[Somebody's Fool]

Looks awful.  Is it wet?

[Fiend]

I wonder if Mick could put this as a news item on UKC??

[Johnny Brown]

The weather in North Wales has held out well this winter, with favourable climbing conditions existing right up until this week, whilst it has to be said the Peak and Yorkshire have been a total washout.

I'd take issue with this. You're suggesting Wales has had better weather than the peak and yorkshire? Or that you have a cave that doesn't get wet very often?

“That is definitely the wettest I have ever seen this crag in all the years I have been climbing here.” Commented a disappointed Si Panton, before adding:.

I thought you wrote this? Don't start the third person thing, its a slippery slope...
Fiend, you beat me to it!

 

[Pantontino]

I know it's a bitter pill for you Peak freaks to swallow, but the simple fact is that there are more opportunities for climbing outside in North Wales than there are in the Peak, or Yorkshire. This is because the bad weather that we get (and we do get plenty of bad weather) tends to pass through quickly, and we have lots of quick drying or extremely sheltered crags that remain dry, unless there is a period of sustained rain and high humidity/unusually warm weather (as was the case this last week, which is the first time this season that I have been thwarted).

I don't really see how you can contest that - JB, I know you are deluded, but this a step too far.

Third person - sorry JB, is the irony a bit too subtle for you? I'll try and keep things more straightforward in future.

And Fiend - is this not a thread about the conditions in the cave? And the story comes from a website about bouldering in North Wales. Seems pretty appropriate to me, non?

Somebody's Fool - you're a funny guy, clearly jealous, but funny all the same.

[Jaspersharpe]

Somebody's Fool - you're a funny guy, clearly jealous, but funny all the same.

Funny how?

I like this thread.

[Houdini]

Funny weird.

[Jim]

funny looking

[Houdini]

Funny smelling.

[Johnny Brown]

I know it's a bitter pill for you Peak freaks to swallow, but the simple fact is that there are more opportunities for climbing outside in North Wales than there are in the Peak, or Yorkshire. This is because the bad weather that we get (and we do get plenty of bad weather) tends to pass through quickly, and we have lots of quick drying or extremely sheltered crags that remain dry, unless there is a period of sustained rain and high humidity/unusually warm weather (as was the case this last week, which is the first time this season that I have been thwarted).

I don't really see how you can contest that - JB, I know you are deluded, but this a step too far.

I don't really want to get into a peak vs eyri debate, but believe me, if the weather was better in wales, (and the orme was made of gritstone) I'd live there. Living here I miss the mountains and the sea. But I've seen the thousand yard stares of you guys, turning up at stanage after ninety days continuous rain. I'd go mad. Or move.

I think the difference in sheffield is the temptation of six different walls including the both biggest in the world and the most famous tends to curb the exploratory instincts.
Even Stanage gets far less rain than snowdonia, this is fact, crags like rivelin, wharncliffe, cratcliffe etc far less. Whereas you have porth ysgo, within a similar drive we have the churnet which is similarly subject to different weather. You have the orme and hylldrem, yes we have stoney, pleasley, roche abbey etc. Gogarth, well we can't compete with that but then this is a bouldering forum.

This is because the bad weather that we get (and we do get plenty of bad weather) tends to pass through quickly

This is hilarious. You do live in the pass, yes? Not Ynys Enlli? I suppose the problem is the next lot is just very close behind, and the gap passes just as quickly?

[Houdini]

  . . . after ninety days continuous rain.

Pah!  That's n.o.t.h.i.n.g.

[Pantontino]

JB you are just so stubborn - once you get an idea in your head, however wrong, and even when all the evidence points in the other direction, you hang in there, bluntly refusing to accept the truth.

Unlike you I have lived for a considerable amount of time in both North Wales (12 years) and Yorkshire/the Peak (10 years). I'm speaking from direct and extensive experience. You're just clinging to an age old 'Wales is wet' cliche. My climbing diary bears witness to what I say: and that is (I repeat) that there are more opportunities for climbing outside in North Wales in a typical year than there are in the Peak. I know this is true (not because of some spurious rainfall statistic, but through real experience) and if you ever spent a winter season climbing over here you'd know the same too. I also reckon that you would be pleasantly surprised at the quality of the new wave of Ormes problems - and if not, just think of all those quick drying slate routes, or old favourites like the Porth Ysgo areas.

And by the way it's Eryri, not Eyri. Think how narked you get when someone says Peaks instead of Peak.

Getting back to the meat of the thread, the Ormes had dried up considerably yesterday afternoon - had a good session. It's gone warm again today, but tomorrow is looking cold, followed by a run of dry weather which should see the remaining seepage lines drying up.

[Houdini]

I'm speaking from extensive experience.

Listen to the man JB, Simon's ancient. 

[Johnny Brown]

Apologies for the welsh typo.

Si, like you I've made a fairly major choice based on my opinion, so you can be sure I'm as sure of my truth as you are of yours. Its not like I don't go to wales regularly, or speak to a dejected Robbins. Its also worth pointing out that although Almscliff dries quick, the peak in general has better weather than west yorks - mainly due to an improved rainshadow effect, again fact not opinion. As said above, I am jealous of some of the things you have in wales, the weather isn't one of them.

[Bonjoy]

 There are ALWAYS a variety of options for bouldering in and around the Peak in all weather except prolonged drizzle (which we don't get much of). Granted crag selection can be a subtle business requiring good crag and weather knowledge, which many people (including many lazy locals) don't have, but there's very rarely no good bouldering to be had.  Yorkshire seems to have less options on wet days, but maybe that's my lack of local knowledge. I don't know Wales well enough to make a comparison.

[Johnny Brown]

Well said. As above, the reasons that these aren't made full use of is folk would rather go to the wall. In wales that option is less appealing.

[dave]

the peak does have options for wet winter days, but these tend to be either miles drive with no guarantees (churnet), not dry after torrential rain (tor, stoney), prone to flooding (rubicon) or very very limited when you do get there and find it dry, especially if you've been to them before (goose feature, WSS, stump hole, hueco wall etc). for some people they may want to use winter to get strong for the summer, in which case you can't fault people for not wanting to go and do chapel of rest 10 times as training.

On the other hand, if you live in llandudno you can just pop round the orme to check it out, or if you live in the pass you can phone someone who is there. I'm afraid north wales do have it better than us in this respect. On the other hand we can climb on dry rock all summer in tollerable temperatures straight out of the car without having to spend 45mins walking uphill to get there :wink: given the choice i'd take the peak overall since there are (for me) about 5 times as many summer climbing days in the year as there are winter days.

[Pantontino]

without having to spend 45mins walking uphill to get there...

Yeah, there's no roadside crags in North Wales at all. 

JB, with regard to the Yorkshire vs Peak thing - you may be right about this to an extent. But don't forget that it is possible to climb at Malham in the winter, and that there are a few obscure grit venues which provide some shelter from the rain (eg. West Vale, Woodhouse). I would still say that I have more experience of climbing in the Peak (when I lived in Huddersfield I spent around 30% of my time climbing in the Peak) than you have of North Wales. I also talk regularly on the phone to Al Williams - hardly a wall monkey, I'm sure you'd agree. So I stand by my original assertion.

As for Robins - he is a bit more routes orientated than me (especially in the winter), and thus is more likely to have his plans scuppered by wet rock. He also has less work flexibility than me. I am surprised he was moaning so much though - he seemed pretty excited about the new problems up at Breck Road a few weeks ago.

[dave]

without having to spend 45mins walking uphill to get there...

Yeah, there's no roadside crags in North Wales at all. 

you know what i mean, the stuff at a higher elevation (mallory) etc that is cooler and windier in summer.

[Johnny Brown]

On the other hand, if you live in llandudno you can just pop round the orme to check it out

Who lives in llandudno? Patch?

I am surprised he was moaning so much though  - he seemed pretty excited

No specifics - just he has told me of occasions where it has rained every day in 'beris for three months straight. I think stats like this are where your "wales is wet" 'myth' comes from.

[Whyatt]

Anyway,
Anyone been to the ormes today? i heard it was quite sunny anything climbable?

[Houdini]

Who lives in llandudno? Patch?

Yeah, he's got the place all to himself . . .

[BenF]

Who lives in llandudno?

Lots of aged, infirm and ailing scousers waiting to die.  Maybe they could do something useful and check on cave conditions for us every few hours.

[Pantontino]

I wouldn't say no to a web cam pointed at the cave, but if you go to the Ormes a lot it becomes quite easy to predict the conditions. The only time I'd really have second thoughts about going is if there was a sudden temp rise. Rain, unless it is very persistent, and continuing for many days, is largely irrelevant.

JB - even if it did rain every day for 3 months in Llanberis (which it never does), you could still climb outside if you wanted to. You might not be able to climb the specific thing you were after, but you could still climb at one of several venues within 30 - 60 minutes drive.

[Johnny Brown]

ditto in sheffield. And it rains less. Let me reiterate that is a fact.

[Houdini]

Fuckin' Nora, at least when I was bumming this thread is was out of good ol' fashioned spite. 



Now it's turned into a thread for Britishers to argue over where it rains most!