[tomtom]

A zero sum game - that had to be played.

[Offwidth]

You're probably right but it looked terrible so I struggle to understand why the Democrats called the vote for witnesses in the first place. Some of the fallout is clearly pants.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/13/mitt-romney-impeachment-row-boxers-versus-briefs

[Oldmanmatt]

You're probably right but it looked terrible so I struggle to understand why the Democrats called the vote for witnesses in the first place. Some of the fallout is clearly pants.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/13/mitt-romney-impeachment-row-boxers-versus-briefs

I don’t think the purpose was to convict.
And the Turtle was involved and coordinated with the intent.
That speech that he made, amounted to a  statement of guilt, carefully qualifying it as acquittal on the technicality of jurisdiction, not innocence.
It indicated a lack of support, for Trump, from the party, as he probably faces felony charges in more than one state, and subtly acknowledges that convicted felons cannot hold office.

[TobyD]

You're probably right but it looked terrible so I struggle to understand why the Democrats called the vote for witnesses in the first place. Some of the fallout is clearly pants.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/13/mitt-romney-impeachment-row-boxers-versus-briefs

I don’t think the purpose was to convict.
And the Turtle was involved and coordinated with the intent.
That speech that he made, amounted to a  statement of guilt, carefully qualifying it as acquittal on the technicality of jurisdiction, not innocence.
It indicated a lack of support, for Trump, from the party, as he probably faces felony charges in more than one state, and subtly acknowledges that convicted felons cannot hold office.

I don't think that the democrats were being delusional, chances of conviction were virtually nil, and they must have known it.
I'd imagine that the main purpose is to have tried to sufficiently tarnish the Trump brand as to make him less popular in case he runs again. I have doubts about how successful that might have been; however if it increases chances that Trump will be criminally liable, then that's just as effective.

Impeachment has never been effective against a president; is the bar too high for conviction? Or is it a necessary safeguard against overuse?

[Offwidth]

I agree with all of that. I was talking about why they called a vote on witnesses. Even I felt it looked a mess and I agree with the Democrat line on Trump.

[spidermonkey09]

Is John Pilger bad? I thought he made interesting documentaries and was respected for it

Pilger has made the move from respected investigative journo and filmmaker to crank over the last 20 years or so. Definitely several screws loose these days but I have read and enjoyed his early books and films.

[Loos3-tools]

I wonder what happened? Maybe everyone else’s screws got tightened while his screws remained the same.

[Loos3-tools]

Is there a sweepstake going on when Biden will be deemed unable to continue? I heard September. Apparently he hasn’t been seen in a while.
I enjoyed this left bloggers post on Twitter.

https://mobile.twitter.com/leftiblog/status/1367506736202928131

[andy popp]

Apparently he hasn’t been seen in a while.

That's right! Apart from all the times he has been seen and heard in the last few days.

[Oldmanmatt]

Is there a sweepstake going on when Biden will be deemed unable to continue? I heard September. Apparently he hasn’t been seen in a while.
I enjoyed this left bloggers post on Twitter.

https://mobile.twitter.com/leftiblog/status/1367506736202928131

Two minutes (to open the Sky news app and then use the menu to navigate to “US news’) shows me his last public speech was on Tuesday, or two days ago, given time differences.
COVID-19: US aims to have enough vaccines for all adults 'by end of May', Biden says

Did you just make up your post, in your imagination, or are you following some “Alternative Media” source and not questioning their narrative?
You should do some research. Check out the “Mainstream Media”, they even have this thing called “Evidence” (like actually transmitting a speech live (can you believe that?)). The “Alternative Media” just want you to believe their narrative, if you check, you’ll see they don’t have any evidence to back up their claims.

[andy popp]

I believe he also spoke Wednesday and was on calls with agencies etc. Thursday for which readouts are available.

[SA Chris]

No, that was an animatronic puppet and some things created in a studio. Fake news.

[TobyD]

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_accidental_president

I'd watch this if I had Amazon prime,  I listened to an interview with the director and it sounds interesting. 

[Loos3-tools]

I enjoyed this interview with Christopher Hitchens on the Clintons. Feels like pretty much where they are again now.

[teestub]

Pretty happy with ‘not Trump’ rn, the dems needed to make sure they got enough swing and Biden did that for them.

Are you a Sanders fan?

[Loos3-tools]

I don’t know enough about Saunders. He appeared a kind and gentle man who was never going to gain power.
Biden I find very uncomfortable, he appears to present with prodromal symptoms of dementia. There seems no getting away from that despite reassurances.
Frank Yeomans an analytic psychotherapist and liberal gives an interesting perspective on Trump and malignant narcissism. He talks about the Republican tendency towards a polarised view of the world. How dangerous this can be and how Democrats are paralysed by analysis of the grey. Leading to openings for dangerous characters like Trump to take power. My opinion is that this position has turned on its head yet is largely in acknowledged. AOC being a very public example. Anyway I’ve linked the video by Yeomans, interesting from the perspective of how developmental and psychoanalytic theory create a window of insight into politics, corporations and power. Of note is that the theory has a strong scientific basis in neurodevelopmental studies and in life observation and treatment. Otto Kernberg a leading psychiatrist in the field of Personality Development and Personality Disorders is a strong voice in this field.Clinton also seemed to fall into this category 

[teestub]

He talks about the Republican tendency towards a polarised view of the world. How dangerous this can be and how Democrats are paralysed by analysis of the grey. Leading to openings for dangerous characters like Trump to take power. My opinion is that this position has turned on its head yet is largely in acknowledged. AOC being a very public example.

You think AOC is a dangerous character or just has a polarised view of the world? It doesn’t seem like the popular republicans are ‘grey’ about anything.

[andy popp]

I don’t know enough about Saunders.

Its Sanders.

[Loos3-tools]

Saunders sanders etc nice one

[mrjonathanr]

There’s no way the yanks would have elected someone called Finbarr.

By the way, I find your psychologising very overstated. One YouTube video does not a complete psychoanalysis make.

[Loos3-tools]

He talks about the Republican tendency towards a polarised view of the world. How dangerous this can be and how Democrats are paralysed by analysis of the grey. Leading to openings for dangerous characters like Trump to take power. My opinion is that this position has turned on its head yet is largely in acknowledged. AOC being a very public example.

You think AOC is a dangerous character or just has a polarised view of the world? It doesn’t seem like the popular republicans are ‘grey’ about anything.

Sorry yes should have been clearer. An example of a regression towards simplicity as trump was / is

[Oldmanmatt]

There’s no way the yanks would have elected someone called Finbarr.

By the way, I find your psychologising very overstated. One YouTube video does not a complete psychoanalysis make.

I was a bit “meh” about the “psychoanalysis” of Trump, etc, based on his public appearances. However, that was fairly obviously Trump going off script and rambling, therefore giving an insight into his mental state. Still a long way from serious investigation.
Biden, seems to follow his prepared statements, by and large, so I’m curious how this can be seen as an insight into his mental state or capacity, since he probably hasn’t even drafted the words himself?

I rather feel that is infinitely better. I would like to think, when we hear the president speak, we are hearing the considered words from the “Office of the President”, rather than the individual holding that office.

I’m certain that is more true under Biden, than it ever was under Trump.

[Oldmanmatt]

He talks about the Republican tendency towards a polarised view of the world. How dangerous this can be and how Democrats are paralysed by analysis of the grey. Leading to openings for dangerous characters like Trump to take power. My opinion is that this position has turned on its head yet is largely in acknowledged. AOC being a very public example.

You think AOC is a dangerous character or just has a polarised view of the world? It doesn’t seem like the popular republicans are ‘grey’ about anything.

Sorry yes should have been clearer. An example of a regression towards simplicity as trump was / is

Well, that’s bollocks.

“Turned on it’s head”?

Are you suggesting there are no “Extreme” Republicans? That all Democrats are “Extremists”?

Bloody hell, you don’t even begin to grasp that you are the one with the “Black and White” vision and views, do you?

Jesus, every political party, that has ever existed (with the possible exception of the UK Liberal party (which is as grey as grey fox, on a grey concrete path, on a foggy day, at dusk), has and has had extremes within it’s ranks. It is bloody obvious which of the two, Republican or Democrat, has the bigger problem with it’s extremists at this time.
At least, it is to anybody who isn’t inspecting the inside of their own colon.

[gollum]

Matt, I really do think he’s just trying to wind you up.

You will have worked with him, I’ve definitely worked with him............

[Oldmanmatt]

Matt, I really do think he’s just trying to wind you up.

You will have worked with him, I’ve definitely worked with him............

Oh he doesn’t wind me up. Pretty sure my 12 yr old son is more politically astute and he thinks Greek mythology is incredibly interesting and Fortnight is a really cool game, for when you’re not playing Minecraft.

No, he makes me laugh, usually. I just don’t believe he should go unchallenged. A bit like my son.

This has backfired on me in the Covid thread, so I shall ignore his “contributions” there.