[DavidM]

Hi all,

There seems to be some confusion of the 7a grade in the Peak Bouldering Guide to this problem. Could anyone kindly explain in a level of detail the holds to be used and those eliminated (both upper and lower section above and below the break) for the 7a grade put up by Andy Banks..?

Here is a picture of the route

https://ibb.co/dzXt27

Any help greatly appreciated.

[highrepute]

This post and further clarification by the first ascentionist in this post should clear things up for you.

On reflection A Bigger Turd seems a bit harsh as it is a nice problem.

[tomtom]

This is my favourite Kudos wall warm up. There are many variations starting easily up the ramp/crack on the left and then the headwall to get muscles moving - then moving to the SS on the face up to the break and onwards - then steadily eliminating the larger holes/jugs. I think it all climbs nicely - friendly holds and a couple that can make you start to pull hard.

There are ways of doing it that make it feel 7A - but plenty that don't :D

In many ways its grade is appropriate given how harshly graded most/all of the other things on Kudos wall are :D some grade karma...

[DavidM]

As you say very nice warm up and some nice moves on this line however you attack it.

So on the original route the two crimps that are below the finishing hold the top one being more positive are out as with the even bigger stuff right.

I can see the diagonal undercut mentioned in the post just above the juggy break but the sloppy dish and other holds that are in, in the upper section are harder to distinguish.

Just thought it would be nice to try the harder route after linking the sections in the easier now cleaned sections.

[highrepute]

So on the original route the two crimps that are below the finishing hold the top one being more positive are out as with the even bigger stuff right.

all of the holds that are currently used are out.

I can see the diagonal undercut mentioned in the post just above the juggy break but the sloppy dish and other holds that are in, in the upper section are harder to distinguish.

Yes, they are very small. I'm certain that it will be harder than 7a. The holds may have broken. And it probably hasn't been done since the day of the FA. The old line is to the left of the current one. It didn't sit-start it just pulled on with the break. If you take the undercut with your right it forces you left away from the newer holds. It's in this region that you'll find the small dish and crimps. When I tried it I found a couple of very small edges (I'm talking the absolute rattiest of rat crimps) that I could reach from the undercut, I imagine that a stronger fingered climber could match these and then pop for a good hold somewhere in the break.

Just thought it would be nice to try the harder route after linking the sections in the easier now cleaned sections.

The original isn't really an eliminate on the current climb, it doesn't use any of the same holds. It's just described as such because it's so close the current climb.

Hope that helps. I would love to see someone climb this having tried and failed on it a couple of times.

[DavidM]

That clears it up somewhat as there is very little chalk or evidence of holds slightly to the left. Looks like no one has climbed it as it's FA as even as you say the undercut forces you left more than likely the finishing hold / break was to the left to which is covered in cob webs currently. Very blank to the left looks very tough.!

[highrepute]

sounds about right

[DavidM]

Anyone got any suggestions for a 6c+ ish problem at Rubicon. Done Miller's tales sit and A Bigger Prize 6b+ with new cleaned holes. Tried Bigger tale which is tough for me and working first few moves of a bigger splash.

Anything in between might be nice if anyone had any local knowledge or tips greatly appreciated.

Cheers

[tomtom]

Start to white bait (7A) is IMHO the next easiest problem on that wall..

http://peakbouldering.info/problems/1412-white-bait-start

Possibly easier for the tall - and its more crimp/sidepull than mono pulling..

[Andy B]

Yes, they are very small. I'm certain that it will be harder than 7a. The holds may have broken. And it probably hasn't been done since the day of the FA.... It didn't sit-start it just pulled on with the break.

I could be wrong, but I think I did it as a sit start, under/right of the break up to a nice flattie before the break. I doubt the top holds have broken as they were scoops rather than sticking out, but it is rubicon. Bonjoy may have done it the same day, as he cleared the ivy, but the better holds started appearing within the next few days. I can't remember which hand I used on the undercut but it was the hand that is most natural for the diagonal, if that makes sense. Is there a thumb catch on the top edge too maybe?

[Andy B]

Just looked at your photo. I think I started in the pockets low right, went up to the nice flattie above, out left to the jug in the break below the diagonal undercut, right hand in the undercut, then the next two holds we're next to each other in the scoop just under the left hand overlap in the picture (blind from below, one edge, one sloper). I finished slightly left in the break above.

[DavidM]

Thanks Andy it seems the most logical way to reach the jug under the undercut so I would say that would be the way you started which is a sit.

Would you mind looking at this picture.

https://ibb.co/hMgeun

 The red line is the line up to the undercut we have established.

The yellow circles are the crimps used in the 6B+ route (not allowed in the 7a route)

Would you say the sloper and edge is in the green section or the blue section and in what region of those circles..?

Also the finish in your 7a route is that where all the chalk is above the yellow circles in the break or on the left hand side of the break where the yellow staining is on the limestone..?


Apologies for all these questions but linked the bottom section and want to have a crack at this before leave in a couple of days weather permitting.

Cheers,

David

[mark20]

Start to white bait (7A) is IMHO the next easiest problem on that wall..

http://peakbouldering.info/problems/1412-white-bait-start

Possibly easier for the tall - and its more crimp/sidepull than mono pulling..

The start to Pirahna , to the left, is worth doing. Nothing too desperate (White Bait is quite a pull?) but quite technical and a bit more on the feet.

[Andy B]

Hi David. I'm not certain without being there but I think the holds are above the right side of the green circle. IIRC they were on the bottom of a scoop feature, which is why they're blind from underneath. I think I finished just left of the sapling in the photo but it may have been under the left hand overlap in the photo. Whichever has the best hold, but not on the check above the yellow circle. Hope that helps a bit.

[DavidM]

Thanks Andy that helped a lot.

I'm going to have go tomorrow morning and check it out.

Cheers for everyone's input and suggestions.

[highrepute]

Still no closure on this as I didn't finish it but I believe the video gives a good idea of what I think is the original line of A Bigger Prize. I didn't start from sitting but climbed like this it's an independent set of moves from the 6b+ version to the right. Once you commit to the undercut it's not really eliminate. Felt high on the last move hence the lack of commitment without a big pad and spotter. I was hoping to lunge left to the ledge with the plant on it. But it would also be possible to lunge right to finish as per the 6b+ version.

[Murph]

Thanks for posting the vid James. Will give that a bash next time I’m there. Lunge left to the plant ledge for the tick, yeah?

[highrepute]

I would say either left or right for the tick, either way seemed like it would be tricky. That way it's not eliminate just has two alternative finishes. Felt like it would be hard for 7a to me but so does everything on this wall.