[Stubbs]

Word been using mine regularly since I got it (was that January?), noticed a serious improvement in open hand and pocket strength thanks to following the 3.2.1 action.  Gone from struggling to do a set of repeaters open handing the big rail to being able to do half a set three finger dragging the bottom rungs.  have been taking it pretty easy on the pockets (staying on the middle row)  as I'm a porker and am terrified of tweaking a long tendon.

Not had any trouble warming up, normally do some theraband, some press ups and then follow a similar series to what Dan said above.

For some reason I really struggle with the slopers - I thought I was OK on slopers, but I struggle to hold the 35's for more than a couple of seconds... i think I need to try another board to see if the Black Mouth is just particularly slick.   

Overall an excellent product - I find it quite inspiring to have the whole bottom row of pockets to work towards still.

[joeb]

have had around 5 weeks training on mine, which is mounted in my car port, and it hasn't warped which i was a little wary of as it is fairly open to the elements (obviously it stays dry) but not as dry as indoors. Has really opened my eyes up to my weakest grip types. very skin and tendon friendly love it.

[chicane]

My Beastmaker has replaced a random mix of resin holds above my door frame and its great to be able to train without wreaking my skin. Also most of the holds are pretty hard for me so lots to work on....great product

believe the hype.....

[GCW]

crimping mainly being digitorum sublimis
open handing being digitorum profundus

I would make the comment that this is an old school view which takes little or no account of the flexor chiasm, and its poorly understood function.  Whilst what you say is likely to have truth to it, I don't think it's as cut and dried as some people would have you believe.

[Serpico]

What this thread needs is more SCIENCE.

"The FDP-to-FDS tendon-force ratio was 1.75:1 in the crimp grip and 0.88:1 in the slope
grip. This result showed that the FDP was the prime finger flexor in the crimp grip,whereas the tendon tensions were equally
distributed between the FDP and FDS tendons in the slope grip."

From "Estimation of finger muscle tendon tensions and pulley forces during
specific sport-climbing grip techniques"
Laurent Vigourouxa,Franck Quainea,Annick Labarre-Vilab,Franc-ois Moutetc  2005

[Richie Crouch]

With my past history of tweaky fingers I have been slowly breaking in to more difficult feats/training over the last few weeks. I set up my board in the wall I work at to ensure I can warm up fully for it so there is no excuse for not being prepared!

Found the 35's tricky to hang on at first but can now do full repeater sets on them dragging on the lip with front 3 and can almost 1 arm deadhang for more than a couple seconds. Finding the 45's nails still - as in I can't do more than a second! (might need to ask Jennings if he had anything to do with this  ) Maybe it is the air temperature/humidity in the wall as it is in a loft with closed skylights and all the heat is rising up there?

I find the thin monos a lot easier to do repeaters on than the deep ones as my knuckles get in the way on the larger ones? Don't know if anyone else found this to be an issue... I find I have to really wrap my thumb around every other digit in a strange way to avoid my fingers resting on the board.

Went from struggling to 1 arm deadhang on the normal slots to doing almost 10 seconds on each arm after 4 weeks (no thumbs pressing against the board). I think this was more a case of discovering how to balance and not twist off them, than gains in fingerstrength.

Was struggling to 1 arm deadhang the incut rung in the middle on week 1 but can now 1 arm deadhang for a few seconds and do a 1 armer on the right arm when going well. Left arm is nowhere near though!

Can use the slopey pockets on front and mid 2 but am yet to complete the full set of repeaters. Tried to hang them with back 2 but got shut down. Something to aspire to in the future 

It's by far the best board I've trained on in terms of having a good range of holds and being super skin and joint friendly and I'm enjoying the progress on all fronts, just hope i can put it into play outside on the lime this year 

[GCW]

The FDP-to-FDS tendon-force ratio was 1.75:1 in the crimp grip and 0.88:1 in the slope grip.

I think (for me especially) the most interesting part was:

The forces acting on the pulleys were 36 times lower for A2 in the slope grip than in the crimp grip

.


Other studies have shown no difference in power of 4 finger voluntary contraction between crimp and open (check out a few of L Vigouroux's stuff).  Therefore FDS+FDP function must remain equal (suggested to be around 420N).  So in crimp we assume FDS provides 152N and FDP 268N.  In open hand FDS gives 223N and FDP 197N.  Which supports the argument for varying grips when training.

The function of the chiasm (in part) is that FDS locks onto FDP during contraction, to form more of a single function unit.  You could argue that in the crimp, FDP is providing a higher proportion of force because FDS is acting more efficiently by locking the flexor units.  This is of course totally ignoring the fact that the intrinsics will also have input in flexion in the crimp.  You would expect FDP:FDS function to equalise in open handing as the need for chiasmatic and intrinsic function is lessened.

Really what we need is dynamic magic angle MR to see exactly what goes on in a non-static rig.  It's important to know where in the system the force is going to have a better understanding of this.

[mctrials23]

I have had mine a few months now and I love the thing. Really kind on the skin and good friction for the most part. It has improved my fingers a fair bit, especially since I have been training all the different groups.

One of the biggest gains I found was in using the 2 finger pockets. On my old moon board I used to train middle 2 and middle 3. Since getting the beastmaker I have started to train front, back and middle 2 and have seen some impressive improvements as a result.

I am at the lower end of the grade scale for the 2000 series but find that the only holds I cant handle are the slopey pockets on the bottom rail, the shallow monos on the bottom and the 45 degree slopers.

Are there any tips for the 45's because I find the 35's fine, I can hang them for a good long time before my strength gives out. The 45's however just feel like I am slipping off them. Any tips would be much appreciated.

All in all though this is deffo the best training tool I have bought. Cheers guys.

[nik at work]

I've only briefly played on the works one and it felt luverleeeeee.

Out of curiosity though when people are saying then can hang or not hang the 45's, 35's, back 2 pockets etc etc etc are they talking one or two handed (i'm assuming one?)? Sorry for off topic-ness, but it would be nice to know everybody is talking about the same thing (i.e. one or two hands) and to know what that thing is.

Anyway I didn't notice any specific strength gains but then 10 minutes messing about is unlikely to yield much noticeable improvement...

[richdraws]

Last year in October I was attempting to deadhang the incut rung (drag grip), I found I could get a few seconds out of my right hand and barely a second from my left. I went to font for 2 weeks came back and tried it (with a slight finger injury) and managed 10 seconds and could have got mebbe 2 more seconds on my left my previous 1 second increased to around 8 seconds.

Which is great but I have not managed to repeat it since.

Other than that one odd discrepancy I have been showing slow steady improvements on all the grips. I had the board set so it was slightly overhanging at first (accidently), but I took advantage of this to hammer the 35's and now I have it so it is very slightly tilted backwards. This made the 45's possible to hang without tricks [other than the few degrees cheat:)] for around 8 seconds. I am still shit at crimping but improving month after month.

I like the very slight sloper in the middle on top - its handy for single arm hangs. The big slots I find useful for warming up to crimping/open crimping as my fingers hate those positions.

Dan, have you looked into any method of incorporating pinches into the board design?

[benj_d]

I will try and upload some pictures of mine tonight, I used Lagers design of attaching a fingerboard to a 'Powerbar' pull up bar. I am quite proud of it! 

[Stubbs]

Nik I was talking about two hands, don't know about everybody else! the only holds I can use one armed are the big central jug and the incut rail.

[richdraws]

Oh yeah, definitely one handed on those 45's. 

[carlisle slapper]

What this thread needs is more SCIENCE, what top end climbing training needs is more science.

I hadn't read that study, infact this is only something i have begun to think about as a way of training recently, rather than it being the result of training.
 I've been trying for ages to find one into passive recruitment and the different areas of FDS & FDP which contract when using pockets/monos e.g. when you use a mono what is the max amount of muscle you can recruit? actively along the main tendon, as well as passively through the other tendons.

any thoughts Serpico GCW?

Mr Crouch, i'm gutted to hear that your knuckles touch on the monos as we designed the board with clearance, has anyone else had this problem? the problem should be less if you drop your fingers out the mono a bit (i know its worse but hey ho).
It was only Dolph's board which recieved the "special treatment" on the sanding front, It seems that weight/ muscle size has a big affect on hanging the 45s, i.e. they are easy when you can recruit alot of muscle to crush the flatness out of them, slightly sweaty hands help with the friction (i struggle with dry hands alot).

Hopefully Ru will turn up in a bit, as he's had a board for the longest just about, i think it's taken him a while to hang the 45s properly, but he can crush the pockets etc.

Richdraws- yes and yes, pinches correspond highly with the sloper strength too,

[GCW]

when you use a mono what is the max amount of muscle you can recruit

Honest answer?  Dunno.
Chao did research in 1976 (not on climbing I admit) which demonstrated the complexity of finger flexion.  They showed that power grip (making a fist) and pinch grips can be shown to involve the intrinsics, which give over 50% of power of the grips.  Now I admit it isn't directly comparable to your question, but intrinsic function must play a role.

Anyone got a few quid spare for some research?

[benj_d]

Here we go!








Slightly different to Lagers design in that the blocks that stop it swinging arent easily adjustable.

[abarro81]

What's the bit at the top which it hangs off (where the gaffa tape is)? Mine hangs off cord at the mo but want to change it to like yours so it's a few inches higher.. I went into a (not very good) hardware store but they didn't have anything which looked likely. (Also, where in broomhill/crookes end of Shef is a good hardware store to buy stuff like that?)

[benj_d]

Its a solid bit of wood just over an inch thick which fits the powerbar perfectly plus a longer bit of ply wood on the back of that to act as a hook. The tape was just to go over the screws, in case i knacked a finger tip while slapping for a sloper.

If you go on the "How to build a Campus Board" thread, that shows Lagers design. It is a bit clearer on how the whole thing is made.

Do you not have a B&Q or Maxwells nearby?

[lagerstarfish]

Abbaro, this is my original design (no Beastmaker on it though). The top "hook" is a length of wood the same width as the top bar sandwiched between the main piece of ply and another piece which is just shorter than the width between the powerbar's bracket arms.

[Richie Crouch]

I had this same setup with a moonboard attached and found it still hung a bit low due to low doorways in my house, coupled with the fact it still flexed a little, it made it hard not to ping off the small crimps violently. Has anyone else using this setup had issues with the flex under load 

[lagerstarfish]

I don't think the flex can be avoided with this set up. Jasper uses some filthy small crimps on his (same) set up, but from what I remember he has the board hanging at just less than vertical so that when you hang, the flex/stretch/creak brings it to just vertical.
Although I'm not sure he has done this deliberately - that would be quite a lot of forethought for someone so blonde.

[Jaspersharpe]

Forethought?! Moi?! It's pure coincidence of course but it does seem to work.

Haven't bloody used it for months though due to injuries, illnesses and extreme laziness. My advice, wherever you mount your board do not put it next to your fridge. Especially if, like mine, it is always full of beer.

[SA Chris]

How do you fill a board with beer?

[Serpico]

How do you fill a board with beer?

They do a complete range of boards for home brewing and fine dining: The YeastMaker and The FeastMaker.

[Serpico]

What this thread needs is more SCIENCE, what top end climbing training needs is more science.

I hadn't read that study, in fact this is only something i have begun to think about as a way of training recently, rather than it being the result of training.
 I've been trying for ages to find one into passive recruitment and the different areas of FDS & FDP which contract when using pockets/monos e.g. when you use a mono what is the max amount of muscle you can recruit? actively along the main tendon, as well as passively through the other tendons.

any thoughts Serpico GCW?

Some stuff on recruitment in finger flexors:
http://jn.physiology.org/cgi/content/full/97/1/550

I think that with a max effort there's a high degree of activation overflow so that all fingers are recruited, I know that it's not uncommon with monos to tear the muscle between the adjacent tendons as the finger under load is extended whilst the adjacent fingers are contracted - curling into the palm; creating shear across the muscle between the tendons.
As with all strength training it's not just about what you can recruit, it's also about what you learn to not recruit: angle specific increases in strength are due in part to increased inhibition of the antagonist.