[M1V0]

Bm1k outside bottom edges are 18mm I thought?

You might be thinking 2k, which are 18mm

[User deactivated.]

The best climber in the world barely getting 77kg to move a few cm off the ground with one arm:

https://youtu.be/Hb8SIrCsesk?si=g7MF-mk8bcECbDdj

[stone]

I know it's mean, but I just can't stop thinking about how stunningly bad at climbing you'd have to be to be that strong and not climb 8C+ or 9b!

I was taken aback a few years ago by just how upset someone got after getting that reaction to an awesome feats of finger board strength video.

If the person doing it "only" climbs 7C or whatever, that is still pretty impressive to me, regardless of whether that is by way of off-the-chart finger strength or by way of a mix of attributes.

[yetix]

Bm1k outside bottom edges are 18mm I thought?

You might be thinking 2k, which are 18mm

I was under the impression they were 14mm. There are old images which stated the depths floating around on reddit stating that. Maybe Dan can confirm the dpeths on here once and for all!?

[yetix]

https://www.reddit.com/r/climbharder/s/Xq7np8G1O1

Bm 1k edges were measured at 16-20mm between different users and bm 2k edges at 12.7mm to 15mm

[abarro81]

Depths definitely changed at some point... The edges on very old 2ks are definitely not the same size as more modern ones (very old ones are a notch smaller). The middle edge also changed shape at some point to be more rounded and less overly incut (not actually changing difficulty much) - if you feel the two at the foundry you can easily feel the difference in middle edge shape

I was taken aback a few years ago by just how upset someone got after getting that reaction to an awesome feats of finger board strength video.

The truth can hurt! I can't understand the physics of falling off boulders where every hold must feel like a jug (he can hang more weight on an edge than I could on a jug), when you can one arm jugs with added weight. It just doesn't compute!

[User deactivated.]

The truth can hurt! I can't understand the physics of falling off boulders where every hold must feel like a jug (he can hang more weight on an edge than I could on a jug), when you can one arm jugs with added weight. It just doesn't compute!

I just looked on his insta page and in the most recent rock climbing vid he goes with the wrong hand for the first move on Lizard King, cutting loose in the process. Perhaps his tactics need a bit of work  But i'm not even hating, the guys a beast and I'd love to have some of that finger strength!

I wonder if the people pulling 80kg+ with 1 hand and still training it actually think they need more finger strength?

[stone]

I was taken aback a few years ago by just how upset someone got after getting that reaction to an awesome feats of finger board strength video.

The truth can hurt! I can't understand the physics of falling off boulders where every hold must feel like a jug (he can hang more weight on an edge than I could on a jug), when you can one arm jugs with added weight. It just doesn't compute!

I think the huge problem online is that we haven't a clue how the guy might take it. He may be reading this with hilarity or he may be crestfallen. If it were a face to face encounter and you saw him crestfallen you would instinctively switch over to just enthusing about how, if he were to dedicate some time on rock he could improve on rock in leaps and bounds. You might even end up saying that if strength training is his passion then he's an inspiration in that department regardless of anything else.

This also put me in mind of how amongst climbers in Edinburgh Uni in the 1980s there was a view that the only measure of climbing ability was what you did on a damp, vegetated, mountain cliff in a death fall situation. To them, your 8b+ onsights would have been merely demonstrating "technical ability" which might or might not be a limiting factor to true climbing ability as they saw it. The narrowness of the gap between technical ability and damp minging death fall scenario climbing gave them the measure of what they viewed as being the essence of all that was worthy and of need of cultivation in a climber.

[Dingdong]

I know it's mean, but I just can't stop thinking about how stunningly bad at climbing you'd have to be to be that strong and not climb 8C+ or 9b!

He’s not been climbing for very long tbf only like 4-5 years, goes back to what we were saying about climbing being a skill sport primarily, an 8C+ can be extremely complex in its moves no?

[mrjonathanr]

This also put me in mind of how amongst climbers in Edinburgh Uni in the 1980s there was a view that the only measure of climbing ability was what you did on a damp, vegetated, mountain cliff in a death fall situation. To them, your 8b+ onsights would have been merely demonstrating "technical ability" which might or might not be a limiting factor to true climbing ability as they saw it. The narrowness of the gap between technical ability and damp minging death fall scenario climbing gave them the measure of what they viewed as being the essence of all that was worthy and of need of cultivation in a climber.

Bonny Masson wrote an article about what she and Livesey termed ’real climbing’ in a magazine. I can’t find it online, might have been an early High, I suspect. There was an accompanying photo of her on Suicide Wall.

It put forward a view that what counted was the ability to hold it together on bold routes. It’s a view that was in the spirit of its time, although not so much nowadays when we revere strength and difficulty. Both perspectives are valid, aren’t they? Whatever floats your boat I say- although I suspect people often seek out whatever they feel most comfortable with, which tends to align with their own areas of strength.

Recently, I was looking at preserved kit and photos from the early Everest expeditions of the 20s-50s and marvelling at the clothes they had at their disposal. Woolly jumpers and tweeds at 8000m 

Climbing has changed so very much, but the rocks stay the same (erosion aside). You can have whatever experience you choose to seek out. Lattice bouldering training programme, soloing on Lliwedd- it’s all valid and no one approach is superior to another imo. You can just get on with what draws you most, it’s all good.

Edit -typos

[abarro81]

I know it's mean, but I just can't stop thinking about how stunningly bad at climbing you'd have to be to be that strong and not climb 8C+ or 9b!

He’s not been climbing for very long tbf only like 4-5 years, goes back to what we were saying about climbing being a skill sport primarily, an 8C+ can be extremely complex in its moves no?

It can be, but not all hard climbing is complex. At the least you'd expect 8Bs on a board to feel easy.

Stone- your example is more like if I said bouldering wasn't "real" climbing. Or a mountaineer saying rocks weren't real climbing. Fingerboarding isn't yet a sunset of rock climbing AFAIK! Of course if that's what these people are into for it's own sake then smash on, but then I can't imagine they'd be upset at my comment like I wouldn't be upset if someone pointed out that I suck at mountaineering.

[Fiend]

Fingerboard is the purest essence of climbing and should be in the Olympics instead of speed-babooning.

[stone]

Of course if that's what these people are into for it's own sake then smash on, but then I can't imagine they'd be upset at my comment like I wouldn't be upset if someone pointed out that I suck at mountaineering.

In the case I was thinking of, the guy was absolutely devastated. My impression was that he had mixed motivations. He liked strength training and revelled in his mastery of that. He also had climbing aspirations and felt affinity for the climbing community  (whatever that is). Anyway, the online commentary about how his strength feats demonstrated climbing ineptitude, upset him so much that he deleted all copies of all videos he had and caused him to view "the climbing community" as being cruel and alienating.

Even things said with a friendly good natured intention can be taken really badly.

[Wellsy]

Abarro you know it's mean to say, because you stated that yourself when you said it. It's hardly unreasonable that people might be upset by self-admittedly mean comments

Lad looks incredibly strong. If he climbs hard or not, that's still cool. Saying he must be an awful climber is pretty unnecessary imo. The thread is about incredible fingerboard feats, which that is.

[abarro81]

I can't help but feel like a Fox news viewer at this point...

[Fiend]

At least you didn't do something truly awful like pointing out him dabbing and still taking the grade...

[yetix]

Has Alex said he feels an awful climber? Or just acted surprised that people that strong don't find boulders and board climbing easy? I'd be surprised too, I'm not trying to be mean, just observing and stating an observation in the politest way I can.

I can completely accept someone might like training, have less time to work on the technical side of things and so and so forth, and still find it surprising people can be that strong and yet not perform on rock as well as I'd expect. Is that unreasonable?

I can think of a instances where I've been blown away at the crag by someone has 1 arm hung 10mm edge on my fb at the crag and then been unable to do a move on a bloc i could do every go which I felt was a straight forward move with sufficient finger strength. Am I meant to mask my shock in this instance? (as my social skills aren't the best and I'm not sure I'd be able to guarantee that) Where do I draw the line? Genuine question as I might just have to find increasing esoteric crags to avoid this situation otherwise.

[Bradders]

Such farcical levels of over-sensitivity on here lately that it's almost parody.

As Yetix says, it's not that anyone is trying to poke fun at this kind of thing, it's that having fingers that strong and not then being able to climb to a very high standard simply doesn't compute! It's fascinating more than anything else; as Alex said, how on earth can you ever fall off when all the handholds must feel like a jug feels to the rest of us?

And, as Alex also said, the truth can hurt. But we need truth to guide us, especially where improvement demands a large degree of introspection, something even the most deep thinking and reflective people can struggle with.

[yetix]

I know it's mean, but I just can't stop thinking about how stunningly bad at climbing you'd have to be to be that strong and not climb 8C+ or 9b!

Okay perhaps this phrasing was a little harsh

[Wellsy]

At least you didn't do something truly awful like pointing out him dabbing and still taking the grade...

A fine and noble heritage

[abarro81]

My phrasing was a bit mean... But I genuinely don't understand being that strong and not finding board 8Bs easy. Maybe that's my lack of imagination?! But I also find it a bit weird/lame that people can't accept if they suck at something. I suck at techy climbing and I suck at heels; it should not be offensive to tell me I suck at heels. Being reminded of this should be a kick up my ass to do something about it. I'll go back to watching Tucker and lamenting the modern snowflake generation now.

[User deactivated.]

My phrasing was a bit mean... But I genuinely don't understand being that strong and not finding board 8Bs easy.

This goes back to our discussion on specificity a few pages back (or was it another thread? They all turn into one...).  Being able to dangle of a 20mm edge has little to do with most board problems, which require different wrist angles, rate of force development, pulling out from the holds instead of just down, etc. the raw strength should be transferable to some extent but it requires getting coordinated first.

[Droyd]

Such farcical levels of over-sensitivity on here lately that it's almost parody.

Someone said something quite mean, and even admitted that saying that was quite mean as they said it, and people agreed that it was, in fact, mean. What about that is over-sensitive? If anything complaining that your mean-spirited comment is being called out as mean-spirited is over-sensitive.

And, as Alex also said, the truth can hurt. But we need truth to guide us, especially where improvement demands a large degree of introspection, something even the most deep thinking and reflective people can struggle with.

Would you really, if you came across a series of posts made by people that you don't know discussing one of your videos and taking the piss out of you, see that as truth-based guidance for your improvement?

[Dingdong]

Maybe we should rename this thread to legendary feats of climbing prowess  wouldn’t be a UKB thread without a massive tangent eh

Also let me give y’all some more context, first of all shaun comes from a country where rock climbing is few and far between so started indoors, came to the UK to do his degree and at the tail end of that degree started going out more on real rock. He also had no car so had to depend on friends for lifts to crags. Also Alex you’re assuming he hasn’t done any 8Bs but he was regularly smashing lots and lots of classics on the 50 and the moonboards often burning off wads.

And Nick the whole over sensitive thing is getting boring, welcome to the real world where people have differing levels of sensitivity to things, shock horror I know

[mrjonathanr]

abarro, if a 9a climber tells me I’m bad at some specific technique or other, I’ll take it on the chin and look to improve, no problem. If the same person tells me I’m basically not good at climbing, it’s going to feel very different. X10 if you’re young, keen and relatively new to the sport. That should be obvious.

More generally, strength is obviously only potential, it has to be applied, like Liam says. The top swimmers are pretty strong in specific ways and do plenty of strength training, but just getting strong won’t stop me from drowning if I haven’t invested in technique