[philo]

hello, i dont think this has been done before so:
im a novice with a camera but want to be able to snap standard photos with decentish quality results.
i really want them to look crisp and clear

what camera settings do you find best when it comes to bouldering photos?
i know the best way is to fiddle with it, but im just not getting the photos i want,
the contrast doesnt seem quite right, and sometimes a bit grainy.


ive got a nikon d70 with a 35-70mm lens,
i usually have it set to P, changing only the aperture ( the one on the back)
or if im lazy/in a hurry then i wack it on auto (i know sinner)
but what settings do you lot use as default? changing iso? auto iso? little things

so whats your set up :]

[Jim]

When you say its grainy, it could be dust/dirt on the lens/sensor.
Have you got the latest firmware for the d70.
On my D50 It tends to overexpose everything so I have contrast set on -0.7

[unclesomebody]

Forgive my ignorance, but I don't own a digital camera... However, if you are setting it to aperture priority mode and then presumably choosing the lowest possible aperture to allow yourself the fastest shutter speed, then the camera is possibly changing the iso up towards 1600 (or whatever yours goes to). If it is doing that, you are inevitably going to get far more noise than if you were shooting at iso 100 (if your camera goes down to that). I would review the exif data to see if you can check exactly what settings are used for what photos and then go from there.

Back in the day before digital SLR's, I used to keep a notebook and record all the settings for every photo I took, so that when they were processed I could check which settings resulted in good photos. It was a different game back then though! It's easy to do this with any photo software on your pictures so that would be a good place to compare settings between good photos and bad photos.

good luck.

[slackline]

Its kind of hard to give advice on this since your settings will vary depending on the venue (is it under trees/sheltered or exposed) and the light conditions on the day (bright sunshine, cloudy and overcast, hazy etc.).

General advice though would be to use ISO 200 on a clear day, bump it up if its very cloudy and dark, or towards sunset (or sunrise if your up really early), rather than leaving it on auto, this will avoid the camera setting the ISO too high as described by Uncle which will produce "noise".

If your not sure about shooting on manual I'd be inclined to stick with aperture priority.  Leave the White Balance on Auto (or again if its particularly grey and overcast stick it on cloudy).  Most (nikon) lenses have a sweet spot between f8-11 so try things out in those ranges.  Its worth snapping a couple of "trial" shots and looking at the review pictures, checking out the histograms and seeing of there are any areas that are blown out.  Then adjust/play with your settings appropriately (learn this through trial and error by reviewing Exif data as Uncle suggests or get a good book, I've heard good things about Understanding Exposure but haven't read it myself).

If your trying to capture dynamic movement and don't want blurring though, then switch to shutter priority as you want to stop the motion.

The best thing as mentioned is to play around, experiment and review your work.

[Johnny Brown]

Dave uses a D70, I'm sure he'll be able to give some more specific advice.

The D70 is a few years old now, I'd stick to the minimum iso of 200 unless its very dull or wooded, and only then go up to 400.

Presumably you're shooting to jpeg? In which case try to get it right in camera as you've less leeway for jigging in PS. The best way to do this is use aperture priority mode with exposure compensation or full manual. These are the only modes I ever shoot in. As slackline says, check the histogram for exposure, screen brightness is a poor indicator.

Why have you got a 35-70? Strikes me a poor choice. 75% of my shots could be covered with an 18mm and a 60mm, try to get something that covers these.

Have you got any pics online? Could give some basic pointers, these are generally more use if specific.

[philo]

alright heres an example:

took on friday, a little bit cloudy, as a result i get this, is it a bit grainy to you?




with a little bit of contrast etc in light rooms:

[dave]

you can't gauge grain on an image unless you're viewing at close to 100%.

On a D70 if you're not sure what you're doing you want to be on P (program) not auto, use A (aperture priority) when you're more confident. set the matering to matrix, contrast to normal, saturation to max, colour mode IIIa, white balance on Cloudy if it normal daylight or Shade if you're in deep shade. In really flat dull light you could set the contrast to medium high to get some pop but i wouldn't recomend it for normal use. Use the view on screen with blinking highlights - if anything important is blinking (like the climbers arm or forehead) then dial in some exposure compensation. Given a high contrast scene (like your vienna shot) the camera will err on the side of underexposure, hence why you've had to lift the shadows later on the computer. Also with the screen set to default i found that images looked correctly exposed on the screen but underexposed on the computer, so turning the screen brightness down to the minimum helped. also make sure your computer monitor is calibrated roughly OK.

Personally I would only use auto ISO for situations when you're using shutter priority and would rather have a grainy sharp photo than none, i.e. wildlife on a long lens, or shit where you can't use flash etc. In normal situations just up the ISO manually when you need to, otherwise leave it at 200, you shouldn't need to up it in normal use until its really dark, bearing in mind 200 is 2 stops faster than a lot of climbing shots taken with velvia. don't forget the built-in flash on a D70 is pretty good, set it to -1.7 and rear curtain sync to fill shadows in daylight - your shot of vienna would have looked good with fill flash, you would have had detail in the climber/rock and still been able to see detail in the clouds, without blowing out the sky or letting all the foreground go to shadow.

[philo]

thanks alot, ill try a few examples with it and get back to you on the results ahaha.

[Andy_P]

I think your photos are great from a composition/angle of view point of view. As the previous poster, I cannot comment on grain, except to say that I wouldn't worry about it. Grain is usually as a result of hi iso use and can add character, especially so to gritstone bouldering pics. If it bothers you, switch to monochrome. Whilst this will get rid of the colour, it will add some atmosphere to the shot and will also get rid of the the chroma noise (the blotchy, colour noise) caused by high iso (which is arguably the most dissatisfactory higth iso noise). I should add that the Nikon CCD equipped cameras (D70, D50, D40, D60, D80, D200 in fact all but D300 and D3) display excessive amounts of this chroma noise even at iso 1600. The other type of high iso noise, luminescence noise, adds film like grain to a shot and is far more pleasing than chroma noise to the eye (in my opinion). You should only see evidence of luminescence noise in a monochrome shot.

Back to your photos: your camera has exposed using its matrix metering, by the looks of it, and because of the brightness of the sky in the background, this metering has underexposed your subject (remember, skin should ideally be 1 step overexposed - your subject's skin is close to 1 step underexposed). There is not alot you can do about this except to angle the sky out of the shot when taking the photo or overexposing the sky. If you decide to overexpose the sky, you can reduce the effect of such overexposure by decreasing your depth of field so that only the boulderer is in foces (but you will need a decent lens (I would suggest a 50mm prime to save cost) to be able to do this (prob max f2.8 or lower f# - decreasing f# will also decrease iso and reduce noise). Alternatively, if you want sky in the photo and don't want it over exposed, use a fill flash (the on camera flash is probably not strong enough to compete outdoors) to light the boulderer or wait until dusk when the sunlight is more dispersed and the subject (the boulderer) is more evenly lit and, in addition, the sky is not so bright.

Finally, as with most gritstone shots, yours are a little on the grey side. I would, if you haven't already done so, set the white balance to Shade and crank up the saturation or switch to monochrome.

[dave]

some good info there. However I wouldn't really stress about the gain at iso1600, even with slow consumer lenses i don't think i've ever needed to take a climbing shot at 1600, and extremely rare at 800. if its that dark the lighting will usually be toss anyway, so you'd get a better result with flash.

unless you're in proper deep shade beneath a blue sky then I wouldn't recommend using the "shade" white balance by default on a D70, it is far too warm (even for my taste) for normal use. IMHO you'd be better off going with Cloudy and fine tuning it if need be. I like warm photos and even i don't have to use Shade very often.

You can do a fair bit with the built-in flash, even in broad daylight.

[Andy_P]

Thought I'd add a B/W pic (though prob too underexposed):

[Andy_P]

Dave:

I'm going to start trying to use my built in flash for bouldering pics to help balance things out (never thought of doing this before as don't usually get the camera out until the sun starts to go down) Cheers for the tip.

I like warm pics for grit too, here's one, high sat and WB Shade to create sunset effect:

.

[dave]

Dave:

I'm going to start trying to use my built in flash for bouldering pics to help balance things out (never thought of doing this before as don't usually get the camera out until the sun starts to go down) Cheers for the tip.

word, also if you find yourself runing out of flash power then don't forget to get closer, wide angle helps.

I would use caution trying to simulate sunset with Shade WB - if you've already got some warm sunlight in the scene then you risk clipping out the warm colours, and I think the brain/eye senses if warm light is coming from the wrong angle (wrong shadow direction/strength) and it can often look totally out of wack.

[Andy_P]

I would use caution trying to simulate sunset with Shade WB - if you've already got some warm sunlight in the scene then you risk clipping out the warm colours

Wise words - I noticed on getting back from Roaches and loading up these images into capture nx that the red channel clipped. Liked the effect so wasn't too bothered but I learnt for future shots. It's fair to say that I got a bit carried away with the D300's ability to really push saturation (not possible on my D80).

[cofe]

is that stoney tom?

[Andy_P]

is that stoney tom?

Dunno. Will check when I get home, I've got his e-mail address. He used to climb loads at Nottingham wall with Neal Mann and Tall James (work today blocked all external email access).

[cofe]

i mean the guy spotting who looks like a pirate. pretty sure it is.

[Andy_P]

i mean the guy spotting who looks like a pirate. pretty sure it is.

That, I don't know. He was climbing with a fella with dreads and steely fingers who, I think, was called Ben.

[philo]

alright some good advice, going to have a shaftoe session tomorrow and try the new settings. 
will post some pics up see if they are any better.

[Paul B]

i mean the guy spotting who looks like a pirate. pretty sure it is.

Tom Emery?

[andy_e]

That, I don't know. He was climbing with a fella with dreads and steely fingers who, I think, was called Ben.

That's Banana fingers isn't it?