[account_inactive]

When I lived up in Sheff (many moons ago) I cleaned and climbed a line to the right of Mark's Roof at Gardoms.  It started on the back wall and met the holds on the lip with some side pull and heel action before whaling over the top on slopers.

Looking in the new guide I wondered if that is what is meant by Mark's direct?  

I sent an e-mail to the cragx people at the time cause they were talking about new problems etc  :roll: , but never heard anything back.

If this is new (cause it had loads of stuff to brush off when I did it)can someone let me know...................

[Suj]

Sheesh, that looks nails.

I would imagine your problem must be Mark' Roof Direct. There's not much room for another problem, or finish.

[Ru]

There are three natural exits from the central bit of the roof.

1: traverse all the way left to the flake
2: traverse a few moves left and lunge up the slopes: Marks Roof
3. Exit straight up and slightly right via bad slopes: the direct

I found several competing claims for all three so left a FA off, so sorry if you are the genuine FA.

[account_inactive]

Better described this properly:

Start to the right of the Marks Roof on shelf.  Move up right to side pull and then to hold just before lip.  Heel hook and then move through to bad slopers on the lip. Finish with the usual style aka marks roof

I did this around 2000 but had not been back until this last weekend when I saw some chalk on it!

[c.j.d.]

I checked this out on Sunday - it looks good.  From what I could gather, people we're starting the same as Marks Roof, and then breaking out left at the jug/lip to exit via the slopers for the V9/7c tick.  After closer inspection, I could see a long side pull for the right hand just out from the back of the cave, Dolphin Belly slap style, to form a true direct out of the cave - looks hard - is this what you've done?

[dave]

i thought the direct finish went slightly right/straight out from the MR lip jug?

[account_inactive]

I checked this out on Sunday - it looks good.  From what I could gather, people we're starting the same as Marks Roof, and then breaking out left at the jug/lip to exit via the slopers for the V9/7c tick.  After closer inspection, I could see a long side pull for the right hand just out from the back of the cave, Dolphin Belly slap style, to form a true direct out of the cave - looks hard - is this what you've done?

So it was you with the chalk on Sunday  :D   The start is not as bad as it looks really.  I used the side pull and then reached through to the flat holds under the lip.  This is why I was confused as it means that You don't actually use any holds on Mark's roof.  Once you have the flat holds you can heel hook to match and then pull through for glory(crux).

I would be suprised if it was worth more than V9 (7c), especially in new money  :wink:

[Bonjoy]

Better described this properly:

Start to the right of the Marks Roof on shelf.  Move up right to side pull and then to hold just before lip.  Heel hook and then move through to bad slopers on the lip. Finish with the usual style aka marks roof

 Is it just me or does that sound like an exact description of the standard Mark's roof (not the direct)? :roll:

[Scouse D]

The direct finishes Right-it doesn't share the same finish as Marks roof.
Dylan-it sounds like you've just done Marks roof :?  :?:

[account_inactive]

The difference being this starts near the right hand arete (where the fallen block is).  It uses side pulls on the arete and is further right of the lip than the big square cut jug on Mark's roof.

Honestly it is quite independent

[Bonjoy]

Does it finish up arete, super slopey slopes or the end section of M's R?

[dave]

what we need here is a guidebook.

[account_inactive]

Does it finish up arete, super slopey slopes or the end section of M's R?

Yes.  Is this Marks roof direct then?  So if it is it looks like I have just added an independent start.
Is :

Mark's roof: Start on shelf at back of roof and make long move via trianglar hold to jug on lip.  Traverse left and then up to slopers and nasty finish

Mark's roof direct: Start as mark's roof but traverse right to flat holds and then shitty slopers to top

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Does anyone have a picture of the roof?

[account_inactive]

sorry bonjoy meant to say super slopey slopes at the right hand edge of Mark's roof just missing the boulder that touches the roof

[Scouse D]

one off Stu's site

[account_inactive]

My thing doesn't use that jug that Ru is going for.  You can see the left hand flat edge in the far right of the photo.  It then tops out from there.

When was Mark's direct done?

[Ru]

This really shouldn't be that hard.

Mark's Roof starts from the shelf at the back, gets big sidepull with right, out to squarecut jug, trav left, up slopey scoop.

Mark's Roof Direct starts as above to square jug, goes direct/slightly right up the wall above, no traversing.

Dylans thing sounds like a different start, slightly right of Mark's Roof start, the only question is whether it exits direct as per Mark's roof Direct, or traverses left to finish as for Mark's Roof.

[a dense loner]

that's not even a question dylan's thing obviously goes the right hand finish of marks direct. though how can you call marks direct direct if it finishes rightwards? :roll:
don't worry dylan i've only been there once n i know what you're on about. the answer to your original question is it's a new prob

[Ru]

Finish with the usual style aka marks roof

It was this bit in Dylan's description that made me think it may have finished with the usual style, aka marks roof.

But it was also insinuated that it finished up the direct.

Hence the question.

[a dense loner]

that is a good point well made. was this done onsight in the rain as well. didn't see that bit, just read the later description.  this leads us back to

the question

[account_inactive]

hurrah!

I climbed a new thing
I climbed a new thing

[Pantontino]

The real question is: whatcha gonna call it?

Dylan's Roof might be tempting, but what if you do another roof first ascent - you've got to think these things through. Might be best to sleep on it, but that doesn't always work.

I did a new problem in a cave on the Ormes yesterday afty, and I'm at a loss (save for flicking through my record collection) for a name. Couldn't think of anything last night; woke up this morning - still, nothing. I've got writer's block. Maybe if I eat a load of cheese before I go to bed tonight it will come to me in a dream. I'll let you know if it works.

[dave]

what about "weapons of ass destruction"?

[petje]

Here the last move on mark's last october. (Crazy italian spotter behind me)

[account_inactive]

Here the last move on mark's last october. (Crazy italian spotter behind me)

Cheers for the Pic.  At least your spotter is pointing in the right direction!

You can see the holds on the right hand side.

I think you might be right Simon.  What to call it?  Seeing as the guide has already been printed it a bit late for that now I think   But I think Dylan's roof might be the easiest answer.  No where has that Brie gone............

[petje]

what french grade would you grit experts give for mark's? and what for the problem left of that?

[dave]

The one left is about font 7a, and excellent. Not sure what its got in the new guide.

[petje]

7a sounds right, the way it felt. that makes mark's 7bish?

[dave]

dunno, i've never done marks - the only hard part is the horrible slopey-lock grovel finish, all the climbing up to that part is easier than the left hand problem.

[DrWong]

Dylan - how about your favourite TV show: "Desperate Housewives", alternatively "Wednesday Night Session @ The House of Power!" also has a nice ring to it.

petje - I am far from being a gritstone expert but F7b (v7) felt about right for Mark's Roof and F7a (v5) feels about right for the one just left.

[dave]

shirley you don't mean F grades? I see no bolts!  :wink:  :roll:

[DrWong]

sorry - by 'F' I meant Font - got lazy

[account_inactive]

What about Wong Woof?

I agree 7a and 7b and my ting 7c

Nice mix

[cowboyhat]

why not call it 'Dylan proves a point'...?
or 'Nice guide rupert but just wait here and listen to us while we pick holes in it'...?

[DrWong]

Nice bit of rock that - anymore lines to go? Is there any potential for a problem that starts at the 7a and finshes up mark's direct / dylan's prob?

[petje]

There is a combi going up mark's and down the left thing, and up mark's and so on.

what about: mark's up; left down; mark's up; finish with dylan's. theoretic 8a trav?

[account_inactive]

That would be the major link up 7c+?

[SA Chris]

Or call it Mark Question?

Although Mark Edwards has done "Mark" based names to death.

Please make him stop.

[petje]

Just so i am in this forum once again:

[Ru]

Sorry to be a pedant, but Dylan's thing is a right hand start to Mark's Roof direct, that may be how mark's roof direct was first climbed?

Is this right?

(Marks roof direct starts where the guy is on the shot and exits up the chalky holds above, just in case anyone is being as slow as I seem to be today)

[account_inactive]

That seems to be about right Ru. Different start and the finish without the jug of Mark's roof.  When was this claimed as I had to brush quite a bit of lichen of it to do it?

[Pantontino]

And to add further to the confusion:

"petje - I am far from being a gritstone expert but F7b (v7) felt about right for Mark's Roof and F7a (v5) feels about right for the one just left."

What's with the grade comparisons? I know this no longer matters in the Peak, especially as the grades in Ru's book are spot on for this roof (and of course everywhere else, with the possible exception, ahem, of, ahem, Boozy Traverse, ahem), but since when has 7a equated (albeit approximately) to V5, or 7b to V7? The only place I've ever seen those grade comparisons is in the OTE 'how to' series - and then I just assumed it was a proof reading error.

[Ru]

Don't know when Mark's Roof Direct was first done. I asked about a bit and several people said that they'd done things that exited the roof in that area, some claiming FAs and others not. In the end I didn't put an FA in, but if you had to clean a lot of stuff off, maybe you were the first??

In general getting the correct FA is really hard in the Peak as people like Ben and Jerry and lots of very talented others have been bouldering there for years. Some things get reported, others don't. Things get climbed in mistake for other things etc, and few can accurately remember when things were done.

I decided to put FAs in the guide, but as it had never been done before lots of stuff is probably open to debate and revision in the future.

[account_inactive]

Nay worries mate, its good enough for me to know that I did the first ascent.  From the look of the rock now and before I cleaned of all the shit I think it was the first ascent.

Now for the link up from Mark's left hand.................

[a dense loner]

have to agree with pantontino here, how many ceaseless crap grading debates have we had and dr wong still can't compare. must be the smog :wink:

[account_inactive]

It could be that fall he took at Siurana  :wink:

[webbo]

And to add further to the confusion:

"petje - I am far from being a gritstone expert but F7b (v7) felt about right for Mark's Roof and F7a (v5) feels about right for the one just left."

What's with the grade comparisons? I know this no longer matters in the Peak, especially as the grades in Ru's book are spot on for this roof (and of course everywhere else, with the possible exception, ahem, of, ahem, Boozy Traverse, ahem), but since when has 7a equated (albeit approximately) to V5, or 7b to V7? The only place I've ever seen those grade comparisons is in the OTE 'how to' series - and then I just assumed it was a proof reading error.

i was going to make some similar comments,but thought why bother there will another grumpy old man along in a minute to say something. :wink:

[DrWong]

What's with the grade comparisons? .....

Oops! seem to have inadvertently re-opened the old can-o-worms.

What I meant to say is that:

Font 7A = V6 = V5 (HAG)
Font 7B = V8 = V7 (HAG)

(where HAG = "Hardcore AUSTRALIAN Grades" cause we all know how solid and hardcore us Aussies are) :wink:

Seriously though, leaving the Font Grades and comparisons aside and using my own experience as reference, the left hand thing feels no more than V5 although I accept that Mark's roof itself could well be closer to V7/8 or V8.

These are just my grades, not "Dave's Grades", not the "real grades" or the "world grades".

must be the smog

more likely the unhealthy influence of hanging out with you crazy (grit)stoners.

[Jim]

I tried marks roof direct a couple of months ago and the slopers were proper dirty and really gritty. seems its not been done/tried for a while. I've not done marks roof yet cos I'm so fuckin knackered by the time I get to the lunging part. MR left end is a bit of a gift at 7a but a top problem.
may have to go here this afternoon as some other unfinished buisiness here as well although I don't recon dense will be keen

[Johnny Brown]

[dave]

 :worthy:

[a dense loner]

stop it my sides are killin me. but seriously jims right i won't be keen, as good as gardoms north is :roll: . gonna go n look at some wimberry 8c's just for cofe.

[cofe]

yeah, i've been thinkin about these wimberry 8cs - maybe they're only 8b+? i feel like i may have just opened a big can of worms...

[saltbeef]

Hardcore australian grades...