[Nibile]

EDIT - I would like to confess that I've been trying these all week, and have not found them to be as easy as I may have earlier suggested....

talk about me and the one arm front lever...
i was close but theres no way i can come closer and do it.
for now...

[unclesomebody]

What is amazing (and I was inspired to check it out again by this thread) is how John Gill was stronger than probably 95% of the people who use this forum and that was nearly 50 years ago. That really does leave me speechless.

"By 1958 I had  learned a variety of climbing-related muscle feats, four of which can be seen below:  One-arm (front) levers , One-finger pull-ups (on a metal ring  3/4" to 1" diameter) , One-arm pull-ups with weights (20+ pounds) , and One-arm pull-ups on a 1/2" ledge . Plus a One-arm Lever Pull-up" - John Gill

As to these one arm front levers of which nibile speaks, I am guessing you mean one arm side levers (not true front levers). I just read that apparently JOhn Gill could actually do a one front lever (ie. holding a 2 arm one and taking one arm without his body moving). Once again... Speechless.

[Nibile]

yes one arm side lever, but as i discovered its really really really hard to close the gap between having a good try at it, and doing it.

[Johnny Brown]

What is amazing is how John Gill was stronger than probably 95% of the people who use this forum and that was nearly 50 years ago. That really does leave me speechless.

You say you're speechless twice but manage to keep waffling on. Where's alan when you need him? 'I wish you were.'
What amazes me is that people think one arm front levers will really make them climb better. By the sounds of things Gill was stronger than 100% of the people on the forum. Did people have to get even stronger in order to climb harder than him? No...

[Bonjoy]

 Gill was evidently a beast. Call me a heretic, but what surprises me most is that he didn't put up harder problems. For a man of his strength he didn't do much with it.

[a dense loner]

For a man of his strength he didn't do much with it

for climbing purposes please. what do you have to do with all that strength then? we're talking impressive shit here, never mind pulling on a smaller crimp cos your fingers are smaller than the next guys

[Bonjoy]

Ok amend that to: For a man of his strength he didn't get near to applying it's potential on rock.

[Houdini]

Gill was evidently a beast. Call me a heretic, but what surprises me most is that he didn't put up harder problems. For a man of his strength he didn't do much with it.

Always thought this.

Ok amend that to: For a man of his strength he didn't get near to applying it's potential on rock.

Yep, found myself reaching this conclusion too.



Bottom line is Gill was a brute.  And....   He was far too fucking heavy.  Far far too heavy.  Add the poor footware into the equation and what have you got?   John Gill in the 50's.

[Nigel]

How about 1 arm L-Sit Pull ups... keeping your body straight and open of course.

am gona come down there n raise you on the river. you've just made that exercise up

Well don't know about 1 arm L-sit pull ups, but Seth used to do 1 arm L-sit lock offs, front on and staying open, for at least ten seconds on each arm, over several sets. After sessions in the school. What an arsehole. 

[Nibile]

Gill was evidently a beast. Call me a heretic, but what surprises me most is that he didn't put up harder problems. For a man of his strength he didn't do much with it.

i happened to read gills biography by pat ament. the book isnt great, its quite boring, not even close to gullich biography in terms of pure passion and writing, but was a funny book, tho.
anyway,
gill was very much into the aesthethic of climbing, and one reason he didnt put up anything "hard" (beyond v8 7b+......) is that he wanted to climb every problem as stylish and beautifully as possible. so no slapping, no cutting loose without control, etc. coming out from a roof, instead of bumping a heel or dynoing out, he would gently let down his legs, then do a slow, controlled one arm pull up, lock off, and move to the next hold.
its in da book.

[Bonjoy]

coming out from a roof, instead of bumping a heel or dynoing out, he would gently let down his legs, then do a slow, controlled one arm pull up, lock off, and move to the next hold.

Maximum control maybe, good style not really.
In my book this is climbing in poor style. Good style by my definition is doing something with maximum efficiency i.e. least expenditure of effort.

[Houdini]

 

[Nibile]

im not sure to agree with the "style=efficiency" theory completely.

to me style is style, regardless of effort.
but ya know...im italian...

[unclesomebody]

and it still comes down to the fact at the strongest climbers are the ones who do the most/hardest stuff. This is not a questionable, it is fact.

The monk has a point, but one that I think is only viable and applicable in the 7th grade. How many 8B's and above require more technique than strength. In fact, point me out an 8B climber who isn't very STRONG.

I do kind of agree with bonjoy, but ultimately style isn't just using the least effort and increasing efficiency. Perhaps that is a component of it, but it's so much more than that. I actually don't know anything about style.

[r-man]

gill was very much into the aesthethic of climbing, and one reason he didnt put up anything "hard" (beyond v8 7b+......)

According to this http://www.planetfear.com/article_detail.asp?a_id=326 he climbed the first V10...

More here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Gill_%28climber%29

[Johnny Brown]

The monk has a point, but one that I think is only viable and applicable in the 7th grade. How many 8B's and above require more technique than strength. In fact, point me out an 8B climber who isn't very STRONG.

Ryan and Tyler have strong fingers, fuck all body weight and an intuitive grasp of momentum. You don't see them doing L-sit pull-ups or one arm front levers. Yes most 8b climbers in their thirties are all-round strong, but the fast repeats are coming from stringy youths swinging about.

I do kind of agree with bonjoy, but ultimately style isn't just using the least effort and increasing efficiency. Perhaps that is a component of it, but it's so much more than that. I actually don't know anything about style.

I think we all know style when we see it. Its about looking like you are using the least effort and climbing in the most efficient way. To achieve this you can either be over strong and but only use it in complete control, or you can use momentum to render powerful moves gentle. For me, I'll admit, its also about bending your hands back as you windmill slightly slower than required to the next hold, plus shaking you hair out (summer) or adjusting your beanie (winter) at opportune moments...

[Nigel]

The monk has a point, but one that I think is only viable and applicable in the 7th grade. How many 8B's and above require more technique than strength. In fact, point me out an 8B climber who isn't very STRONG.

Ryan and Tyler have strong fingers, fuck all body weight and an intuitive grasp of momentum. You don't see them doing L-sit pull-ups or one arm front levers. Yes most 8b climbers in their thirties are all-round strong, but the fast repeats are coming from stringy youths swinging about.

Its a fair point Keith - for instance, neither Ryan nor Tyler can do 1-5-8 on a campus board (in fact last time I saw each try neither could do 1-4-7!), and Ryan usually has to try pretty hard just to do one one-armer. Doubt he could do a front lever either! But for the exact reasons Adam says, they are both beasts.

[Doylo]

Doubt he could do a front lever either!

I'd be bloody impressed if he could with that lanky torso.

[Houdini]

Momentum or lightness? 

[webbo]

or a fat suit.

[Houdini]

Don't think so.  There's nothing  covering his neck, he's got wristbands sure and long trousers, but the neck is naked.  I think it's real. 

His body tension will blow, mind.  Deadhangs deadly, frontlevers but a dream.  Owning a delicate victorian toilet?  Impossible.

[a dense loner]

to me style is style, regardless of effort.
but ya know...im italian...
nibile please, we've seen pics of you wearing an elbow support 

that guys a fat bastard

[unclesomebody]

Don't think so.  There's nothing  covering his neck, he's got wristbands sure and long trousers, but the neck is naked.  I think it's real. 

His body tension will blow, mind.  Deadhangs deadly, frontlevers but a dream.  Owning a delicate victorian toilet?  Impossible.

it's definitely fake. It's from some commercial which I have seen many times in much higher resolution than that youtube video. It is a fat suit, 100% guaranteed.

[SA Chris]

that guys a fat bastard

You mean that guy is about as convincing as Fat Bastard in Austin Powers. How can anyone think thats real? You can see his neck looks like a vagina.

[a dense loner]

i meant fat bastard from austin powers, the suit is genius tho