[grimer]

Good answer dude.

Stormbringer is right at 5c. 6a would make it sound like it was technical, but as a grade, 5c says more about ones ability to suffer

[Danny]

  isn't the sort of route where you'd be pleased if you hurt yourself, with continually bland moves in a painfully contrived position with artificially enforced danger.

...a fine, generic description of most grit routes?

[Paz]

Cheers Andi. 

This isn't the same Calver Mill that's now the fine modern day establishment of The Bridge Inn?  Forgotten the name of the beers they do there (it begins with a C or K?) but they were good.

With Stormbringer, there's a general unjustified rule of thumb that says any rarely is any move done in Plimsolls in the 50s (you can't aid a mantel, surely, unless there was a foot loop job?) given harder than 5c. 

[AndiT]

This isn't the same Calver Mill that's now the fine modern day establishment of The Bridge Inn? 

Yeah, I think so.

[Fiend]

Hmmmm.

I tried to go for the mantle option, and I could either have both hands pulling on the ledge, and thus gain enough height BUT not have my hands in the right position, OR have one hand starting in a mantle position BUT not gain nearly enough height.

I also considered the slap for the slopey bollox above, but since I can't do deep one arm lock offs on a flat shelf, errr, gave that option up.

Guess it is just stupidly fucking hard. As Paz says it's not even anywhere near 5c. But equally as grimer says, it's one of those bastard hard grit things that one supposes has to be a hideous sandbag.

Bletch.

[RopeBoy]

The Gully Joke, Froggatt

I put a runner in to protect the start, I'm very glad I did as I fell off it! I found it an increadible reach out of the cave, I can only just my finger tips to it.

Impossible Slab,

Don't recall any additional runners other than what's on the route.

J :-)

[Sloper]

Ok, here's one for Feind.

Dry Rot on gargoyle butress stanage given E1/2 in the book (although it was a Garry Gibson route so who knows).

They way I've done this is from a couple of feet along the traverse of gargoyle but. move up the steep arete for a few moves until it is possible to rock over onto the slab.  Felt much harder than 5b.

Any takers to see if the rumours are correct and that I can't grade flour?

[rehab21]

Another shameless beta request:

Gumshoe E2 5c - Ramshaw. Got up to the niche, placed the gear, shilly-shallied about for half an hour ending up in a stretched position attempting to rock over onto the shelf with one hand in the sandy sidepull, the other in the pocket containing the gear. Should I have committed to the move at this point?

Instead I dropped my knee and attempted to go again with the left hand... that didn't work...

[AndiT]

Gumshoe: Right hand in sandy undercut pocket, build your feet up and reach out left to good side pull and your left foot goes on the big foothold. I now let my right leg flag to counter-balance and reach over with my right to the crack above, which is great and takes good gear. Juggy surprises upto the top now! Fantastic route.

If anyone knows what the righthand variant is all about, please let me know...

Oh and yes, you should have committed at that point, it is a romp from there!

Hope that helps,

Andi

[unclesomebody]

Ok, here's one for Feind.

Dry Rot on gargoyle butress stanage given E1/2 in the book (although it was a Garry Gibson route so who knows).

They way I've done this is from a couple of feet along the traverse of gargoyle but. move up the steep arete for a few moves until it is possible to rock over onto the slab.  Felt much harder than 5b.

Any takers to see if the rumours are correct and that I can't grade flour?

I seem to remember soloing this one day with James. I shit myself. James went up first finding it casual (as usual) and then I had to use rather a lot of concentration whilst James was saying "a little further, nearly at a good hold". I think I remember being suprised at it being as hard as it was, or certainly it felt commiting when the ground was looming... I could be thinking of another route though... hard to tell exactly without a guidebook!

[Paz]

I remember Dry Rot being thin on a lot of those rusty crozzles, gritstone grattons up to a break, but more slabby than not after the minioverlap you go over where your gear is, and therefore just a hard E1, even if the moves are 5c.  Just a bit Raah Goferrit!  I could well have just got back from Font at the time which would explain why it didn't feel too bad.

I've heard rumours about people playing on the direct over the roof at the bottom.  Be a good ground up project.

[bigphil]

Hmmmm.

I tried to go for the mantle option, and I could either have both hands pulling on the ledge, and thus gain enough height BUT not have my hands in the right position, OR have one hand starting in a mantle position BUT not gain nearly enough height.

I also considered the slap for the slopey bollox above, but since I can't do deep one arm lock offs on a flat shelf, errr, gave that option up.

Guess it is just stupidly fucking hard. As Paz says it's not even anywhere near 5c. But equally as grimer says, it's one of those bastard hard grit things that one supposes has to be a hideous sandbag.

Bletch.

Fiend your description of Stormbringer sounds just like my attempt t'other week at Peas at Stanage.  Another 5c mantle thats not a 6a but feels bloody difficult.  Anyone have any knowledge?

[rehab21]

Thanks Andy,

Feel a bit guilty about all this beta blagging, but at least yours confirms my suspicions - I';ve been kicking myself ever since. Gotta get back there!

Cheers

[Fiend]

Gumshoe: Right hand in sandy undercut pocket, build your feet up and reach out left to good side pull and your left foot goes on the big foothold. I now let my right leg flag to counter-balance and reach over with my right to the crack above, which is great and takes good gear. Juggy surprises upto the top now! Fantastic route.

Exactly how I did it - pimp move, more balancy than strenuous.

Helps if you've brought loads of different gear to fill the decaying pods.


P.S. Sloper, yes, in this case you can't grade flour

[Fiend]

Another one for the Staffordshire massive:

Bridge of Sighs @ The Hanging Stone. The lower wall bit. Attempted recently but reversed and left alone eventually. What I don't get is:

Bridge of Sighs: Description says it goes up the lower wall past the plaque, the only actual line is climbing the right hand side of the plaque into a small flake thing. But topo shows it climbing the left hand side of the plaque?

Jewel of Corruption: Description says it climbs the left hand side of the arete, this is too hard for the grade and cobblers. It would be possible and natural to climb up the right hand side of the arete. But the topo shows it climbing the right hand side of the plaque as for the "natural line" of Bridge of Sighs?

WTF?

I suspect that when I will go back I will do the obvious BOS line and forget the rest of the bullshit, nevertheless it is all a bit confusing...

[Gus]

Another one for the Staffordshire massive:

Bridge of Sighs @ The Hanging Stone. The lower wall bit. Attempted recently but reversed and left alone eventually. What I don't get is:

Bridge of Sighs: Description says it goes up the lower wall past the plaque, the only actual line is climbing the right hand side of the plaque into a small flake thing. But topo shows it climbing the left hand side of the plaque?

Right hand side of the plaque is right I think?, using the right edge of it as a left facing edge for you left hand I seem to remember, big reach/ rockover up to a good hold, then move right round the arete at the break, pull over the roof and traverse left then up via amazing but pretty steady moves. Top class!!!!!

If you're into checking out this sort of thing go have a do at "The Phantom" at Gradbach hill, flippin amazing route, top end E4 5c???
Enjoy!
Gus

[AndiT]

definitely left side of the plaque. it's the hardest bit by far. really good above that. better off climbing it via the arete, lose an E point but gain a star in my opinion.

[Fiend]

definitely left side of the plaque.

Ummmm, but, firstly there isn't really a line of the left side of the plaque, and secondly...

Right hand side of the plaque is right I think?, using the right edge of it as a left facing edge for you left hand I seem to remember

....the confusion grows.

P.S. Gus, The Phantom is on my list, walked along there once, looked very cool but a bit green. Is it likely to need a quick brush at this time of year?

[Gus]

I seem to remember it being pretty clean, although the weather has been pants!!!!
Worth getting someone else top brush it though as it would really spoil it having seen those holds before you grope blindly for them!!!!!

I'm really confused about bridge of sighs too, and doubting my sanity, as Andi was belaying me!!! I'm sure it was to the right of the plaque??? Dunno though.
Worth going back for however you do it though! The VS to the left is really good, and quite tricky!!!
Have a good un!
gus

[Fiend]

Another one for the Leek massive, if they can spare the time from demolishing man-made crag patios and ponder on it...

The Clown, Belmont Hall Crags: Real grade? Line? Gear?

[Gus]

Hi again!
This is another hidden (in the true sense of the word) gem!
Me and Andi gave this place some attention in summer, and it's worth the bushwack to get there.
The clown is really good, although not one to dop when it's quite hot. It has a tricky, bouldery start and then is quite bold, the legendary peg is no longer there, or unuseable anyway. But the line is good and the obvious way up the clean face.
There is a fantastic route on the right wall too called The Face, which shoudl still be quite clean.
Give me or Andi T a shout if you need any more info about the place or directions if you've not been already.
Cheers
Gus

[Gus]

Sorry, should have also said that E3 is about right, although once the start is done it's more E3 5c due to it's bold nature.

[andy popp]

Is the peg still in the Face - never quite understood why this was OK? As Gus, very worthwhile and probably pretty soft at E5.

[Gus]

I don't think there was a peg in The Face, the start was a bit bold, and then there was some Ok ish gear in the break before the big reach to the good pocket, then brilliant but bold moves after this, easing with height.
Defo soft at the great but fantastic nonetheless!
When does Alton Towers open? Time to get to Park Bank Crags before it does!!!

[AndiT]

Gus, your memory is crap. The peg is most definitely still in the Face, it's the crux passing it. That big move out right with peg at your belly. It is is a good peg. Probably good E5 without and easy E5 with, it was very hot when we did it. Still, not a patch on Inaccessible... The best E5 in Staffs possibly...