[richdraws]

"This year I'm pretty psyched, but I'm all over the place, I can climb well one day and pants the next.  It doesn't appear to be linked to rock type (except I always have felt more confident on slate) or partners.  So far this year I've climbed far more than any previous year at the same point, as I can get out in the evenings as well as weekends."

Climbing is becoming a bigger part of your life. When this happens it is hard not to attach a greater part of your ego to it.

Going from someone who climbs occasionally, then regularly, then feeling oneself to be 'a climber', must change the way you perceive yourself at the activity. The more of yourself you invest in something the harder it is to accept that some days you will be shit on rock, and dependant on your nature you may forget to hold on to the days when the sun shined out of your arse and you cruised.

Rich x

[Fiend]

There have been lots of interesting and useful replies to this thread and I have been following them closely.

I only have a couple of things to add...

Firstly I was at Pex the other day, watching a young kid trying to top-rope The Web. He was struggling dismally to use the required bridging technique (incidentally, nut, you should go do this route, it's great bridging with good pro and good rests) and to heed any of the advice offered by his father / minders / instructors / whoever they were - and becoming increasingly irate and agitated. At one point one of the adults suggested...

"If you put the same energy you're putting into having that paddy into climbing the route, you'd be up it by now!"

Which is probably something I should bear in mind. Maybe it will be useful for cider nut too?

And secondly....someone (Popp or Pantontino....or was it Poppontino?) mentioned something about looking at the bigger picture. This is something I've been musing on recently and I think it can be useful to split your view of your climbing and how it is in TIME into two ways. Ignore the middle ground, the mid-term goals, the progression in the foreseeable future (well, don't ignore them, have goals, but don't focus so much on them). Instead focus on:

The long term - i.e. your climbing over a period of years, realise the time you have to progress and to climb and realise with dedication you can and will use that time and you can be patient and allow yourself to progress without forcing it on yourself (but obviously TRYING is important).

The short term - i.e. the route you are on now, even the move you are on now. Let go of any particular move or particular climbs "role" in your progression or your current climbing state, and do what it is you're doing at present to the best of your ability.

Look near....or look far...to find the answers.

Maybe.

[cider nut]

Cheers Rich, another interesting point.

[cider nut]

Well, I went out last night and lead an HVS!  When I arrived I wasn't much in the mood for climbing having done lots this week so far, but the line looked great so I had a go.  Plus it was the easiest thing on the crag.  I had to get a little beta because I couldn't work out where it traversed and was getting a little distressed, but did the moves ok after that and held it together.  So even though this thread wasn't about me climbing HVS, the thoughts I'd had about getting my consistency and confidence back meant I felt able to have a go at it, and succeeded.  So thanks everyone!

I've had a lot of thoughts about my climbing, linked to this thread, can't write them now as am off to work but if anyone's interesting what's occurred to me, I'll post them over the weekend.

[cider nut]

Okay, well I've decided to post my thoughts anyway, even though this thread has kind of died! 


To start off with I wrote down the trips when I had my bad days (when I experience fear or my mind was not in the right place), and also the trips when I had a really good and productive time, and had a look to see what links them.  I had an inspriation that perhaps the days I had a bad time were when I'd gone with specific routes in mind (working off the expectation idea), but that didn't hold true, it was half and half for both the good days and the bad.  There was also an equal spread of weekend versus evenings trips, and while a lot of the 'bad' days were when I climbed with my partner, not all of them were.  So that didn't help, but while I've been out climbing this week, after I read the thread, I was able to think more clearly and also see what I'm thinking when I'm actually climbing...

Thought 1
Because my brain takes a while to process stuff, I often don't realise I'm enjoying a route until afterwards.  This means my feelings while I'm on it will be taken from my current thoughts of the day and the environment I'm in.  Sometimes the route really does get through to me though, and I whoop when I get to the top, so next time that happens I'll work out why that route was more special to me.

Thought 2
I'm get terrified when I lead indoors (because of the feeling of falling, not because of objective danger - obviously there's isn't much of that), outdoors I've normally been fine.  As FD suggested (and I agreed) it's possible (quite likely!) that I've picked up some introspection while leading trad off my partner, which makes me dither on routes, and then my indoor fears start to creep in.  It might benefit me to go on a sport climbing trip, as I push myself much more at my limit then - I can then find out if my problems are fear based, motivation based, or logistics based (see next thought).  I haven't climbed sport for a year!

Thought 3
Another reason for random fears being allowed to creep in, is that now climbing is a lot more accessible to me (as richdraws hinted at), I don't have to stress about fitting routes in, so I can relax.  That's a point that took a while to occur to me, as I would have thought my issues would stem from putting myself under more pressure, rather than less (especially with everybody talking about expectation).  However, I have put myself under pressure of a different sort, and this might well be the hidden key that I forgot to mention (not intentionally) - I moved up to Stoke in September, and the evenings were just getting too short and damp to get out after work.  I spent the whole winter waiting excitedly for spring so I could climb in the evenings and explore the local area.  Finally the spring arrived, and I'm as excited as ever at living close to rock.  As it happens, evening climbing suits me very well as I can climb with a variety of people, and I'm always happy with just one of two leads in a session (I sometime struggle to lead for a whole day, as feel like I'm pushing my luck), BUT - because I'm not used to it, and spent the whole winter waiting perhaps its thrown me out of kilter a bit.

No doubt somebody will say i'm still over-analysing, but once I've started I've got to follow it though (I'm quite stubbon, often the only thing that gets me up routes!).  Now I've identified some possible issues, I'll do what I normally do and let the solution present itself naturally (and of course bear the tips from here in mind, to encourage it along).

[andy popp]

Glad you've been able to take something positive from it and good effort on the HVS.

[jwi]

Let me quote Wilde: "Consistency is the last refuge of the unimaginative."

That is true for athletic performance as well. It is well known that the only way to attain truly consistent athletic performance is by being consistently bad.

[cider nut]

Glad you've been able to take something positive from it and good effort on the HVS.

Thanks.  It was too good to last though, on Saturday I had my worse 'bad day' yet!  Still, I think I've tracked down the cause of it a bit more successfully (to do with climbing with the partner, and not being in the right frame of mind, like I have an 'us' entity and a 'me' entity and I'm only able to climb in the former otherwise I can't focus, that kind of thing), my thoughts above were interesting but possibly red herrings.  I did half of another HVS at Witches Quarry today, but then the rock type changed and I was dubious about the gear and the next moves, so I backed off as we only had a half day and no time for faffing.  Still, I did some nice, hard moves and it's best to keep trying hard routes I guess, rather than just being scared of them.

[Somebody's Fool]

Let me quote Wilde: "Consistency is the last refuge of the unimaginative."

That is true for athletic performance as well. It is well known that the only way to attain truly consistent athletic performance is by being consistently bad.

Sensible words.  From both Wilde and your bad self.

[Paz]

 then the rock type changed
[/quote]

From what into what?!  If I'm dubious about the gear then I just pack in as much as possible, then have a look above so I -know- what I'm up against.  You can never have too many nuts in.  You've probably got to be in the mood for bold bits, but they're de rigeur where I'm from, even on the sport routes so I'm used to them.

I've had some small success recently after a winter of backing off, grabbing drawers and yelling take too much, but this has probably got more to do with choosing conventional routes instead of esoteric choss.  I always put this down to a particular route itself or conditions.  You should be able to haul up a wall of jugs and nut slots any day of the week, surely?

[cider nut]

From what into what?!

Well, not so much type but style.  It changed from small, crimpy, crossly holds, into large, chalky, slippy holds.  Obviously there was more to it than just that, but I was summarising.  I'd been enjoying the bold, bouldery style of climbing, but when the holds got bigger (and also less positive), my brain let go of the focus a bit!  Plus it had started to rain etc.  I did go up and down a bit, but enough was enough.  Anyway, this thread wasn't about specific routes

[RopeBoy]

There's a lot of useful stuff here but to add my two peneth; only lead, try and avoid seconding till you break the cycle. Have you got a mat? Go out on your own and do some easy solo-ing.

Obviously I don't know you from Adam so this might not work for you.  

J  

[cider nut]

There's a lot of useful stuff here but to add my two peneth; only lead, try and avoid seconding till you break the cycle. Have you got a mat? Go out on your own and do some easy solo-ing.

Obviously I don't know you from Adam so this might not work for you. 

J 

I don't actually do much soloing at all to be honest, since my main partner climbs a lot harder so abs for gear.  I'm also wary of soloing/bouldering on my own in case I get into trouble - I can't focus enough - although haven't tried it much.  I don't have a mat but considered buying one, so maybe if I do I'll get out on my own more!

[butters]

For getting into soloing you should go and do all of the really easy routes at the end of Burbage North - there is nothing harder than a VDiff there but there is some OK stuff there which is made a lot better for being soloed. Birchen is another favourite for a bit of easy soloing though it does have the disadvantage of being far too popular.

As for focus - the thought of falling off and hitting the ground cures that problem for me but if I am out on my own I always try not to do a move if I am not 100% sure that I can reverse it.

bluebrad

[cider nut]

For getting into soloing you should go and do all of the really easy routes at the end of Burbage North - there is nothing harder than a VDiff there but there is some OK stuff there which is made a lot better for being soloed. Birchen is another favourite for a bit of easy soloing though it does have the disadvantage of being far too popular.

As for focus - the thought of falling off and hitting the ground cures that problem for me but if I am out on my own I always try not to do a move if I am not 100% sure that I can reverse it.

bluebrad

Oh I've done plenty of soloing, just not a big fan of doing it on my own!  In fact, last year I think I soloed too much, and this year I'm trying to focus on onsighting - I'm only allowed to solo for a warm up, or after I've led something, or it I just end up at a soloing crag, I'm not allowed to solo routes just because they're there and I can.

As for Burbage North - that's the crag I've been to most in the Peak and I keep vowing never to go back.  I've soloed End Slab, Ender, Endste, End Buttress and Amazon Gully at the far end if they're the ones you mean.

[Fiend]

What about onsight soloing?? 

[cider nut]

pedant.

[webbo]

In fact, last year I think I soloed too much, and this year I'm trying to focus on onsighting - I'm only allowed to solo for a warm up, or after I've led something, or it I just end up at a soloing crag, I'm not allowed to solo routes just because they're there and I can.

this reads like your climbing is a bag of rules.its ok to have targets but if they cause you so much stress and anxiety you might as well be at work.
do what you feel like after you've got to the crag and had a look around.solo what you feel like,lead routes after your mates even with the runners in place.don't get hung up on all this onsighting shit save it for when you are on top of your game.

[cider nut]

I don't actually think to myself 'right, I'm allowed exactly one solo before I lead a route', it was a bit tongue in cheek.  I appreciate your point, by I'm just saying that now I've got more opportunity to climb, I'm trying to maintain focus and keep some structure without it being set in stone.  One of the the things that aggravated my personal problems last year (that I mentioned in my OP), was I did what I usually do and booked a load of things into my weekends, but they weren't actually things I'd intended to do, and I ran out of weekends before realising that.  So I spent the year doing fun stuff (like an Alps trip), but not the stuff I'd expected to do (sea cliff climbing, my fave).  This year, I've hardly booked any specific weekends in (the previous two years I'd be busy until August by this point, this year I'm mostly free), but I've made theoretical goals instead, as I think that's a better way for me to enjoy my year.

[curly ben]

Am i on ukclimbing.com by mistake...??

[cider nut]

Am i on ukclimbing.com by mistake...??

I can't read the understones there, so I won't reply.

Oops.

[Paz]

You got rained off then.  A Cast Iron excuse.  What you need to say to yourself when you're on a large hold in a pumpy position is that you'll be absolutely made up if you manage to stand on it.  Did I already say about once being advised to try to concentrate on your foot work when you're scared and getting pumped.  I'm not sure if I don't do this already, or if I take it for granted, as I just focus on big footholds in general.  Also it can be quite a good idea to just climb out of that situation quickly too.  I like it on safe routes when I can get into the mind set of saying `I've got more left in the tank yet' and hanging on for more.  It's surprising what you can do, and if you fail then you're not bothered as you're absolutely fucked.  I'm not so sure how much these `good climbers' (I almost think they are fictional) go in for that Energy efficiency, Neil Gresham's 50 magic techniques approach.  I'm sure a lot of it boils down to how hard a move you can do when you're fucked.  As well as the head thing this explains why boulderering ability doesn't necessarily translate into trad ability.

[cider nut]

Cheers, useful reply Paz.

[cider nut]

I don't actually do much soloing at all to be honest, since my main partner climbs a lot harder so abs for gear.  I'm also wary of soloing/bouldering on my own in case I get into trouble - I can't focus enough - although haven't tried it much.  I don't have a mat but considered buying one, so maybe if I do I'll get out on my own more!

Sorry bluebrad, I made a typo there, I should have written "don't actually do much seconding at all"!!!  Didn't mean to confuse you, I probably came across really contrary!

[Paz]

Now that I've admitted I'm just posting random trad lead head hints I don't feel the need to wait for a specific question to suggest a good one:

Tip no. 17.   ditch the rack

While this works on so many levels, on trad routes if you've tried everything to do a move and it's not happening, you keep reversing, well if you know you're not going to need a lot more gear (or frankly if you're me because you think the risk is worth it because you're that pissed off and will try anything) then clip all your gear in top whatever kit you've got in.  If there's nowt to clip it to then (you shouldn't have brought so blinking much in the first place should you), just keep  crab of wires and your belay plate or sommink.  Bingo, you're now 2kg lighter and 6a moves feel easy again.