[Dave Westlake]

Hi,

I'm writing an article, and I have a feeling that Rosanna (cascade sector, Ceuse) was the first 8a route in France. 

Problem is I can't seem to find any confirmation of this on the web.

Can anyone confirm this is true? or put me straight..?

Many thanks,
Dave

[SA Chris]

There was a record of first routes at each grade on Planet fear once, but can't find it now. Chmpanzodrome (sp?) at Soissois (sp?) rings a bell, but that could just be first one onsighted (by Jerry his self).

[Jaspersharpe]

Chimpanzadrome's 7c+. Well it gets 7c+ but it's Old Skool and probably 8a in reality (and grim).

The first was Reve. Climbed by a 15 year old Mark LeWADestrel in 1983.

There were other 8as done in '83 - Fritz The Cat at Saussois (by Jean-Pierre Bouvier), Crépinette at Eaux-Claires  (by Fabrice Guillot) and one by Edlinger (on the West Face at Buoux?) I think but I'm pretty sure Reve was first.

[Ena]

There was a record of first routes at each grade on Planet fear once, but can't find it now.

Found it! http://www.planetfear.com/articles/Sport_Climbing_Records_Page_315.html It does seem to repeat itself!

[Jaspersharpe]

That list is a total sack of shit.

[jwi]

Have you seen this: http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/2212/lesprit.htm  ?

L'Europe aborde le 8a.

Les grimpeurs du Vieux Continent enregistrent la leçon américaine en se hissant dès 83 au 8a avec Jean-Pierre Bouvier et Fritz the cat au Saussois, Patrick Edlinger dans Ça glisse au pays des merveilles à Buoux, Fabrice Guillot dans Crépinette aux Eaux-Claires et Marc Le Ménestrel, 15 ans (!), dans Rêve de papillon à Buoux. De son côté, Jerry Moffatt réalise The Face; un gros 8a/8a+ sur la falaise allemande de l'Altmühtal, une voie qui sera répétée l'année suivante par un jeune allemand inconnu, Stéfan Glowacz, suivi par Antoine Le Ménestrel et Jibé Tribout. A Bleau, Pierre Richard réalise le premier 7c bloc, l'Abbé Résina, alors que Catherine Destivelle fait le premier 7a féminin, la Dudulle.

Looking on http://www.grimporama.com/francais/images/ph_saussois.htm it seems like Bouvier put up "You are what you is", 8a, in 1982.

[Jaspersharpe]

http://www.grimporama.com/francais/images/ph_saussois04.htm

Great photo.

Didn't know that was '82 although I've seen the route. Bouvier is a legend.

[SA Chris]

That list is a total sack of shit.

Aye, it's a lot guffier than I remember. I think it was set up as a work in progress, then died.

[a dense loner]

Bouvier is a legend.

shame he then moved on to shuffling sideways in font, but i do agree. probably what you have to do when you've done most other things

[jwi]

Looking on http://www.grimporama.com/francais/images/ph_saussois.htm it seems like Bouvier put up "You are what you is", 8a, in 1982.

Apparently "You are what you is" was 7c+ when it was first put up.

There used to be some french list that listed first routes for every grade, the site is down but google have a cache
http://209.85.129.132/search?q=cache:Ruc9fQTnm_IJ:climbingaway.free.fr/culture/hat.php

[Jaspersharpe]

That site gives ça glisse au pays des merveilles (the Edlinger thing at Buoux) as the first and Reve as the 3rd. Even more confusion! 

Is ça glisse on the West Face or something? I don't remember ever seeing it on any topos and I used to know the place backwards.

[fatdoc]

There was a record of first routes at each grade on Planet fear once, but can't find it now. Chmpanzodrome (sp?) at Soissois (sp?) rings a bell, but that could just be first one onsighted (by Jerry his self).

Chimp was 1st iirc
Then down graded, though IMO it was & is 8a

Reve got 8a on the most famous cliff in the world at the time, amazing ascent. Grade stuck

Fwiw I think chino is harder than reve, even with my thin fingers, both damn fine routes

The first 8a will always be a bit conjectural. I'm sure jerrys flash of chimp made sure it never got the 8 it deserved ;-)

[cofe]

I'm sure jerrys flash of chimp made sure it never got the 8 it deserved ;-)

Pop trivia: he flashed it the day of his 21st birthday too.

[Falling Down]

I'm sure jerrys flash of chimp made sure it never got the 8 it deserved ;-)

Pop trivia: he flashed it the day of his 21st birthday too.

I'm sure he told me that he only tied on with a loop around his waist or a sling for a harness as he was so convinced he was going to flash it. Perhaps all will be revealed next week ??

[cofe]

"I had decided to flash Chimpanzodrome on my birthday and was beside myself with excitement. If I could pull this off, it would be the ultimate birthday imaginable. At the same time, failure would be horrific. The pressure was on."

Books arrive Monday. I'm not sleeping well at the minute.

[Ru]

I did Champanzodrome in sumer 2007 and thought it was ok for 7c+, no harder than, say, Rooster Booster which was from around the same time. I did Reve a few days later and thought it was a bit harder, despite flashing it and not flashing Chimpanzodrome. Having said that I tried to flash Chimpanzodrome with no warm up after arriving there following a 10+ hours drive from Manchester. It's quite a nice line through a little double wave of rock, and it tops out. You Are What You Is and the variation on it Fritz the Cat, are 5m high slabs with 2 cemented pegs for gear on a tiny little buttress tucked away in some woods next to a canal. Not at all what you'd expect really.

[The Sausage]

I Have a Martin Atkinson guide "French Rock Climbs" from 1990.
In the history section it says:
"...The year is 1983 and suddenly the barrier of 8a is broken, the claim for the first is a matter of some discussion, but three people certainly climbed 8a routes withina short period. Indeed, according to the diaries of Marc LeMenestral and Fabrice Guilot, the first ascents of Reve d'un Papilon (Buoux) and Crepinette (Eaux Claires) were made on the same day. In the same week Edlinger added Ca Glisse aux Pays des Merveilles, also at Buoux."

[fatdoc]

I did Champanzodrome in sumer 2007 and thought it was ok for 7c+, no harder than, say, Rooster Booster which was from around the same time. I did Reve a few days later and thought it was a bit harder, despite flashing it and not flashing Chimpanzodrome. Having said that I tried to flash Chimpanzodrome with no warm up after arriving there following a 10+ hours drive from Manchester. It's quite a nice line through a little double wave of rock, and it tops out. You Are What You Is and the variation on it Fritz the Cat, are 5m high slabs with 2 cemented pegs for gear on a tiny little buttress tucked away in some woods next to a canal. Not at all what you'd expect really.

fairy snuff.. though if you can use 2 finger stacks and not monos on the chimp crux you'll be having a much better time than most. chimp was my 1st 7c+ (2nd 7c iirc..) so my opinion could be skewed

the ist 8 On the same day!!!! awesome.... I love this history stuff.. great thread.

[jwi]

Yes fantastic thread!

So to sum up: "You are what you is" was the first 8a, but is to short/shit to count, first real 8a in France was in 83?

[Ru]

Chimpanzodrome is certainly hard for 7c+ and there are definitely easier 8as around, but what I meant was that I didn't think it wrong at 7c+ compared to other 7c+s from the same era.

Another historical route is right next to Chimpanzodrome, Le Bidule. I think that this was the first 8a+ in France, done in 84, same year as Revelations - I'm not sure which came first. It's also similar to Revelations in that it has a hard start into an easier finish and is about the same length. Bidule also has a runout slab to finish. I think the FA was a race between the Menestrels and Jibe - I'm not sure who got there first, the Saussois guide attributes it to all of them.

[grimer]

Ah, what you'll need is a book that contains all these facts in an interesting, amuzing anecdotal format 

[mrjonathanr]

That site gives ça glisse au pays des merveilles (the Edlinger thing at Buoux) as the first and Reve as the 3rd. Even more confusion! 

Is ça glisse on the West Face or something? I don't remember ever seeing it on any topos and I used to know the place backwards.

It's on the walls to your right as you descend the road before it turns left to take you past the colonie de vacances. ie vaguely opposite face ouest but a bit lower down. Jibe did an early 8a called voyager something or other, not sure which crag,but not the first. Probably the first E7 is Berhault's La Haine, given 7c+ at La Loubiere, 3 really hard moves. Couldn't link it and I had climbed 8a at the time, tho better on stamina and La Haine is pure power. Chimpanzodrome has varied in grade, going down to 7c but probably settled at 7c+ I think

[Andy Harris]

I thought Ca Glisse was on the crag above the auberge to the right of the boute de monde. Climbing was banned here shortly after the route was climbed?

[mrjonathanr]

I may be wrong (sometimes happens ) but I wasn't aware that there was any climbing directly above the auberge at any time, can't imagine Pierre would have tolerated that under any circumstances. Anthoine used to gaze longingly at the big wall behind the house but Pierre was was clear that he might as well be gazing at the moon. Knowing the family doesn't make me the authority on Buoux tho and like I said,  you may be correct. Be interested to know.
Jon

[Jaspersharpe]

It's an amazing bit of crag. A real shame that it's banned.