[AlistairB]

Don't be silly Dave, why employ a tried and tested system like getting solid at bouldering limestone 7b(B)+ and then adding on a quick bit of power endurance, when there's a perfectly good energy system fad that works well for 8c wads and only costs a hundred quid to be a part of the gang?

I don't dispute that if I were in Shark's shoes I'd want to be stronger but calling energy systems a fad is pretty disingenuous. It's what's come out of trying to apply scientific method to climbing improvement. Do bear in mind that their plans always still have a large strength component, I guess that often gets overlooked because the energy systems stuff is newer and more exciting.

Simon, I have a question for you, are you currently following a plan or did you just have the assessment?

[nik at work]

Got back on it this week. Managed to get training done as wife was away so I was stuck at home with kids and fingerboard.
S/M/LTG - trad
M - bm session
T - managed to sneak a traverse wall session with some cunning child care strategy
W - bm session
T - nowt
F - nowt
S - tradding, E2, 2xE3/4 and an E6. All repeats of routes that I did 3 years ago.
S - nowt

[shark]

Simon, I have a question for you, are you currently following a plan or did you just have the assessment?

Just the assessment and some tips

[shark]

Imagine if after trying a gymnastic routine and failing the coach advocated continuing with exactly the same general type of training and preparation that had failed to seal the deal for the preceding 8 years.

Actually, keen students of Sharkology will know that the big breakthrough last autumn, when he all-but-sent then released his possibly-unwise "it's-in-the-bag" video, followed shedding some weight whilst in Canada, perhaps thanks to his business partner pointing out that consuming large bowls of muesli every 2-3 hours was not in fact a diet ...

 

Sorry - did I not acknowledge you sufficiently? Oddly I didnt lose the weight whilst with you but back in the UK implementing your teachings. Another helpful thing you did was to show Sonia path of enlightenment as well.

Anyway that was so last year. We now pray at the Church of Keto.

 

[petejh]

Imagine if after trying a gymnastic routine and failing the coach advocated continuing with exactly the same general type of training and preparation that had failed to seal the deal for the preceding 8 years.

Actually, keen students of Sharkology will know that the big breakthrough last autumn, when he all-but-sent then released his possibly-unwise "it's-in-the-bag" video, followed shedding some weight whilst in Canada, perhaps thanks to his business partner pointing out that consuming large bowls of muesli every 2-3 hours was not in fact a diet ...

Or to look at that breakthrough another way - for the skeptical Habrich and anyone who thinks 'hard' bouldering/steep board training  is 'prattling about' - Shark dropping weight improved his power-to-weight ratio. The same end result he'd get from hard bouldering or training on a steep board, just a different path to get to the same place. (imagine what you could do if you did both the well-timed weight drop and the bouldering/steep board....)

Add on some fitness (PE/aeropow) and you're all set. It isn't rocket science.

[shark]

Habrich and anyone who thinks 'hard' bouldering/steep board training  is 'prattling about'

I don't think he, me or anyone else thinks that. Given the choice (which we have) we tend* to spend our time on other stuff that we are better at and enjoy more.   


*Hab's tendency being 100%

[John Gillott]

Habrich and anyone who thinks 'hard' bouldering/steep board training  is 'prattling about'

I don't think he, me or anyone else thinks that. Given the choice (which we have) we tend* to spend our time on other stuff that we are better at and enjoy more.   

*Hab's tendency being 100%

You enjoy eight-year sieges? Maybe you did say this once, actually ;-)

I can hardly believe that it's nearly 4 years since I offered the same advice as the other simple-minded folk re strength then PE....

http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=20789.0

But of course, we have to accept that this pattern of training may also have failed to produce the required results. Time for a completely single-minded regime designed to create an Oak performance peak in the autumn? Or alternatively, enjoy the summer sun and wait till next winter to try the simple old school programme...

[shark]

Or alternatively, enjoy the summer sun and wait till next winter to try the simple old school programme...

Hi John. Hope you are keeping well. Let's face it if I wasn't on the Oak I would be seiging something else it's just taken longer than the others. I think if it doesn't go down this Autumn then this winter I will "do what it takes" as three-nine describes it. Currently waiting for crags to dry in Fairhead. Keeping the flame alive is just as important no?

[petejh]

Habrich and anyone who thinks 'hard' bouldering/steep board training  is 'prattling about'

I don't think he, me or anyone else thinks that.

That's odd, because yesterday he typed this:

But Simon has long since demonstrated that he can do the moves. I am sceptical of this current orthodoxy that to succeed on a hard'ish sport route you have to prattle about doing wholly different moves on boulder problems.

Given the choice (which we have) we tend* to spend our time on other stuff that we are better at and enjoy more.   


*Hab's tendency being 100%

[/quote]
Quite right. The results speak for themselves. You're really good at - and must hugely enjoy - epic'ing on routes you haven't properly trained for, judging by the massive amount of time you spend doing this on the Oak. 

[John Gillott]

Or alternatively, enjoy the summer sun and wait till next winter to try the simple old school programme...

Keeping the flame alive is just as important no?

Absolutely Shark. On the subject of (non-metaphorical) flames, take care with those as well...

[Doylo]

How PeteJh spends his working day:

[petejh]

Except that shark has great aeropow!

[dave]

what we know about that is 1. that he can do the moves 2. that he can't quite link all of them. So it is an endurance/ stamina/ <insert preferred jargon> issue.

Nope. If the moves are too hard (as they seem to be) then no amount of stamina is going to make them easier.

but the required strength gains are highly specific and unlikely to be gained doing very different styles of movement on a different rock type (ie gritstone bouldering).

Bollocks. Fingerstrength and power and fingerstrength and power. If anything gaining a bit of steep power will have a greater crossover effect to other rocktypes and climbing styles, and will be useful over say the coming winter grit season, compared to increasing stamina which lets face it is going to be hard to maintain over winter as it will probably be barely used.

[petejh]

Well you have selectively misquoted me, as usual.

Selectively misquoted you how? You're talking nonsense. Here's your full post:

But Simon has long since demonstrated that he can do the moves. I am sceptical of this current orthodoxy that to succeed on a hard'ish sport route you have to prattle about doing wholly different moves on boulder problems. Imagine if a gymnast consulted their coach, complaining that they could never complete their five minute rings routine, even though they could do every movement in isolation. They are surely going to be recommended to work on their stamina, not told to go play on the parallel bars.

What gem of wisdom from the 'Imagine if a gymnast..' second half of your post makes my quoting the part where you state being skeptical of bouldering as training for sport climbing a case of selectively misquoting you? After all I quoted you saying he could 'do all the moves', which is all your rings analogy is trying to say.

It's like the blind leading the blind on ukb sometimes with you and Shark - two climbers who make no bones about not being keen about bouldering, both 'relatively' weak stamina types with preference/climbing style suited to routes that can be summarised as 'not 12 metre bouldery UK sport'. Nothing at all wrong with that per se, except when you start talking nonsense about training for the sort of short bouldery sport route neither of you seem equipped to send. 

[a dense loner]

Why have we not got a handbags emoticon?

[mr chaz]

The all new non-offensive ukb cannot be having sexist emoticons like that now can we 

[petejh]

Well we have 

[Hugh]

Nice one the_dom, sounds like a top week!

STG: 7B. Surely I can drag my arse up something at Neath soon...
MTG: Don't get broken. Get strong for Santa Gadea in June.

Forgot last week so...

Mon: Warmup and campus session. Basic ladders x 4, 1-4-6 x 4
Tue: Nowt
Wed: TCA, Moon board power problems on decent holds. Failed to do much - either wasn’t even close to a move or felt ok after a couple of goes.
Thu: Nowt
Fri: TCA, hard circuit, did a few, worked moves on others. Decent session.
Sat: Nowt
Sun: Cycle ride 22m.

Mon: TCA with wife and child. Spent most of the time chasing the boy round.
Tue-Thu: Rest
Fri: TCA, power moves on slopers on Mothership. Finished with quick 4x4 set on 5-move power problem on 45.
Sat: Run 4.5km
Sun: Biblins, felt shit before getting warmed up. Did the Bulge from a couple of moves in, along with Pop for the Top. Worked Freshly Squeezed - much to my surprise it feels fairly doable.

Good to get out again finally, and feeling pretty decent after rest. Hopefully I've timed it right for Spain in a couple of weeks.

[Three Nine]

[/quote]


It's like the blind leading the blind on ukb sometimes with you and Shark - two climbers who make no bones about not being keen about bouldering, both 'relatively' weak stamina types
[/quote]


Thing is Simon isn't weak. He's done one armers, some fairly heroic deadhang feats, 1-4-6 on the second rungs from the right at the foundry, and 1-3-5-7-9 on the really small rungs at the foundry (you need good fingers too for that). Yet he's somehow crap at bouldering.

[tomtom]

Simon - your best Oak season to date (this spring non?) has been after a winter of relaxed but mainly bouldering type climbing/training?

There's a clue there somewhere....

[Nibile]

I am sure it works, not least as one of my regular climbing partners became near skeletal after following it for a year, but I reckon very very few people have the required self-discipline.

I seriously doubt that becoming skeletal is what one should really want from a diet.
Anyway, de gustibus.

[nai]

Simon - your best Oak season to date (this spring non?) has been after a winter of relaxed but mainly bouldering type climbing/training?

There's a clue there somewhere....

No, last Autumn after a visit to Squamish after lots of trad climbing    Without trawling back through his diary I'm not sue what else but weight loss could have been a key factor, not sure he's dropped quite as low this year

[a dense loner]

He's been trying it 9 years, that might be the biggest clue of all

[shark]

Simon - your best Oak season to date (this spring non?) has been after a winter of relaxed but mainly bouldering type climbing/training?

There's a clue there somewhere....

No, last Autumn after a visit to Squamish after lots of trad climbing    Without trawling back through his diary I'm not sue what else but weight loss could have been a key factor, not sure he's dropped quite as low this year

Yes that's correct (though I did a reasonable amount of bouldering in week 2 and 3 at Squamish as well).

I think that the key difference was that last autumn the conditions were generally poor and this  spring the conditions were generally abysmal

[shark]

Any diet that encourages bacon, cream, cheese and chocolate and generally keeps hunger at bay surely requires less self discipline than most dieting regimes. It goes without saying that in my case it is keto-with-a-twist. This week's variation includes two pints of guinness per night.

I seriously doubt that becoming skeletal is what one should really want from a diet.
Anyway, de gustibus.

Healthy skeletal is good  I am confident that Ted, Toby and Moose will all be kicking sand in my face by the end of the summer