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21
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by Oldmanmatt on Today at 07:30:57 am »
You’d have to translate your response into a cogent argument as to why you think elite theory is nonsense. Otherwise it reads like an ad hominem attempt to humiliate.

Fine.

But:

If you plump for the melodramatic, I’ll swing back with a balloon on a stick and silly makeup.

I think you are projecting your own anger and frustration onto THE PEOPLE at large and I do not think that’s how it works, not anymore.

One: The Genie is out of the bottle, education is virtually universal in the Western world and way more common beyond that, than it was even fifty years ago. We can argue about social media and whipping up extremism, but it swings both ways and I’m not so sure a sustainable push to one extreme or the other is as easy as all that.

Two: Thinking of the conditions that lead to real revolution, historically, we are still a long way short of the kind of oppression, poverty and societal injustice, required to provoke 70% of the “low masses”(is that what you called them/us? Charmed, I’m sure. Please do not consider a career in PR, speaking as a friend there) to rise up blah blah.

Absolutely poverty still exists and is dire in many cases, huge disparity is real. However, in the Western world (and increasingly beyond) it has a very different colour to that which existed as little as 100 years ago. My Grandfather (paternal) grew up in Coventry, in a single, rented room, with one bed, thirteen brothers and sisters, three of whom died before the age of five, a mother who “took in laundry” and a father who worked in the Mill and IT WAS NORMAL. Hundreds, if not thousands of families crammed into slums (long bulldozed) and that was between the wars.
Yet, despite the very loud example playing out in Russia, and much more provocative conditions, your vision did not play out. Now, a social revolution, a resurgence in the Labour movement? Different story, but even then, it will look quite different from what happened then.
22
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by lukeyboy on Today at 07:13:37 am »
I think you're spot on with the psychology OMM.
23
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by Oldmanmatt on Today at 06:51:12 am »
The free public transport point is interesting, and shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. I'd recommend giving Freakonomics Ep 513 a listen as they covered this in detail. It's been seriously considered by some US cities.

One of the main purported benefits is enhanced social mobility and economic opportunity - the jobs are often not close to where the poorest people live, who also don't have personal transport. The time and cost of public transport can make a lot of jobs unviable.

Then there's the massive improvements in efficiency by public transport being widespread and well used, as well as fewer vehicles on the road, environmental benefits etc.

I can't see how it would be done in a rural setting, and there's definitely flaws - but it also has its merits.

It is a potentially very useful thing, that would have very positive effects in other areas of the economy and environment. It would not be free, in fact quite expensive, as others have mentioned. Funding it is a political nightmare.
On the other hand, the road network doesn’t magically fall from the sky every spring and that is publicly (under)funded.
For very human reasons, I think, the political sell of the road network is a lot easier.

I would posit that in the minds of many:

Road network/car = individual freedom.
Public transport = crowded, dictated, herded.

I’m not suggesting this is “correct” only that THE PEOPLE tm, often react from deep, subconscious, reasoning, that they then construct their “logical”, conscious, beliefs around (castles built on sand etc) and individual freedom is one of the most powerful. Many, of course, don’t seem to feel the need to extend that courtesy or respect that base desire, in any other individual…

Perhaps then, in the interests of “easing people in” to a more collective approach to transportation, cheaper but not free, based on the existing road network, improvements in bus services and active encouragement of hailed personal transport ( Uber type), would begin to shift that base emotion towards the ultimate goal of an extensive, free, ultra low emission, public transport network.

Back to my trains again, sorry, people will not just jump on a speeding train, heading the opposite way. However, a subtle nudge, a small change in direction, can bring on a surprisingly rapid increase in turn rate, as long as each move of the curve doesn’t throw people from their seats.

The UK national grid is a prime example:

Think of the push back against Wind farms, Solar farms, yet see the progress! Once the wheel starts to turn…
How many of you have gone to buy a new car in the last 12 months?
I mean showroom, off the production line, new.
You were offered a hybrid or full E, weren’t you?
There weren’t any conventional cars in the showroom, they might have been out on the forecourt, but they definitely couldn’t be called flagship models.
Aside: Methanol, converting a petrol engine to methanol is “relatively’ straight forward ( not so much in the existing vehicle, I’m thinking at production/design stage). Methanol emissions are much lower than petrol, can be stored at normal temps and pressures, low flash point and less energy dense than petrol but, not too far away. Very, very possible to produce almost completely green. Give it a ten year phase in (look at E vehicle time scales, novelty to market dominance. Ten years from today almost all petrol/diesel vehicles will have been scrapped). I design/buy propulsion systems ( marine, not automotive) I think I have a handle on the direction (if not I’m going to be unpopular and unemployed in five years), interim 10-20 years, methanol, phasing in from 5-10 years time, fuel cells (not going to be energy dense enough for another 10 years for transport applications, several ships are launched or launching this year with methanol + cracker H fuel cell plants for harbour/port generation (ie. Zero emissions in port) but pulling out the big kWs isn’t there yet).

Again, I don’t just keep mentioning this because I get excited about it, my base point is to illustrate how fast change can occur, once a subtle pull on the wheel begins and I’m certain the same psychology applies in political and social matters.

Let THE PEOPLE, have a sniff, then a taste, then add a course into the set menu, in a very few years, it’s the new normal and most of them will have “always said it was the best dish, very tasty. Been saying it for years, haven’t I Mildred?”…
24
shootin' the shit / Re: Cars, Cars, Fucking CARS !!
« Last post by Paul B on Today at 04:27:35 am »
Sounds like a result.

Indeed. When you say bearing, are you meaning a wheel bearing or a prop-shaft bearing?

My re-gas seems to have gone OK (so far as I can tell from the other side of the world). There are 2 gases, one that's harmful to squirrels etc. and one that isn't (and is consequently more money). It was (of course) the latter!
25
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by SA Chris on Yesterday at 10:37:12 pm »
It's already in place in Tallinn in Estonia and Luxembourg. I know they are special cases from a POV of infrastructure already in place and population densities, but shows it is possible, if not always viable.

As Wellsy said earlier, in general it can do with a lot of improvement across the country if not free, then at least cheap and reliable.

An don't get me started on LEZs.
26
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by lukeyboy on Yesterday at 10:23:50 pm »
The free public transport point is interesting, and shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. I'd recommend giving Freakonomics Ep 513 a listen as they covered this in detail. It's been seriously considered by some US cities.

One of the main purported benefits is enhanced social mobility and economic opportunity - the jobs are often not close to where the poorest people live, who also don't have personal transport. The time and cost of public transport can make a lot of jobs unviable.

Then there's the massive improvements in efficiency by public transport being widespread and well used, as well as fewer vehicles on the road, environmental benefits etc.

I can't see how it would be done in a rural setting, and there's definitely flaws - but it also has its merits.
27
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by ToxicBilberry on Yesterday at 10:02:55 pm »
You’d have to translate your response into a cogent argument as to why you think elite theory is nonsense. Otherwise it reads like an ad hominem attempt to humiliate.
28
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by Oldmanmatt on Yesterday at 09:29:56 pm »
I didn't mean car-washers etc should be made unemployed. On the contrary, people on here were complaining that doing something such as the 2017 Labour manifesto would create an overly-tight labour market and so inflation. I was simply meaning if good jobs in eg retrofitting buildings to increase energy conservation, the NHS, driving busses, whatever, enticed workers away from hand-car-washing jobs, then so be it.

Ah I get you, thanks 😊. I think it’s a great idea. My concern is the governments, left and right, reciprocal power and wealth relationship with corporations wouldn’t allow any such policy to happen. What ‘might’ happen is that if the bottom 70% continue to perceive themselves as an alienated and disliked group with no message of hope from politicians, this will pave the way for extremism - left or right - to form a new elite and mobilise the low masses against the middle. At that point decarbonising and retrofitting council houses will be the last thing on people’s minds

Boffo the clown:
Keep up! That happened twenty years ago, we’re all doing the dystopian two step these days. Meet the new elite, same as the old elite but whiter teeth.

Boffo exit, stage left.

Narrator:
Meanwhile, in the real world…
29
shootin' the shit / Re: House Buying Beta
« Last post by Duma on Yesterday at 08:34:42 pm »
Run. A. Mile.
30
shootin' the shit / Re: UK General Election 2024
« Last post by ToxicBilberry on Yesterday at 06:29:35 pm »
I didn't mean car-washers etc should be made unemployed. On the contrary, people on here were complaining that doing something such as the 2017 Labour manifesto would create an overly-tight labour market and so inflation. I was simply meaning if good jobs in eg retrofitting buildings to increase energy conservation, the NHS, driving busses, whatever, enticed workers away from hand-car-washing jobs, then so be it.

Ah I get you, thanks 😊. I think it’s a great idea. My concern is the governments, left and right, reciprocal power and wealth relationship with corporations wouldn’t allow any such policy to happen. What ‘might’ happen is that if the bottom 70% continue to perceive themselves as an alienated and disliked group with no message of hope from politicians, this will pave the way for extremism - left or right - to form a new elite and mobilise the low masses against the middle. At that point decarbonising and retrofitting council houses will be the last thing on people’s minds
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