[Fiend]

Good stuff, glad Caff had willingly opened it up and there's no drama.

[Doylo]

If you refer to my Twitter and Insta (social media plug) pic comments you will see a bit of beef. 

[cheque]

Go for it cheque!

  Driving down now.

[shark]

If you refer to my Twitter and Insta (social media plug) pic comments you will see a bit of beef. 

That’s going to have taken the shine off the ascent for Steve no doubt.

Given that Steve had cleared it with him it’s especially unwarranted.

Think he should apologise

[jwi]

Never mind the feelings of ownership of projects, that's normal.

What I want to know, and having wanted to know for a long time, how come England's best climber is fifty years old?

[36chambers]

Never mind the feelings of ownership of projects, that's normal.

What I want to know, and having wanted to know for a long time, how come England's best climber is fifty years old?

I'd love to see him try and keep up with the young bucks on a Rocklands trip.

[Doylo]

Never mind the feelings of ownership of projects, that's normal.

What I want to know, and having wanted to know for a long time, how come England's best climber is fifty years old?

Tenacity and an ‘engineers brain’.

[Duncan campbell]

Are we sure this isn’t just some banter from Caff?

[Will Hunt]

If you refer to my Twitter and Insta (social media plug) pic comments you will see a bit of beef. 

That’s going to have taken the shine off the ascent for Steve no doubt.

Given that Steve had cleared it with him it’s especially unwarranted.

Think he should apologise

Surely everything that Caff writes on social media should be taken as tongue in cheek?

[Duncan campbell]

I wouldn’t necessarily say everything but in this instance if he did indeed give Steve the go ahead then maybe he’s just bantering? I’d like to think it’s just a joke anyway.

[Fiend]

Never mind the feelings of ownership of projects, that's normal.

What I want to know, and having wanted to know for a long time, how come England's best climber is fifty years old?

Incredibly strong fingers and no body weight.

Not on twatter or instawank so dunno what's going on. Hope it's all peaceful.

[Coops_13]

Looks like it's getting juicy...

[cheque]

Not on twatter or instawank so dunno what's going on. Hope it's all peaceful.

You don't need an account on either to read public posts.

[Will Hunt]

CONFIRMED BEEF!

Doylo has played a blinder here. He must be raking in the followers since his picture is hosting the spat.

[ferret]

To be honest this wants splitting to a different thread about when is it ok to try a project somebody else is already trying and leave this thread to discuss the route and Steve's impressive accent

[spidermonkey09]

Leaning towards Caff here but sounds like a good thread in the offing as its an interesting topic.

[Fiend]

A split would be good. I don't read twuntter nor instacrap except when people link me to pictures of cute cattos and doggos on the latter.

[36chambers]

To be honest this wants splitting to a different thread about when is it ok to try a project somebody else is already trying and leave this thread to discuss the route and Steve's impressive accent

Climbing history without any beef wouldn't be half as interesting

[Will Hunt]

I can sympathise with both here. If it's a well known project that Nick has pointed both people at then it can hardly be a closed project. But if Caff has put in the work to unlock a sequence on tiny sandstone crimps, then that's worth something significant. But an idle browse of social media shows photos (@marc_langley) of him top roping the route with the holds chalked - which is plain daft. Maybe that's because Caff can just assume that nobody else good enough is interested or will stay away, or maybe it's because photographers can't keep their stuff back in this age of instant gratification. Why not release the photos once the deed is done? There will be lots of "well known projects" out there that are within the grasp of plenty of good climbers (anybody think Jim Pope couldn't have walked up this?) - it's creating a buzz around them that actually gets them done. Had there been media silence around this then I don't doubt that Caff would have got there first.

He's definitely right about the name though. Awful awful name for one of England's hardest trad routes.

[spidermonkey09]

Steve's impressive accent

Looking forward to McClure doing a risque stand up turn at the next BMC AGM where he impersonates various different nationalities. 

[andy popp]

I can sympathise with both here. If it's a well known project that Nick has pointed both people at then it can hardly be a closed project.

You're right, it can't. But Caff is claiming he specifically asked Steve to give him a little more time, a request that was ignored. Of course, people are free to do as they wish, but I've always believed such requests should be respected and honoured, at least for a reasonable period of time.

[Will Hunt]

I can sympathise with both here. If it's a well known project that Nick has pointed both people at then it can hardly be a closed project.

You're right, it can't. But Caff is claiming he specifically asked Steve to give him a little more time, a request that was ignored. Of course, people are free to do as they wish, but I've always believed such requests should be respected and honoured, at least for a reasonable period of time.

Steve's side of the story is that he asked and Caff said something about "if its not done by the end of the week". I'm not sure if that was before dropping the finishing hold? I guess that getting that close could really renew the psyche for the route.
Maybe Caff didn't feel it was right to block access to someone else, but then there's no place to then go slagging when someone does step in.

[CrimpyMcCrimpface]

But Caff is claiming he specifically asked Steve to give him a little more time, a request that was ignored.

Mentioned in a reply https://www.instagram.com/p/Bx2SoJRjx4g/

[andy popp]

I can sympathise with both here. If it's a well known project that Nick has pointed both people at then it can hardly be a closed project.

You're right, it can't. But Caff is claiming he specifically asked Steve to give him a little more time, a request that was ignored. Of course, people are free to do as they wish, but I've always believed such requests should be respected and honoured, at least for a reasonable period of time.

Steve's side of the story is that he asked and Caff said something about "if its not done by the end of the week". I'm not sure if that was before dropping the finishing hold? I guess that getting that close could really renew the psyche for the route.
Maybe Caff didn't feel it was right to block access to someone else, but then there's no place to then go slagging when someone does step in.

Just to be clear, I'm not judging the ins and outs of these particular events - I'm in no position to. Rather, it was meant to be a general statement of principles. I know others think differently and that anything goes.

[danm]

Yeah, at the end of the day, it's a real shame that two bona fide legends have fallen out, whatever the in's and out's of it all. I blame that shit Doyle but then again the copter pastiche was pretty hilarious.

I've just realised that by posting this, I have probably joined the ranks of the Cyberwankers, dammit.