[Fultonius]

So, back to coffee!

Fresh beans and a tweaked grinder and I'm finally getting a good, slow, steady stream of espresso from my machine. I'm pretty sure the pump is slowly producing less pressure as when I get a good tasting coffee it literally dribbles out in a very thin stream.

Back to my last question: Anyone tried roasting their own?

[petejh]

No. It looks like there's some cheap -  stove-top, and some not-so-cheap - Drum, kits out there: http://www.sweetmarias.com/sweetmarias/coffee-roasters/starter-kits.html?source=grid

I made my own bread for a few months. Tasted nice. Didn't last.

[ksjs]

Why has it taken me so long to notice this thread? It delights me that grown men (and women) are carefully analysing and discussing the intricacies of coffee making; a good antidote to some of the madness around and there's some excellent reading recommendations and comment on scientific / research methods to boot. Only on UKB! (I've just purchased 'Irrationality', sounds very interesting).

Anyway, I digress. So, this Aeropress device, is it actually any good, worth the money? And should I really buy a grinder and is there any difference between the ones mentioned above (blade and burr)? I fear I am raising the potential for an unresolvable debate on taste and subjectivity etc but I hope we can respect each other's constructively intentioned viewpoints.

For what it's worth I drink coffee most days, I generally use a stove top (Bialetti) espresso maker but sometimes a cafetiere. I remain unsure about the weird deposits inside the Bialetti - are they the metal oxidising or what? - and I can't get my head round why the stove top maker is supposed to be good when you have to boil the water (I am right in stating that's what happens?) to get it to pass through into the upper chamber yet the received wisdom is that coffee should be brewed at lower temps (80oC ish)?

I prefer the coffee from the stove top maker as it seems stronger yet I sense I get less flavour compared to using a cafetiere where there's more time for flavour to come out.

By the way I had a lovely cappucino in the deli beside the Outside 'Square' shop in Hathersage last week. Can't remember the beans they advertised as what they were using but they sounded special (apologies for the vagueness). Only downside was the naff music (radio from what I recall) being played.

In short, should I bin my cafetiere and stove top maker, throw away the Cafe Direct / Taylors ground coffees and invest in re-invigorating my coffee life with an Aeropress, grinder and whole beans? 

[galpinos]

ksjs,

I have all three and no longer use the stove top. I use the aeropress and hand burr grinder at home and a cafetiere with pre-ground at work. The home set-up gives a lot better coffee in my opinion but I get enough hassle in the office for the cafetiere (it is powder blue so only myself to blame) so can't see myself sat at my desk grinding beans!

I'm no connoisseur though......

[Fultonius]

I've not tried the aeropress yet, I run a Gaggia Espresso Pure and a Duallit Burr grinder which, with a few years of tinkering can get a pretty decent espresso. That's about the cheapest setup you can get for espresso making. (£160 for the machine, £80 grinder). If you want to spend less than that stove top or aeropress are probably the way to go.

I use a stove top in the camper. Quite happy to use pre-ground coffee in that (Lavazza or whatever) - I don't think it makes a huge difference. What does make a difference is getting it off the heat and pouring when you hear the first bubble. Don't let it boil dry as the steam scorches the coffee.

The other cheap option is a chemex or similar: http://www.chemexcoffeemaker.com/products/classic.html

Those hand burr grinders look great for 1 or 2 cups. Might hint for one for the camper ;-)

[Richie Crouch]

Hey keith

I find you always get a consistently good brew from the aeropress and its great for taking on trips as it won't be in danger of shattering/cracking in a bag, like a cafetiere Or pour through might.

I can heartily recommend this: http://www.hasbean.co.uk/collections/kalita/products/kalita-wave-ceramic if you are after something which will extract even more flavour than the aeropress.

Both the kalita wave and aeropress are a good upgrade in terms of taste from cafetiere and stove tops.

I use on of these: http://www.bellabarista.co.uk/porlex-mini-grinder-with-ceramic-burrs.html to grind with and it is not too tricky to adjust the size of grind if switching between different brewers.

[Muenchener]

I've recently switched from an Aeropress to a Hario filter (similar to the Kalita) and I prefer the Hario. I find the results from an aeropress quite harsh, from the Hario much mellower but still full flavoured. The slow pouring ritual is a bit of a faff though.

[psychomansam]

If you have an adverse event it is perfectly reasonable for you to discontinue a study, so as to prevent the worsening of those side effects, not so that you don't report any more side effects!  To suggest, as you seem to be, that you should continue on the treatment so that you can stay at the clinic and get more cash for participating is ludicrous.  If you're prescribed a licensed medication for an ailment by your GP and after starting to take it develop one of the symptoms listed in the side-effects you go back to your doctor pronto who will seek alternative medication, you don't sit around and continue taking it ignoring the side effects!


Thats not to say there aren't bad practices by pharamaceutical companies in the reporting (or not) of their studies which is widely acknowledged to exist and covered by Goldacres "Bad Pharma".  This is the "tip of iceberg" you should be more concerned with rather than well conducted clinical trials.  And if you openly admit that you "lied about being healthy" or "didn't report side effects so you could stay longer" then you should look at and question your own motivations at that time as well as questioning the practices of pharmaceutical companies as they're probably not too far away from each other (i.e. money).

Yes, I lied about my drinking, among other things. I exercised when I shouldn't have, drank when I shouldn't have, had caffeine when I shouldn't have. We colluded to distribute food according to need when staff weren't watching. I hid negative side-effects.

Yes, I was in it entirely for the money, just like the clinical trial companies - and that showed too (e.g. technicians just used to make up breathing rates sometimes). But the point is that it wasn't just me - I've been on a dozen trials and I'm merely representative of the average participant. Some are worse, smuggling in alcohol or cigarettes, drinking the night before being admitted, and of course smoking weed or taking other drugs in between visits. All fairly standard. Clinical trials appeal to some of the poorest people around, along with students and people on gap years.

[slackline]

That isn't necessarily a bad thing though.

Very few people are completely honest with their GP when they are asked about their drinking/smoking/drug consumption/exercise.  If a drug has been tested in a group who do the same and hide their habits that is a benefit as it has been tested against a representative sample of the target population, it might even flag up dangerous interactions.

[mini]

Well, thanks to you guys I've just ordered a Aeropress and Porlex grinder. Seems my decade+ of stove-top brewing and Lavazza combo may have come to an end (way over due to be fair!).

So, the next objective is to get me some beans man! This is obviously a new journey I'm undertaking, so going to proclaim myself a mega punter;
 - Which is the preferred country to look out for (does it matter)?
 - Is online or local coffee shop / deli better?
 - Are there different types of roasting to be considered?

I tend to like my coffees with quite a quite strong taste, but hopefully well rounded. Keen to start enjoying a brew without the bitterness of the Bialetti pot. I tend to have one brew first thing in the morning and maybe a couple at weekends, so not a heavy consumer but enjoy the process. I therefore assume pointless to buy bulk or the beans would go stale? Logically fridge stored once package opened?

Any tricks, tips or recommended first bean-to-burr greatly appreciated!

[Fultonius]

I'm not sure about the Aeropress, but I find recently roasted beans last me around 10 days to 2 weeks before the coffee is noticeably degrading. I would of thought it would be similar with an aeropress. If they come in a foil bag just take out what you need every day and then squish all the air out. Either that or keep them in a airtight container. I don't bother with putting them in the fridge or freezer, others do.

Search out an artisan type roaster nearby and if there's no such thing order locally. Not sure where you are based? www.beanshop.co.uk are reliably good and nice people, also, http://www.algcoffee.co.uk/ seem good.  If you say where you're from I'm sure others can give you recommendations. House espresso blend is always a good place to start.

[Bubba]

York Coffee Emporium are good too and have friendly customer service.

[mini]

If you say where you're from I'm sure others can give you recommendations. House espresso blend is always a good place to start.

Yes, might help. I'm based in Leek, Stafforshire. We do have a couple of deli's, and coffee shops, so manged to pick up some Monmouth Coffee espresso, so I at least have something to have a meddle with once the grinder arrives. Cheers for the links, I'll have  abutchers once the first batch has disappered (which wunna take long!).

[petejh]

Why has it taken me so long to notice this thread? It delights me that grown men (and women) are carefully analysing and discussing the intricacies of coffee making; a good antidote to some of the madness around and there's some excellent reading recommendations and comment on scientific / research methods to boot. Only on UKB! (I've just purchased 'Irrationality', sounds very interesting).

Anyway, I digress. So, this Aeropress device, is it actually any good, worth the money? And should I really buy a grinder and is there any difference between the ones mentioned above (blade and burr)? I fear I am raising the potential for an unresolvable debate on taste and subjectivity etc but I hope we can respect each other's constructively intentioned viewpoints.

For what it's worth I drink coffee most days, I generally use a stove top (Bialetti) espresso maker but sometimes a cafetiere. I remain unsure about the weird deposits inside the Bialetti - are they the metal oxidising or what? - and I can't get my head round why the stove top maker is supposed to be good when you have to boil the water (I am right in stating that's what happens?) to get it to pass through into the upper chamber yet the received wisdom is that coffee should be brewed at lower temps (80oC ish)?

I prefer the coffee from the stove top maker as it seems stronger yet I sense I get less flavour compared to using a cafetiere where there's more time for flavour to come out.

By the way I had a lovely cappucino in the deli beside the Outside 'Square' shop in Hathersage last week. Can't remember the beans they advertised as what they were using but they sounded special (apologies for the vagueness). Only downside was the naff music (radio from what I recall) being played.

In short, should I bin my cafetiere and stove top maker, throw away the Cafe Direct / Taylors ground coffees and invest in re-invigorating my coffee life with an Aeropress, grinder and whole beans? 

I used a stove-top for years, then I went to one of these: http://www.cuisinart.co.uk/grind-and-brew-plus.html  and recently got an aeropress for when away from home. The aeropress is tidier and easier to clean then a stovetop, and makes a better-tasting brew imo. The machine's good for setting the time and having it ready when you wake up, but the aeropress is so simple that I've started to just use that at home as well.. The machine has a burr grinder built in which I use to grind my own when at home, but I wouldn't buy one especially. I use a cheap blade grinder when away from home - I don't notice any taste difference between burr/blade.

I think ground coffee tastes good from a stove-top, and even better from an aeropress. Grinding your own gives it more flavor again but pre-ground still tastes good to me..

A cheapo thermometer might be good, I don't have one but I just experiment a little bit with heating the water until it starts to boil and letting it cool down for different times to see what difference it makes to taste. As someone else said you can try using the lowest heat when boiling your stove-top and take it off as soon as it's bubbling, that's how I was using mine.

You could do some blind tasting by getting someone else to make the coffee using supermarket beans versus more expensive fresh beans to see which you prefer.. Would be interested to hear what you think if you do - no cheating!

[Muenchener]

Having switched to a Hario filter cone at home, I took my Aeropress into the office today. Dangerous -  this could lead to my caffeine consumption going throug the roof if I'm not careful.

[Fiend]

Got a £15 Tefal blade grinder the other week. Definitely nicer through the stove-top than pre-ground, plus the smell of the beans grinding is 

[shurt]

For fellow Bristolians...
visited 'didn't you do well' a specialty coffee outlet on park row. It's all a bit highbrow but thought it might knock out a high class flat white. Anyway the boutique espresso tasted a bit funny (prob too complex for my pallet) and the milk was luke warm. Nice cups though.
Like a true Brit in the 21st century I smiled, left and then slagged it off on an internet forum.
God save the fucking queen.

[shurt]

On another note, does anyone know what makes espresso espresso? I know its a drink but is it a type of roast or the fine grind used to make the drink that gives the coffee this name?  A lot of coffee is branded as espresso in supermarkets and also in posh coffee shops but then there are all the other types. Can you just grind them up finely and stick them through the machine? I'm confused.

[andyd]

On another note, does anyone know what makes espresso espresso? I know its a drink but is it a type of roast or the fine grind used to make the drink that gives the coffee this name?  A lot of coffee is branded as espresso in supermarkets and also in posh coffee shops but then there are all the other types. Can you just grind them up finely and stick them through the machine? I'm confused.

I'm on the move, otherwise I'd commit to a essay to enlighten you.
Get yourself on youtube and see the plethora of different opinions, then experiment to your heart's content. Needless to say, most of the videos are not made by English coffee shops...

[Muenchener]

Typically a darker roast, which makes for a little more bitterness (hopefully not overdone), plus espresso machines need a rather fine and very even grind to ensure the hot water goes through at the optimum speed to get the flavour out of the coffee without over-brewing it.

[shurt]

Typically a darker roast, which makes for a little more bitterness (hopefully not overdone), plus espresso machines need a rather fine and very even grind to ensure the hot water goes through at the optimum speed to get the flavour out of the coffee without over-brewing it.

So any bean can be termed espresso if it is roasted slightly darker?
I get the fine grind part. I've got a pretty good grinder (not slicer) and always have it set on the finest setting to go through the machine. I guess I'm intrigued by the terminology.

Andy: if you have the time I'd be interested to read that essay! Will check YouTube as well...

[Muenchener]

Strictly speaking espresso is the process, the distinctive thing about it being that the hot water is forced through the coffee by steam pressure instead of by gravity. In principle you could do it with any coffee, but darker roasts seem to be generally preferred and give the best results.

I suppose there must be varieties that lend themselves to darker roasting better than others, but I wouldn't claim to know which they are. Looking at the leaflets from my two local roasters, one says he uses mainly Guatemalan for his house espresso blend and the other doesn't specify.

[Footwork]

Any advice on how to hide your coffee? Jacob keeps stealing mine and the stuff he buys tastes crap

[andyd]

So any bean can be termed espresso if it is roasted slightly darker?
I get the fine grind part. I've got a pretty good grinder (not slicer) and always have it set on the finest setting to go through the machine. I guess I'm intrigued by the terminology.

A darker roast (meaning roasted for longer) has less sugar so adds to the bitterness. As it roasts, it caramelises the sugar, then the sugar burns off.

The pressure you put on to compact it down is key too. In an espresso, you want the crema (spelling?) on top. This is achieved as M' says by sending steam through, but without packing the coffee in, the pressure is reduced and less caffeine and flavour is released. I've read and experimented that you want to pack it down with roughly 30 lbs of pressure (just less than 2 stone).

[shurt]

I find the pressure one of the hardest things to get right at home as I always grind in batches as don't have time to grind before I make every coffee. As it dries out you have to adjust pressure to get it right. I suppose that's why coffee is great at a good place with a barista that's used to the grinder and machine and making coffee all day. I've heard that they adjust the grind slightly depending on the weather to keep the quality consistant! High tech...