[Don Jebus]

Wondering if anyone can clarify this for me. I've been trying thick end of the wedge recently, but i'm a little confused about where to start with my left hand. Does it need to be on the edge by the arete, or can you start on the weird sidepull ear thing further out left? Anyone now how Ned started it?

[Murph]

Necro post but seemed most appropriate...

Various videos of this problem doing a stand start. For example this recent one:



But also Orrin doesn't exactly do a sit either:

https://youtu.be/kgCMzUdia-A?t=01m34s

The stand Home Cooking is 7A apparently, but there's something about block removal so maybe that's not a thing any more?

2 extra moves turns 7A into 8A or is everyone claiming 8A having themselves on?

[Bradders]

I did the stand last year; still fine after the block being moved.

As far as I know they've both started in the right place in those videos, but unless you're tall you can't reach those holds without stacking pads. Tough few moves!

[sirlockoff]

I cant say for sure because I am not ned but i did put in quite few sessions in the past and;

0) UKC says 'from the sit start not crouching'
1) there was no way I could start without the left crimp
2) that meant I had to stack the pads to reach it from sit start, but keep in mind I am really tall, I do remember pulling from one pad, but then the pull on was the hardest move by far on the route for me, two was ok
3) from crouched or stacked pads, it is for sure 7C/7C+ at minimum, it adds a bunch to home cooking

id steer into the territory that ned did it off stacked pads but can't confirm

[Murph]

Thank you sir, yes it is a bit unclear. Sit start and sit start on 4 pads are quite different things, and if the holds are like that its understandable people are interpreting it.

There is another vid looking like the chap does it from more of a sit but can't tell what his arse is on.

https://youtu.be/N4hJ2x6KBQ0?t=03m04s

[sirlockoff]

clever cutting to avoid possible callouts / having to do it again 

[Murph]

Well if that's how it goes, that's how it goes. I cant find anything where someone does a proper sit start. Thanks both bradders and sirlockoff for your assistance.

[Moo]

Ned started sitting with left hand on the crimp and right hand on the arête level with it.

[Bonjoy]

It's difficult to apply the 'minimum number of pads to reach the start holds' rule when one hold is a continuous feature like an arete or crack. Moo's clarification is helpful though, level with the crimp is clear enough. Also I think a sit starts need to be a sit start even if you have to stack pads to start sat down. It's non trivial to break inertia from sitting and it can be significantly easier to start from the same holds but from a crounch/kneeling/hovering start.

[spidermonkey09]

It's difficult to apply the 'minimum number of pads to reach the start holds' rule when one hold is a continuous feature like an arete or crack. Moo's clarification is helpful though, level with the crimp is clear enough. Also I think a sit starts need to be a sit start even if you have to stack pads to start sat down. It's non trivial to break inertia from sitting and it can be significantly easier to start from the same holds but from a crounch/kneeling/hovering start.

I agree that full crouching is easier than arse on the ground, but its going to be very common that people simply don't have the requisite amount of foam to make the boulder safeish and also have their arse on the floor. I ran into a similar problem when I was trying Flatworld sit; I didn't have enough pads to both pad the landing for the top move and get my arse high enough so I could reach the start holds from  a proper sit. In the end I was trying it from a low crouch as it was the only way, and if i'd done it I'd have considered it good.

[Bradders]

It's difficult to apply the 'minimum number of pads to reach the start holds' rule when one hold is a continuous feature like an arete or crack. Moo's clarification is helpful though, level with the crimp is clear enough. Also I think a sit starts need to be a sit start even if you have to stack pads to start sat down. It's non trivial to break inertia from sitting and it can be significantly easier to start from the same holds but from a crounch/kneeling/hovering start.

I agree that full crouching is easier than arse on the ground, but its going to be very common that people simply don't have the requisite amount of foam to make the boulder safeish and also have their arse on the floor. I ran into a similar problem when I was trying Flatworld sit; I didn't have enough pads to both pad the landing for the top move and get my arse high enough so I could reach the start holds from  a proper sit. In the end I was trying it from a low crouch as it was the only way, and if i'd done it I'd have considered it good.

Full agree, as long as people are starting from the correct holds (let's not go over that again!) they shouldn't have to carry in an extra pad just to sit on.

[Murph]

I agree, no-one has to do it in any particular way, but if ned did it from his arse and gave it 8A then thats the thing.

Someone else doing it half crouched because of reasons - and there being a material difference between sit and crouch - then sure, you can do the climb that way but can't in honesty claim you'd done the 8A.

Sounds like the crouch start is a different animal if it makes much difference. If it makes no difference in difficulty then its mere pedantry.

[spidermonkey09]

Yeah, if Ned did it off a huge amount of foam from a full sit at 8A but it actually gets done from a crouch at 7C+ with a normal amount of pads it should be recorded as 7C+. Which also to me sounds like the better way to do the boulder, if one applies the 'if pulling your arse off the ground is the crux its a shit problem' rule 

[Murph]

Thanks spider v well put.

And for clarity, I didnt raise this q to piss on anyones chips, its a genuine question. If I'm going to get the murph show on the road again in an attempt to climb the holy grade before the killer robots take over then the last person I want to be fooling is myself.

It's different if you've done loads of them, but if you only get to do one you want to do it right.

[Johnny Brown]

Pope has done it from a proper sitter, i.e. shortarse not stacking pads and then doing a hard move to get the first left crimp. To get back to the OP

Does it need to be on the edge by the arete, or can you start on the weird sidepull ear thing further out left?

The standard start is definitely from the edge, the move to the shit bit further out is quite hard and impossible for sitting so would definitely warrant a downgrade.

I did it from a crouch as I couldn't carry enough pads to pad the landing for the top and stack them for the sit, and if you do they then get in the way, and presumably kicking them out of the way of the sit and into the landing for the top, mid-crux, would be considered a dab.

It felt like 8A like that, but I was strict about starting static from the lowest position I could reach the crimp, rather than momentarily bending a knee to lower towards it as you see in the vids.

[36chambers]

Yeah, if Ned did it off a huge amount of foam from a full sit at 8A but it actually gets done from a crouch at 7C+ with a normal amount of pads it should be recorded as 7C+. Which also to me sounds like the better way to do the boulder, if one applies the 'if pulling your arse off the ground is the crux its a shit problem' rule 

I've tried it from both crouching and sitting with arms as straight as possibly (can't remember if it was off 2 or 3 pads) and the pull on felt trivial either way. I'd be surprised if pulling on from one pad would make any real difference, since the holds are so good, but who knows.

[Stu Littlefair]

Given the problem name I think it's appropriate to climb it from wherever you want, and take the grade.

[Dingdong]

Given the problem name I think it's appropriate to climb it from wherever you want, and take the grade.

Where you taking the grade? On holiday?