[tomtom]

'kinell, Shark living to 2092? Is he fucking highlander or something?

Well immortality is one strategy to get up the Oak I guess..

[duncan]

5. As shark 'works' from home and you work in a large institution his risk is much greater and he won't let you get close enough for you to have to make that decision.



Currently weighing-up the risks going to Ceuse in June via the train to Avignon. From a risk of getting infected perspective, I have no major concerns: being in Ceuse will be a lot less risky than being in London. Train travel is slightly risky but probably less so than going to work on the Tube.

My major concern is travel to France (or from the UK) will be banned or advised against. I think this is irrational but governments can’t be relied on to act rationally according to best evidence. A lesser concern is that one of us gets infected or have to self-isolate at the wrong time (two of us work in high-risk environments).

So my view is still that we book tickets but take out insurance having had a very careful look at the exclusion clauses of the policies available. If anyone has any suggestions regarding insurance please let me know!

[teestub]

I got this as an email from The BMC and it seems to cover their position pretty well

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/how-does-coronavirus-affect-bmc-travel-insurance

[Will Hunt]

I (and two offices worth of employees) had to work from home today, so the company could test work continuity should it all kick off.

Where did you get to? Caley?




On TomTom's thoughts, do viruses not generally become inactivated by UV - hence why winter is the flu season? Not sure how that tallies with humidity, where higher humidity kills viruses. Mind you, I think that's absolute humidity rather than relative humidity, so perhaps viruses will last less long in summer because absolute humidity is higher, even if relative humidity is lower.
So basically, in summer the risk of fomite transmission out of doors is lower, so climbing probably less risky provided you're not at a busy crag or working a problem with members of The Infected.

In any case, there are shitloads of crags you can go to where you're not going to bump into anyone. Could be the ideal time to go to Yeadon/Eavestone/Sypeland/Sigsworth etc etc etc.

[spidermonkey09]

5. As shark 'works' from home and you work in a large institution his risk is much greater and he won't let you get close enough for you to have to make that decision.



Currently weighing-up the risks going to Ceuse in June via the train to Avignon. From a risk of getting infected perspective, I have no major concerns: being in Ceuse will be a lot less risky than being in London. Train travel is slightly risky but probably less so than going to work on the Tube.

My major concern is travel to France (or from the UK) will be banned or advised against. I think this is irrational but governments can’t be relied on to act rationally according to best evidence. A lesser concern is that one of us gets infected or have to self-isolate at the wrong time (two of us work in high-risk environments).

So my view is still that we book tickets but take out insurance having had a very careful look at the exclusion clauses of the policies available. If anyone has any suggestions regarding insurance please let me know!

Off topic, but I'd be interested in the logistics of getting to Ceuse via train. Could you possibly drop me a DM with the websites etc you're using? Cheers

[tomtom]

@will. From what I’ve read UV kills it. But viruses are quite happy in the dry - and some prefer moisture. So there’s no hard and fast rule.

[petejh]

[monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]
1. Coronavirus will have to queue up behind the rest of the massed ranks of viruses lurking around in the Beacon waiting to infect you, since they're too stingy to provide their customers with warm water to wash their hands after using the loo or after climbing.
[/monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]

[SA Chris]

From what I've read CV 19 won't last long in high 20s, maybe why there are no outbreaks in Southern Hemisphere where it's midsummer?

[tomtom]

From what I've read CV 19 won't last long in high 20s, maybe why there are no outbreaks in Southern Hemisphere where it's midsummer?

Has there been a major tectonic episode over night and Australia move several thousand K’s north? 😃

[petejh]

Latest stats from John Hopkins:

[tommytwotone]

In any case, there are shitloads of crags you can go to where you're not going to bump into anyone. Could be the ideal time to go to Yeadon/Eavestone/Sypeland/Sigsworth etc etc etc.

Who knows, you might find the antidote lurking down a hole in the jungle under Guisecliffe!

[teestub]

Liquid chalk: performance hand sanitiser!

[sdm]

[monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]
1. Coronavirus will have to queue up behind the rest of the massed ranks of viruses lurking around in the Beacon waiting to infect you, since they're too stingy to provide their customers with warm water to wash their hands after using the loo or after climbing.
[/monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]

Warm water offers no benefit for hygiene when washing hands.

Most bacteria and viruses are not affected by warm water. For the water to be hot enough to impact them, is going to irritate (or even scald) your skin, leaving you more susceptible to infection.

Maybe the Beacon are trying to look out for your safety 

[SA Chris]

From what I've read CV 19 won't last long in high 20s, maybe why there are no outbreaks in Southern Hemisphere where it's midsummer?

Has there been a major tectonic episode over night and Australia move several thousand K’s north? 😃

Missed that, apparently Brazil too.

[petejh]

[monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]
1. Coronavirus will have to queue up behind the rest of the massed ranks of viruses lurking around in the Beacon waiting to infect you, since they're too stingy to provide their customers with warm water to wash their hands after using the loo or after climbing.
[/monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]

Warm water offers no benefit for hygiene when washing hands.

Most bacteria and viruses are not affected by warm water. For the water to be hot enough to impact them, is going to irritate (or even scald) your skin, leaving you more susceptible to infection.

Maybe the Beacon are trying to look out for your safety 

Yeah I was actually aware of that about bacteria/hygiene, however cold water doesn't get rid of dirt and grease very well does it. The simple practicalities of getting the grease, dirt and chalk off your hands is much easier with warm water than cold. That's why we use it to wash stuff isn't it.

[sdm]

[monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]
1. Coronavirus will have to queue up behind the rest of the massed ranks of viruses lurking around in the Beacon waiting to infect you, since they're too stingy to provide their customers with warm water to wash their hands after using the loo or after climbing.
[/monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]

Warm water offers no benefit for hygiene when washing hands.

Most bacteria and viruses are not affected by warm water. For the water to be hot enough to impact them, is going to irritate (or even scald) your skin, leaving you more susceptible to infection.

Maybe the Beacon are trying to look out for your safety 

Yeah I was actually aware of that about bacteria/hygiene, however cold water doesn't get rid of dirt and grease very well does it. The simple practicalities of getting the grease, dirt and chalk off your hands is much easier with warm water than cold. That's why we use it to wash stuff isn't it.

A decent surfactant makes far more difference when getting rid of non water soluble compounds than temperature. Though I'm guessing the Beacon often doesn't have decent handwash either?

[Will Hunt]

[monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]
1. Coronavirus will have to queue up behind the rest of the massed ranks of viruses lurking around in the Beacon waiting to infect you, since they're too stingy to provide their customers with warm water to wash their hands after using the loo or after climbing.
[/monthly nohotwaterforBeaconcustomers moan]

Warm water offers no benefit for hygiene when washing hands.

Most bacteria and viruses are not affected by warm water. For the water to be hot enough to impact them, is going to irritate (or even scald) your skin, leaving you more susceptible to infection.

Maybe the Beacon are trying to look out for your safety 

Cold vs warm water might not be better or worse washing microbes from your hands, but you are more likely to spend more time washing if the water is warm. 30 seconds is a long time to wash your hands under cold water for. Furthermore, if you're using a bar of soap, you're going to get a better lather under warm water.

[petejh]

A decent surfactant makes far more difference when getting rid of non water soluble compounds than temperature. Though I'm guessing the Beacon often doesn't have decent handwash either?

They provide hand wash, just not warm water. I can’t comment on whether or not it’s decent.
If warm water is irrelevant to hand-washing - and I’m aware it isn’t necessary to remove some bacteria -  then we’ve all been doing it wrong for a very long time. As Will points out there are good reasons for using warm not cold. If you think cold is fine then just use cold.

[tomtom]

The expert I heard on the BBC the other day said that warm water was important. Water above 25-30 degrees physically breaks down the virus. Hence washing clothes/gloves  works too.

Beacon could be reported - warm/hot water for washing is a basic work place requirement IIRC.

[spidermonkey09]

Beacon could should be reported - warm/hot water for washing is a basic work place requirement IIRC.

Fixed! I imagine they'll have a hot water tap behind the counter for the staff though...

[r-man]

The expert I heard on the BBC the other day said that warm water was important. Water above 25-30 degrees physically breaks down the virus. Hence washing clothes/gloves  works too.

Seems odd, given that it's well below human body temperature.

Hot water taps should produce water at 50 deg. (I just googled that). Though I think most people find that a bit uncomfortable for hand washing.

[dunnyg]

Depends how thin your skin is. After smashing yourself on the grit that would be torture.

[Paul B]

Beacon could be reported - warm/hot water for washing is a basic work place requirement IIRC.

As I said in the other thread where this was mentioned, I'm pretty sure building regs. also require it where there are public toilets.

[Dolly]

Sorry if I’m slow (I read the link TT) so can the virus stay on rock ? And is it worse on non porous rock ?

[tomtom]

Sorry if I’m slow (I read the link TT) so can the virus stay on rock ? And is it worse on non porous rock ?

No idea. Those are good questions. I’d have thought it’s more easily transferable on smooth glassy rocks.. as that’s the surfaces it seems to like from the built environment.

Self isolate in the shed...