[tomtom]

It’s fucking daft.

In the same guidance it says that it’s not right to go out and buy paint to decorate your kitchen - but you can drive for an hour for a potter somewhere..

[macca7]

Surely exercise is still limited to the few listed, walking, running or cycling?

So you can drive a short way to do these. Its not said crack back on with whatever you want?

I guess as been said a million times it depends how you want to read it?

[Adam Lincoln]

What it gives you in the very least is a reason to be driving to a crag if you get stopped. As you can say you are going for a walk.

An out of the way crag out of public view without much footfall.

[abarro81]

Surely exercise is still limited to the few listed, walking, running or cycling?

"Exercise can come in many forms"

[petejh]

Next three weeks will likely see increasing stretching of the spirit of the guidance. May 8th bank holiday could be mental.

[macca7]

Be interesting to see if the bmc change their stand point with the new explanation of the restrictions?

Can't imagine they will?

[Johnny Brown]

Surely exercise is still limited to the few listed, walking, running or cycling?

They were only ever presented as examples. Climbing was 'banned' entirely by the climbing community.

[petejh]

I think the concern will shift from health to access, because public perception of climbing is a different issue from health impacts of climbing.
Sat here thinking through how would I feel about going out tradding with my housemate later this week.. when I think about how a landowner would perceive seeing us, it’s quite possible we could end up having a confrontation and long-term access issues.
Simply not worth it at the moment on any crag that requires landowner consent.
Other venues.. not sure how I feel about it.
BMC owned crag?? Would they ban access in future But clearly they have a political image to upkeep.. have to balance that image with it being weird for them to not allow their members access to horseshoe/trem etc. Weird situation.
Local lowball bouldering on esoteric crags with no others present, my opinion is unchanged.

[ali k]

Surely exercise is still limited to the few listed, walking, running or cycling?

So you can drive a short way to do these. Its not said crack back on with whatever you want?

That’s just because those are the three forms of (non-team) exercise anyone would come up if they thought for 2 seconds, surely?

I’m sure it has also been implied, if not explicitly said, the exercise should be around an hour. So that doesn’t leave much driving time to get out to the country if the exercise has to be significantly more than the driving time. Pretty unfair on the city dwellers!

[Paul B]

Roads and isolated parking spots certainly seemed much busier today than last week.

Agreed.

[T_B]

Gav’s gonna be gutted he bought all that ply!

[petejh]

‘’However, a very short period of ‘exercise’ to excuse a long period of inactivity may mean that the person is not engaged in ‘exercise’ but in fact something else.’’

It’s almost as if whoever wrote the guidance had Malham catwalk in mind when they wrote this.

[Paul B]

It’s almost as if whoever wrote the guidance had Malham catwalk in mind when they wrote this.

I'm not sure you'll get a very good welcome in the Dales. I think the NT have closed the carpark and all of the usual Malham show clearway cones may be in use.

[petejh]

Was a joke, as in people hanging around working their proj!

[Will Hunt]

Surely exercise is still limited to the few listed, walking, running or cycling?

So you can drive a short way to do these. Its not said crack back on with whatever you want?

That’s just because those are the three forms of (non-team) exercise anyone would come up if they thought for 2 seconds, surely?

I’m sure it has also been implied, if not explicitly said, the exercise should be around an hour. So that doesn’t leave much driving time to get out to the country if the exercise has to be significantly more than the driving time. Pretty unfair on the city dwellers!

Macca, exercise was never limited to those three things.
And whoever was saying it, exercise was never explicitly time limited to half an hour or an hour. I believe they are just the numbers that sprang into Mr Gove's head when he was questioned. Although democracy in this country has been suspended, he is not a one man legislative body.

It’s fucking daft.

In the same guidance it says that it’s not right to go out and buy paint to decorate your kitchen - but you can drive for an hour for a potter somewhere..

The fault (if there is any is a matter of opinion) is with the legislation. The police have just set out their interpretation of the legislation. To do more would be unlawful. Exercise is deemed a reasonable excuse, going out to shop for essentials is reasonable excuse. You could always pick up your paint (or ply and t-nuts  ) while out doing your big food shop.

I can't wait till we get the news report of the billionaire who gets stopped while popping out for a pack of paracetamol and a swarovski encrusted Rolls Royce.

I thought this bit was interesting.

Moving to a friend’s address for several days to allow a ‘cooling-off’ following arguments at home.

Presumably an attempt to curb domestic abuse?

[Paul B]

Was a joke, as in people hanging around working their proj!

I did get that. There's a Malham specific COVIDIOT poster kicking around (I can't find it now). They misspelled Cove 

[tomtom]

This really would have been so much easier - if they had followed the French model (I think) saying you can exercise by walking, running or cycling, not going further than 5km from your house....

Black and white. So - tough shit to climbers, canoeists, cavers, fencers, pole vaulters - whatever floats your boat. Tough.

Instead we have a daft interpretive set of rules - not really wanting to ruffle any feathers or make anyone too pissed off. All feels a bit like they don’t want to irk too many voters rather than the right thing...

Ffs - it’s killing 1000 people a day and will probably make 3 million people unemployed (or more)... don’t fuck about - it’s not the time to be gentle about this!!!

/rant

[ali k]

All feels a bit like they don’t want to irk too many voters rather than the right thing...

^^^This

And now disproportionately favours the wealthier end even more so.

If you live in a tiny inner city flat with no garden (and no car) you can’t go to the park to sit on a bench or on the grass just to be outside in the sunshine, you would have to constantly be moving.

But with a car you can basically drive wherever you like to go for a walk in the countryside with your sandwiches.

[Bonjoy]

In the same guidance it says that it’s not right to go out and buy paint to decorate your kitchen - but you can drive for an hour for a potter somewhere..

Why?
That seems entirely the right way round to me. Mental and physical health are more important  than DIY. But more importantly, shopping is indoors and more likely to involve close person to person interaction and contact with contaminated surfaces. Going for a potter outside can very easily avoid both. How far is justifiable to drive is dependant on many factors obviously.

[tomtom]

@Bonjoy A few things (edit - I see you’ve covered some of them ). Firstly - most people will not travel far to get paint. Driving for an hour for a walk is - say up to 60 miles. The latter risks increasing the geographic spread - the former less so.

Secondly - I’d assume this means the same level of social distancing as happens at paint shops as at supermarkets now - If not greater as they would be less busy. So - is this really any worse than going somewhere for a walk where there are lots of other people.

Third, judging by the amount of DIY, gardening, car polishing and general furtling going on around here (and as evidence on social media I look at) - I would say that to many people doing some DIY is as important to their mental health as going for a walk is for others... I don’t think we can apply the feelings of the members of a climbing forum to the general population on this front..

But to counter my original point (which was a frustrated rant at the silliness of picking an hours drive as an example) you can of course buy paint rollers and all that stuff online and have it delivered - whereas you can’t with exercise.

As a final point - I live in a city - suburbs - but Victorian suburbs so a fairly high population density (not high rises - bit plenty of flats). I miss the hills - but have been perfectly able to get enough exercise - air (much better now) and space to stretch my Legs and where the lad can ride his scooter. I’d like to leave the burbs and go for a walk in the peak - but it’s not something I consider necessary at the moment to my physical or mental health. I really can’t see why driving out to the peak (for example) could be justifiable to me - when I could walk to a park - or drive if I were not that mobile.

Why on earth might people in Sheffield (for example) feel they have to go to Curbar for a walk instead of near their houses??

[moose]

Roads and isolated parking spots certainly seemed much busier today than last week.

Agreed.

n=1 but during when driving to site visits (I generally work from home but am still visiting fire scenes) I've noticed a "creep" back toward average re pedestrians in town centres. In Hull and Gateshead this week there were lots of people mingling at bus stops and the pavements seemed only a little less crowded than a normal weekday afternoon.  On the motorways there has been incrementally more non-commercial traffic. 

[Johnny Brown]

Why on earth might people in Sheffield (for example) feel they have to go to Curbar for a walk instead of near their houses??

Umm, well, for the same reason you get more (presumably) out of going to Curbar (during normal times obvs) than going to the wall or park. Add in the fact that its heaving in the parks and round here they are mostly very linear (narrow paths, narrow valleys) and you get huffed on by joggers and have to jump out of the way of cyclists plus gates etc. Whereas Burbage is a six minute drive, unlimited space, and yes I get better mental health benefits from a huge open space with grand vistas etc. I would respectfully suggest if your choice of a house/ career etc wasn't entirely dictated by access to that open space you may not understand its importance.

I've noticed a "creep" back toward average re pedestrians in town centres

Our road just never got that quiet. I'm think there are a lot of businesses that just carried on as they weren't explicitly told to stop. This is where the police should be busy imho.

[tomtom]

Why on earth might people in Sheffield (for example) feel they have to go to Curbar for a walk instead of near their houses??

Umm, well, for the same reason you get more (presumably) out of going to Curbar (during normal times obvs) than going to the wall or park. Add in the fact that its heaving in the parks and round here they are mostly very linear (narrow paths, narrow valleys) and you get huffed on by joggers and have to jump out of the way of cyclists plus gates etc. Whereas Burbage is a six minute drive, unlimited space, and yes I get better mental health benefits from a huge open space with grand vistas etc. I would respectfully suggest if your choice of a house/ career etc wasn't entirely dictated by access to that open space you may not understand its importance.

I've noticed a "creep" back toward average re pedestrians in town centres

Our road just never got that quiet. I'm think there are a lot of businesses that just carried on as they weren't explicitly told to stop. This is where the police should be busy imho.

What makes it more important for you to go out for a walk at Curbar than anyone else in that park JB?

I would respectfully suggest you should live somewhere more rural yourself if that’s an issue? :p

[Bradders]

Be interesting to see if the bmc change their stand point with the new explanation of the restrictions?

Can't imagine they will?

I hope they don't, we need crystal clear messaging from dedicated sporting bodies to mitigate the lack of detail the Government can give, as it's impossible for them to cover every activity (without a France style "don't go outside").

It still comes down to asking yourself the question of who do you want to be, and are you part of the problem or solution. If you don't absolutely have to drive, don't.

[Will Hunt]

The issue with saying the shops should be open is that the shops are indoor spaces which were not designed to be used during a pandemic. I'm sure we've all been to the supermarket by now and we know that, in an aisle that's only just about 6 feet wide, social distancing does not get observed religiously, despite everyone's best efforts. The shops also have to be manned, and the staff that do so will often be getting the bus or train to work. So public transport fills up again.

I'm not trying to argue that the rules shouldn't be tighter. I think they ought to be and the main thing I would change is for more to be done about business. Though I'm not privy to the economic information that might have informed that decision. The thing I do disagree with quite strongly is having a go at the police for simply enforcing the law and going no further. The law is shit, not least because it was passed in a day and then the legislature disbanded so it couldn't be amended.

Regardless of what the police can do with their powers, we can still expect residents of the countryside to give a very cold reception to unwanted visitors, and I'd rather face a trial by jury than a trial by social media.