[guypercival]

These videos have been really good.
I thought the last one was superb

[jwi]

Gunslingers at Bombé Bleu.  Anatole Bosio, Lucien Martinez and Charles Albert tries the legendary project under the watchful eye of Marc Le Menestrel

[JamieG]

These videos have been really good.
I thought the last one was superb

Really enjoyed that. He comes across as a really nice guy. Such a shame to hear about his illness. Really debilitating condition ME/CFS.

[moose]

Re the Bombe Bleu video, does the French use of "mythical" have a different sense to the English?  The term is used to describe Bombe Bleu and it was repeatedly used in the recent Seb Bouin video to describe Fred Rouhling's routes. 

In English, mythical has implications of the fictitious, "fairy stories" etc. So I thought Seb's video was perhaps suggesting that Rouhling's routes were somehow invalid (either had not been climbed or because of chipping).  Now I suspect that in French, mythical is more equivalent to "renowned" (thinking about it, the words "fabled" and "legendary" are similarly ambiguous - can mean "of a fairy story" and / or "dead famous").

[mrjonathanr]

<< C’est plus fin qu’il ne paraît>> Effectivement, Charles c’est le héritier natural de cet esprit mythique du vallon.

“Aleatory”  = low percentage move. Jibé at 12.57 I think?

Edit - seen your post Moose. Yes, mythique = legendary in this context, but it can also reference myths and legends.

[jwi]

Re the Bombe Bleu video, does the French use of "mythical" have a different sense to the English? 

yup, as mrj says, mythique is legendary in this context. It's a common usage. You can even say that a party was "mythique" etc

[moose]

Cheers Fellas, I suspected as much - implied cheating / invention did seem a bit incongruous for a feel-good corporate puff-piece.

I am now disappearing into a mental worm-hole on the gradations between legendary, fabled, mythical, renowned, storied etc. and their variations.  Matters such as why is Jerry Moffat a "climbing legend" but not "legendary climber", whereas Jack and the Beanstalk is about a "legendary climber" but not a "climbing legend"!

[cheque]

I am now disappearing into a mental worm-hole on the gradations between legendary, fabled, mythical, renowned, storied etc. and their variations.  Matters such as why is Jerry Moffat a "climbing legend" but not "legendary climber", whereas Jack and the Beanstalk is about a "legendary climber" but not a "climbing legend"!

It’s like the debates between football pundits over who is or was a “world class” or “top top” player. Battles rage long and hard without any of them stopping to come up with a definition of either category.

[mrjonathanr]

To muddy the waters further, what I was referring to in French was the mystical element to Buoux, its history of settlement over 5000 years with the underground necropolis, Roman fort, carvings in the rock, Huguenot refuges and so on.

Fabrics Guillot ( iirc ) spent some time fasting and meditating under the crag with Antoine once upon a time. Stood up, fell off the ledge and left citing ‘mauvaises ondes’ or something similar. Or that’s how the story went, details a little hazy now.

[SA Chris]

These videos have been really good.
I thought the last one was superb

I like their stuff, the one about The New Deal is one of my favourite recent chuffing films.

[Duma]

Loving the buoux vid! Moose, that strikes me as a surprising question, mythical is used in exactly the same way in English regularly?

[moose]

Loving the buoux vid! Moose, that strikes me as a surprising question, mythical is used in exactly the same way in English regularly?

Really? I nearly always encounter mythical with apocryphal / fabled stuff - Robin Hood, King Arthur, the Iliad / Odyssey etc.  Legendary is the more ambiguous term - used for both the historically dodgy and genuine, truthful matters of historic significance (bear in mind though that I am one of those arseholes who gets upset by the erosion of the delineation between disinterested and uninterested, and the use of decimation when destruction / annihilation would be more apt).

[SA Chris]

French use Legend(e) too - "Je suis un Legende (7a+) - Verdon.

[teestub]

and the use of decimation when destruction / annihilation would be more apt).

I think it’s been a while since it’s common usage swung from 1/10 to being synonymous with the other two but would be interesting to know when that was.

Loved the Buoux vid, they get some great stuff on Relais Vertical

[moose]

and the use of decimation when destruction / annihilation would be more apt).

I think it’s been a while since it’s common usage swung from 1/10 to being synonymous with the other two but would be interesting to know when that was.

That "when" is forever a dark time in my heart!  I admit I'm resigned and in the minority on that front but I'm adamant the disinterest / uninterested difference is worth keeping.

[andy popp]

Decimate may have a technical meaning but I would guess most people have used it more loosely for a long time. Here's a Google Ngram:

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=decimate&year_start=1700&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0#t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0

I wonder if the steady climb in usage from the first half of the C20th indicates increasing misuse? However, following some of the sources I immediately found someone complaining about widespread misuse in 1885. So, it's been going on for a while.

Meanwhile, uninterested and disinterested have completely different meanings and can't substitute for each other.

ps. Buoux film was great, fascinating to see this legendary route up close.

[Fiend]

Bombe Bleu.... it's halfway up the crag with an long access scramble to get there, looks as if it bakes in the sun, rambling to start to a rest ledge, disproportionately hard bloc crux, a possible entirely morpho way to bypass that, moves that are easier with one bare foot, and endless painful pockets that limit the amount of tries you can have. What's not to love! Nice film and commentary though, and of course Charles being Charles.

[jwi]

Speaking of decimate.

Words like this drives me crazy. I suspect it is partly because I am a ESL speaker, and my method to acquire vocabulary is by memorising etymology.

(Decimate has nothing on the name of the ninth to twelfth months in most European languages. That the 9th month is called the seventh (sept) month, the 10th month is called the eight (octo) month ... argh....)

[SA Chris]

Decimate may have a technical meaning but I would guess most people have used it more loosely for a long time. Here's a Google Ngram:

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=decimate&year_start=1700&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0#t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0

I wonder if the steady climb in usage from the first half of the C20th indicates increasing misuse? However, following some of the sources I immediately found someone complaining about widespread misuse in 1885. So, it's been going on for a while.

Meanwhile, uninterested and disinterested have completely different meanings and can't substitute for each other.

Interesting. I was completely oblivious of anything other than the use in the modern venacular. Likewise flammable and inflammable are not the same thing. (apologies for the OT, but I find this stuff fascinating.

[cheque]

[SA Chris]

Hi Everybody!

[JamieG]

I'm finding this conversation about semantic change egregious! 

[moose]

Decimate may have a technical meaning but I would guess most people have used it more loosely for a long time. Here's a Google Ngram:

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=decimate&year_start=1700&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0#t1%3B%2Cdecimate%3B%2Cc0

I wonder if the steady climb in usage from the first half of the C20th indicates increasing misuse? However, following some of the sources I immediately found someone complaining about widespread misuse in 1885. So, it's been going on for a while.

Meanwhile, uninterested and disinterested have completely different meanings and can't substitute for each other.

Interesting. I was completely oblivious of anything other than the use in the modern venacular. Likewise flammable and inflammable are not the same thing. (apologies for the OT, but I find this stuff fascinating.

Flammable and inflammable are usually both used interchangably for "readily ignitable".  I've come across inflammable being used for igniting spontaneously in air but that's not a widely accepted meaning and it's not described by its etymology (the "in" just means "to do", like "indoctrinate"); and that behaviour is normally termed pyrophoric.

Now back to the report I am writing where I am having to explain the differences between smoke-, flash-, fire-, and auto-ignition points to a solicitor.....

[mrjonathanr]

Nomenclature of months comes from the Roman system of ten.

[jwi]

That inflammable means burnable should be clear to everyone that has had a burning sensation from an inflammation.

This message is possibly off topic.