[haydn jones]

Anyone go beta for this. Did it in 2 halves tonight but the sequence i had felt pretty contrived and wrong and gonna be hard to link in a oner the way im doing. And defo 8b if the way im doing it is right then this needs upgrading.

[kc]

That route has never inspired me. Don't get me wrong it is definitely a good route but teetering up some grim grit style grove does not comply with the essence of cornice climbing for me.

 Funnily enough there is a route to the right called Snatch that is apparently quite hard for the grade so I'm told, that is totaly technically grim too. I would have stayed clear of that as well if someone got it first.

That route like 4 doors do tend to feel the living end on first acquaintance and with thin sweaty skin on those sharp holds it is easy to start doubting the grade. It can come down to good body positions and conditions.
But yes, it is classic "Peak 8a+" with a hard clip/skip near the top.

By the way how's the start of K3 looking.

[haydn jones]

If it feels like 8b and climbs like 8b its 8b im taking 8b if i do it. If people want to sandbag them selves they are welcome to. K3 is dry

[SA Chris]

One of by favourite route names.

[TobyD]

I have been told in the past that FDD is one of those things that feels 8b until you do it; when it feels not so bad. On the other hand it looks kind of similar to ouijaboard, which used to get 7c+, and seems harder than 8as on the cornice such as powerplant or unleashing

[kc]

If it feels like 8b and climbs like 8b its 8b im taking 8b if i do it. If people want to sandbag them selves they are welcome to. K3 is dry

In that case I'll have 8b for Devonshire, 8a+ for Sissy and 7c+ for Free Monster. You have just got to accept sometimes the odd route may not suit you and 4 doors is just one of those routes that come together. Reserve judgement till the deed is done.

[haydn jones]

I think sissy is 8a+ personally too. Devonshire i couldn't  touch last year either was very surpriesed that didn't  go in at 8b in the new guide.

[kc]

I tried to argue the case on here a couple of years back but was dismist. They were all wads climbing well and operating at a much higher level so not too sure their opinion counts for much. When I was on my way up I dismissed K3 as piss 8a. Several years older wiser and weaker I realised that I was just like all the arrogant youngsters on 8a spraycards that log all there triumphs as "soft" " 2ND go " whatever that means?
42 now that's 8b+.Went in book as 8b but I sneaked it in to the graded list at 8b+. Unfortunately it's not in a climbable state currently.

[haydn jones]

Either way i ask for beta since i did find it so hard yesterday and was hoping that i am trying it wrong since it feels so much harder than any 8a+ I've done.
sequnce from the slot jugs.
RH gaston  get LF high
LH roll over to good under cut. Feet up make awkward clip
RH to decentish gaston LF high pull in close to walll
LH to tiny undercut RF smear
RH then rolls over left to and undercut that i take like its a gaston this feels really awkward.
LH flicks to tiny under cut further along. Put drop knee in
RH back down to first tiny under cut that i took with LH originally
LH goes to the furthest left undercut thats big but slopey. Build feet up and really far left
RH big slap to good slopper
LH into undercut flake in front of face build feet
RH intermediate crimp build feet yet again
RH go really big to the jug

[haydn jones]

Whats wrong with 42? Have holds come off?

[kc]

Bolts are very rusty and you need to put a wire over a stud to work the crux. There is a crucial crimp on the head wall that flexes alarmingly. I may see to it as I had been tempted to join the 42 club that has 3 members but only I will have the double. Only problem is i'v not got long to get back up to speed.

[Bonjoy]

One of by favourite route names.

Such a waste nobody put up a route called Cawdor Dostoyevsky at the crag of that name

[nai]

Went in book as 8b but I sneaked it in to the graded list at 8b+.

So was it also you that moved Mecca?

[kc]

Yes Zippy and I had fun with that. All lot of that list is random as there are so many unknowns ,the brief was for it to be wrong.

[nai]

Brilliant, hoped it was deliberate. 

[kc]

Not responsible for it being listed at wrong crag though.

[gme]

42 now that's 8b+.

Nic Sellers thought it was 8a+ having fallen off the last move on the flash, the day after bring Keith close to tears by flashing Nemesis in front him; he was still holding out for it being 8b. Nic did have a rep for down grading though and is responsible for Evolution being 8c until recently.

Its an abortion of a route however, to say John Heart was an art dealer he made a proper mess of the Sika job on 42.

[kc]

Yes I know the stories of Nick and his down gradings well. He was however loaded up with tonnes of beta. He also thought Make funky was harder than Evolution which just goes to show how some routes suit peoples strengths.
 And 42 is definetly mared by the glue. Looks like vanilla ice cream was troweled on then melted down in streaks. It was however a mighty fine effort for John to get up and makes me doubt the grade of my route to the right.

[Paul B]

I have been told in the past that FDD is one of those things that feels 8b until you do it; when it feels not so bad. On the other hand it looks kind of similar to ouijaboard, which used to get 7c+, and seems harder than 8as on the cornice such as powerplant or unleashing

I'd like to think that I'm no longer classed as a Youngster so dismissing KC; Ouija actually deserved an upgrade, it's not only hard but grim too. FDD is standard Cornice 8a+ (you can't go measuring stuff against the likes of K3 or Powerplant, even if no knees are involved!) as they both just scrape into their respective brackets.

...or alternatively scrub the above, can I take 8b for RnP (I heard some guy called Caff couldn't do it)?