[Jacqusie]

After bouldering at Eagle Tor today we were made aware by a party that the owners of the Tor who live in the farmhouse below it, may now wish climbers not to climb there.

Just a note to say that if you are challenged when visiting the the Tor, please act with good grace and leave if asked to while the BMC access reps try to see what the situation is with the owner and try negotiate.

Also if you are visiting the Tor, please access it via the left hand path that curves round the tor and not the path that goes up and right past the farm house as the owners had previously requested.

cheers

Si

[andy_e]

 

Was at Cratcliffe today, are we allowed to park on the other side of the road to the layby, in the driveway? I had to park half-on and half-off of the road.

[Bonjoy]

Also if you are visiting the Tor, please access it via the left hand path that curves round the tor and not the path that goes up and right past the farm house as the owners had previously requested.



Si

Approaching from what direction? I don't know which path you mean. If coming from Birchover the LH path takes you under the farm. If approaching from Cratcliffe the LH path doesn't lead to the crag.

[fashionguru]

Hi Jon,

Think he got his left and rights mixed up.

It should be use the righthand path up the hill (from Birchover) not the lefthand which goes past the house and upsets the dog with the bouldering pads!!!!!!

Tony

[Jacqusie]

Approaching from what direction? I don't know which path you mean. If coming from Birchover the LH path takes you under the farm. If approaching from Cratcliffe the LH path doesn't lead to the crag.

Doh - yeah - sorry go right from the vicarage at Birchover round the path thats goes opposite cratcliffe - not left past the farm!

Si

[Bonjoy]

Cheers. I thought that was the official access but wasn't 100%

[fatdoc]

Would it help to insist that all access is up the hill from the cratcliffe side?, as opposed to the birchover side??
It would be gutting to lose this area, the kind accptance by the landovner than we can climb there is not a given right and I would hope the BMC could consider my suggestion, Ta!

[Bonjoy]

The approach from Birchover is a public footpath

[Rice Boy]

Spoke with the landowner on the Sat. She was keen to persue the BMC regarding access withdrawl but asked if we could spread the word and let people know that they would be asked to leave in future.

She was very approachable / reasonable but dead set on doing something.

[Bonjoy]

 What were her stated reasons?

[fashionguru]

Can they withdraw the access.

As JB has just pointed out the path up from Birchover is a public right of way and runs through the wooded area past all the bouldering.

So if we stick to the boulders adjacent to the path are we actually doing anything wrong.

Come to think of it the path we are asked not to take past the house is a public path so why are we cowtailing to a landowner who just wants no one on there land even if there is a public right over it.(I of course will do all it takes not to antagonize the owner)

I came across this problem in the Yorks Dales some years ago and I think I am right in saying that if a public right of way is not used in 12 years(i seam to recall) then it can be removed as such.

Is there a legal person between us that can shine some light on this.

[Rice Boy]

The kids are at an age where they want to piss about in the woods.

I think this is a cover and they want to create an isolated climbing venue for the kids, train them up, get them lapping Autumn by 10 and by thirteen have them taking the climbing world by storm with ascents of 8b's . . oh wait, old news!

[Jacqusie]

Would it help to insist that all access is up the hill from the cratcliffe side?, as opposed to the birchover side??
It would be gutting to lose this area, the kind accptance by the landovner than we can climb there is not a given right and I would hope the BMC could consider my suggestion, Ta!

 

Yes it may do - but the access that had been agreed would take people from the vicarage round to the access point on the cratcliffe side and bouldereres wouldn't need to go past the farm house. I think at the minute not passing the house is the best option all round and if challeneged - go with good grace.

Make no mistake - the owners can stop climbing there if they so wish and at the moment we would try not to antagonise the owners so that the BMC can sort the access issue out in time. What I would say is that we will try to find the reasons that the owners wishes to use to stop access and work with them in solving a happy medium - whatever that may be!

Cheers

Si

[fatdoc]

look,

sod the right of way to the crag shite.

end of the day the crag owners can, and may well will, stop access.

if the way up to the crag via the cratcliffe access causes no issues to the crag owners than we gotta go that way, if we lose this area it would be a disaster...

i still suggest that the BMC agree with this simple suggestion and publicy insist to climbers that access agreements have changed....


to me this is an obvious remedy to a potentially very serious issue....

am i missing the common sense point here??

we need to be seen to be sensible and to conform to the landowners concerns... dont we??

[Rice Boy]

we need to be seen to be sensible and to conform to the landowners concerns... dont we??

Couldn't agree more. The landowner approached us as we descended the hill side facing Rowtor which I now understand to be the less disceet / wrong access. It seemed that access routes weren't an issue just that the owner wished to close the area.

It ultimately comes down to the discourse the owner and BMC develop, which I for one hope is good.

[fatdoc]

bugger...

we're screwed then.
 

[cofe]

not a major problem as we can climb at horseshoe now that good money and effort has secured it for our future, and that of our children. and our children's children.

are the bmc, i.e. one of their FTE access and conservation officers, dealing with this as a priority?

[Jacqusie]

are the bmc, i.e. one of their FTE access and conservation officers, dealing with this as a priority?

 

Guy Keating is aware - check the RAD on the BMC site.

As access has not officially been questioned yet to the BMC and no one has been asked to leave - if this occurs please get in touch with either the BMC, Henry Folkard or myself..

Cheers

[Rice Boy]

Has there been any further discussion / news regarding access?

The RAD is not showing any changes.

Cheers

[Idol eyes]

I support the closure of here and Rowtor, seen some pretty shit things done by climbing folk hereabouts. Its a very very sensitive area, and screaming and swearing are the issues. Have had liasions with locals, and we have been tied in with glue sniffing reprobates that tear around the fauna and foliage with total abandon. its such a beautifull area, and with growing interest in esoterica this area will get hammered. please be patient and allow the trust to be restored and the area to recover. peace and love...

[Daniel]

What?!? You cant seriously support the closure of this place - its great... That would just be a case of the selfish few spoiling it for the rest of us.. If swearing and shouting is the contentious issue, then surely thats what needs to be dealt with - Not stopping everyone.

[Idol eyes]

It needs a rest... and its selfish to think about our needs and not the venues.

[Sloper]

While I'm opposed to banning anything I do support the idea of a temporary closure of areas that are suffering at the hands of climbers (usually boulderers).

Places like cratcliffe, the bridies, eagle tor, burbage south boulders are getting completely ruined, a five year lay off with appropriate, skilled remedial work would not only address the damage to the rock but also help ease some of the access 'tensions'.

It's not as if Cratcliffe was in Northamptonshire and the only rock for 100 miles, there are plenty of areas in the peak and yorkshire that could *do* with more traffic.  Bouldering has a disproportionate impact on the environment and a temporary closure would at least bring this home to people.

The other way forward is to create 'honey pot' areas in the full knowledge these will be utterly trashed (eg the path up mam tor, pavey ark etc) and *hope* that the rest survives.

[Bonjoy]

I can see the logic behind this and in an ideal world I might be all for it. However I do think you are risking permanent denial of access if you go down this road. It'd be much easier for a landowner to prevent access once your foot is no longer in the door so to speak. After a five year break from climbers what's the guarantee that the owner will want to have their peace disturbed again?

[Pantontino]

Bonjoy makes a very pertinent point. Just look at Craig y Forwen in North Wales. Temporary bans have a habit of becoming permanent. I think more dialogue with the landowner is the way forward; in any situation there is nearly always a worthwhile compromise that, at least in part, satisfies both parties.