance the natural and cultural heritage of the area, and to promote understanding and enjoyment of the special qualities of the national park by the public." I don't see this as being implicitly pro-participation, in fact it could easily be said the being pro-participation harms the first aim above. Same as in climbing.
I am going on what Henry said about the establishment of the Peak District National Park (the first National Park) which was gifted to the public (I forget by whom) for the specific purpose of public recreation. Would be strange if it has a slightly different remit to the other later Parks.
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Wikipedia states that the two statutory purposes of the National Parks are "To conserve and enhance the natural and cultural heritage of the area, and to promote understanding and enjoyment of the special qualities of the national park by the public." I don't see this as being implicitly pro-participation, in fact it could easily be said the being pro-participation harms the first aim above. Same as in climbing.
I am going on what Henry said about the establishment of the Peak District National Park (the first National Park) which was gifted to the public (I forget by whom) for the specific purpose of public recreation. Would be strange if it has a slightly different remit to the other later Parks.
I understand the wording of the National Parks and Access to the Countryside Act 1949 says "to confer on the Nature Conservancy and local authorities powers for the establishment and maintenance of nature reserves ; to make further provision for the recording, creation, maintenance and improvement of public paths and for securing access to open country, and to amend the law relating to rights of way; to confer further powers for preserving and enhancing natural beauty ; and for matters connected with the purposes aforesaid."
I read the access part of that to mean that people have legal right of access to open country, and that's not the same as increasing participation.
As I've said many time, in climbing I very much doubt that the increased lobbying and volunteering power of a hugely increased cohort will counteract the negative aspects of increased numbers. Basically it's a hell of a gamble to make.
There's also more to it than numbers. It could be said that if increased participation just boosts indoors numbers but many of them rarely go outside then it's all gravy. The problem remains though that if and when they do go outdoors they're going to go to honeypot locations, and as inexperienced users are more likely to trash the joint climbing on damp rock, parking badly etc etc. Also, generally it's inevitable that increased numbers are going to impact on popular sites pretty badly. You can develop as many esoteric venues are you like but the famous crags form such a huge part of the cultural history of climbing that traffic there is inevitable. Even the best marketing job isn't going to get all those climbers to make a beeline for the unfashionable unfrequented crags.
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Even the best marketing job isn't going to get all those climbers to make a beeline for the unfashionable unfrequented crags.
Bolt them and people will come :worms:
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The modern wisdom in my line of work (public libraries) is that it's less effort and cost to retain existing occasional users who're at risk of leaving altogether than it is to recruit current non-users, but has the same result.
So I reckon that rather than extolling the virtues of climbing to the general public the BMC should just mount smear campaigns against road biking, fell running, surfing, DIY, parenthood etc.
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So I reckon that rather than extolling the virtues of climbing to the general public the BMC should just mount smear campaigns against road biking, fell running, surfing, DIY, parenthood etc.
Along the right lines with regard to fell runners :sick: but road biking, surfing and DIY (RBSD) has the opposite effect which has cost me many belayers climbing buddies. We should support the RBSD community and their rights as an offsetting carbon trading karmic rebalancing exercise as it gets those participants away from the hills and crags.
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It's all very well grandstanding about not promoting outdoor rec, but I suspect the Fell Running Association would rapidly change their tune if faced with steadily ageing participation and falling numbers.
We all base our perceptions of 'busy' and 'quiet' based on when and how we got into climbing. I'm not aware of any baseline data, but anecdotal evidence seems to suggest a lot of climbing areas are quieter than they were twenty years ago. At honeypot sport and bouldering locations the opposite is obviously true. Either way, what remains either way is that use is not evenly spread - increased participation seems to mean there are a few more mental busy days rather than no quiet times. The busy days have always happened and the savvy have always gone elsewhere.
I feel the argument against promotion, but I don't think it bears much scrutiny.
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Then the savvy come back to the plantation midweek and find broken holds due to huge PSYCHE teams up from the big smoke sieging stuff in the damp.
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Bloody Londoners, coming over here...
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This is another form of Nimbyism. The Peak National Park (and presumably the other National Parks) was set up with the primary aim of providing open-air recreation for the public which is an implicitly pro-participation goal. That is the public - not a self-selected clique who would prefer that others didn't clutter their playground.
Getting more people in the hills is a good thing and if we do that then helping to manage the impacts is a complementary responsibility.
Participation by people you like you mean - ramblers, climbers, birdwatchers... and not trails bike riders. I mean why would increased participation in trail-bike riding on bridleways be a problem :-\
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Well for a start your whole blog post reads much like a decent argument for a smaller, sleeker organisation not a larger one.
I question the need for the BMC to grow. It needs to get better at making decisions and acting. Something which large organisations are notoriously bad at doing. So why grow larger?
Your main (only) reason seems to be - so the BMC can make more money (in the face of reduced funding). Which for a commercial consultant makes sense as it's what you've been employed to do. But bottom line is it's just a climbing/mountaineering member organsiation. Not a commercial business that *must* grow or die. And your/the BMC's effort to grow participation/members/revenue risks negatively affecting the pastime (not sport) of climbing and I'm not in favour of that - all I care about is climbing and our access to it, not its member organisation's desire to be bigger.
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Does bigger really mean more influential?
On a local level, fell running clubs seem to do OK securing access and working with landowners.
Indeed, as I've pointed out before, the Fell Runner's Association (6,000 members) do not promote participation (on environmental grounds):
The Environment
Fell running is perhaps unique amongst sports in that it does not seek to attract ever-greater numbers of participants. The reason for this policy is that we have to balance our sporting interests with the impact on the environment. The sad fact is that the hills of Britain simply will not cope with ever-increasing pounding of feet. Protecting the environment is one of our primary aims. We continually liaise with agencies and landowners over access and racing over environmentally sensitive areas. The Fell Runners Association will continue to protect your interests in these and many other matters.
http://www.fellrunner.org.uk/join-the-fra.php
This is perfect; for years I've been looking for a reason not to go fell running.
Reading some off this stuff, from people I know well is depressing. You want climbing to be fightclub. There is a phrase for this, something about eating cake whilst looking at cake.
How did you all get into climbing? Were you inexperienced once?
And are you getting your kids into climbing? You must feel pretty guilty about that? OR let me guess, they aren't allowed to tell anyone what they do at weekends...
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Does bigger really mean more influential?
This is perfect; for years I've been looking for a reason not to go fell running.
Reading some off this stuff, from people I know well is depressing. You want climbing to be fightclub. There is a phrase for this, something about eating cake whilst looking at cake.
How did you all get into climbing? Were you inexperienced once?
And are you getting your kids into climbing? You must feel pretty guilty about that? OR let me guess, they aren't allowed to tell anyone what they do at weekends...
Sorry, I really don't understand your point here. Yes of course I would like my son to get into climbing and of course I had to start somewhere. I don't see that has much to do with my not wanting the BMC to actively promote participation in climbing. I want the BMC to do as much as possible with my subs towards the things I value it doing rather than spreading itself thinner and getting bigger. As Pete said earlier I think it should concentrate on doing a good job of representing members interests rather than getting more members, raising more money and becoming bigger.
To me this has nothing to do with the crags becoming busier or overcrowded. That may or may not happen anyway. It is just about what I think the BMC should be doing, which is again in my opinion representing members interests
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Well for a start your whole blog post reads much like a decent argument for a smaller, sleeker organisation not a larger one.
I question the need for the BMC to grow. It needs to get better at making decisions and acting. Something which large organisations are notoriously bad at doing. So why grow larger?
Your main (only) reason seems to be - so the BMC can make more money (in the face of reduced funding). Which for a commercial consultant makes sense as it's what you've been employed to do. But bottom line is it's just a climbing/mountaineering member organsiation. Not a commercial business that *must* grow or die. And your/the BMC's effort to grow participation/members/revenue risks negatively affecting the pastime (not sport) of climbing and I'm not in favour of that - all I care about is climbing and our access to it, not its member organisation's desire to be bigger.
Sleeker yes. Smaller no. I covered the wide ranging remit the BMC has and that it was several organisations melded into one. I think it is stretched currently to cover what is asked and expected of it. Currently decision making is slow and innovation stifled by its structure mainly. It could be both bigger and more agile. An organisation of say 50 is still not large and could be far less bureaucratic.
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I think it is stretched currently to cover what is asked and expected of it.
The point Davo, myself and others are making is that it isn't expected to do all the things it tries to. I don't expect it to do half of what it currently tries to do.
Just concentrate on being a good members organisation - one that sorts the shit out in climbing which needs sorting, such as access, lobbying decision makers, insurance and promoting good quality meets for members to experience the world of climbing in all its flavours. Forget trying to become the voice of climbing because the BMC isn't that. Climbing is far bigger than the BMC and still at bottom an activity which attracts self-reliant types who shun authority/organisations.
Cowboyhat. Waa? I got into climbing because I live in N.Wales and I have a strong adventurous spirit. The BMC had zero influence on my discovering climbing - I'd never heard of them until I'd been climbing a few years. I honestly don't really care if people who don't have that spirit never find climbing. I don't begrudge anyone who discovers the joy of the outdoors with *some* help from the BMC. Just don't think it needs to become the proselytiser-in-chief because that won't do the pastime any favours and it isn't in climbers' interests for numbers to grow greatly. Shark's and the BMC's 'expansion/increasing participation' line is, for me, not much more than self-justification by people who like to do work administering a large organisation - aka bureaucrats - for existing and being busy.
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I think it is stretched currently to cover what is asked and expected of it.
The point Davo, myself and others are making is that it isn't expected to do all the things it tries to. I don't expect it to do half of what it currently tries to do.
But that is what has been asked of it via the democratic structure. My experience is that very little new or major is initiated by the BMC Office who are rather (too much) like the Civil Service in carrying out the wishes of their masters. The Memorandum of Articles and the culture of the Office is to carry out the express wishes of the Volunteer Exec Board and National Council. Feel free to insert Yes Prime Minister clip of choice to make the obvious rebuttal.
Just concentrate on being a good members organisation - one that sorts the shit out in climbing which needs sorting, such as access, lobbying decision makers, insurance and promoting good quality meets for members to experience the world of climbing in all its flavours.
Does it not do these things already? Just because they are your preferences of things that need sorting doesn't mean other things arent important to other members. There will be a new poll of the membership (the last was in 2010) that will aim to determine and prioritise those things that are perceived as important by the membership.
Forget trying to become the voice of climbing because the BMC isn't that. Climbing is far bigger than the BMC and still at bottom an activity which attracts self-reliant types who shun authority/organisations.
Why are they not the voice of climbing? Who would you have instead - UKC? And of course climbing is bigger than the BMC - that is a trite thing to say. The BMC serves climbing not the other way round.
Yes I would have counted myself as a generally anti-authoritarian type who, due to arrested development, was well into my mid-40's before seeing the value of the BMC, recognising that the only way to achieve a voice outside the bubble of climbing is through an organisation. Whether a Trade Union or the BMC an organisation can gather gather and mobilise resources in a way that individuals cant. My judgement of how good that organisation is: how clear they are in their purpose, how capable they are at gathering resources (money, peoples time) and then how efficient they are at deploying the resources to the greatest effect. I have spelled out the areas where there is room for improvement.
Shark's and the BMC's 'expansion/increasing participation' line is, for me, not much more than self-justification by people who like to do work administering a large organisation - aka bureaucrats - for existing and being busy.
Rather ungenerous for you to characterise those involved in the BMC in this way, particularly the Volunteers. For every vocal Bob Pettigrew who revels in the bureaucracy and politics there are a score of Ru's and Rob Greenwood's who would rather be ledge shuffling in Wales than paper shuffling in Manchester. They are in it for the greater good rather than its own sake.
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That last point isn't aimed at every volunteer Shark, it's aimed at a specific type of person who enjoys building/growing/administering complicated organisations and the politics that goes with them. Not the typical volunteer, who I have plenty of respect for.
I come from a background where if you want to get something done, in any area of life, you get on and make it happen yourself. Need a guidebook? - write it. Routes need re-equipping? - do it. Need bolts? - set-up/support a local bolt fund. See a new sport route/new sport crag? - equip it and climb it. Access issues? - approach people and try to solve them. I also do really appreciate the support on offer from organisations.
Perhaps I'm just a bit sick of hearing about the BMC recently. It's something that I think should just be in the background and not something I want to hear much about or distract me from my selfish precious time spent going out enjoying climbing.
Quite simply I think the BMC is probably a bit too large, a bit too complicated and a bit too cumbersome; is trying to do and be too many different things; and climbing doesn't actually 'need' what you're saying the BMC should be. Climbing's a pretty simple activity really when you strip away all the bullshit surrounding it.
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The BMC is mostly run by volunteers though and I'm struggling to think of any staff or volunteers who "enjoys building/growing/administering complicated organisations and the politics that goes with them".
Yes of course it's easier to get things done on your own. No consultation or consensus. And hats off to your equipping work. But a lot of the representation and collaboration the BMC does to other National bodies and interest groups is beyond individual capability especially if done in a joined up way.
Yes climbing doesn't need the BMC but I bet it would be more appreciated if it did suddenly disappear
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Personally I just want my subs to be used in the most effective way to gain the most "bang for buck" to promote things I value in climbing. More people taking part is not something I value and therefore I don't want it promoted.
Dave
Is this really what you think? If a friend said to you "can i come climbing with you?"would you tell them "no, more people taking part in climbing is not something I value".
I imagine you wouldn't say that instead you'd introduce them to climbing. So why is your friend allowed to have climbing promoted to them but not "other" people? What kind of other person starting climbing specifically do you have a problem with?
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Shark, why would you want a larger BMC? What's so good about getting larger? What about as above a trimmed down organisation with less responsibilities?
Why would you not? Personally I want the organisation that represents us (ie all climbers and hillwalkers) to be as an influential and active as possible in representing and promoting our interests - I certainly don't want to constrain it. The more resources, the more good things can be achieved.
Does bigger really mean more influential?
On a local level, fell running clubs seem to do OK securing access and working with landowners.
Indeed, as I've pointed out before, the Fell Runner's Association (6,000 members) do not promote participation (on environmental grounds):
The Environment
Fell running is perhaps unique amongst sports in that it does not seek to attract ever-greater numbers of participants. The reason for this policy is that we have to balance our sporting interests with the impact on the environment. The sad fact is that the hills of Britain simply will not cope with ever-increasing pounding of feet. Protecting the environment is one of our primary aims. We continually liaise with agencies and landowners over access and racing over environmentally sensitive areas. The Fell Runners Association will continue to protect your interests in these and many other matters.
http://www.fellrunner.org.uk/join-the-fra.php
Guess that's why I never got into fell running then. Which I'm sure the fell running community is glad about.
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not much more than self-justification by people who like to do work administering a large organisation - aka bureaucrats - for existing and being busy.
Got any evidence to back up this bureaucrats claim?
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The BMC is a bit too large, a bit too complicated and a bit too cumbersome; is trying to do and be too many different things;
In answer to this:
Not too large for its remit
Yes it's too complicated and can be simplified
Yes too cumbersome
Would benefit from clearer and consistent goals
So some common ground \o/
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I know a few people in that world who love all the BMC committee stuff and the organisational bollocks. I'm sure you do too if you think about it.
So some common ground \o/
CROW land, you mean?
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Personally I just want my subs to be used in the most effective way to gain the most "bang for buck" to promote things I value in climbing. More people taking part is not something I value and therefore I don't want it promoted.
Dave
Is this really what you think? If a friend said to you "can i come climbing with you?"would you tell them "no, more people taking part in climbing is not something I value".
I imagine you wouldn't say that instead you'd introduce them to climbing. So why is your friend allowed to have climbing promoted to them but not "other" people? What kind of other person starting climbing specifically do you have a problem with?
That really is a bizarre way to interpret what I have written! I don't really see the link between my not wanting one of the BMC's aims to be promotion of climbing and my willingness to take a friend out climbing.
Just so I am clear, I am on a personal level happy to introduce people to climbing and my reasons for not wishing the BMC to promote climbing have nothing to do with the crags getting busier or not wanting others to enjoy the experience. It is simply that I think the BMC should concentrate on representing the interests of the members and sorting out things like access.
If you choose to interpret that to mean I wouldn't help someone learn how to climb or begrudge others getting into climbing then so be it.
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Davo
Take one aspect of pro-participation (by default) that the BMC is actively engaged in - equality (equity) and youth. Do you think that the BMCs attempts to remove barriers for underrepresented socia-economic, age, race or gender groups to encourage those groups (particularly at a time when locally funded outdoor education is on the decline) to participate in our great sport isn't a good thing? It's not a major part of our work but it is something we currently do.
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Hi Shark
Can't really argue against that being a good thing in general. If you don't mind me asking what exactly does the BMC do to remove barriers to under represented groups?
I suppose my issue is that I really don't care about whether more people get to climb or not. I think it is a great sport and am genuinely confused that everyone doesn't love it! However I don't see that we need to go out and promote it. Their are loads of ways for people to stay fit and healthy and in my opinion the responsibility for pushing a healthy lifestyle lies with govt organisations (which I repeat I am happy to pay more taxes to).
I just feel that the BMC should focus on its core role of representing the interests of members rather than allowing this focus to be diluted. I appreciate it is possible to interpret this as I am being selfish but it really isn't, I just think the best value for money comes with having a highly focused organisation that concentrates on the key jobs rather than worrying about the societal greater good.
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Articles here: www.thebmc.co.uk/cats/all/youth_equity
They are newish areas for the BMC paid for by Sport England funding (so not coming out of your subs) which also means that they are areas that are at at risk of being cut in the near future. Sport England is currently witholding all funding until they are satisfied with progress with the independent governance review.
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Personally I just want my subs to be used in the most effective way to gain the most "bang for buck" to promote things I value in climbing. More people taking part is not something I value and therefore I don't want it promoted.
Dave
Is this really what you think? If a friend said to you "can i come climbing with you?"would you tell them "no, more people taking part in climbing is not something I value".
I imagine you wouldn't say that instead you'd introduce them to climbing. So why is your friend allowed to have climbing promoted to them but not "other" people? What kind of other person starting climbing specifically do you have a problem with?
That really is a bizarre way to interpret what I have written! I don't really see the link between my not wanting one of the BMC's aims to be promotion of climbing and my willingness to take a friend out climbing.
Just so I am clear, I am on a personal level happy to introduce people to climbing and my reasons for not wishing the BMC to promote climbing have nothing to do with the crags getting busier or not wanting others to enjoy the experience. It is simply that I think the BMC should concentrate on representing the interests of the members and sorting out things like access.
If you choose to interpret that to mean I wouldn't help someone learn how to climb or begrudge others getting into climbing then so be it.
I realise my response was a bit tetchy but I did interpret what you posted like that.
I understand your argument but perhaps we're thinking about what promoting climbing in different ways.
I'm thinking about providing support to school clubs, helping indoor climbers get outdoors, providing advice to people who are venturing out to try trad/sport/bouldering/ice/alpine/mountain/hills etc for the first time, encouraging more minorities, youth, women, deprived background to get into climbing. These are things I see value in even though I might not get any direct benefit (although if some young beast has been on and chalked up my next trad onsight I'll not complain).
Perhaps Shark is thinking on further promotion than this? You do mention an aim being to increase participation - how might this be done?
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I'm thinking about providing support to school clubs, helping indoor climbers get outdoors, providing advice to people who are venturing out to try trad/sport/bouldering/ice/alpine/mountain/hills etc for the first time, encouraging more minorities, youth, women, deprived background to get into climbing. These are things I see value in even though I might not get any direct benefit (although if some young beast has been on and chalked up my next trad onsight I'll not complain).
Perhaps Shark is thinking on further promotion than this? You do mention an aim being to increase participation - how might this be done?
Not particularly. It was more the general principle than specifics. The specific pro-participation activities you suggest are all worthy things that BMC could and maybe should lead on and the sort of thing that may continue to be supported by Sport England (once their governance concerns have been addressed) and so not even a draw on member subs potentially.
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Davo
Take one aspect of pro-participation (by default) that the BMC is actively engaged in - equality (equity) and youth. Do you think that the BMCs attempts to remove barriers for underrepresented socia-economic, age, race or gender groups to encourage those groups (particularly at a time when locally funded outdoor education is on the decline) to participate in our great sport isn't a good thing? It's not a major part of our work but it is something we currently do.
Sounds wonderful Shark but your question could be placed in a similar category to 'Have you stopped beating your wife?', and 'Are you still a racist?'. It's leading and doesn't address the point being discussed.
The point isn't whether or not anyone is for or against 'people participating in our great activity', or 'equity'..
The point is what number targets the BMC has in mind for increased participation in our activity - which has access issues, environmental impact and limited capacity at its popular areas.
To a lesser degree is the question of how much time, money (Sport England funds acknowledged) and effort climbing's member organisation puts into encouraging those things over other things.
I'm assuming the BMC *does* have a target number in mind and a timescale, for increased participation in climbing...? Just like I assume you, as commercial consultant, have been given a target figure and timescale for 'increased commercial revenue'. Otherwise you could turn over an extra quid and have achieved your aim of 'increased revenue'; and one extra Asian teenager from Toxteth going to Stanage in the next five yeasrs would achieve the aim of increased participation from minority-represented groups.
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The point is what number targets the BMC has in mind for increased participation in our activity - which has access issues, environmental impact and limited capacity at its popular areas.
To a lesser degree is the question of how much time, money (Sport England funds acknowledged) and effort climbing's member organisation puts into encouraging those things over other things.
I'm assuming the BMC *does* have a target number in mind and a timescale, for increased participation in climbing...? Just like I assume you, as commercial consultant, have been given a target figure and timescale for 'increased commercial revenue'. Otherwise you could turn over an extra quid and have achieved your aim of 'increased revenue'; and one extra Asian teenager from Toxteth going to Stanage in the next five yeasrs would achieve the aim of increased participation from minority-represented groups.
Whoa Pete - you are jumping the gun here. We don't have pro-participation figures/targets. Why would we? - we don't have a pro-participation agenda. Some our activities but result in increased participation but would be a by-product not an aim.
Reeling back to my blog what I was saying was that if we converted to a charity it should be something to be considered as one part of a list of charitable objectives.
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please no more Scousers in the Cave.
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If the BMC becomes a charity - does that mean I'll see you chugging at Piccadilly - waving a collection tin in the faces of passing commuters?
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If the BMC becomes a charity - does that mean I'll see you chugging at Piccadilly - waving a collection tin in the faces of passing commuters?
The liberal, hand wringing, burghers of West Didsbury will be a handier and softer target
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If the BMC becomes a charity - does that mean I'll see you chugging at Piccadilly - waving a collection tin in the faces of passing commuters?
The liberal, hand wringing, burghers of West Didsbury will be a handier and softer target
Never works like that... most charity comes from working class areas. In West Didsbury the shutters will close, doors will be unanswered and distant mutters of discontent heard over the quinoa...