[Fiend]

I think we need some clear proof of the entire sequence....

[SA Chris]

Yes, using some sort of motion based photography system. Should technology allow such a crazy concept to exist yet.

[Johnny Brown]

just spoke to iain and he said he climbed it on the left since any other way you can escape into the huge drill hole, to miss this out really would be contrived

Had a chat with him last night over a couple in the norfolk arms, the furthest right hold is the same on both sequences. So either you contrive not to use any holds further right, or you contrive not to use the easiest sequence. Seeing a pattern? Its contrived. A shame, because the moves are great.

[cofe]

just spoke to iain and he said he climbed it on the left since any other way you can escape into the huge drill hole, to miss this out really would be contrived

Had a chat with him last night over a couple in the norfolk arms, the furthest right hold is the same on both sequences. So either you contrive not to use any holds further right, or you contrive not to use the easiest sequence. Seeing a pattern? Its contrived. A shame, because the moves are great.

Is it not just the arete without the shot hole? That seems logical enough.

[Johnny Brown]

Yeah, I suppose it is. Logically contrived.

[dave]

just spoke to iain and he said he climbed it on the left since any other way you can escape into the huge drill hole, to miss this out really would be contrived

Had a chat with him last night over a couple in the norfolk arms

Isn't that a bit rude? What did that couple say about it?

Iaiaiaian's way sounds least contrived to me. His way he wouldn't have the eliminated hold just to the side of him, he's have it way out of sight and presumably (crucially?) out of grabbing distance round the arete.

[Johnny Brown]

Yeah. But in the Venn diagram of holds used my sequence sits entirely within his. His uses one hold extra for a harder sequence.

Its similar to Ben's Wall at RHS I guess. Either you can do it the normal way and avoid the arete, or you can do the harder left-hand rockover way for a less contrived sequence. Which does everyone do?

Maybe we need to stick a bonus tag on the crimp out left.

[cofe]

I'm just going to mark it as 'Project' in the guide. Or call it Bohemian Grove.

[a dense loner]

Unfortunately this is rather contrived as you can climb it on the right with the big shothole running down the right-hand side at about 6c+. Without it was fair bit harder, I thought perhaps 7a+/7b (similar to a big Angle Ben's), but the others thought harder. On the plus side the moves are very good and unlikely, but it is a total eliminate.

you can't reach the shothole climbing it the original way. your body is on the left the whole way. its an entirely seperate problem with no chance of escaping to easier territory.
its like getting rid of don and archangel and just getting the tick for going au cheval

[cofe]

Unfortunately this is rather contrived as you can climb it on the right with the big shothole running down the right-hand side at about 6c+. Without it was fair bit harder, I thought perhaps 7a+/7b (similar to a big Angle Ben's), but the others thought harder. On the plus side the moves are very good and unlikely, but it is a total eliminate.

you can't reach the shothole climbing it the original way. your body is on the left the whole way. its an entirely seperate problem with no chance of escaping to easier territory.
its like getting rid of don and archangel and just getting the tick for going au cheval

to be fair to dense, for once it seems he does have a point?

[Ru]

you can't reach the shothole climbing it the original way. your body is on the left the whole way. its an entirely seperate problem with no chance of escaping to easier territory.

I thought that was exacly what JB's sequence did - start on the left and used the same holds to swing right?

its like getting rid of don and archangel and just getting the tick for going au cheval

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

[Nigel]

My take on this line is that it is an eliminate, albeit a very logical and easy to describe one i.e. the arete sans shothole on the right. This being the case, Adam's solution is perfectly valid, and as it seems to be easier, then for me that should be the basis for grading it. I felt that Adam's way would be in the region of 7c.

[Johnny Brown]

to be fair to dense, for once it seems he does have a point?

He might have a point worth hearing if a) I hadn't had a long discussion with Iain about it last night and b) he had the first clue what my sequence involved and c) he had done a single move on it to decide for himself where the holds naturally lead.

Edit: I see Nige has posted and, incredibly, ticks all those boxes too! Lets listen to Dense though.

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

[cofe]

I'm getting bored of this. This is write up for guide:

L’Angle Parfait 7c
The impressive, vertical square-cut arête around and left of Green Death is climbed predominantly on its left-hand side, avoiding the vertical shot hole around right. Steady moves at the start are followed by hard, tenuous arête work, before a scary barn door pop for an edge at 5m to finish. Iain Farrar

Last chance...

[Ru]

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

So it is the easiest sequence?

[slackline]

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

So it is the easiest sequence?

If you're a show pony perhaps?

[Johnny Brown]

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

So it is the easiest sequence?

So Don Whillans said.

Yeast Bums Dogs 7b+
The impressive, vertical square-cut arête around and left of Green Death gives a good 6c+ using the vertical shot hole on the right. Better and harder is to eliminate it with cryptic, tenuous arête work either direct or via an edge out left.
Iain Farrar

Quote from Iain 'I did think someone like you or Nige would be able to do it an easier way with some fancy smearing'.

[Ru]

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

So it is the easiest sequence?

So Don Whillans said.

I stand corrected.

[cofe]

Sorted.

[erm, sam]

tenuous arête work

Wow. Work! Is it just me, or is there something unaspirational about that phrase?  It makes it sound like climbing the arete is er, work when it should be fun. Doesn't it? Maybe it is some modern bouldering terminology I haven't kept up with but it feels a bit odd. Not that I expect the guidebook rewritten to my exact spec or anything.

[Bonjoy]

Or it would be if climbing Archangel a cheval was the easiest sequence. But's not.

And what would you know about that?

So it is the easiest sequence?

So Don Whillans said.

Yeast Bums Dogs 7b+
The impressive, vertical square-cut arête around and left of Green Death gives a good 6c+ using the vertical shot hole on the right. Better and harder is to eliminate it with cryptic, tenuous arête work either direct or via an edge out left.
Iain Farrar

Quote from Iain 'I did think someone like you or Nige would be able to do it an easier way with some fancy smearing'.

I'm sure his exact wording was "...someone like you or Nige with your silky footwork" An important distinction to make I feel.

[Somebody's Fool]

I was fairly tipsy by the time the exchange took place as I was the wrong side of two pints of Moonshine, but I'm pretty sure his exact phrasing was:

 '...someone like you or Nige could have worked out an easier sequence because it's frightening how silky your footwork is!'

[nodder]

I wasnt there but are you sure it wasnt

"I knew some twat would ruin it, my ways much better shame you couldn't do it"

?

[Nigel]

I was fairly tipsy by the time the exchange took place as I was the wrong side of two pints of Moonshine, but I'm pretty sure his exact phrasing was:

 '...someone like you or Nige could have worked out an easier sequence because it's frightening how silky your footwork is!'

I was stone cold sober, and I believe Ian's word's were:

'...someone like you or Nige could have worked out an easier sequence because it's frightening how snazzy your footwork is!'

[Johnny Brown]

tenuous arête work

Wow. Work! Is it just me, or is there something unaspirational about that phrase?  It makes it sound like climbing the arete is er, work when it should be fun. Doesn't it? Maybe it is some modern bouldering terminology I haven't kept up with but it feels a bit odd. Not that I expect the guidebook rewritten to my exact spec or anything.

Right you are.

Yeast Bums Dogs 7b+
The impressive, vertical square-cut arête around and left of Green Death gives a good 6c+ using the vertical shot hole on the right. Better and harder is to eliminate it with a cryptic, tenuous mini-break at Centre-parcs, either direct or via an edge out left.
Iain Farrar

We should do everything by committee. The names would certainly improve.

I was stone cold sober, and I believe Ian's word's were:

'...someone like you or Nige could have worked out an easier sequence because it's frightening how snazzy your footwork is!'

According to the recording on my phone, Iain's exact words were:

'...someone like you or frightening Nige could have worked out an easier sequence because it's how snazzy your silky footwork is!'

though if I play it backwards, its more like 'yyyoooaaassstt boooaaaammmmsss hoooooonndds'