[douglas]

I'm having real issues with thin skin on my finger tips recently. They don't seem to dry out and crack, they just get thin. First a bit tender, then purple and leaking plasma, then red and sore and if I'm lucky they bleed. Has anyone got any advice on keeping them climbable? Climb-on seems to make them softer (which I don't want) and I don't use superchalk.

How does everyone else cope with the abrasion?

Oh and I climb on limestone crimps.

Cheers!

[clgladiator]

Ive got really moist and thus really terrible skin, and have similar problems to those that you have described. I find superchalk helps as it dries them out alot more than other chalk. Other than that I use climb on in the evenings to regrow and a healthy dose of man up at the crags to keep climbing on trashed skin.

[douglas]

OK thanks, I'll try switching chalk and see if it makes a difference.

[fiveknuckle21]

 I'm in the same boat buddy and appreciate it can be really frustrating. The best combination I've found is to try and limit the amount of chalk I use - if you've got a chalk bucket just put one hand in instead of two and brush onto your other hand, or use the dregs on the sides. The other one is to really really limit using moisturiser which seems to have the opposite affect for me. You could try the Neutrogena Norwegian Formula on the odd night which is not greasy at all.

 It took a couple of weeks for this to work and a lot of perseverance slipping off the odd hold and stuff but I'm really benefitting from it now.

[douglas]

I'll cut out the climb-on completely but why do you think reducing chalk helps? cheers

[fiveknuckle21]

 I don't know the science behind it or anything but I always guessed that it probably inhibits the repair process.

[douglas]

Ok, sweet. Thanks.

[nai]

I totally trashed my tips on a three day trip back in October and it was then bad for months.  Basically once you've gone through a tip I think it takes a lot longer than you expect to heal.  The hole might have repaired but with soft new skin so it's more prone to wearing out again.  I endured the frustration of not climbing for about a week then holing a tip again warming up on a couple of occassions.

What I did was cut back on climbing, hung off my board for a couple of weeks (wait for a wet spell) with just a couple of short, low intensity outings for exfoliation.  I also started using Sypeland balm rather than the crap that I'd been using before and that seems to have helped too but I wouldn't say that it makes tips thicker, just helps repair them quicker and keeps tyem in nick, it feels medicinal rather than cosmetic if that makes sense.

I've not had a problem for a couple of months now but I've been careful not to hole a tip again, I will walk away from a problem rather than keep trying it and risk causing damage, sometimes easier said than done I know but I don't want to go through another period of frustration like that.

Dave Macleod's got stuff on his blog too: http://onlineclimbingcoach.blogspot.com/2008/10/split-tips.html

[shark]

I've taken to sanding my tips after climbing which sounds counter-productive but really sems to be working well (cheers Tom). I'm also avoiding gettting 'wash-hands' in the shower and using different sorts of moisturising creams on but not settled on a preferred product yet. Also I wash the chalk off at the end of climbing.

[rodma]

I've taken to sanding my tips after climbing

Are you sanding the slightly thicker skin away from around the worn part, or sanding the worn part?

[chris_j_s]

As mentioned by Dave MacLeod in his book I have been using Cow Udder cream (Mrs is a vet so I can get hold of it quite easily) to keep my skin in good nick!!

Only started using it recently so the jury is still out but my skin has definitely been in very good condition since I started...

[douglas]

Interesting answers, thanks all.

Nai, I've looked back through my diary and basically in January I split a tip on a route. It was a cold day, skin was hard and it was a proper split not a wear down like I get now. So I started with the climb-on then started working a super fingery vert wall in March which really wore my tips thin and I don't think they've recovered from that. And the moisturising could have been making them softer.

Chris, what do you find the cow cream does? Is your issue that your skin wears down quickly or does it just tend to split?

[chris_j_s]

Chris, what do you find the cow cream does? Is your issue that your skin wears down quickly or does it just tend to split?

It seems to promote growth really well after sessions when my skin feels like its getting thin and it also keeps the skin supple without being greasy. Despite climbing mostly on limestone I haven't had any split tips since using it, although I couldn't tell you whether thats through luck or the cream helping!

Normally I would really suffer with thin skin after hard sessions and when the skin grew back it would be very excessively hard and not very grippy. Particularly during winter time my skin would get excessively dry and (even without climbing sometimes) I would get cracks appearing in my fingertips and knuckles.

Anyway so far so good and I'll see how it goes for the next few months. Warm weather, soft skin and sharp limestone should prove a good test!

[butterworthtom]

This isn't really a solution to the problem, but if you are ever on a week long trip and want to climb everyday only to find that your skin gets greasier and greasier then it is worth using some antihydral. I have found it to be a god send on trips allowing me to keep climbing despite trashed skin. Probably nopt the healthiest thing to do though.

[Probes]

Get yourselves one of these...

wash your hands with fairy after climbing to remove chalk/chemicals then break abit of leaf off and rub the gizzum in. It works for me a treat, n stops me whinning on like a pansy about my sore pinkies.
 

[psychomansam]

Like people have said, prevention is better than cure.

You could think about taping your tips while not pushing your grade as the slight friction/crimping loss shouldn't matter too much unless you're right at your limit. Bit more of a problem on crimps, but just think of it as extra training. Might not be ideal, but a lot better than opening tips up.

You could also change rock/route type, or even just change route if it's one hand/finger that's taking the worst of it.

[shark]

I've taken to sanding my tips after climbing

Are you sanding the slightly thicker skin away from around the worn part, or sanding the worn part?

Originally the former hoping that it would stimulate all the skin to grow back but found that didnt seem to work so sanding all of it now which seems to work better. Only been experimenting for about 6 weeks so other views would be good. 

[douglas]

Thanks for the replies so far. I'm interested in this antihydral cream. Can anyone who's used it explain what it does? Thanks. If it sounds worth it I may try to get a few tubes from abroad...

Doug

[rodma]

I've taken to sanding my tips after climbing

Are you sanding the slightly thicker skin away from around the worn part, or sanding the worn part?

Originally the former hoping that it would stimulate all the skin to grow back but found that didnt seem to work so sanding all of it now which seems to work better. Only been experimenting for about 6 weeks so other views would be good.

I do pretty much the same as you, sand all the thick skin away from around the area and a little bit of sanding of the thin bit. This definately works best for me.

Thanks for the replies so far. I'm interested in this antihydral cream. Can anyone who's used it explain what it does? Thanks. If it sounds worth it I may try to get a few tubes from abroad...

Doug

I use this a lot, as I have super sweaty tips, lots of peeps on here seem to run high risk of split tips when using it. It's something that you have to experiment with to get it right.

Buy one tube from abroad, or ask for a loan from a friendly stump-cream abuser to see if it works for you. One tube should last years.

[butterworthtom]

They sell it in the climbing works. I think there are a few threads on it if you have a search?

[IanP]

I'm not convinced that anybody who talks about sanding their tips has properly thin skin!  I've always suffered from poor skin in almost exactly the way you describe - going through the skin either by gradual wear (where gradual = a few hours) or by cutting on sharp(ish) holds.  It can be particularly problematic when bouldering or on early acquaintance with sport project where your trying the same move many times.

Unfortunately I can't offer too many solutions - I do use a moisturiser with Vitamen E to hopefully encourage regrowth, though not sure how much it helps.  Otherwise I try to be careful and if things start to rip I back off or tape up.  Sorting out how to tape your tips effectively with the help of a bit of superglue is useful - allows you keep on climbing without risking further damage, I've also gone down the route of tape to work a route and then removing the tape for the redpoint,

[Dexter]

I can attest to udder cream works pretty well on tips as it repairs but hardens instead of softening

[Carnage]

I can attest to udder cream works pretty well

Me too. Bagbalm is great but its so greasy. The best way I found to use it was to cover my hands with it and then don a pair of thin cotton gloves to stop it going all over the place, before going to bed . Skin was great in the morning and the one thing I did notice was its pain killing qualities, fixing the sting where your skin is raw from slapping rough holds etc. This plus antihydral is now my best combo.

[douglas]

An update incase anyone's interested. My tips are sorted. I've switched to superchalk, stopped using climb-on and now use antihydral/stump cream. Thanks to all who helped.

[account_inactive]

Anti-hydral+superchalk = Splits

[Three Nine]

An update incase anyone's interested. My tips are sorted. I've switched to superchalk, stopped using climb-on and now use antihydral/stump cream. Thanks to all who helped.

Where can i get some of this? I want to try it out on my udder. (no seriously, where?)

[douglas]

the antihydral? I got three tubes from here

http://www.apotheke-online-internet.de/p52729_antihydral-salbe.html

which worked out at 9 pounds a tube. Postage is about 11 euros or something. One tube will last at least a year but I got one for a friend and a spare. The works sell it apparently for 15 pounds a tube.

It's like a paste that you smear on your tips, don't get it near the joint creases, then leave to dry and either leave it on overnight or while you watch a film or something before washing it off. What it does is basically reduce sweating. So the skin dries out and is able to thicken as it's more resistant to abrasion. Apply too much and I expect it'll crack but the stuff arrived before a long weekend away to gordale and I'm not joking when I say my tips were in a better state after than when I left. In fact my thumb tips were the most sore because I hadn't used any on them!

[rodma]

the antihydral? I got three tubes from here

http://www.apotheke-online-internet.de/p52729_antihydral-salbe.html

which worked out at 9 pounds a tube. Postage is about 11 euros or something. One tube will last at least a year but I got one for a friend and a spare. The works sell it apparently for 15 pounds a tube.

It's like a paste that you smear on your tips, don't get it near the joint creases, then leave to dry and either leave it on overnight or while you watch a film or something before washing it off. What it does is basically reduce sweating. So the skin dries out and is able to thicken as it's more resistant to abrasion. Apply too much and I expect it'll crack but the stuff arrived before a long weekend away to gordale and I'm not joking when I say my tips were in a better state after than when I left. In fact my thumb tips were the most sore because I hadn't used any on them!

I bought from Mycare.de Significantly cheaper, but the same expensive postage.

Douglas, listen to Dylan re: superchalk and stump combination.

And by no means put the stump cream on the joints themselves, only put it on the pads, or you're all but gauranteed a split

[douglas]

By all means check mycare but I thought the postage was more and the tubes no cheaper.

I'll stay aware of the superchalk stump combo but tbh I don't notice a difference between superchalk and others because my hands are moister than most. Cheers though.

Doug

[Three Nine]

Sorry, i meant udder cream.

[andybfreeman]

Sorry, i meant udder cream.

google is your friend. you can get original udder cream in tins from vet suppliers or what seems to be the same stuff but in fancier looking packaging being sold as a cosmetic!

[account_inactive]

By all means check mycare but I thought the postage was more and the tubes no cheaper.

I'll stay aware of the superchalk stump combo but tbh I don't notice a difference between superchalk and others because my hands are moister than most. Cheers though.

Doug

I too have VERY wet hands, but after using AH you gain a yellowish layer to your skin that is kinda glassy.  So much so that I have to spit on my hands for them to take chalk.  Using Super chalk in this instance will fuck you up especially, if you are like me, you are used to having soft skin. I'd never used hand cream (and didn't see the point) until discovering AH.

On another note does anyone have any science on how AH works?  From my experience it doesn't seem to grow skin, more stop skin from shedding and then letting it build up underneath.  Thoughts? 

[Carnage]

Sorry, i meant udder cream.

I got mine on eBay from the US. A great big jar of the stuff cost me about 10 bucks and the postage was minimal. Just search for Vermonts Original Bag Balm.

[rodma]

By all means check mycare but I thought the postage was more and the tubes no cheaper.

It my well be now, it def used to be cheaper though

[rodma]

which worked out at 9 pounds a tube. Postage is about 11 euros or something.

I'm confused as to how this is cheaper than at 5.71 euros a tube, but I'm easily confused

[chris_j_s]

Three Nine, you could get some from a local farm vet (my wife is a vet so she picked some up for me) or there are plenty of farm/vet suppliers around. Heres one example I found (£4.61 for 400g, which will last forever but if you're a heavy user there's always the option to get 4kg for £28.99!!) :

http://www.medicanimal.com/product/~product_id=3033?gclid=CMGk_rH6l6ICFVKZ2AoddEK2Ww

[douglas]

which worked out at 9 pounds a tube. Postage is about 11 euros or something.

I'm confused as to how this is cheaper than at 5.71 euros a tube, but I'm easily confused

meant 9 pounds included postage. sorry

[rodma]

which worked out at 9 pounds a tube. Postage is about 11 euros or something.

I'm confused as to how this is cheaper than at 5.71 euros a tube, but I'm easily confused

meant 9 pounds included postage. sorry

Ahhh, that makes a lot more sense now.

The very first time I ordered from mycare (bloody years ago) overseas postage wasn't an option on their order form so I sent an email (in English) asking if there was another way of ordering.

They said if I emailed them my credit card details they could sort it out, which did seem dodgy but I went for it telling them I wanted two tubes of stump.

The stump arrived two days later and they didn't charge my card for almost a month, and when they did it worked out about £7/tube. I've felt somewhat loyal to them since then, as they were so helpful at the time. Not that the repeat business is worth much to them, ordering two tubes of stump every 3 years or so.