Indeed, but I don't think the way to solve that issue is saying that no-one should leave draws in anywhere.
Indeed, but I don't think the way to solve that issue is saying that no-one should leave draws in anywhere. Saying no leaving draws in at crags with sensitive access, or crags where lots of people walk right next to it or whatever makes sense, and people are more likely to listen to that IMO.
Which crag would you like to be our wakeup call?
Sorry. Next time I'll remember to read 'anywhere' as 'at Chee Dale', 'in the UK' or 'at crags with potential access issues'.Quote from: T_B on July 08, 2011, 10:57:04 amThe very fact that someone thought leaving draws in on the Cornice would be OK proves that it's increasingly going to be an issue. Indeed, but I don't think the way to solve that issue is saying that no-one should leave draws in anywhere. Saying no leaving draws in at crags with sensitive access, or crags where lots of people walk right next to it or whatever makes sense, and people are more likely to listen to that IMO. If you say no draws should be left anywhere I'm far more likely to dismiss what you're saying and not take on board the important bit about areas where it's best to strip them every day. I suspect I'm not the only one who works like that.
The very fact that someone thought leaving draws in on the Cornice would be OK proves that it's increasingly going to be an issue.
:D Slackers, does your house have lots of notices around the place? You know, switch the light off. Put the toilet seat down. Remember your keys. Toilet upstairs. ?? You may find this handy when out in the field..... http://www.sitorsquat.com/
and take the rest of your crap (finger tape, bog roll etc) home with you at the same time. It doesn't matter what crag you're on the same principle of leaving it in as pristine condition as possible should surely apply?
Quote from: Norton Sharley on July 08, 2011, 04:10:31 pmand take the rest of your crap (finger tape, bog roll etc) home with you at the same time. It doesn't matter what crag you're on the same principle of leaving it in as pristine condition as possible should surely apply?yeah that's utterly fair enough. All the rest of your post is a bit 'other channel' for my liking
Unless you're a sponsored hero why would you want to leave your own draws in a route to get hammered by people dogging on them/UV?
And here's a UKC classic for you; at what grade does leaving draws in a route become acceptable? Or is about people not being good enough to make quick repeats and having to use siege tactics?
Quote from: Baron on July 09, 2011, 10:33:04 amUnless you're a sponsored hero why would you want to leave your own draws in a route to get hammered by people dogging on them/UV?Because the route is steep.Because the route is long.Because you want to have a redpoint straight away the next day after warming up, not waste time/energy putting clips in.Because your mate wants to have an onsight go the next day.Because there's a section at 30m that you couldn't manage and had to haul the stick up for, but with an extended draw you can just grab it, clip and work that section without the stick.Because I'm a lazy cunt.Quote from: Baron on July 09, 2011, 10:33:04 amAnd here's a UKC classic for you; at what grade does leaving draws in a route become acceptable? Or is about people not being good enough to make quick repeats and having to use siege tactics? At any grade. There's plenty of easy stuff with draws left in for a day or two, or longer, on the continent.Here's a UKC classic for you; at what grade does "having to use siege tactics" become perseverance/dedication. I've yet to hear a 9a climber dissed for sieging something...
Quote from: Baron on July 09, 2011, 10:33:04 amUnless you're a sponsored hero why would you want to leave your own draws in a route to get hammered by people dogging on them/UV?Because the route is steep.Because the route is long....................; at what grade does "having to use siege tactics" become perseverance/dedication. I've yet to hear a 9a climber dissed for sieging something...
jeapordise access in some places / look ugly to non climbers
They aren’t long enough or steep enough for it to be a major faff equipping them.
It’s also a pain for other climbers as Paul B said at the start – lots of people don’t want to climb a route on someone else’s draws, when they don’t know their history etc – especially if they’ve been in situ for a long time.