[Gus]

maybe......

[abarro81]

Look bitches, I'm one ghetto mutha fucka and I could out bench both of you put together. I'm like a white fiddy cent.

[TobyD]

I definitely think that 2 sessions a week of climbing specific weight training would be beneficial (and give better results than a 45min bouldering session) and you might still have time for the fingerboard in the evening.

If I had to pick between the two (and it sounds like the OP does) then I reckon finger-boarding is without doubt the way to go.
Personally I'd never consider deadhanging on a 'rest' or 'off' day, it's far too intense and is one of the few things that makes my forearms really sore.

Quite right. Deadhanging  is definitely in no way shape or form restful.

You can never have strong enough fingers, and specificity is hugely important. If you have any limits on time  - as Barrows said more or less - climb.

[Lund]

A question for those of you who do (or have done) weight lifting etc..  as part of your training: I find myself with 55 minutes lunch breaks and I was wondering what's the best way to use them. There's a gym 200 mt from where I work, so I was playing with the idea of going there, maybe 2-3 times a week during my lunch breaks to do some weight training, on top of the 2 evenings at the local bouldering wall. Somebody 'experienced' bouldering and weight training told me 45 min sessions are way too short, therefore useless or even potentially dangerous for my joints and muscles, so I was wondering what you  think about that, considering also that right now money for me is a bit of an issue, so I'd really hate to waste them on something not worth it, and that I might instead go for a run during those breaks, and shave off some weight...
any input is really appreciated
g

The problem you've got is that you've asked a generic question about generic exercises on a forum with contrasting and variable opinions, ignorance and arrogance.  So you're going to get contrasting advice. :-)

The usual and balanced advice is that if you climb below, say, V5, and are male, then climbing and losing weight if you're fat are the two things to consider.  Ignore all else.  This advice ignores the fact that you might have an hour to spare at lunchtime, can can you do anything with it though?  Well, apart from cardio to lose weight (if you are a fatty).  Or the fact that you might just like weight training.  Or you might be Mark Twight (the classic riposte to anyone who says, just climb to train to climb, blah blah)

If you're climbing above V5, then train your weaknesses, and no amount of generic advice without knowing those will help.

Being a girl, IMHO is the exception to the above: girls seem to plateau at V4 because they can't do any pullups.  They need to address that weakness earlier, again just my fuckin' opinion alright.

So all that blah blah aside, can you do anything useful during your 55 minutes?  Of course.

I would suggest
- fat finger rolls, wrist curls
- bicep curls
- deadlifts
- deadlifts
- deadlifts
- deadlifts
- core exercises

Only other advice, is to ignore the bench press and the squat machine unless your general fitness/strength is shit.  You're not trying to get buff.  It enrages me to see grown men preening over their fucking breasts in a climbing gym.  It's just vanity ballast, for crying out loud.

Oh, and slow and steady progression and PERFECT FORM AT ALL TIMES on your deadlifts.

End opinion!

[account_inactive]

Bench presses are great for shoulders and are often the missing link to being able to do a on armer. Go figure

[TobyD]

If you're climbing above V5, then train your weaknesses, and no amount of generic advice without knowing those will help.

Being a girl, IMHO is the exception to the above: girls seem to plateau at V4 because they can't do any pullups.  They need to address that weakness earlier, again just my fuckin' opinion alright.

End opinion!

I can't do pull ups (well no more than 6 anyway) and have climbed font 7c. I probably could do with some weights eh.

[tomtom]

Me too (<10 pull ups and 7C - just!) tbh I can't remember the last
time I did more than three in a row...

[Lund]

If you're climbing above V5, then train your weaknesses, and no amount of generic advice without knowing those will help.

Being a girl, IMHO is the exception to the above: girls seem to plateau at V4 because they can't do any pullups.  They need to address that weakness earlier, again just my fuckin' opinion alright.

End opinion!

I can't do pull ups (well no more than 6 anyway) and have climbed font 7c. I probably could do with some weights eh.

What fucking part of "any" do you not understand, 7c wad man?

I don't give a shit how hard you punter along. Doesn't mean you know anything.




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[Gus]

Good advice to definitely avoid bench presses etc. I'd also recommend maximum whining sooner or later when your weak shoulders give in and you can't climb for months.

[ianv]

I can't do pull ups (well no more than 6 anyway) and have climbed font 7c. I probably could do with some weights eh.

Me too (<10 pull ups and 7C - just!) tbh I can't remember the last time I did more than three in a row...

But what sort of 7c (slab or big burly one), how long did it take and how much time do you have to climb?

Having a stronger upper body could: make more stuff accessible and faster and possibly even open up the next grade. Don't dismiss it till you have tried it. The question was, "how do I make the best use of limited time?" and for this weights are good.

[tomtom]

I can't do pull ups (well no more than 6 anyway) and have climbed font 7c. I probably could do with some weights eh.

Me too (<10 pull ups and 7C - just!) tbh I can't remember the last time I did more than three in a row...

But what sort of 7c (slab or big burly one), how long did it take and how much time do you have to climb?

Having a stronger upper body could: make more stuff accessible and faster and possibly even open up the next grade. Don't dismiss it till you have tried it. The question was, "how do I make the best use of limited time?" and for this weights are good.

Burly - and it took me aaages

I dislike Gyms and weights even more - but I gladly accept that it would help my climbing if I did some weights.. (and its probably a great use of a short time to get a work out etc..). My response was probably OT - and more towards the comment about women plateau-ing due to not being able to do any pull ups - which seems a bit of an odd thing to say... I think being able to do a pull up (or how many you can do) is not necessarily a good indicator of how hard you can climb. Rambling explanation over

[Lund]

I can't do pull ups (well no more than 6 anyway) and have climbed font 7c. I probably could do with some weights eh.

Me too (<10 pull ups and 7C - just!) tbh I can't remember the last time I did more than three in a row...

But what sort of 7c (slab or big burly one), how long did it take and how much time do you have to climb?

Having a stronger upper body could: make more stuff accessible and faster and possibly even open up the next grade. Don't dismiss it till you have tried it. The question was, "how do I make the best use of limited time?" and for this weights are good.

Burly - and it took me aaages

I dislike Gyms and weights even more - but I gladly accept that it would help my climbing if I did some weights.. (and its probably a great use of a short time to get a work out etc..). My response was probably OT - and more towards the comment about women plateau-ing due to not being able to do any pull ups - which seems a bit of an odd thing to say... I think being able to do a pull up (or how many you can do) is not necessarily a good indicator of how hard you can climb. Rambling explanation over

Soz folks, was very grumpy yesterday due to lack of sleep.  Newborn baby just arrived home etc.

Point number 1 is that 7c on its own just doesn't qualify you to be a coach.  I hope anyone with any brains accepts this.  In fact, I would say coaching link is although not orthogonal to climbing skill - there's clearly a dependency - you don't need to be brilliant to coach brilliantly.  Other sports are full of examples like this (notably football).  There's no reason to think that climbing gets some kind of special ticket.

Point 2: I said *ANY* pullups, and didn't say all.  If I were to put more flesh on it, I would have put

* women often lack upper body strength from day 1: classic novice behaviour for men is to pull hard and fail; for women who cannot pull so hard it is to use flexibility and technique - and indeed this means that lots of novice women are much better than novice men

* this greater technique and flex allows women to progress more quickly.  Human nature means that they will gravitate towards the slabs, vertical techyness etc. and avoid their weak spots = overhanging, burly terrain

* Most women are shorter.  They can't lank like some 7c merchants who can only do a few pullups.  To get big moves done they often need to either use fuckloads of technique and flex (typical on slabs), or lots of dynamic power (overhangs)

* Thus, women often get to a point where they are a bit scared of overhanging terrain, because they are relatively shit at it.  They need to learn some new technique on it as well as getting strong, and weights and other strength exercises supplement and accelerate that process.

* However, not addressing the gaping hole in their climbing portfolio often leads to plateauing.  At about V4, in my experience.

Anyone got anything constructive to say about that?

P.S. Benching for shoulder stability, fine, but just do pressups.  No climber needs to bench their own body weight unless they want to pull with the beauty of their breasts.

[i.munro]

P.S. Benching for shoulder stability, fine, but just do pressups.  No climber needs to bench their own body weight unless they want to pull with the beauty of their breasts.

My understanding (& bear in mind I may have garbled what I was told by a physio) is that typically climbers have overdeveloped, short pecs & underdeveloped serratus anterior.
Therefore what she advised me to do is work on the serratus. This is involved in a bench press if you have good posture & technique but most don't.  If you don't then a press/push up  will simply make the situation worse as you will make the pecs even stronger in relation to the poor serratus.


further strengthen the pecs.

[TobyD]

What fucking part of "any" do you not understand, 7c wad man?

I don't give a shit how hard you punter along. Doesn't mean you know anything.
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charmed i'm sure. i was merely trying to make the point that your grade boundaries for suitability of various styles of training may vary wildly between people. perhaps i should have just said that. i don't give a shit how hard i punter along either really.

clearly coaches don't need to be adepts, and i am neither, however i do have a working knowledge of exercise physiology, go climbing a lot and interested in training.  i was merely contributing in the same way that you were.

[krymson]

i thought she made a pretty valid point
there is a huge difference between no pullups and 6 pullups.

I'm a dude(as if it wasn't obvious) and last week I tried coaching a very light, lanky girl with pretty decent finger strength and strength to weight ratio on an overhanging  V2

I thought i had been doing the problem as efficiently and "weakly" as possible, but when I saw her on(or maybe i should say off it!) it, I realized I had been using significant core strength, shoulder strength, and lock off power that she absolutely did not have.

[Motown]

Make use of what you have got is surely key. (Perhaps foolishly) recently moved to country with only two bits of rock in it so have adapted a gym routine to reflect this, but hopefully will sustain some level of climbing fitness for holidays.

The best climb able rock is underground and dirty so footwork has decreased in importance... So, use gym to work on pull up strength with maximum pull ups using different grips, followed by lat pull downs of over body-weight, followed by single armed lat pull downs at maximum weight. I would like to build up to a one armed pull up and am certainly increasing in strength.

Finger strength has been kept with using only rock available although fingerboard is due to arrive any day.

On other days I do circuits which blast legs, chest, shoulders and heart which has kept me trim (ish)

The result - I can feel the increased strength in my (limited) climbing but need more work on fingers to maintain climbing level.

IMHO your gym time would be best used on pull ups that increase in intensity, but would be best with something like rock rings that could develop finger strength.

Unless your a porker, then Get on a tread mill.

[quejada]

I suppose the bottomline is that different routines/training systems suit different climbers. I'm afraid that going to the weight room would probably feel too strong a commitment in terms of money, effort and learning curve (never properly done it before), whereas fingerboard, I know it quite well and I'm sure I can get more satisfaction out of it in 45 min...(hopefully).
we'll see....