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The REACH index... (Read 2416 times)

tomtom

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The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 08:59:06 pm
Given Fiends new found interest in climbing metrics, I thought I'd throw this one in. Be interesting to compare people. Basically its a combination of ape and height (with a little bit more thrown in too) and I think is probably a good measure of how able you are to 'lank' something.

Quite simply it is the distance you can reach standing on the floor. Of course using just one hand - and you can get further with one foot too. Tip toes fine - but no jumping :D in other words replicating what you could do on rock reaching as faaaar as you could.

So it takes into account arm length, body length, flexibility and ability to rotate hips and shoulder. My logic is that it represents  your max range of how you could theoretically reach a hold (this assumes its a slab I guess - but it also translates into how far you can reach things statically too..).

For me its 2.65m (!! seems like alot). I am 1.88m standing flat on my feet. We can also put this into a ratio - which may normalise for height to show how well people can use what height/ape they have etc.. so for me its: 1.41.

2.65m; 1.88m; 1.41

Oh - and thats with my left arm/right leg. I'm 2cm worse with the right arm/left leg!

What about everyone else?
« Last Edit: March 11, 2020, 09:04:26 pm by tomtom »

tomtom

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#1 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 09:02:29 pm
Just saw this on the other thread...

I think the debilitating effect of broad shoulders and inflexible hips should definitely be accounted for  :tease:
#pubscience

:)

Fiend

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#2 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 09:30:04 pm
Thanks. Will bolt this on to my algorithm to make it even more sciencey.

Yetix was moaning about this, that he has a +8 ape index but 4' wide shoulders (or something) so while he can fridgehug an entire fridge freezer, his vertical reach is tyrannosaur proportions.

Duma

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#3 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 09:32:58 pm
I've been thinking about starting this thread, so thanks tt

R- 2.35m
H- 1.75m
S- 1.81m

Ratio 1.34

moose

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#4 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 09:37:58 pm
Tom - either I'm tall but stumpy, or you have a massive ape index / broad and extendable shoulders?  I often find I'm outreached by short people but that's probably more due to being too weak to pull up than any skeletal ratios.

R: 2.53
H: 1.91
S: 1.32

tomtom

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#5 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 09:46:14 pm
Tom - either I'm tall but stumpy, or you have a massive ape index / broad and extendable shoulders?  I often find I'm outreached by short people but that's probably more due to being too weak to pull up than any skeletal ratios.

R: 2.53
H: 1.91
S: 1.32

I've gone and re-measured. I think I may have moved the tape measure first time (5cm over). Found a little mark on the wall I can just snag. Sorry! My ape is +4 or 5 cm (not huge but positive..). I think after 20-30 min of stretching (including one arm deadhang) I might get a cm or two more...

Reach: 2.60
Height: 1.88
Ratio: 1.38

cheque

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#6 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 10:03:45 pm
R 2.33
H 1.71
S 1.87

How do I work out the ratio?  :shrug:

Duma

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#7 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 10:07:16 pm
Moose, either that's a typo or you didn't use S to stand for span like I did!
Cheque, R/H. Also your span is massive! +17cm ape!

tomtom

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#8 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 10:10:20 pm
R 2.33
H 1.71
S 1.87

How do I work out the ratio?  :shrug:

R/H.

moose

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#9 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 10:18:22 pm
Moose, either that's a typo or you didn't use S to stand for span like I did!
Quote

to clarify,
Reach is 253cm (so far as I can tell - tricky to manipulate a tape measure over ones head!)
Height is 191cm  (6'3" in old units)
Ratio is 1.32
my ape index is 0

cheque

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#10 Re: The REACH index...
March 11, 2020, 10:38:40 pm
Cheque, R/H. Also your span is massive! +17cm ape!

Cheers, 1.36 ratio for me then.

Iím 7cm shorter since my accident- ape index was high before, itís ridiculous now!  :lol:

zloty_dziecko

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#11 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 10:45:15 am
Love things like this, just further confirmation I'm a lanky tw*t!

R 2.74
H 1.96
S 2.03

Ratio of 1.39.


Will Hunt

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#12 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:02:46 am
I said something kind of similar to this quite a while ago:
https://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=10347.0

spidermonkey09

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#13 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:05:06 am
R 2.15
H 1.67
S 1.71

Ration of 1.29. Think thats the smallest so far; what does this mean?

Will Hunt

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#14 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:10:24 am
Result! You're now both the shittest AND the stumpiest person to do Bat Route!

spidermonkey09

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#15 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:12:37 am
Sweet!

I wonder what the median ratio would be. Need more data; someone hack into the Lattice server...

Probably a dumb question, but how does broad shoulders effect ones reach?

kelvin

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#16 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:22:03 am
R - 2.35
H - 1.77
S - 1.77

Ratio is 1.33

That's right side, I can only reach 2.33 with the left hand.

*six years ago I used to have a -4cm ape and it would seem that all the shoulder and back physo after rolling my van has altered that. A massage therapist for a girlfriend must help too.

teestub

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#17 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 11:23:01 am
R: 230
H: 170
S: 175

Ratio 1.31

Jim I thought you were shorter, you obviously just stoop even worse than me 😄

nai

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#18 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 03:11:52 pm
R: 225
H: 168
S: 175

Ratio 1.34

Swear I used to be 167 and negative AI (-1" so ~3cm), maybe mobilty & postural stuff has helped but more likely I measured Span wrong at least

spidermonkey09

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#19 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 03:29:33 pm
I only measured reach with one hand, presume its the same with my other hand. Or really, should we measure with both hands above head at same time?

Jim I thought you were shorter, you obviously just stoop even worse than me 😄

Yet another postural inefficiency to address...

Duma

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#20 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 03:57:23 pm
R 2.15
H 1.67
S 1.71

Ration of 1.29. Think thats the smallest so far; what does this mean?
Seems low considering you've got a fairly positive AI.
Are you stood on one foot and reaching with the other hand? This adds a bit compared to keeping both feet on the floor.
You are the shortest data point so far so could be the ratio varies with height

Bradders

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#21 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 04:12:25 pm
R - 248
H - 181
S - 196

1.37

I would like to reiterate that long arms do not necessarily give an advantage  :lol:

petejh

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#22 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 08:16:12 pm
R - 241
H - 178
S - 189  ..never realised I had +11 AI until now

1.35


teestub

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#23 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 09:12:53 pm
R - 248
H - 181
S - 196

1.37

I would like to reiterate that long arms do not necessarily give an advantage  :lol:

Your reach is disappointing, weíre you standing on one leg on top toe? That ape though 😂 20 cm  difference from mine!

tomtom

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#24 Re: The REACH index...
March 12, 2020, 09:52:32 pm
I said something kind of similar to this quite a while ago:
https://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=10347.0

So come on - what are your figures Will?

AnaisB

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#25 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 07:51:24 am
Just joining in with the stats of a short person with shit ai:

R225
H167
S 158

Ratio 1.35


tomtom

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#26 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 08:15:03 am
Just joining in with the stats of a short person with shit ai:

R225
H167
S 158

Ratio 1.35

Whatís interesting is that your ratio is much better than others with small/negative AI - so you must be able to use your shoulders and hips well to get that height!!

nai

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#27 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 08:28:22 am
Indeed, we're more or less the same height, same reach despite a 17cm difference in span.

tomtom

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#28 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 08:46:13 am
I hadnít really though about it until this morning - but that suggests hip / lower spine flexibility is important too.

Shoulder width would seem to be an obvious one too - along with flexibility to use it. Though personally - despite being tall I have (I think) fairly narrow shoulders - yet a high ratio. Long arms? Ha! Around in circles again....

Bradders

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#29 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 08:53:48 am
R - 248
H - 181
S - 196

1.37

I would like to reiterate that long arms do not necessarily give an advantage  :lol:

Your reach is disappointing, weíre you standing on one leg on top toe? That ape though 😂 20 cm  difference from mine!

Yeah that was as far as I could go! Is this where shoulder breadth comes into it?

My knuckles do drag along the floor though  ::)

Duma

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#30 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 09:14:54 am
I suspect measurement errors are pretty significant in all this self reporting - hard to believe nai and AnaisB have the same reach if the rest of their figures are accurate.

kelvin

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#31 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 09:38:57 am
I hadnít really though about it until this morning - but that suggests hip / lower spine flexibility is important too.

Shoulder width would seem to be an obvious one too - along with flexibility to use it. Though personally - despite being tall I have (I think) fairly narrow shoulders - yet a high ratio. Long arms? Ha! Around in circles again....

The thoracic spine is the area where I was stiff, pretty much solid until all the physio - it's only now I realise how much that affects climbing. There's no way to use the shoulders or hips properly when the middle of your back is locked up.
Despite hardly any climbing and no training at all for the past two years, I managed my previous hardest grade second go on the last trip, despite really weak fingers. Climbing felt easy all trip and I'm sure that's down to having a flexible thoracic for the first time in donkeys years.

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#32 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 10:09:01 am
Some more data:
R: 247
H: 186
S: 193

Ratio: 1.33

I have quite small feet (street size 9.5) for someone of 6'1" so maybe that limits my reach? That and maybe needing some shoulder/thoracic flexibility improvements a la Kelvin

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#33 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 10:58:13 am
R 226
H 173
S 170

Ratio = 1.31

Narrow shoulders and stumpy fingers, stiff back.

Obviously I try to make up for it with technique and cunning

yetix

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#34 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 01:40:17 pm
R 226
H 175
S 185

Wide shoulders?

Trail

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#35 Re: The REACH index...
March 13, 2020, 01:42:58 pm
R - 248cm
H - 177cm
S - 190cm

Ratio 1.40

hmmm, no wonder my wife gives me abuse for reaching past things when we're the same height ;D

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#36 Re: The REACH index...
April 04, 2020, 07:45:53 am
R is 241cm, with a H of 178cm.

Ratio is 1.35.

Span is 185cm.

Will Hunt

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#37 Re: The REACH index...
April 04, 2020, 08:15:03 am
I can reach 241cm.
Arm span 188cm.
180cm tall.

Ratio (Reach/height) 1.34.

Will Hunt

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#38 Re: The REACH index...
April 04, 2020, 09:58:14 am
Have you done anything with the data yet, TT? The ratios are all generally 1.3. So tip to tip span is a very good predictor of how high you can reach off the floor? Obviously in a climbing context it's a bit more complex (lock off ability comes into it etc).

Are we to be ranked according to tip to tip span? I'm not sure how accurate my measurement for that was as it was done by a woman holding an infant and the tape measure was going across my chest (thus bendy, rather than measuring the distance between two points on a flat wall).

tomtom

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#39 Re: The REACH index...
April 04, 2020, 10:30:53 am
Back around Albatross :)

Ratio varies from 1.29 to 1.42 (I think) which is quite a big range (1.42 on a 160cm person is near same reach 1.29 on 180cm.

What is interesting is that It seems to be more about flexibility (hip, thorasic and shoulders) than Tip to tip.

Anyway - Iíve got a toddler to look after interspersed with trying to do the groundworkís of woody building - and then thereís the full time job. In other words - no time. So please If youíve got any spare (or anyone) collate the data on a google sheet if you like and then we can all fiddle with it?

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#40 Re: The REACH index...
April 06, 2020, 03:03:27 pm
Reach 2.24m
Span 1.83m
Height 1.69m

Ratio 1.33

carlisle slapper

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#41 Re: The REACH index...
April 06, 2020, 09:59:48 pm
reach 2m50cm
span, 1m89cm
height 1m83cm

1.36

I'm actually one of the smallest of the county locals.

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#42 Re: The REACH index...
April 06, 2020, 10:26:49 pm
Reach - 243cm (though it was 293cm until I realised the lass's tape measure (mine's down in the garage) was only 150cm, not  200.

Height: 183 cm

Ratio:1.33

Span: 188 cm

I've not got wide shoulders, ok flexibility, but generally lank the shit out of everything despite not looking particularly lanky (my secret weapon). 

Oh, wait a minute - are you lot doing this barefoot, or in a stiff climbing shoe? Pretty sure I can tiptoe like a ballerina in a stiff shoe ;-)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2020, 10:38:10 pm by Fultonius »

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#43 Re: The REACH index...
April 10, 2020, 02:45:17 pm
R: 227
H: 170
S: 175

Ratio 1.33

I used to be H: 167-168. Shoulder stretching and thorasic postural stuff at the end of last year has made me stand up straighter and improved my shoulder mobility (I can close a skylight I needed to stand on something before, an extra 3cm minimum)
I'm starting more hip and shoulder mobility stuff, be interesting to see if that changes things in a month or so.

 

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