[Monolith]

Being a complete non-entity in the PC specification stakes, I have no idea how to prioritise certain components in building my ideal machine. I'll need it to run AutoCAD, the Adobe CS suite, a vast library of typefaces and a lot of music. I would anticipate that RAM and an all singing graphics card take priority? I would like to buy the new Mac Book to replace my iBook G4, but am aware how quickly across the course of 5 years this will date and I need a machine to have a bit more longevity than current selection has. I'll need to keep hold of my Mac for purposes that the PC cannot fulfill however.

I already have a 300gb external hard drive, so hopefully won't need to spend to much in that department. Would a budget of 800 pounds anywhere near work towards what I would require? Perhaps that's more than enough, I just don't know having worked on laptops for so long.

Any help much appreciated.

[Paul B]

I use CAD (2005) loads for my degree and have it installed on the desktop im currently on and a laptop, had no problems with either and I'm sure you can get the same specs as the desktop for a whole lot less than 800 now. The university have it installed on some right pieces of crap and they work fine too. Hope this helps.

[Jim]

The pentiumD CPU's are really cheap now the duo core has come out. £800 is plenty enough.
Here are some rough figures ( i am about to build 3 boxes like this for various people I know)

• PentiumD 945 2x3.4GHz = £110
• Socket 775 motherboard = £50
• 1 gig ddr2667 pc5400 memory = £70
• Reasonable Graphics card PCIe = £50
• Good Case = £50
• Fastest DVD+-R (18x) = £20
• 250 gig sata2 HDD = £50
• 19" monitor = £120
• Keyboard & mouse = £10

About £530ish for a complete, very fast set up

[unclesomebody]

I would suggest you get a dual core if you don't want to be totally left behind in 6-12 months. I would also suggest you stick to AMD as they run cooler, fail less, and represent better value for money. Also, if you are wanting to run all that graphics stuff I would recommend a good graphics card, perhaps somethign like this;

http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/121055/rb/24475262802

And I would also suggest you buy 2 19" widescreen monitors because it will make life easier, they are so cheap now, and you will be the envy of all your friends. This would all come within £800.

And Jim, you can buy a computer with better specs than you named for less than you quote. If you know where to look you can get one via dell with a 3 year warranty for under £500 andn better spec than you mention.  Hope your "friends" don't read this forum.

[Monolith]

Cheers guys, I knew some computer heads would pipe up with the good shit. Pleasing also to hear it need not be as expensive as I had imagined.

[Jim]

Fair enough, I'm a bit behind with all this stuff at the minute, core 2 duo have come down a fair bit since I last looked, throw another £30 and get a core 2 duo instead.
Uncle what do you base your opinion of intel and amd on?

[unclesomebody]

SCIENCE

[Jim]

Show your workings Bradbury!

anyway you can't get better performance from dell for the money (assuming using core 2 duo instead of pentium D).
£560 total cost of home built pc.
closest dell is £530 for the 1.86 E6300 against the 2.13 E6400 core 2 duo cpu
slower DVD writer, smaller hard drive, slower memory, inferior graphix card.
The only advantage is you get winxp thrown in but who buys software these days (apart from buisiness) which is going to be replaced with vista very shortly anyway, or use linux

[unclesomebody]

This was up for £365;

Intel Pentium D processor 820 Dual core(2.8Ghz unconfirmed by me ) | 2GB Ram | 7x USB 2.0 | Memory card slot 9-in-1| FireWire / IEEE 1394 ports 2 | Graphics card NVIDIA GeForce 7300LE | Graphics card - video RAM 256MB | Hard drive 160GB | CD / DVD optical drive DVD writer DVD RAM and DVD±R/±RW (double layer)(lightscribe)

This was up for £478

AMD® Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4200+
Genuine Windows® XP Media Center Edition 2005 (Incl Operating System Re-installation CD) - English
Collect & Return, 1 Year Service only
Dell 19" Value Flat Panel (E197FP) - UK/Irish
1024MB Dual Channel DDR2 533MHz [2x512] Memory
250GB (7200rpm) Serial ATA Hard Drive with 8MB DataBurst cache
16x DVD +/- RW Drive
128MB ATI® Radeon® X1300 PCI Express graphics card


 

[Jim]

both still a fair bit slower than my build and lower spec

[unclesomebody]

When you say a fair bit slower do you mean to say faster? If  you would like to vist tom's hardware and compare your processor (pentiumD 945) with the Athlon X2 4200+ you'll find the athlon wins in nearly every test. Plus it's cheaper. And it runs cooler. And it can be overclocked further.  It's simple Science.

[Somebody's Fool]

Instead of throwing around meaningless numbers prefixed by equally meaningless letters, maybe you two should settle this outside.  I feel a drag race, with a distinctly German feel, would bring about the most satisfactory resolution.

[unclesomebody]

ha ha... great idea. But can it be on a dry day? And can you factor in the relative cost of our german machines? ie. Jim's was 3 times the cost of mine...

[Somebody's Fool]

It's out of my hands now I'm afraid. You'd have to speak to the relevant governing body.

[Monolith]

After much fannying around and tweaking, my UCAS application for Architecture is now in. Pending the result of the interview, I'll be scouring through your checklist Uncle and bagging that lot. Cheers for the knowledge.

[Jim]

I had revised my cpu to the core 2 duo 6400 2.13, which I think you'll find is a hell of a lot faster than your athlon.
also I think you'll find my audi is a lot faster and higher spec than your VW, I've not even had mine remapped yet and will still easily win in a race wether that be straight line, round a track, in the wet or in the dry.

Also you'll find that planet Jim is a lot better place to live although it is by strict invitation only.

I must admit the dell stuff is really good value but its still cheaper and better to build your own (also more fun if you enjoy building stuff, its like lego for adults!)

[Obi-Wan is lost...]

I hate the way that Dell advertise systems for £299!!!!!!!!! and by the time you have specced to any reasonable level (changing a CD-ROM to a DVD-RW for example) it's strangely £700! Does anyone else get away with charging £60 for 'delivery'?

From previous experience, you don't save a lot building your own machine, but you do get to spec it out how you want it. If your can't be bothered to build it but still want a high spec budget machine look out for weird specials like the ones Aldi (yes the cheap supermarket!) have from time to time, this one was from before xmas http://www.computeractive.co.uk/computeractive/hardware/2170180/Medion they always get good reviews. Big names such as Dell do not equal reliable computers. We have room full of Dells that regularly go pop for various reasons.

Or forget all that and save up for a new Intel Mac. I recon they will be around a lot longer than most new PC's Vista sounds so power hungry I think people will need 10gig of RAM before long! WinXP on Parallels or Bootcamp screams along. Best of both worlds? Tis true.

[Obi-Wan is lost...]

[random post to avoid my 'number of posts' equally the Number of the Beast!]   

[unclesomebody]

Dell have bargains, just not on their front page or through normal channels. You have to be shrewd.

Jim, indeed, that is a fast processor, but I would take an athlon x2 5000+ instead. However, since we are having a battle of ego's here, tell me what you could build this system for... assuming your time is worth nothing;

Intel Core 2 Duo E6400
2048MB DDR2 533
500Gb SATA
256MB ATI Radeon X1300 PRO
DVD-ROM Reader
DVD+/-RW Reader 16x Dual Drive
Sound Blaster Audigy

We shall forego the 3year warranty. Don't forget to include a decent PSU and case! Decent motherboard supporting 4gb of ram, if not 8gb. I look forward to your results, not because I want to destroy you, but because I am genuinely interested. 

[Johnny Brown]

assuming your time is worth nothing

I've seen Jim building computers, its like greased lightning. His hams act as insulators so he has no need of any anti-static precautions.

[Obi-Wan is lost...]

...if not 8gb.

It's happening already...

[unclesomebody]

I should add that I don't recommend vista. It is full of crap. It does look nice and is a fun upgrade, but totally ridiculous if you look upon it as a performance related upgrade. For that, look to linux or some custom install's of XP.

I would still say that mac's are way overpriced and now they are intel based offer no distinct architectural advantages. Better to just run linux on a PC.

[unclesomebody]

also I think you'll find my audi is a lot faster and higher spec than your VW, I've not even had mine remapped yet and will still easily win in a race wether that be straight line, round a track, in the wet or in the dry.

Also you'll find that planet Jim is a lot better place to live although it is by strict invitation only.

Here you go again spraying your mouth off about things that are most definitely untrue. I know your car is putting out 180bhp/273 lb ft torque, has 4 wheel drive, and weighs 1600kg. My car is rockign 175bhp, 280 lb ft torque, is measly 2wd, but weighs 1500kg. I am not even going to try and debate that in the wet your car will kill me. However, in all other conditions, i would say your car is no faster (but it did cost loads more).

and as for planet Jim? I can do without the gut, without the injury's, without the mortgage, without the ongoing loft conversion, etc etc. Need I go on? You know why you're king of planet Jim? cause you're the only one stuck there! 

[Jim]

can we rename this thread Uncle vs Jim?

don't forget your figures are estimates and are almost certainly inflated by the tuning companies, mine are factory figures which normally tend to be lower than actuals, also I've got a boost leak to fix and then its remap time! 

I'll have a look at that pc build. How much have you been quoted so far? and what do you need all that ram for?
DVD writers are now up to 18x and I presume you want sata2

[unclesomebody]

Car figures are definitely on the conservative side from the dyno's of the remapped cars I've seen! Once you remap I will have no chance, but you always seem to ignore the fact your car cost 3 times what mine did... and it didn't come with heated mirrors, or an armrest, etc etc.... 

As for the PC build. I'll give you the price once you've crunched some numbers. Sata2 isn't strictly necessary... Don't need 18x either... but must be dual layer. I await with baited breathe...