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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by Bradders on Yesterday at 01:13:44 pm »

Faiza Shaheen had support from and had been selected by her CLP.

Do we want to be run by a Party built top down by a tiny band of people who have got there by lying and are mostly preoccupied with their own empowerment. It's not clear to me what their general policy aims are even (I guess they're hawkish on foreign policy but other than that I have no idea).

I've explained above why I think an overreliance on members deciding national policy is mental. Obviously I don't want autocracy either, its a balancing act.

Full agree.

Speaking of "people who...are mostly preoccupied with their own empowerment", is anyone more guilty of that than Diane Abbott? She seems determined to throw as many hand grenades into Labour's campaign as she can purely so she can keep her job, instead of bowing out with some semblance of dignity and grace.

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by monkoffunk on Yesterday at 12:48:12 pm »

The status quo is that the people running us have lied to get where they are and are preoccupied with power. That’s not the Labour Party currently.

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by ToxicBilberry on Yesterday at 12:43:24 pm »

In the sense that that’s how power works. A small group of people implement top down policies often controlling the public perception through false binaries to maintain their position and implement their ideology. Which at the moment is a sort of left-capitalism leaning towards a sort of corporate totalitarian regime. I think it gets called a few things e.g. stakeholder capitalism or ‘the third way’. Etc

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by monkoffunk on Yesterday at 12:33:19 pm »

In what sense?

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by ToxicBilberry on Yesterday at 12:23:48 pm »

He is describing the status quo

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by monkoffunk on Yesterday at 12:01:56 pm »

Do we want to be run by a Party built top down by a tiny band of people who have got there by lying and are mostly preoccupied with their own empowerment. It's not clear to me what their general policy aims are even (I guess they're hawkish on foreign policy but other than that I have no idea).

Out of context you’d be forgiven for thinking you are describing the status quo, certainly that first part. The answer is surely not.

The Labour Party was designed to be built bottom up by trade unionists and people who chose to be members and volunteers.

The NEC has a wide range of representation (officers from the leadership, CLP representatives, trade union representatives, etc) 36 out of 39 are elected by their constituencies to make decisions on behalf of eligible voters on governance. This allows some, but not total, central control of a national party in a democratic fashion.

A situation where a CLP could elect anybody to be the candidate without any kind of broader oversight is simply nonsense for obvious reasons.

87

shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by ToxicBilberry on Yesterday at 12:00:33 pm »

Faiza Shaheen had support from and had been selected by her CLP.

Do we want to be run by a Party built top down by a tiny band of people who have got there by lying and are mostly preoccupied with their own empowerment. It's not clear to me what their general policy aims are even (I guess they're hawkish on foreign policy but other than that I have no idea).

The Labour Party was designed to be built bottom up by trade unionists and people who chose to be members and volunteers.

It’s exactly this Stone, they don’t want her in parliament due to pro Palestine views seen as potentially destabilising both internally and with the wider public who’s perception is that everything that ‘goes with’ more extreme left politics e.g. rapid cultural change, as having a detrimental affect on their lives.

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by Will Hunt on Yesterday at 11:44:43 am »

Lets look at the comparison and remember that at the end of the day it’s going to be a Tory or Labour government.

No it isn't. It's going to be a labour government. The only doubt is the size of their majority.

I don't think it's that clear cut yet. Polls always narrow towards election day. Definitely scope for a hung parliament or a slim enough majority to be a problem for Labour.

I don't see the candidate selection as being inept. I see it as being utterly ruthless factionalism. I think an element of it is performative. They want to reassure everyone that they have "permanently Changed Labour" -and deselecting a lefty economist is part of that.

Regarding Starmer not being at the centre of this is BS IMO. It is people from his leadership campaign who are doing this.

There's no real evidence for this view is there? Is John McDonnell standing? Surely if what you're saying is true then he would have been a prime target for deselection?

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by spidermonkey09 on Yesterday at 11:34:25 am »

Faiza Shaheen had support from and had been selected by her CLP.

Do we want to be run by a Party built top down by a tiny band of people who have got there by lying and are mostly preoccupied with their own empowerment. It's not clear to me what their general policy aims are even (I guess they're hawkish on foreign policy but other than that I have no idea).

I've explained above why I think an overreliance on members deciding national policy is mental. Obviously I don't want autocracy either, its a balancing act.

The Labour Party was designed to be built bottom up by trade unionists and people who chose to be members and volunteers.

The Labour party has not won an election for 19 years. Prior to 1997 it had not won for 17 years. I do not consider it controversial to think that whatever it was doing in those years was not working, so I'm happy enough to try a different model. as MoF said, for me there are bigger concerns right now than Labour internal politics.

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shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024

« Last post by Duma on Yesterday at 11:32:00 am »

I don't see the candidate selection as being inept. I see it as being utterly ruthless factionalism. I think an element of it is performative. They want to reassure everyone that they have "permanently Changed Labour" -and deselecting a lefty economist is part of that.

Regarding Starmer not being at the centre of this is BS IMO. It is people from his leadership campaign who are doing this. They have now been parachuted in as parliamentary candidates themselves at the last minute so as to bypass any CLP involvement in their own selection. https://www.thenational.scot/news/24355642.luke-akehurst-labour-pick-extremist-israel-lobbyist-safe-seat/

This.