[tomtom]

As per the title - its rather obviously because the indoor walls are closed but...

Just from my observations - from my little corner of the world - but from my trips out to the Lancs quarries and other esoterica in the region, there seem to be a lot more people out and about on the rock. Looking at my social media feeds it is also clear that many people - including strong mainly indoor climbers are getting out onto rock and getting up lots of hard and often very off the beaten track problems.

I think its really cool - 7C's and above that have only had a handful of ascents by the regular Lancs protagonists have been getting ticks from a whole load of folk who normally don't seem to venture out much, leading to new beta - new tricks and even subsequent downgrades!

I expect there may be some grumbles of "the rock getting worn out" etc.. but for many of the places I go to - its good to see them getting some action and being kept clean...

Is this something being repeated elsewhere in the country?

[jwi]

On the other hand, there are like five people climbing in the Verdon. In middle of June.

[T_B]

Not in the Peak from what I’ve seen. Apart from Lees Bottom and Harborough Rocks I’ve seen 2 other climbers at 11 different venues I’ve climbed at since Lockdown ended. The weirdest thing is hardly anyone is doing trad. Maybe Horseshoe and the Cornice are busy but they would be anyway.

[cheque]

When I was at Stanage a few weekends ago it was as busy as any sunny bank holiday Monday but no busier. I did, however, see a bunch of lads who were obviously strong indoor climbers wandering around, no pads, no guide, clearly not sure when you take your shoes on and off etc. looking for things to climb (on the dirty little rocks down and right of the Unconquerables weirdly enough )while their girlfriends hid in the shade of the glass hour block. I thought it was quite funny at first but as I progressed down the edge I thought about how it could well be a day they look back on fondly as the first of their new lives. They’ll probably have all done The Joker by Christmas.

Unlike T_B I have seen plenty of people out on trad in the Peak (as above, Stanage is as busy as normal, there were a few teams at Rivelin the other week even with the car park shut, moorland venues have been busier than most years, partly from the weather, partly from wanting to go to more obscure venues, partly from not being able to go further afield) I very much doubt any of them are new recruits though!

It must be weird currently to be one of those people who go to the wall three times a week but see “outdoor climbing” as a niche that’s not for them- how many do you think are buying pads and giving it a go compared to those who’ve already forgotten about climbing completely? 

[Offwidth]

I'm still avoiding the Peak park for now. Wharncliffe has seen several people outside for the first time setting up some pretty responsible top rope systems (good research). First time I've ever met such people up there. On the negative side the littering chavs have never been worse.

[Will Hunt]

It seems like almost every time I've been out I've seen new faces.

I've also seen a young comp climber brought to tears because they couldn't climb something quite easy on rock. Through the tears they said, "I just want to go indoors. I just want to climb indoors again". So we may yet see that everybody heads back to plastic when it all blows over.

[Andy F]

I've seen people at Pex who never climbed outside before COVID. Lots of puzzled looks on their faces when they hear the thing they've just fallen off is V1 and they cruise V5/6/7 on the plastic.

It's like learning how to drive after you've been playing Forza for years.

[mrjonathanr]

Not just by the poster above, but I have seen the word 'chav' used a few times on this forum. That's a shame.

It doesn't, as some people assume, mean: ' an oik, my social inferior'
but rather: 'I am a snob who has no insight into how ignorant I look'

Sort it out please.

[abarro81]

On the other hand, writing self-righteous sounding posts with no attempt to back your point up or argue people around to it does of course make you look clever, charming, witty and handsome. 

[tomtom]

Can I call Barrows a scrote then? Or just a malevolent youth?

(please note the smiley all concerned!)

[mrjonathanr]

On the other hand, writing self-righteous sounding posts with no attempt to back your point up or argue people around to it does of course make you look clever, charming, witty and handsome. 

How very dare you. I have NEVER been accused of being clever, charming, witty or handsome and do not intend to start now.

[Offwidth]

Not just by the poster above, but I have seen the word 'chav' used a few times on this forum. That's a shame.

It doesn't, as some people assume, mean: ' an oik, my social inferior'
but rather: 'I am a snob who has no insight into how ignorant I look'

Sort it out please.

I've argued about this before...  in my view pejorative labels need to be fairly deserved... by definition litter louts deserve this even be they from the well educated middle classes. As a counter example those using a phone for their news are not fairly all called idiots in my view (even though some will be).

I think I deserve a bit of anger having cleared several used disposable nappies at Wharncliffe shoved into places that that were a real bastard to access but still visible and smellable.

[mrjonathanr]

I get why you're livid Offwidth, I was fairly enraged by a smattering of sweet wrappers at Burbage and you have clearly cleared up far worse. And I know it's a sanctimonious point from me, but chav just sends out a social message I think is best avoided.

[Offwidth]

Happy to apologise... It was meant as a label for the guilty not a specific estate locatable sector of society.

There seems to be a reduction at Wharncliffe of the special people who put their dog's shit in a plastic bag and then use it to decorate a bush, tree or cracks in a wall. Just a bit more shit on the path. Pendle Hill used to be the favourite haunt of such folk.... never seen it worse than there.... even the sign next to the dog shit bin had its own special black plastic humoured decoration.

[Will Hunt]

What is the correct pejorative term for somebody who sits drinking Strongbow (it's always Strongbow) at the top of the Cow and Calf/Almscliff/any other elevated position in the countryside and leaves their litter behind or throws it over the edge?
"Litter lout" is not nearly strong enough to convey my contempt for them.

[tomtom]

What is the correct pejorative term for somebody who sits drinking Strongbow (it's always Strongbow) at the top of the Cow and Calf/Almscliff/any other elevated position in the countryside and leaves their litter behind or throws it over the edge?
"Litter lout" is not nearly strong enough to convey my contempt for them.

I would have thought its perfectly acceptable to use any of the following.

Johnsons?
Hancocks?
Cummings?

[dunnyg]

I'm not throwing my tinnies over the edge, I am aiming at those nobheads who carry their own mattresses to the rocks and then shout "CUNT" as they fall about a meter, whats that even about? 

[Bradders]

What is the correct pejorative term for somebody who sits drinking Strongbow (it's always Strongbow) at the top of the Cow and Calf/Almscliff/any other elevated position in the countryside and leaves their litter behind or throws it over the edge?
"Litter lout" is not nearly strong enough to convey my contempt for them.

CUNT

YW 

[tomtom]

I'm not throwing my tinnies over the edge, I am aiming at those nobheads who carry their own mattresses to the rocks and then shout "CUNT" as they fall about a meter, whats that even about? 

LOLZ. All about perspective :D

[gme]

Can I call Barrows a scrote then? Or just a malevolent youth?

(please note the smiley all concerned!)

Never been a fan of chav but i love the use of scrote. Feel free to call me it any time.

[gme]

I would suggest that numbers at the honey pots up here , that are still generally quiet, are down but lots of less frequent places being visited going off instagram and looking at UKC logbooks. Everywhere i have been had signs of people being there recently.

This is a good thing but its noticeably the usual suspects out and about not newbies.

[steveri]

I've had an ace chat with a bunch of rough looking rapscallions [cough] new to outdoors. Strong as you like but a bit clueless, hungry as anything to learn and absolutely full of enthusiasm. They'll be converts I'm sure. Redirected another couple stumbling around under shiny new pads nearly but not quite at the crag.

Browsing latest photos on ukc has given a little insight into people casting around for daft little challenges (guilty). Squiggly mobile topos of new or previously ignored rock. Liking it.

[Ged]

I get why you're livid Offwidth, I was fairly enraged by a smattering of sweet wrappers at Burbage and you have clearly cleared up far worse. And I know it's a sanctimonious point from me, but chav just sends out a social message I think is best avoided.

Absolutely agree.  My wife always gets enraged whenever someone makes a derogatory comment about people who live in council houses (just in case you're unaware, Council House Associated Vermin).  It happens alarmingly frequently, and from people who would probably consider themselves to be empathetic liberal types.  It's really not an ok term to use IMO.

It smacks of the other common thing that seemed to be happening post lockdown, which reeked of self important middle class snobbery; referring to a bunch of people using the outdoors as "they aren't real walkers/climbers/bikers/daisy pickers".  Just because they aren't wearing a £500 Arcteryx jacket doesn't mean someone appreciates the outdoors any less than you (unless they leave a mess. In which case lock em up).

[Oldmanmatt]

I get why you're livid Offwidth, I was fairly enraged by a smattering of sweet wrappers at Burbage and you have clearly cleared up far worse. And I know it's a sanctimonious point from me, but chav just sends out a social message I think is best avoided.

Absolutely agree.  My wife always gets enraged whenever someone makes a derogatory comment about people who live in council houses (just in case you're unaware, Council House Associated Vermin).  It happens alarmingly frequently, and from people who would probably consider themselves to be empathetic liberal types.  It's really not an ok term to use IMO.

It smacks of the other common thing that seemed to be happening post lockdown, which reeked of self important middle class snobbery; referring to a bunch of people using the outdoors as "they aren't real walkers/climbers/bikers/daisy pickers".  Just because they aren't wearing a £500 Arcteryx jacket doesn't mean someone appreciates the outdoors any less than you (unless they leave a mess. In which case lock em up).

I thought it was “Council Housed And Violent”?

And misapplied? As in it was originally supposed to refer to specific, gang related, looks and behaviour, then somehow entered the lexicon as a pejorative for “badly behaved” or even “dressed like/look like, they might be badly behaved” (what ever that might mean)?

I don’t object to not using the word, however, does using another pejorative really “mean” something else, or does it just become a euphemism for the term you would have used but chose not to?

Ultimately, the word represents a lifestyle of choice, not an innate or involuntary state of being. My father grew up on council estates. It was a “normal” thing. His parents stayed in a council flat until death and care homes claimed them. They and their neighbours were not Chavs, they would be now (and were then) utterly disgusted by that type of behaviour. They were poor, at least until my Grandfather became foreman at the Foundry, when they almost scraped the lower edges of middle class.
Chav wasn’t a word, then, as far as I know, but the people who would later have that moniker hung in them, certainly existed.
It’s a pejorative for a type of behaviour, rather than strata of society.

Of course, using scrote instead, does have the advantage of covering all people regardless of social standing or wealth, that display undesirable behaviours in the outdoors. 😜

[Ged]

I get why you're livid Offwidth, I was fairly enraged by a smattering of sweet wrappers at Burbage and you have clearly cleared up far worse. And I know it's a sanctimonious point from me, but chav just sends out a social message I think is best avoided.

Absolutely agree.  My wife always gets enraged whenever someone makes a derogatory comment about people who live in council houses (just in case you're unaware, Council House Associated Vermin).  It happens alarmingly frequently, and from people who would probably consider themselves to be empathetic liberal types.  It's really not an ok term to use IMO.

It smacks of the other common thing that seemed to be happening post lockdown, which reeked of self important middle class snobbery; referring to a bunch of people using the outdoors as "they aren't real walkers/climbers/bikers/daisy pickers".  Just because they aren't wearing a £500 Arcteryx jacket doesn't mean someone appreciates the outdoors any less than you (unless they leave a mess. In which case lock em up).

I thought it was “Council Housed And Violent”?

I'm sure it's lots of things.  But they're all going to be pretty insulting to the many, many people who have or do live in council houses.