[Jaspersharpe]

Yeah probably my fault. By "freely available" I meant that anyone can get it rather than it's actually free.

By the way, is that Randy Leavitt article that Pete mentioned about how he likes using Windows 7?

[Johnny Brown]

there aren't any records of any contributions from Alan James, UKC or Rockfax to the north wales bolt fund in the last 20 years.

The North Wales Bolt Fund was established in 2008.

So are there two funds? Or was it just ukboltfund that was established in 2008?

[ianv]

So, post acquisition there would presumably have been some value attributed to that acquisition on UKclimbing's balance sheet. He must have paid something for it!

My guess on what has happened is:

Over the last 4 years he has written down the value of the acquisition, thus reducing the value of the balance sheet. Less tax, better cash flow and the ability with a straight face to declare that his business is not profitable and he cant affort to support bolt funds .

Of course, he could also be paying himself a  big dividend or making a loss but we will never know.

[Doylo]

how long have i got to get my proj done before you go to print

Come on Ian, you've only had 20 years  same here though..

[Jaspersharpe]

So, post acquisition there would presumably have been some value attributed to that acquisition on UKclimbing's balance sheet. He must have paid something for it!

My guess on what has happened is:

Over the last 4 years he has written down the value of the acquisition, thus reducing the value of the balance sheet. Less tax, better cash flow and the ability with a straight face to declare that his business is not profitable and he cant affort to support bolt funds .

Of course, he could also be paying himself a  big dividend or making a loss but we will never know.

Alan has explained the company setup on the other thread:

Accounts - yes, UKClimbing Limited is the single company that runs both. It is actually the old Rockfax Limited which we switched names on when Rockfax bought UKC. Rockfax Limited (the old UKClimbing.com Limited) is just there as a dormant company.

[shurt]

Its funny how that with Alan's answer on the other side about the contributions to the bolt fund his assertion that he will not deal with Pete "on any level, on any topic" is not quite true. Pete raised the issue on here which was in turn mentioned on UKC. This whole discussion has (albeit a few times removed) opened up lines of communication between the two.

Could this be the basis for a form of reconciliation in the future? Or is that wishful thinking?

[tomtom]

Could this be the basis for a form of reconciliation in the future?

[ianto9]

how long have i got to get my proj done before you go to print

Come on Ian, you've only had 20 years  same here though..

Ha i know m8 ,fell off last move twice last week,back to climbing once a week again at the moment,sucks

[account_inactive]

Just remembered to donate to the fund. Rockfax shame on you

[petejh]

there aren't any records of any contributions from Alan James, UKC or Rockfax to the north wales bolt fund in the last 20 years.

The North Wales Bolt Fund was established in 2008.

So are there two funds? Or was it just ukboltfund that was established in 2008?

It's just the one fund Adam.

This is from Chris, the person who runs it (I know you know that):
'Since its formation in 2008 the NWBF has spent £12976 on drills and other equipment, bolts, resin, servicing drills  and training on safe bolting for re-equipping, establishing good lower-offs and new-routing.

Currently proud owner of 2 brilliant Dewalt 36v drills with extra batteries, a good Bosh 24V and 2 petrol drills. The fund has provided bolts to all areas across North Wales; North Wales Limestone has had massive proportion of the bolts and resin with solid chunks to the Slate and Clwydd and help to the mid-Wales guys.

The NWBF took over from the North Wales Slate Fund - this had been funded by the profits from the 1992 & 1999  Llanberis Slate Guides - in fact the last 400 of the 1999 Slate guidebooks raised over £2000 with Indi Wall,  V12 and Joe Browns managing the 'clear out' taking no profit at all.

Other contributors have been Simon Panton of  Ground Up and Mike Doyle (A55 Sport), and many individual donations from climbers who generously send fivers and tenners every now and then.

For over 5 years year the fund has received all the Winter Aggregate Fees from both the Beacon Climbing and Indi Walls in North Wales  - amounting to between £700 and £1000 each spring - good old boulderers.

Thanks to all donators.'



So there's actually a bit of precedent, at least in N.Wales,  for guidebooks supporting the climbing areas they describe when those areas are heavily reliant on fixed equipment.

New routers have always paid for their own bolts, the bolt fund provides them at cost if people ask but they still have to be bought.  Just wanted to point that out.

FYI the blurb on ukboltfund.org for the NWL bolt fund says:

'The North Wales Bolt Fund was established in 2008. Money is used for re-equipping and subsidising new routing. Assisting primarily in North West Wales Areas but also Clywd, Llanymynedd and Mid-Wales.'

Just want to make sure they have their facts straight.

New routers are subsidised - by being able to purchase bolts from the NWBF at cost price instead of retail. That's what that means.


I'm off out in 15 minutes to glue the bolts in the very cool-looking routes in the tidal zawn which we started on yesterday. Grubes - I'll send you details when I get a chance, they are really ace! You want to hit them on a windy day with dry air. Without wanting to labour the point (!), this is exactly what I'm talking about  - NW Lime is full of quirky hidden venues with brilliant routes but rotten bolts/pegs.

[SA Chris]

Without labouring the point any further this is exactly why this guide is so damn important and needs to sell by the boxload; obscure area gets gear fixed up and rebolted; it gets sufficient write up in new guide for people to be encouraged to go there, people buy guide, people have an amazing experience, more people are encouraged by feedback, routes stay clean due to traffic, everyone has a great time, more money to bolting fund more out of condition routes get a facelift, more people get on them, routes in honeypots see less traffic and crowds and polish. Win Win and Win.

[Doylo]

I can't face posting on there. As is always the case there's a few armchair voices who just don't get it and you'll never get the message over to them. And that bell going on about Africa- give me strength 

[lagerstarfish]

And that bell going on about Africa

Bob Geldof?

[ianv]

I can't face posting on there. As is always the case there's a few armchair voices who just don't get it and you'll never get the message over to them. And that bell going on about Africa- give me strength 

The moral argument seems to be won though. Loving the cross examination of aj by quiddity qc, excellent work 

[highrepute]

Well I've just spent 10minutes on a friday evening reading UKC. not cool.

Seem's like Alan has changed his tune and is scaling back his NWL coverage - whilst trying to save face.

The website looks ace.

Didn't seem like anyone else was going to, so I've made a facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/NorthWalesLimestone

feel free to "like". maybe you should twit about it or something...

[Doylo]

Well I've just spent 10minutes on a friday evening reading UKC. not cool.

Seem's like Alan has changed his tune and is scaling back his NWL coverage - whilst trying to save face.

The website looks ace.

Didn't seem like anyone else was going to, so I've made a facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/NorthWalesLimestone

feel free to "like". maybe you should twit about it or something...

#

cheers. i was just about to do that. Could you make me one of the administrators?

[highrepute]

groups been up 20mins already have 7 likes. suck on that rockfax!

[highrepute]

cheers. i was just about to do that. Could you make me one of the administrators?

should be done

[James Malloch]

Not sure if this is something that you've thought of, but whilst this is all up in the air and more and more people are getting on your side - would there be a possibility of setting up a pre-order for the guide? Might make even more people pay for this now instead of wrongfax.

Would be a good time with the website and FB page going up, get it out there early.

Not sure how viable it would be and if pricing etc has been decided, may be worth a thought...

[Oldmanmatt]

26 right now...

[Doylo]

cheers. i was just about to do that. Could you make me one of the administrators?

should be done

cheers pal, can use the page for bits of news and general interest aswell as guide updates

[Paul B]

if you could find a way of pulling in the daily weather forecast (and dew point) then you might get a page people would go back to etc.

[James Malloch]

Llandudno tide times too - maybe with an optimal climbing time shown either side. Could be handy top get people checking it each time they want to get out.

[crimp]

Website could use link to facebook page

[Potash]

I'd pre order a copy.