[jwi]

I'll probably go to Chamonix for 1-2 weeks in August and I'm keen to do some classic rock routes. Hit me up with some routes. 5-15 pitches up to ED-/ED or thereabouts. I like cracks. My better half will have to lead anything with ice on it, figure out how to cross bergschrund etc.

[Lopez]

If you are into crack there's a fairly new book called Mont Blanc supercracks or somesuch. Right up your street.

What sort of grades are you after? The ED type grading is fairly meaningless when it comes to rock routes.

[Lopez]

supercracks

[andy popp]

The Brown-Whillans on the Blat is one of the best rock routes I've done anywhere ... and has lots of cracks, including the Fissure Brown of course.

[jwi]

What sort of grades are you after? The ED type grading is fairly meaningless when it comes to rock routes.

Not meaningless at all, tells you how tired you are at the end of the day.

We are looking at routes with not more than a handfull of pitches in the sevens and preferably no pitch harder than 7b/c.

[Fultonius]

Mont Blanc supercracks is good for inspiration, well, as long as you don't want photos with more than 150 pixels. Do not, ever, use it for topos - they are really, really bad.

I'll get back to you with some good suggestions tomorrow.

[Lopez]

Right on. At those grades rock routes usually get an ABO grade or just the rock grade. I can't help with personal suggestions in the upper grade bracket, as i ain't that 'ard  but on the easier side of it involving cracks...

For some easy access, one day in and out hits; In the Midi there's La dame du lac, which has excellent 8 or so pitches of mainly pure crack climbing thin hands and fingers/fingerlocks with an offwidth at the top to finish. Pretty sustained with a bunch of 6b/+ pitches stacked up on top of each other. Also, the Contamine on the right side of the face - Quality climbing all the way, with the main pitches following a parallel system of thin cracks going past an overlap, and another near the top being a slightly overhanging 7a burlfest

At Pointe Lachenal if you haven't done the Contamine is a must do route, but it gets crowded as hell. Otherwise the California has a quality 6c+ish pitch following a soaring crack line of varying gauge. 

A bit farther along there are a bunch of good easyish routes on Adolphe Rey. The Bettembourg follows a corner crack system for 300 or so metres and it's all quality. First pitch is sold at 6b but i'll eat my hat if it isn't closer to 7b. The receding glacier may have accounted for the bottom section, but the crack above is no walk in the park either... but above that is all an enjoyable romp. A bit to the left Coup de Foudre is definitely class.

At your grade i would be sure to have a good bash at Ma Dalton and L'Enfer du Decor, they are the Chamonix classic crack testpieces and meant to be 5 stars.

For the night in a hut (or bivy) type routes you can't go wrong with the American Direct in the Dru. Easily done to the top of the 90m corner and down (to the bivy) in a day, great rock, and amazing climbing.

Across the valley there's enough quality to keep you entertained all week, but 2 routes that stand out which follow cracks are Pedro Polar and Subtilites Dulferiennes (sp?), both at the 6b mark following a myriad of cracks and long corners in the later.  (Edited to add: The cover photo above is on Pedro Polar)

Up and over on the Argentiere basin Versant Satanique at the Minaret will keep you smiling all the way at a paltry 6c.

With more glacier involvement the obvious choice is Gulliver's Travels in the Capuccin, it takes you to a beautiful summit through a series of cracks and slabs on perfect rock. You can mix it up with l'elixir d'astaroth to add 3 pitches at the beginning, (i didn't, so can't say how that is) and if you are feeling strong (i most definitely wasn't even considering it) finish it up with the last pitch of Panomarix (7c) to tick the Triple Direct.

[lagerstarfish]

nothing hard on it, but I really enjoyed Anouk on the Petites Jorasses (a long time ago)

[Fultonius]

For some easy access, one day in and out hits; In the Midi there's La dame du lac, which has excellent 8 or so pitches of mainly pure crack climbing thin hands and fingers/fingerlocks with an offwidth at the top to finish. Pretty sustained with a bunch of 6b/+ pitches stacked up on top of each other.

I've been wanting to do this one for a while - it looks nice. We went to the Guide's office to get a topo (they have a decent one) but they warned us off going because of the work going on at the Midi top station which was sending loose rock down the route. I'm not sure the current situation. I'll try and get in there this week and ask, as I'd like a go myself. There's also Super-Dupont which is all cracks and gets rated at F7b, but I'm sure I've read Fr6c+ elsewhere...  Cracks are often a bit overgraded in Chamonix, if you're any good at cracks which I believe you are?

Also, the Contamine on the right side of the face - Quality climbing all the way, with the main pitches following a parallel system of thin cracks going past an overlap, and another near the top being a slightly overhanging 7a burlfest

Yep, a good one. Not usually too busy. The south face of the midi feel a bit more like "high mountain cragging" so, maybe good for the start of the trip or more iffy days  - you could get a route done before afternoon thunderstorms hit.

A bit farther along there are a bunch of good easyish routes on Adolphe Rey. The Bettembourg follows a corner crack system for 300 or so metres and it's all quality. First pitch is sold at 6b but i'll eat my hat if it isn't closer to 7b. The receding glacier may have accounted for the bottom section, but the crack above is no walk in the park either... but above that is all an enjoyable romp. A bit to the left Coup de Foudre is definitely class.

Cache Cache is also very good. There is a Fr6c slab and Fr6c crack, either of which can be the crux depending on your preferences. I fell off the last bolt of the slab but got the crack. Ho hum. http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/174155/fr/pointe-adolphe-rey-cache-cache

Off the top of my head here are some other suggestions:

État de Choch on the Petit Clocher du Portalet - http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/182781/fr/petit-clocher-du-portalet-etat-de-choc
Bada Boom on Les Perrons Fr7b bolted. http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crag.php?id=9828

Need to do some work, will pop back with more info later if I think of anything.

[jwi]

Thanks people!

Regarding cracks, we have to balance our desires a bit. While I have climbed quite a few cracks the last 10 years mrs Jwi has done practically none since leaving US six years ago. I just went through her guide book collection, and the only book mrs Jwi has on Chamonix had something about snow & ice in the title. Thus: what guidebook(s) should we get? French, English or German doesn't matter.

[Lopez]

There's also Super-Dupont which is all cracks and gets rated at F7b, but I'm sure I've read Fr6c+ elsewhere...  Cracks are often a bit overgraded in Chamonix, if you're any good at cracks which I believe you are?

Super-dupont is 6c+ if you french-aid a very short section of 7b up high. Standard fare for weaklings...   

Off the top of my head here are some other suggestions:

État de Choch on the Petit Clocher du Portalet - http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/182781/fr/petit-clocher-du-portalet-etat-de-choc
 

Good call. I was going to propose that as well as it look awesome and have been on my hit list for some time now.

Another route(s) i haven't done (so not a recommendation based on experience) but meant to be awesome though rarely climbed are either of the big 'uns in the South Face of the Fou. The classic American route and les ailes du désir

[Fultonius]

South Face of the Fou is on my list too, but only if I can avoid the dodgy couloir approach - it's above my arbitrarily set "objective danger limit".

[Lopez]

The latest edition of the Piola guide for the aiguilles is pretty complete, and thankfully he adjusted some of the grades for them to be closer to reality...

For anything else i normally go to the guides bureau and spend some time reading guidebooks and making copies of the topos i want (i just take photos). They got pretty much all guidebooks available for the area plus folders full of hand-drawn topos, magazine cutouts, and online printouts. I also like to complement those topos with stuff fished online as some guidebook's descriptions may not be as clear or precise as you may want them.

 If any of the guides take your fancy you can get them down at the qechua shop in Sallanches usually cheaper than in town.

 And about the guides office... I find it's useless to ask them for any info. They will either say "Nooooo... nooooo... Condition no gooooood" or "Nooooooo... Nooooo.... Too Dangerouuuuuus......". ItTheir knowledge seems to be limited to the goats route up MB

[Lopez]

South Face of the Fou is on my list too, but only if I can avoid the dodgy couloir approach - it's above my arbitrarily set "objective danger limit".

That couloir is nasty alright. I looked down it once from the Col de Fou and thought "fuck going down that!".  It would have to be a fast abseil in a very cold night for it to have a semblance of safety, and then just find a comfy place to chill and wait for dawn.

[Franco]

South Face of the Fou is on my list too, but only if I can avoid the dodgy couloir approach - it's above my arbitrarily set "objective danger limit".

We looked into this in a few years back. Thwarted by bad weather, but the plan was to do the midi-plan to the fou and then just rap the face. Maybe you've already thought about this, I dunno? Alternatively, you could climb either the blaitiere or something on the envers and then traverse across and do the same.

[Fultonius]

 And about the guides office... I find it's useless to ask them for any info. They will either say "Nooooo... nooooo... Condition no gooooood" or "Nooooooo... Nooooo.... Too Dangerouuuuuus......". ItTheir knowledge seems to be limited to the goats route up MB

Interesting - wonder if Dame du Lac is possibly ok then? I'll ask around.

Aye Franco - those were our tentative plans. You coming out this summer or just charging through all the obscure lines of the moors?

[lagerstarfish]

with the w face of the blatiere you have the option of doing more than one route - it's a good place to get fast at getting up and down routes without being too committing

[Lopez]

They'd have to be trundling considerable amounts of rock for it to be affected. It's reasonably sheltered with maybe only the base of it possibly exposed if that.



You could always rap down the line that leads into the Mazeaud and make the call, and if unhappy just throw a top rope into Digital Crack 

[T_B]

There's also Super-Dupont which is all cracks and gets rated at F7b, but I'm sure I've read Fr6c+ elsewhere...  Cracks are often a bit overgraded in Chamonix, if you're any good at cracks which I believe you are?

Super-dupont is 6c+ if you french-aid a very short section of 7b up high. Standard fare for weaklings...   


 

The hard bit is a boulder problem into undercuts/sidepulls.

If the weather is poor in Cham and good in Italy, then I recommend seeking out Becco di Valsoera in the Gran Paradiso NP. V impressive chunk of rock near the Pontese hut (nice hut). We got most of the way up a 7a+ called Nel corso del Tempo before being stormed off. Routes tend to be 8 pitches plus some easier stuff to the top.

[jwi]

Cheers! Our plans is to go sport climbing in Brianscone, and when/if weather forecast for  Cham or The Dolomites looks good go there... The boss lady feels she had this year's fill of loose rock in Wadi Rum though. So Granite alternatives are much welcome

[jwi]

Off the top of my head here are some other suggestions:

État de Choch on the Petit Clocher du Portalet - http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/182781/fr/petit-clocher-du-portalet-etat-de-choc

Wow! Whenever a route description calls for more than 2 blue camalots I get psyched!

I saw some of the pitches are supposed to be 60m. You don't happen to know if a 57m rope suffice? (Should really get new half ropes anyway...)

Edit: Damn. Apparently Mrs Jwi already done it and says it was nice and easy.

[Franco]

Aye Franco - those were our tentative plans. You coming out this summer or just charging through all the obscure lines of the moors?

Haven't been out for the last three years. The alps is dangerous. In a really bad way.  Have fun like, go fast!


Also, not sure what routes the op's looked at. Dimanche noire is incredible (on the peigne - lots of other good stuff on there), le fleurs de mal is a bit harder on the blaittiere (haven't done all of this, but the start is cool).

[adamb]

Don't suppose anyone knows if you need a number 6 to do Etat de Choc? Seem to be conflicting recommendations out there... (Including some folk who say just 3 and 4 will be fine).

Cheers
Adam

[Fultonius]

Not according to camptocamp - I've just asked a few locals so I'll see what the answer is.

[adamb]

Thanks! Would be very interested in what they reckon... The new VP hundred best book implies you should take a 6 ... But we're getting tempted to have a look without...