[edshakey]

Extract from a recent post about going to Slovenia

... The next day, I could make the first ascent of “Fantazija” 9a+ 👌 To finish the day off, I onsighted two 8c’s - Kingslayer and Inferno do vrha.

Double 8c onsight in a day, after a new 9a+, and this isn't even particularly newsworthy for Ondra. Incredible.

[Fultonius]

I'd love to see a pan-European grade comparison chart at different levels. I epexcet in the 9a-9c region there's so much travel amongst the top climbers that they're fairly consistent. Some 8cs have been around for ages and I assume not all have been regraded, so there might be some inconsistency. In the lower grades us mortals climb at, there seems to be a huge variance...

Let's take, say, F6c as an example. In Spain, Greece they can be very straightforward compared to say, France, Finale Ligure there they've be more likely to get 6b+ or 6b, then we've got Slovenia/Croatia where they might veen get 6a/6a+.

Give the top end is, by my hypothesis, fairly consistent, it would be interesting to see at which level there is some grade compression....?   What we've noticed in Slovenia is that grades are consistently a couple of grades harder than elsewhere, but also that even in the lower grades they seem to be graded purely for the easiest sequence (so hard to onsight, knacky, sequences with hidden holds) are not given any leeway. (conversely in France etc. you get the feeling lower graded routes up to low 7s are kind of graded for the onsight, seeing as that's how they're mostly climbed.)

[jwi]

I'd love to see a pan-European grade comparison chart at different levels. [...]

Give the top end is, by my hypothesis, fairly consistent, it would be interesting to see at which level there is some grade compression....?  [...]

I made an attempt on such a chart at some point, based on my opinions and the opinions of some friends for harder stuff. There is indeed some amazing grade-compression, expansion and overlaps at certain grades in some areas. I never dared to post it anywhere since I realised that people much prefer to shoot the messenger rather than the message.

But I have it from pretty solid sources that since even 9b has become commodified and not so competitive anymore so there is a lot of grade creep and that old solid 9b's are a lot harder than most that have been put up the last 5 years.

[remus]

Casual 9a flash of a line called Peščena Ura put up by Jernej Kruder in 2020.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CyyWr8aM7QO/

[remus]

For those counting along at home, this is his 7th onsight or flash at 9a or harder. Lest we forget, the only other person to onsight or flash a route in the 9th grade is Alex Megos who has climbed three routes at the grade in this style (Estado Critico, TCT and Intermezzo XY Gelöst).

[Duncan campbell]

Such a legend! Sounds like a tricky one too with a coordination dyno outside!
Get gold in Paris Ondra, then go back to specialising on rock and do some more awesome stuff!

[remus]

Another 8c+/9a onsight, this time El Gran Bellanco in Spain.

When Im recording impressive onsights on climbing-history.org I'll (somewhat inconsistently) record anything 8c or harder. I had a look at doing the same for Ondra and got bored because he's done it so often.

[jwi]

It is a Pedro Pons route so I ask myself if Pedro went straight up via some absolutely heinous holds and everyone else wisely took a more meandering path. That is usually how it goes with his routes?

[crimpinainteasy]

Ondra legit looks like he might be on his best form ever. Nearly onsighted another 9a and got a 9a+/b FA after 3 days of work.

[Wellsy]

He's gonna get retroactive credit for the world's first 9A soon too

[crimpinainteasy]

He's gonna get retroactive credit for the world's first 9A soon too

Would seem fitting that both the world's first 9a route (Hubble) and world's first 9A boulder are both grotty limestone problems.

[petejh]

Would seem fitting that both the world's first 9a route (Hubble) and world's first 9A boulder are both grotty limestone problems.

And that both were given 8c+ by their respective first ascensionist...

[erm, sam]

Get gold in Paris Ondra

He still has to qualify first....

[crimpinainteasy]

.

[remus]

Lovely vid of his os of El Gran Bellanco 8c+/9a in Montanejos. Sometimes you forget what a weapon he is, but then you remember he's basically the only game in town when it comes to hard onsighting and watching the vid you can see why. Im more scrappy on my fifth session than he is on the onsight!

[remus]

More first go waddage.

[spidermonkey09]

My kingdom for Ondra to try an aesthetic looking route again!

[Wellsy]

We're so desensitised to it but it truly is incredible isn't it, the consistency of his best in the world ability

[Bradders]

I think that looks like an amazing crag! Maybe the line isn't the most standout but then what sport routes follow truly amazing lines? I feel a list coming on....

The area looks very atmospheric though.

[abarro81]

what sport routes follow truly amazing lines? I feel a list coming on....

Depends on what you're into as a line, but for starters: Tennessee, Tete de Gondole, Prouman show, Rose des Sables, La rose, Pull over, Alone, Hulkosaur, Tom et je ris, Black bean, Cosi fan tute, De batte mon couer, Colliseum, la reina mora, kalea borroka, Rollito Enmienda, Era Vella, La rubia, that 8c nr Briancon, Slimline, the big 8c arete in Costa Blanca that's name I can't remember, Supersonico...

[spidermonkey09]

I've seen worse admittedly, but its hardly tom et je ris!

Nice looking crag but the rock isn't aesthetic for me. Obviously awesome climbing but that goes without saying 

[remus]

...the big 8c arete in Costa Blanca that's name I can't remember...

This thing? https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/locaive-1701/el_camino_de_les_flores-21857 Should be on the list even if it's not the one you're thinking of, looks totally rad in person.

[Will Hunt]

People love to talk smack about UK sport, and yes, it isn't dripping golden tufas, but I can think of tonnes of inspirational Yorkshire lines. We could split hairs about whether they're "truly amazing". Maybe when you've supped from the fonts of Ceuse and Taipan Wall it all becomes intolerable shit but I don't think that's entirely the case.

[abarro81]

This thing?

That's the one

Ceuse and Taipan Wall

If we're including "good lines on stunning walls" the list gets very very big (Groove Train, Serpentine, Biographie, le cadre, most stuff in the bowl at Ramirole, etc...)

I don't think there are many sport routes in the UK that I would call amazing lines though. Maybe Totally free, The Thumb and Premonition are pretty decent, but in general it's a bit of a struggle to find "wow" lines on UK sport even when the routes are good...

[dunnyg]

Uk sport is ok, but the number of incredible looking lines I've seen in the last 2 weeks in Spain does shit all over it.

That's not to say I don't enjoy UK sport (and still want a belay Will). I think it is down to the amount of rock out here though (plus more tufas).