[Liam Copley]

I've been there when he has crushed font 8a (flash) in Val Di Mello, he also did a long standing project of 8a+ too. this was in July, i have no reason to doubt these further claims of crushing.

Am I right in thinking that this is the only person ever to have come forward and say they have seen scott climb hard?

I have a picture of Scott on The Ace ??? if that counts?, Lol!. Of course people have seen him crush things, I missed him send The Ace becuase I got to the crag late, OR he got there too early on his bike!

[Jim]

you got a picture of him on the ace after he had done it but couldn't do it again, is that correct?

If this lad is as good as his claims are, then he's putting people like ryan and the champ to shame. He should be on the british team ffs!
why isn't he impressing down the wall when he's come from a indoor background?
Why has no-one seen him climb anything in the peak?

We would all love for these claims to be true but without a shread of evidence and suspect spotters/situations then the climbing community is not going to believe it.
Saying thing like "I would trust him with my life" etc is not evidence so please stop typing bullshit like that!!!!!

[Liam Copley]

you got a picture of him on the ace after he had done it but couldn't do it again, is that correct?

If this lad is as good as his claims are, then he's putting people like ryan and the champ to shame. He should be on the british team ffs!
why isn't he impressing down the wall when he's come from a indoor background?
Why has no-one seen him climb anything in the peak?

We would all love for these claims to be true but without a shread of evidence and suspect spotters/situations then the climbing community is not going to believe it.
Saying thing like "I would trust him with my life" etc is not evidence so please stop typing bullshit like that!!!!!

No, I said I have a picture of him on the ace, on my pc. I didn't take the photo, I was having a bit of laugh mate, I know you would like some evidence, UKB spent all last night telling me this. Scott is away in font which is going to slow things down, lets just calm down now until then?

[Liam Copley]

I meant that I just have a photograph of him on it..

[GCW]

lets just calm down now until then?

Is that



or



?

[tc]

With apologies to those who also had their heads bent out of shape over the SOC hoax, I dragged the following up from the mists of time as it seems to be relevant to the current debate. At the very least, it gets my thinking straight on the matter:

Sadly, people have been fabricating stuff for years (McCallum, Maestri, Cesen, Mr X in Northumberland, Gibson, O'Connor and many more). The problem has always been in 'proving' a negative. However, if someone claims to have redpointed/ soloed 8c, headpointed E9, bouldered V15 (or done the first ascent of Cerro Torre) and NO ONE has ever witnessed them climbing at this standard at any time, then it's probably a safe bet to assume they haven't. It's called concensus credibility and it usually works well.
Would you believe a claim by a hitherto totally unknown runner to have run 100 metres in a new world record time, timing himself on an empty track with no witnesses present?
In the case of SOC, the smokescreens he generated and the refusal to provide simple answers to simple questions (i.e. "who belayed you on"...oh, I dunno...The Very Big and the Very Small, for example) inevitably coloured my view of his claims. In the absence of compelling substantiating evidence I simply do not believe any of them.
 
For example, and at a more modest level, I have done some of my best bouldering during solitary wanderings with my dog as spotter (being alone concentrates the mind and is often a far more intense and pure experience). However, if I then return with tales of a hard new problem, the claim has credibility as I have actually been seen climbing at this standard on boulders in the Peak, the Lakes, Northumbria, Wales, Scotland, Font, Austria, Switzerland and the States and during my 'misspent' 1990s at various comps - a highly critical audience and a situation in which it is impossible to cheat -, playing on stuff, training with other credible players, setting problems of a similar standard to those claimed for competitions, etc. And, crucially, I am not claiming cutting edge new problems at V12 and above. Thus, logically, I am free to continue my solitary explorations without a camcorder or attendant media team to provide evidence. I can even shape up like a complete punter and flail miserably on a lowly V-easy in the full glare of publicity if I'm having a bad day, and no one gives a fuck. And sometimes, when I do pull one out of the bag, there are people there to witness it.

It is this credibility that seems to be lacking.

[craic-head]

Tell you what, some youths playing fantasy football with 'rumoured ascents' is almost preferable to the 'little fish' nonsense above. Haven't read such pretentious tosh in a long time.

[Monolith]

Tell you what, some youths playing fantasy football with 'rumoured ascents' is almost preferable to the 'little fish' nonsense above. Haven't read such pretentious tosh in a long time.

 

Pretentious: "expressive of affected, unwarranted, or exaggerated importance, worth, or stature <pretentious language>"

Which was in complete opposition to my demeanour and my intentions within this thread craic-head. I started climbing around the same age as Liam and with similar enthusiasm. I admittedly wondered off-topic in an attempt to usefully impart some advice to a very keen youngster at the outset of his career in the hope that rather than getting disillusioned with the 'community' and encounter hostility when he moves to Sheffield, he might start to see that the division between the online world and the liklihood of meeting people that use this forum is not so great.

If attempting to construct an argument with an analogy is pretentious in your mind, I think you best sit a short philosophy course. Thinking and attempting to formulate rational arguments does not make an individual pretentious.

[Liam Copley]

Tell you what, some youths playing fantasy football with 'rumoured ascents' is almost preferable to the 'little fish' nonsense above. Haven't read such pretentious tosh in a long time.

 

Pretentious: "expressive of affected, unwarranted, or exaggerated importance, worth, or stature <pretentious language>"

Which was in complete opposition to my demeanour and my intentions within this thread craic-head. I started climbing around the same age as Liam and with similar enthusiasm. I admittedly wondered off-topic in an attempt to usefully impart some advice to a very keen youngster at the outset of his career in the hope that rather than getting disillusioned with the 'community' and encounter hostility when he moves to Sheffield, he might start to see that the division between the online world and the liklihood of meeting people that use this forum is not so great.

If attempting to construct an argument with an analogy is pretentious in your mind, I think you best sit a short philosophy course. Thinking and attempting to formulate rational arguments does not make an individual pretentious.

I know the division is not great at all. But thanks for informing me anyway, I didn't actually intend to 'upset' people, and to be honest I didn't think NECimbing.co.uk was that popular and I wasn't expecting that many views, as I was waiting for some more info before I was to put it on a bigger site like UKC. I just thought that nec could do with a bit of news, and didn't the regulars of nec would request much more evidence. I could have guessed that everybody would have found out, but possibly not so soon, and also I thought I would have got more info very soon to be ready to put on bigger sites. Which then raises the question of, why did I put it on nec? Well, I was just bored and wasn't expecting this kind of responce, my perception of how the internet speeds things up was not very good.

[benpritch]

Hi liam, would you mind posting the photo of scott on the ace i would really like to see it

[Liam Copley]

Hi liam, would you mind posting the photo of scott on the ace i would really like to see it

Yeah, of course.

I was on my nanas pc when he sent me it so it might be tommorow when you get it, I'll email it to you or just put it on here. I'm sure scott or the photographer wont mind?, I'll try and ask scott tonight, then send/post it tommorow.

[benpritch]

thanks Liam - which move is he on?

[north_country_boy]

This phot was posted ages ago when he claimed to have done it. I believe Bonjoy found it on Facebook?? (correct me if wrong)

However it is in no way conclusive of Scott doing or indeed not doing the problem:

In the words of one individual: "I Have a picture of myself looking stronger on that move and I'm shit!!!"

(If it is the same picture which looks like it was taken with a timer and the camera sat on a rock....)

[Liam Copley]

thanks Liam - which move is he on?

On the photo, he has his left hand on the LH joker hold and has just placed his foot on the jug and his RH is on the jug.

[benpritch]

funny to take a pic of the easiest move on the problem?

[slackline]

thanks Liam - which move is he on?

T'is here for (cross-)reference.

[benpritch]

hi Liam to put it in context to get your foot to there is about font 6c/7a?. The problem is 8b. Also the fact there is no spotter means that scott must be very bold indeed. I've seen quite a few wild exits from nearly every move on this. Do you know who took it and why there are no photos of the rest of the problem.

[Liam Copley]

hi Liam to put it in context to get your foot to there is about font 6c/7a?. The problem is 8b. Also the fact there is no spotter means that scott must be very bold indeed. I've seen quite a few wild exits from nearly every move on this. Do you know who took it and why there are no photos of the rest of the problem.

I have no idea if there are any other photos, there might be loads. Scott had it as his display picture on msn, and i said send us that.
I'm sure whoever took the photo took more than one

[benpritch]

I think you would be doing Scott a massive favour by hunting these photos down and posting them asap. I really really want to see them. all the best ben.
ps get someone who has seen him do these things to come on here as well. It is only because his claims are so impressive that we want to see evidence. I really want to be blown away.

[north_country_boy]

thanks Liam - which move is he on?

T'is here for (cross-)reference.

Thats the one. Conclusive. I'm sure everyone will agree?? 

[Nigel]

Fucking hell guys, this is one of the worst cases of shooting the messenger I've seen for a long time!

As I see it - If my mate told me something direct to my face then I'm afraid I have to side with Liam and say that I would probably believe him. If I pressed them on the issue by getting them to proof read an article about there own brilliance and they still gave the thumbs up then I probably wouldn't feel too outside the box publishing it. Especially on NECROclimbing or whatever. Further to that Liam seems to be conducting himself pretty sensibly so can we please stop condescending to him?

The real issue is Scott and I guess it has all been said before.

[Liam Copley]

I think you would be doing Scott a massive favour by hunting these photos down and posting them asap. I really really want to see them. all the best ben.
ps get someone who has seen him do these things to come on here as well. It is only because his claims are so impressive that we want to see evidence. I really want to be blown away.

I would post them If i could, But I only have that one, which you have all seen, I wouldn't know where to go to find any others, I will just have to wait to talk to him. I' sure people will come forward soon, or as soon as they know that they are needed.

[casa]

I'm sorry i had to post, i've been belly laughing too much it hurts since that photo.

For me that is total proof that he's done it. What's the matter wiv all you doubters!!! Shame on you.

Now i'm knowhere near this level but i am a rock fanatic and i've been an avid reader of OTE for many many years (is it still going by the way, it used to be well good honest) and i've seen all the pictures of the main men on this exact move and they looked well composed extactly the same (and maybe a move or two higher and they cant be that harder surely). And obviously Malc crushed it didn't he? 

All in good fun eh.

[account_inactive]

No disrespect casa but that picture proves nothing.

From what I know:

The Ace has 3 moves (and a match move at the top)

Scott is pictured on the 1st move (about 6c/7aish)

The move to match the Joker holds is the second move (7b+/7c ish)

The original Joker method starting with left foot on and going to the top (hard 8a) is the 3rd and hardest


So as Ben points out this does not prove anything.  Other 'stars' like Malc are seen crushing hard all the time

[Paul B]

I can't tell if you're being serious but in case you are:

Now i'm knowhere near this level

Don't worry that was made completely clear by your post....

and maybe a move or two higher and they cant be that harder surely

I guess not, just a really short 8a that has an alarming number of subtleties...

Not to mention that a fair few people on this board (who, it's safe to say aren't shit) have got to that move and a lot further but STILL haven't ticked it.

And...in case someone starts shouting 'jealous', it's simply not the case. People WANT to believe.

I'd also like to add that in my opinion if you're using the heel beta, if your foot doesn't slide perfectly from the placement into the toe lock, you're off or f*cked for the rest of it.