[lukeyboy]

Absolutely brutal questioning by the media for Truss after her statement;

- Are you going to apologise to your party?
- Why has Kwasi gone but you get to stay?
- What credibility do you still have?

Etc. And this from The Telegraph, The Sun, ITV and the BBC!

It was just dire wasn't it. If that's your first question and it's from the torygraph, you know it's only downhill from there.

The summary of her speech was she wants growth (who doesn't). The reality is she's achieved the opposite and has no plan.

Rishi in by December? I guess they'll avoid another leadership contest and come up with a way to slip him in quickly. And then do anything to avoid a GE for as long as possible, they would literally be wiped off the map as it stands.

[Bradders]

Absolutely brutal questioning by the media for Truss after her statement;

- Are you going to apologise to your party?
- Why has Kwasi gone but you get to stay?
- What credibility do you still have?

These are all pretty fair and legitimate questions if you ask me, given the events of the last few weeks. Not exactly the Paxman treatment.

They only seem harsh ‘cos we’ve got so used to them getting such an easy ride. Or in her and Bojo’s case avoiding scrutiny altogether.

Yeah of course, but have you ever seen a press conference like it?!

She's literally making it worse in her attempt to fix it. I can only imagine Hunt has accepted the Chancellor job because he thinks it'll give himself another shot at the top.

[ali k]

Yeah of course, but have you ever seen a press conference like it?!

She's literally making it worse in her attempt to fix it.

Nope, it was diabolical. Johnson did some pretty abysmal speeches and press conferences but he did have an ability to bluster his way through somehow. She is completely out of her depth and has been found out.

Also ironic that as she was literally saying the words economic stability the pound was tanking again.

[lukeyboy]

I can only imagine Hunt has accepted the Chancellor job because he thinks it'll give himself another shot at the top.

The guy who wanted to cut corporation tax even further than Truss did 

[petejh]

Week a long time etc. I said the markets would kill this. Within 6 months Hunt to replace Truss as PM, Sunak returning as Chancellor. The trigger to justify Hunt replacing Truss will be some kind of systemic US and European financial markets instability event requiring another change of policy from all, which is v.likely just a matter of time now. Truss will be a footnote in history as shortest serving PM in ages, perhaps the idiot tory party members who elected her might have learned something about ideology meeting political reality although it's doubtful.

[teestub]

Be interesting to see if they do get to have another PM without answering the calls for a GE, heck are coming from inside their party as much as outside

[Bradders]

I really wanted one of the journalists to challenge her when she said she would always act in the national interest; surely the only thing that would be in the national interest now is a general election.

[Moo]

I can barely type out a post fast enough to be relevant and keep up with this absolute face.

[edshakey]

I really wanted one of the journalists to challenge her when she said she would always act in the national interest; surely the only thing that would be in the national interest now is a general election.

I thought this too, but she would no doubt just blunder through it with buzzwords aplenty. Been a long time since questions like that got genuine answers!
And apparently now, the new tactic is just leave when you think you've had enough of the questions  next press conference, no questions at all?

[TobyD]

I really wanted one of the journalists to challenge her when she said she would always act in the national interest; surely the only thing that would be in the national interest now is a general election.

I thought this too, but she would no doubt just blunder through it with buzzwords aplenty. Been a long time since questions like that got genuine answers!
And apparently now, the new tactic is just leave when you think you've had enough of the questions  next press conference, no questions at all?

It hardly seems worth asking her that many questions, I can't see her staying in office very long, maybe til Christmas but unless something changes not much longer. There's no way they'd call for an election now, it can't be much worse for them in the polls than now, can it? Having said that....

[Bradders]

Two thoughts;

- I wonder whether Hunt will now become the de facto leader, with Truss remaining as PM in name only. Mentions today of him being the "Chief Executive" to her Presidency, but I think her authority is so completely shot that she'll struggle to do anything she wants to do. It's the Jeremy Hunt administration now.
- Is this the logical conclusion of having party leaders chosen by party memberships and not by MPs? Less than a third of MPs supported her, so she was always going to find it difficult when a majority didn't want her in the first place. Clearly she's shot herself in both feet as well.

[mrjonathanr]

Truss to be moved out and Hunt to take over I expect. He isn’t, in my view, one of the good guys. As the longest serving health secretary and culture secretary during Leveson, it is clear he’s a very skilful politician, but very right wing, despite his unctuous manner. I expect similar politics, just conducted intelligently.

[petejh]

As an aside to the current tory volatility, it's an interesting display of tory parliamentary party preference (Hunt/Sunak) rapidly overriding tory party membership preference (Truss). In contrast to Labour party membership preference (Corbyn) overriding Labour parliamentary party preference (Burnham/Cooper). Although volatility of markets probably accelerated the change in the case of Truss in a way it didn't need to in the case of Corbyn.

In both cases party membership majority preference were shown to be unrealistic. Which perhaps hints at a larger truth that ideological extremes aren't tolerated by the 21st century economic system. Nice comfy centre only, doesn't matter what you call it.

[Will Hunt]

Truss is a political jellyfish compared to Hunt, and not the kind that stings. Just listen to him in this interview and compare to anything Truss has done. What a vast authority gap there is now on Downing St!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001d4mh
1:10:00

Incredible to think that his continued presence in the party is a miracle given that he never bowed to Johnson and sniped the govt from the Health Select Committee. This is one of the big issues the party has. They've purged or recently shafted so many of their most competent politicians.

For weekend lolz listen to Miriam Margolyes' hot take at 1:30:20.

[largeruk]

Week a long time etc. I said the markets would kill this. Within 6 months Hunt to replace Truss as PM, Sunak returning as Chancellor. The trigger to justify Hunt replacing Truss will be some kind of systemic US and European financial markets instability event requiring another change of policy from all, which is v.likely just a matter of time now. Truss will be a footnote in history as shortest serving PM in ages, perhaps the idiot tory party members who elected her might have learned something about ideology meeting political reality although it's doubtful.

What's your view as to what this market instability event might look like and how it might be triggered?

UK politicians would do well to remember this classic Clinton quote (from Bob Woodward's book, The Agenda:-

[petejh]

It could be any number of triggers, it doesn't really matter what the trigger is that shocks markets into severe instability. What matters is that the pressures resulting from the particular set of circumstances the west finds itself in make severe market instability more likely than not.

The current favorite: the European energy trading market getting margin-called beyond its capacity to pay. This is the purpose of the next BoE emergency funding package to be launched on Monday. Which the media will no doubt make sound like the next end of the world. Likewise a similar ECB emergency funding measure with the same purpose - to backstop energy trading companies with central bank capital to meet margin calls.

BTW the BoE's £60Bn bond buying didn't happen. They bought ~£21Bn. And had to tighten the criteria mid way as hedge funds were gaming the extra liquidity to make profits from the BoE support measures. The same gaming the system is feared to happen if/when central banks intervene into margin calls on Euro energy companies.

These triggers will find the weakest spots in markets eventually. And predators will always find ways to game any system and profit from any efforts to provide stability.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/10/15/bank-englands-40bn-push-stop-another-lehman-moment/

[teestub]

BTW the BoE's £60Bn bond buying didn't happen. They bought ~£21Bn. And had to tighten the criteria mid way as hedge funds were gaming the extra liquidity to make profits from the BoE support measures. The same gaming the system is feared to happen if/when central banks intervene into margin calls on Euro energy companies.

These triggers will find the weakest spots in markets eventually. And predators will always find ways to game any system and profit from any efforts to provide stability.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/10/15/bank-englands-40bn-push-stop-another-lehman-moment/

Good to know you can always rely on stock brokers to be cunts. Hopefully a few of them will end up in prison this crash unlike 2008.

I guess if the BoE had been forced to spend the whole £60bn it would be likely they would have had to fork out more, so it’s a good news story they didn’t?

[chris j]

As an aside to the current tory volatility, it's an interesting display of tory parliamentary party preference (Hunt/Sunak) rapidly overriding tory party membership preference (Truss). In contrast to Labour party membership preference (Corbyn) overriding Labour parliamentary party preference (Burnham/Cooper). Although volatility of markets probably accelerated the change in the case of Truss in a way it didn't need to in the case of Corbyn.

In both cases party membership majority preference were shown to be unrealistic. Which perhaps hints at a larger truth that ideological extremes aren't tolerated by the 21st century economic system. Nice comfy centre only, doesn't matter what you call it.

If Corbyn had been in power I imagine the markets would have forced the same process on Labour that the Tories are undergoing. It says a lot about how detached and unrealistic party members are collectively on both sides and they shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the process if you want an an effective party leader with appeal outside their little bubble...

[petejh]

Good to know you can always rely on stock brokers to be cunts. Hopefully a few of them will end up in prison this crash unlike 2008.

I guess if the BoE had been forced to spend the whole £60bn it would be likely they would have had to fork out more, so it’s a good news story they didn’t?

Hedge funds: https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/wild-uk-market-swings-opportunity-lifetime-hedge-funds-2022-09-28/ 
I'm sure they'd say they were just taking part in an open market process with great risk to themselves (with massive central bank liquidity as incentive and some forced selling going on). Doubt morality would come into it and you can probably argue every shade of grey once you get into the weeds. The pension funds' choices for instance. Sadly most markets are ponzis when you unwrap the onion layers for long enough, with a core value much lower than the frothiness.  Some markets just have a more respectable mask created by the bullshit you're fed by banks and governments of any stripe.

If Corbyn had been in power I imagine the markets would have forced the same process on Labour that the Tories are undergoing. It says a lot about how detached and unrealistic party members are collectively on both sides and they shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the process if you want an an effective party leader with appeal outside their little bubble...

Yep no doubt. Wonder if, in an alternate universe, Corbyn and McDonnell would have persisted in the face of market pressure against whatever policy they were trying to pass. The hard left seem even more authoritative once they have their power challenged even than the hard right. Maybe would have had Andrew Bailey sent to the tower for re-education, or just prolonged turmoil.

[TobyD]

As an aside to the current tory volatility, it's an interesting display of tory parliamentary party preference (Hunt/Sunak) rapidly overriding tory party membership preference (Truss). In contrast to Labour party membership preference (Corbyn) overriding Labour parliamentary party preference (Burnham/Cooper). Although volatility of markets probably accelerated the change in the case of Truss in a way it didn't need to in the case of Corbyn.

In both cases party membership majority preference were shown to be unrealistic. Which perhaps hints at a larger truth that ideological extremes aren't tolerated by the 21st century economic system. Nice comfy centre only, doesn't matter what you call it.

If Corbyn had been in power I imagine the markets would have forced the same process on Labour that the Tories are undergoing. It says a lot about how detached and unrealistic party members are collectively on both sides and they shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the process if you want an an effective party leader with appeal outside their little bubble...

Quite right, there is no way that party members should have a say. Neither party has a fully transparent membership structure, or way of anyone knowing if they're even all UK citizens, or indeed real people (tortoise media did an investigation where they enrolled 'Mr tortoise' as a conservative party member, apparently). Memberships choose ideological leaders, rather than competent ones, it seems.

[battery]

As an aside to the current tory volatility, it's an interesting display of tory parliamentary party preference (Hunt/Sunak) rapidly overriding tory party membership preference (Truss). In contrast to Labour party membership preference (Corbyn) overriding Labour parliamentary party preference (Burnham/Cooper). Although volatility of markets probably accelerated the change in the case of Truss in a way it didn't need to in the case of Corbyn.

In both cases party membership majority preference were shown to be unrealistic. Which perhaps hints at a larger truth that ideological extremes aren't tolerated by the 21st century economic system. Nice comfy centre only, doesn't matter what you call it.

If Corbyn had been in power I imagine the markets would have forced the same process on Labour that the Tories are undergoing. It says a lot about how detached and unrealistic party members are collectively on both sides and they shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the process if you want an an effective party leader with appeal outside their little bubble...

Quite right, there is no way that party members should have a say. Neither party has a fully transparent membership structure, or way of anyone knowing if they're even all UK citizens, or indeed real people (tortoise media did an investigation where they enrolled 'Mr tortoise' as a conservative party member, apparently). Memberships choose ideological leaders, rather than competent ones, it seems.

The Conservative party tried to change the way in which it elects its leader in 2005 but the party/1922 committee voted against it. I've done a bit of reading but it is all so f****ing complicated that I got very lost very quickly - it's almost as if they don't want people to know how it does/doesn't/might work....

[Bradders]

Good to know you can always rely on stock brokers investment bankers / hedge funds to be cunts. Hopefully a few of them will end up in prison this crash unlike 2008.

Terminology correction; stock broking is a bit of an outdated term, and brokers aren't involved in this sort of thing anyway.

Hedge funds: https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/wild-uk-market-swings-opportunity-lifetime-hedge-funds-2022-09-28/ 
I'm sure they'd say they were just taking part in an open market process with great risk to themselves (with massive central bank liquidity as incentive and some forced selling going on).

The irony here being that one of the things Truss and Kwarteng were trying to address (badly) was the reliance on cheap money and extreme liquidity, which has essentially propped everything up artificially for the last decade.

[Oldmanmatt]

Good to know you can always rely on stock brokers investment bankers / hedge funds to be cunts. Hopefully a few of them will end up in prison this crash unlike 2008.

Terminology correction; stock broking is a bit of an outdated term, and brokers aren't involved in this sort of thing anyway.

Hedge funds: https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/wild-uk-market-swings-opportunity-lifetime-hedge-funds-2022-09-28/ 
I'm sure they'd say they were just taking part in an open market process with great risk to themselves (with massive central bank liquidity as incentive and some forced selling going on).

The irony here being that one of the things Truss and Kwarteng were trying to address (badly) was the reliance on cheap money and extreme liquidity, which has essentially propped everything up artificially for the last decade.

Why “artificially”?
All financial markets and financial systems are at heart artificial, aren’t they?
 “Here mate, you Labour all day for me and I’ll give you this bit of paper, that you can swap for food (or beer).” It’s all LARPing, really, even if you replace the paper with a lump of soft, yellow, metal (which is actually pretty useless in the hands of the majority of the world’s population, you can’t even sharpen it into a knife).

So, it almost feels like you’re saying that one piece of paper, that some authority declares is worth X (or it’s digital equivalent) is actually worth less than a slightly different piece of paper, the same authority also claims is worth X.
Sometimes, from the outside, listening to those who are professionally engaged in this world, is a bit like listening to over enthusiastic D&D players.
Often I just want to scream “Fuck’s sake! The fucking Emperor’s dick is swinging in the fucking wind! Get a grip!”
Instead, I spend all day grubbing for more bits of paper and worry about how many, slightly different bits of paper from the other side of the world, my bits are worth today.
(I’m fully aware of how flippant I’m being here. It’s just that sometimes, if you lift up it’s skirts, you can’t help but remember it’s all standing on nothing but shared delusions).

[Bradders]

Hard to reply to that without sounding exactly like what you're railing against!

Isn't basically everything about human culture, society, religion, economics, etc. nothing more than shared belief/delusion?

[Oldmanmatt]

Hard to reply to that without sounding exactly like what you're railing against!

Isn't basically everything about human culture, society, religion, economics, etc. nothing more than shared belief/delusion?

Ah.
Yes.
Balls!
Well, here comes another existential crisis.
I believe I shall numb that out by heading to the wall and failing to climb something even more contrived…