[i_a_coops]

I know it's a bit pathetic not just turning up and seeing what it's like, but I'm going to the Roaches on Sunday and I'm wondering how viable this would be to ground up .....

Bearing in mind I've been bouldering a lot on southern sandstone, and have done (admittedly fairly soft) Font 7B in a session, but all I've done on grit (apart from a VS at Stanage) is solo Golden Days (E3 6a, and very short) above a couple of pads. Basically all I want to know is will I be alright falling off it repeatedly!

And if it's a very, very stupid idea then other suggestions for routes with good gear and hard moves (British 6b or 6c) would be appreciated!

Cheers,
Ian

[tommytwotone]

Been years since I went up there with mates to spot a mate on it, but I seem remember the landing is a little tasty. You'll want more than one pad and willing spotters if memory serves.

[Johnny Brown]

I'm wondering how viable this would be to ground up .....

Very.

on Sunday

No chance! Unless you are one of these folk who believes 'conditions' are a myth.

have done (admittedly fairly soft) Font 7B in a session, but all I've done on grit (apart from a VS at Stanage) is solo Golden Days (E3 6a, and very short)

Hmm. I think you'll struggle even on a cold day. It probably is only 7a+/ 7b, but its very knacky, technical climbing. Very gritstone.

will I be alright falling off it repeatedly!

Hmm. Not really. The landing is a small, very sloping ledge. Folk usually weave a rope into trees to help spotters support the pads. The kind of thing you'd fall off a couple of times, but it would soon put you off. It is high too - the E6 was fair and folk used to lead it.

[i_a_coops]

No chance! Unless you are one of these folk who believes 'conditions' are a myth.

Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

I just had a look,  it's forecast to be cold and wet I think... I definitely believe in conditions, unfortunately. Any recommendations for things wi' crimps then?

[Johnny Brown]

15 degrees is cold? Forecast is showers  - I'df be looking at the Churnet.

[Will Hunt]

Hopefully the weather will play ball and we can have a go at this over the weekend (even if it doesn't rain it is due to be VERY windy - I hope this is sheltered?). I've seen talk of tied down spotters and threading a rope round trees etc. Some vids online don't seem to use this and people seem to be winging off it quite comfortably.

I hadn't been planning on taking rope and harness so would like to avoid this if possible. We'll have around 4 pads minimum and hopefully more. Can anyone give any info on what has become the established "protection" for this route?

[T_B]

Can anyone give any info on what has become the established "protection" for this route?

It depends who you are and how you like to climb. A cats cradle of roped in pads must take away from the experience somewhat. I did it on my own with two pads.

It catches loads of wind BTW.

[Footwork]

I think the ground has eroded pretty badly underneath it. I wouldn't want to spot without being tied down!

[Eddies]

Good effort T_B 

Totally ground up'able... I wish I had, but joined a couple of mates and had one quick go on TR.

The crux for me was near the top, which can been lanked if you have very long limbs (Andi-T)!

There was a team on it when I sent it, they had a belayer held on the end of the ledge with a rope but it wasn't necessary.
Id say you want a bare minimum of 4 pads in order to provide a flat landing that you wont fall off or need a spot for.

Good luck... That climb is as good as it gets imho

[Will Hunt]

Sounds like a mix of opinions then - certainly if you were happy to fall on 4 pads without a spot, Eddies.

I think the ground has eroded pretty badly underneath it. I wouldn't want to spot without being tied down!

Have you been to the block? I've never seen it. Do I need to bring my harness then? Can you get a club rope or something?

We may be fucked anyway if that block gets all the wind. I thought it would be a bit in the trees. There are gale force south westerlies and that block faces south west...

[Johnny Brown]

Eroded? I don't think so. The landing is a sloping ledge, big enough for a pad or two but they won't stay there on their own. Below is a bit of a gully. See below, it's a bit confusing with the shadows but there is a spotter below holding the pads in place.



It's fairly exposed yes, but there are spots nearby which can be sheltered by the trees.

[Wood FT]

Now that's what I call Gristone

[Will Hunt]

Thanks for posting that Adam. The light in that photo isn't shit is it?

I can't really tell whether the spotters are tied down there. They seem to be standing comfortably or sitting/leaning against trees. There is a vid on Vimeo where one person has a sling around both a tree and their waist but no more that. They were also using the method of having one person hold the pads up and this seems to be the key bit of protection. I guess the ropes and harnesses can probably stay at home but maybe take a sling or two.

The guy on the far right (Bonjoy?) appears to be executing a near perfect "tree" pose 

[Johnny Brown]

Nobody is tied on in that shot. I think BJ took a short length of rope and a tent peg/ dog skewer to help tie the pads on.

[andy_e]

dog skewer

I'm not a huge fan of dogs but this seems a little excessive.

[dave]

dog skewer

I'm not a huge fan of dogs but this seems a little excessive.

Stolen from a Korean kebab shop?

[Eddies]

There were lots of pads when I sent it (like in JB's pic) and a useless spotter on a rope way out left off the pads, plus Bonjoy stood in his usual spot making sure the pads didn't slip off the ledge.... so no 'spotter' as such.

Just fold up and shove 2 or 3 pads side ways to pack the gully out and then a couple on top to level the landing. Also worth adding a satellite pad up against the wall so you dont smash your swede when / if you turn and bail!

If you don't go up there and get stuck in after all this ill be disappointed!!

[SA Chris]

And??

[Will Hunt]

We did do Doug-less on the Saturday though which I thought was great. The top break is quite slopey, and you get it with your left as a pinch; you run your left foot as high as you can up the crack; then, facing left you bring your left foot up (knee also pointing left) and smear with your outside edge (so you're almost sat on it now) on a tricky-to-spot smear. Trust the smear and stand up with trepidation to tickle the top sloper.
I thought it was about 6C (6B+ absolute minimum - never 6B) and we each had a good few lobs off the top before trusting that outside edge smear to stick.

[Fiend]

I think one of those lefts is a right....

[Will Hunt]

FFS you're right of course.

We did do Doug-less on the Saturday though which I thought was great. The top break is quite slopey, and you get it with your left as a pinch; you run your left foot as high as you can up the crack; then, facing left you bring your leftright foot up (knee also pointing left) and smear with your outside edge (so you're almost sat on it now) on a tricky-to-spot smear. Trust the smear and stand up with trepidation to tickle the top sloper.
I thought it was about 6C (6B+ absolute minimum - never 6B) and we each had a good few lobs off the top before trusting that outside edge smear to stick.

[cowboyhat]

Eroded? I don't think so. The landing is a sloping ledge, big enough for a pad or two but they won't stay there on their own. Below is a bit of a gully. See below, it's a bit confusing with the shadows but there is a spotter below holding the pads in place.



It's fairly exposed yes, but there are spots nearby which can be sheltered by the trees.

I went to do Art Nouveau in about 1998ish when my tactics included a small metolius crash pad and two of the worst spotters in the history of standing with your hands in your pockets; Dom Hall and some Dense Loner of this parish. Possibly also Ben Hall and or Ben Tetler, either one equally useless.

The 'ledge' upon which those pads in JB's photo sit is actually a damp patch of heather and bilberry about eighteen inches wide.

Problem being that you can't stand on the pad to spot which is perfect for the men I had on staff that day: one's preference being to keep a look out for some rare buzzard or other and the others inclination as ever being towards getting his sweater shop jumper into a guidebook, but in each case absolutely no where near the plumb line.

I had a couple of feeler goes to get my eye in that passed without incident but then when inevitably at thirteen feet my left foot did a fandango and I hit the pad at a certain speed, mat and I were eventually caught in the arms of a pine tree a further twenty feet or so below where I'd started.

As a wise man once said 'there's belaying and there's fucking belaying.' I have a scar on my ankle.

[Will Hunt]

I had a couple of feeler goes to get my eye in that passed without incident but then when inevitably at thirteen feet my left foot did a fandango and I hit the pad at a certain speed, mat and I were eventually caught in the arms of a pine tree a further twenty feet or so below where I'd started.

All I'm hearing is that it's basically safe.

[Footwork]

I had a couple of feeler goes to get my eye in that passed without incident but then when inevitably at thirteen feet my left foot did a fandango and I hit the pad at a certain speed, mat and I were eventually caught in the arms of a pine tree a further twenty feet or so below where I'd started.

All I'm hearing is that it's basically safe.

Wasn't it Mr Dawes who said that he fell off something and had to keep running down the steep hill or he would fall over? Can't remember where I read that

[grimer]

I've been refraining from commenting on this as I didn't think it was too hard or scary, after which someone will inevitably call me a lanky twat and that I missed out the best bit. Anyway...

We had, I think, two pads and someone tied to something off to the side to stop the pads flying off the ledge. I fell off two or three times trying to get the last sidepull and each time rotated outwards and landed on the mat comfortable. And I'm no gazelle. I wasn't spotted, but it was nice to have someone to catch me if I had needed it.

I didn't think it was 7A+ or whatever JB said, as my multi day limit is 7B+. More like 6C or 6C+. ("You lanky twat...") but my sequence looks the same as everyone elses'.

Such an utterly beautiful climb. Here's a photo of my on it. While it wasn't desperate, it still made my head go very pink .

http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=20141#photos