[kc]

Now Then!
Not wanting to sound elitist. No wanting to be elitist this is the Tor after all. The galv bolt and hanger has been removed from the left hand crux sequence of Sardine. We can’t just go round chucking in crappy bolts left right and center. The place is starting to replicate a dart board. Not only did some poor twat go to a lot of effort (almost single handedly may I add) placing top quality bolts into positions that were sympathetic to the original flavor of the outings. There is also not enough parking spaces at the crag for all the geriatrics and punters from Horseshit quarry to start frequenting the place. Just like all the silly talk of bolting the trad routes down the Cornice. Bugger off to Max Wall. The new RED tat on the Toilet belay was not very clever, this too has gone. Please please let’s keep things tidy.

That sounded all very Self-righteous! Sorry.

[Peanuts]

Not wanting to sound elitist and if you've seen me climb you could not miss the irony there, good !  Sardine is the warm up route at the tor but it is still a good route and you may climb the crux by any of the seventeen approved sequences using the approved  holds    What you may not do is avoid the crux altogether by lanking  up the wall to the left of the route and rejoining it higher up and then spraying about over graded routes. > Do it properly! I wont tell you again 

[shark]

kc,

Who would have thought there was so much pent up rage - you seem so laidback in the real world !

I thought the new bolt was a good idea and made for a less cruxy route at 7b for a single extra bolt. The tor is the unspiritual home of linkups and variations after all.

I don't have a vested interest as I still do it the old way because its hardwired in but thought a new guide could describe the left hand variation.

Due respect for your fastidious and thoughtful bolting and the general theme of not unnecessarily cluttering the tor but unconvinced you've called this particular one right.
 

[Ru]

I'm with KC on this one. Routes are routes, even if the FA didn't take the line of absolute least resistance. If we start a precedent of whacking in extra bolts every time someone finds a slightly easier off route sequence the crag will turn into a right mess.

[Bonjoy]

My main gripe is that it's a shitty non-stainless bolt and stands out like a sore thumb among all Kristian's lovely well placed stainless glue-ins. Cut-price kit on a cut-price version of the route.

[kc]

kc,

Who would have thought there was so much pent up rage - you seem so laidback in the real world !

I thought the new bolt was a good idea and made for a less cruxy route at 7b for a single extra bolt. The tor is the unspiritual home of linkups and variations after all.

 

Funnily enough my chosen method is going left, but it is not so much of an ordeal to traverses back in. I did consider clipping it but it did seem a bit high anyway. This is the second non stainless bolt to be removed from this position. The crux bolt serves 2 routes and a new clippable one out left would put them very close to one another.
Went to Rubicon the other day and saw the new bolts (3/4 years) in Too old to be bold, looking very rusty now. Peoples good intentions gone to waste!

[abarro81]

Routes are routes, even if the FA didn't take the line of absolute least resistance.

Next you'll be telling me I can't use knees on mecca or Stu's method on the extension

Saying you can't use the left hand method is basically saying 'everyone used to be shit at finding holds/sequences so now we have to be shit at finding holds/sequences too'. That aside, the old bolt is clippable by any sequence and as said above neatly serves both sardine and toadside so I think it's cool to remove the new thing.

p.s. Thanks a lot Kristian for all the bolting!

[Ru]

There's a difference between using a different sequence and adding new bolts off the original line.

[Three Nine]

I did sardine today, man its shit.

[kc]

How can you call it shit. According to RockFax it's "Top 50".

More like "Top 50" of its grade.

It would be interesting to see the impact of negative stars being introduced into a guide book, like the old  bag of  symbol.

[Tommy]

kc,

I thought the new bolt was a good idea and made for a less cruxy route at 7b for a single extra bolt. The tor is the unspiritual home of linkups and variations after all.

7b? 7b?! That's outrageous. I failed to redpoint that route for the whole season because of that new suggested sequence. I partly blame you of course.

[mrjonathanr]

It was E5 when I first did it.  It's the proper grade you know.

[shark]

kc,

I thought the new bolt was a good idea and made for a less cruxy route at 7b for a single extra bolt. The tor is the unspiritual home of linkups and variations after all.

7b? 7b?! That's outrageous. I failed to redpoint that route for the whole season because of that new suggested sequence. I partly blame you of course.

IIRC you should blame that lanky fucker who knackered your finger for sending you that way.

It's as big a variation as Toadside and should be described seperately.

In the meantime, at 7b, justice is served for those claiming to tick Sardine.

[Tommy]

Ah really? It was the silver fox?

That means he's now to blame for knackering my finger, nearly killing me at Masson Lees and for denying me my Sardine quality experience.

[abarro81]

It's as big a variation as Toadside and should be described seperately.

You must have been smoking a lot of crack recently.

[shark]

It's as big a variation as Toadside and should be described seperately.

You must have been smoking a lot of crack recently.

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided whilst Toadside only adds a couple of moves into the Sardine crux and some unmemorable moves higher up. Sardine direct would be just as apt. However, I defer to your greater knowledge of exploiting variations, eliminates and extensions.

[abarro81]

IMO Toadside is a direct start/alternative finish, the two ways on the crux are just different sequences on the same route...

However, I defer to your greater knowledge of shamelessly and repeatedly exploiting variations, eliminates and extensions in order to show Stu who's boss on the 8a.nu rankings.

[Three Nine]

Stu had to ask me for beta yesterday; he's no threat to you anymore.

[TobyD]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

[benpritch]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

only a 100 people have done Brad Pitt? I thought nearly everyone had done it.

[shark]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

No, because only Jason did it that way then everyone else used the heel so that became the established way to do it whereas Sardine has been repeated following Ron's line for over 25 years so that is the established way to do it.

Also I don't think the way Jason did Brad Pitt was absurd and deserves massive kudos especially as he was originally shit at dynos and jumped out backwards on Chouca.

[Jim]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

No, because only Jason did it that way

Our survey says:
egh err

[shark]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

No, because only Jason did it that way

Our survey says:
egh err

you know what I mean

[jwi]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

No, because only Jason did it that way

And Willenberg.

[shark]

I thought so given that Sardine is a cruxy route characterised by unusual moves which are now avoided ... Sardine direct would be just as apt.

by the same rationale are you denying 98% of Brad Pitt ascentionists their tick, because they didn't use the absurd original method, and proposing that it should have a new name when climbed as such?

No, because only Jason did it that way

And Willenberg.