[Danny]

Agree. Just thought it worth pointing out some ill-informed, ironic (predominantly sport climbing site questions the merits of lowering off before the top) conjecture. For the shits and giggles you see.

As for the baby thing, I'm going to hazard a guess that you've never been 2 months down the parenthood road before. But you're right, in that it all depends.

More importantly, again, it looks mega...maybe not as mega as that roof crack of Tommy's in Wales, but more than worthy nonetheless.

[Tommy]

NOTHING is as good as that roof crack in Wales ;-)

Except... everything else in Wales.

As for the baby thing - I always think you have to remember that hardly anything in a video on the internet is anything like a representation of reality. I mean, if I think of anything that I've made or done, it looks like I live in cellar under my house with Pete Whittaker, I only climb cracks and I'm a total idiot. Oh wait a sec.

[Fiend]

Nah that's not true, you climbed that thing at Millstone....

[Nibile]

Chuffing?
Nice little DWS video with Mauro Calibani.

[Gus]

Good vid. Shambles ethics!

Where's the ground up tekkers??

Good job team megaphone wasn't around! Makes it feel a bit more justifiable megaphone heckling him off diablo a few years ago. Think his words were "Bastardos"   

[Fiend]

https://www.reelhouse.org/hotaches/redemption/purchase/rent

Redemption available.

[Fiend]

Streamed it. Entertaining enough if you want a potted history of Keen Yoof, quite concise and doesn't drag on too long with the talking heads bits - a few funny comments from Jack G too.

Showing his background in grit repeats was a nice touch, with candor about his yooffulness (sp!). Showing his return to harder trad since coming back from Europe would have been good as well.

The grading hype over Walk Of Life was a bit overhyped. Obviously there was a lot of fuss but to anyone with half a brain it's obvious that most commentators understand neither the grading system for the hypothetical onsight, nor the logical reasons behind James's grades.

The footage of Rhapsody was good, he pisses it.

[Danny]

I've nothing but respect and admiration for JPs accomplishments on rock in recent years. The way he has systematically chipped away at his weaknesses - the sporty side of things - and then gone on to smash a load of hard trad routes in in great style is superb.

However, I have to say I'm a little sceptical about this film. For me, if he'd just climbed Rhapsody, written a wee blog about it and left it at that, I would've probably had similar thoughts, i.e. nice one JP.

But to approach a film company specifically to document a presumably self-proclaimed, and at that point pre-emptive redemption (is that an oxymoron?)...well, that seems a bit silly to me.

Apologies if that seems harsh, I realise some on here may know James personally...so, again, I'd like to be clear that, in the main, I admire what he's done on the rock. 

[SA Chris]

He's a pro athlete, any promtion you can do can only be good for your profile.

[Jaspersharpe]

Exactly. It's what he does for a living.

In some ways it's even more impressive to me as it took some serious balls to go back to that route after everything that had happened previously as it was. Having a film crew there was putting even more pressure on himself.

[tim palmer]

Film looks good, nice sort of conversational format.

He's a pro athlete, any promtion you can do can only be good for your profile.

Just on a slight off-topic note, but when did all full time climbers become athletes? 
I am not just being contrary, I think there is a lot of baggage that goes a lot with the term "athlete", why isn't pro-climber good enough?

[Nibile]

Semantics: to be a pro-climber, just means that someone gets paid for climbing. The only thing you need, is someone that gives you money. To be an athlete, someone has go to put the work in.
Not all pros are athletes.

[dave]

Athletes have to do athletics don't they, by definition? I tend to find use of "athlete" by climbers seems like a bit of an affectation.

[Danny]

I thought an athlete was simply someone who participates in a physical sport. Unless you take issue with the word "sport" then we're all athletes by this definition. Sweet.

Although I did laugh a while back when a sponsored friend of mine proclaimed he was an athlete.

As for JP, well, as a brand ambassador / athlete / pro I guess I shouldn't fault him for doing what he must.

[Nibile]

That's the point, but they don't need to do necessarily athletics.
Being an athlete, to me, means embracing an athlete's life, in terms of committment to the discipline, to the training, to a life that's devoted, to an extent that can vary, to a sport discipline.
The term athlete seems a bit of an affectation because most climbers do not show this attitude: they simply tour the world in good company, crushing hard boulders and routes and having fun. Who could blame them for this?
But that seems to be a completely different life from those who maybe have a regular job, and train for a goal with lots of effort and sacrifice.
Being an athlete isn't about having fun, to me.
It's about working hard day in day out, on and off the specific medium on which you'll perform.
So, not all pros are athletes, and not all athletes are pro. But I think that all pros SHOULD be athletes.

[tomtom]

What about a piss artist?

[Danny]

I think that all pros SHOULD be athletes.

I almost totally agree with this. But it's a tad dogmatic.

On the one hand, it would be great to see less of the sub-standard attention seeking charlatans who pass for pros, on the other I fear this may come at the expense of diversity in what is a massively nebulous activity.

For example, by this definition Honnold wouldn't be a pro. By his own admission he isn't a sport or bouldering wad - not an athlete - maybe through lack of application, though.

It's your classic Si O'Connor / Rich Simpson dilemma.   
 

[Sasquatch]

An interesting comparison to me within climbing of the "athletes" vs the "pro-climbers" would be to look at the WC guys.  I'd say they're all "athletes",  as well as Pro-climbers.  Someone like dave graham, or Chris Sharma, are pro-climbers, but not really athletes - by there own admission. 

[tim palmer]

but is athlete not meaningless unless it is used in the strictest terms ( some who does athletics) and in the context of climbing all it will be used for is to flog someone's cross training fad.
plus "athlete", to me, is indelibly associated with elitism and drug cheats.

I am also not sure that the rich Simpson comment was fair, he was incredibly strong but just did/claimed some dubious things,  sounds like alot of athletes to me

[Muenchener]

but is athlete not meaningless unless it is used in the strictest terms ( some who does athletics)

"Athletics" used in that particular sense - basically limited to running, jumping, throwing and excluding other forms of physically strenuous sport - is a uniquely British usage not found elsewhere in the world. Not even the other English speaking bits of it. Sean MacColl is Canadian and his sponsors in this case are Swiss, so you can't reasonably expect them to speak your local dialect.

[tim palmer]

but is athlete not meaningless unless it is used in the strictest terms ( some who does athletics)

"Athletics" used in that particular sense - basically limited to running, jumping, throwing and excluding other forms of physically strenuous sport - is a uniquely British usage not found elsewhere in the world. Not even the other English speaking bits of it. Sean MacColl is Canadian and his sponsors in this case are Swiss, so you can't reasonably expect them to speak your local dialect.

No but I suppose you could expect the world governing body to determine it

http://www.iaaf.org/disciplines

[hamsforlegs]

IAAF is only the governing body of athletics.

It isn't the world regulator of the concept 'athlete'.

A governing body can define its terms and its remit how it wishes. It only has authority insofar as other people want to rely on or be associate with  it.

When I think of 'athletes' I do automatically think of traditional 'athletics', which for me is about a proud tradition of grass roots, cheap-as-chips hard work and early mornings. Increasingly I think a lot of the pro climbers do live in that kind of world?

[Muenchener]

but is athlete not meaningless unless it is used in the strictest terms ( some who does athletics)

"Athletics" used in that particular sense - basically limited to running, jumping, throwing and excluding other forms of physically strenuous sport - is a uniquely British usage not found elsewhere in the world. Not even the other English speaking bits of it. Sean MacColl is Canadian and his sponsors in this case are Swiss, so you can't reasonably expect them to speak your local dialect.

No but I suppose you could expect the world governing body to determine it

http://www.iaaf.org/disciplines

I see your IAAF and raise you a Merriam Webster:

ath·lete noun \ˈath-ˌlēt, ÷ˈa-thə-ˌlēt\
: a person who is trained in or good at sports, games, or exercises that require physical skill and strength

and a Collins

athlete (ˈæθliːt  Pronunciation for athlete )

Definitions
noun

a person trained to compete in sports or exercises involving physical strength, speed, or endurance
a person who has a natural aptitude for physical activities
(mainly British) a competitor in track and field events

(I don't have access to the OED online and my paper copy is in a box somewhere)

I don't see Sean MacColl not matching these definitions, except the last (mainly British) one

[Tommy]

However, I have to say I'm a little sceptical about this film. For me, if he'd just climbed Rhapsody, written a wee blog about it and left it at that, I would've probably had similar thoughts, i.e. nice one JP.

But to approach a film company specifically to document a presumably self-proclaimed, and at that point pre-emptive redemption (is that an oxymoron?)...well, that seems a bit silly to me.

Apologies if that seems harsh, I realise some on here may know James personally...so, again, I'd like to be clear that, in the main, I admire what he's done on the rock.

It doesn't really work like that in most cases. Most of us climbers who make various films/videos/whatever are friends with the filmmakers and it's more a "hey do you fancy doing this next year..." kinda thing. Sometimes it sounds cool, sometimes it doesn't. If both parties like the project then it's got a chance of happening! It's pretty similar to how it works between photographers and climbers as well. I'm almost certain James would never have approached Diff to make that film. It would have resulted from a vague chat in a pub or on a sunny afternoon sat around in Pembroke. No Hollywood film deal meeting rooms that's for sure!

The downside I think, is that if filmmakers don't personally know some of the "most interesting" climbers then their story will probably never get told and we'll never get to see it.

[Danny]

I'm almost certain James would never have approached Diff to make that film.

I have a vague recollection of reading a Hot Aches post that suggests he did...from memory, it was in the context of Hot Aches not being so keen to film Rhapsody yet again, until James explained his reasons, which apparently constituted a nice story arc. Can't find it now though, so it could just be a figment of my imagination. 

Not sure it matters following the whole exposure / pro conversation. Plus many (most?) of us on here, including myself, are equally shameless narcissists with Vimeo accounts stuffed to the gills with "Two from somewhere" type flicks. I shouldn't play holier than thou as a result.