[cowboyhat]

Well whos done it these days?

Off the top of my head here is a list of Hubble ascents involving no research;
Moon, Smith, Gaskins, Mclure, Bosi, Megos, Dawson, Buster

I reckon Matt Wrights got half a stone on all of them. He isn't heavy by any stretch of the imagination, for a human, or even a rock climber. Looks about 68kgs.

So there you have it; knee pad or not. If you want to do Hubble, lose weight.



(He's the same dimensions as me except I'm twenty years older and haven't just climbed Hubble so rounding down quite a bit...)

[abarro81]

Dunning too (IIRC from a conversation with him, it sounded like he was very light at the time)..

Simpson 

Gaskins

[Doylo]

.

So there you have it; knee pad or not. If you want to do Hubble, lose weight.

Thought that was same for most hard climbs?

[yetix]

Billy Ridal managed Superman sit, Keen Roof  and Fat Lip today.

[DAVETHOMAS90]

With a side of judgement and you're trying to argue Dave's point that he shouldn't take the route. 

That's like the old tradsters bi^&*ing about the youngsters.  Except you're the old sportster bi^&*ing. 

We deal with the technology and circumstance that we have, and if we are being forthright then we disclose everything and go with it.  He's not hiding anything.  He's being honest and that's good enough for me.

Sorry for the late post.

Hi Mr Squatch 

I'm not saying "he shouldn't take the route". I'm not applying black/white thinking, just trying to establish the facts, while also trying to make sure we're not comparing apples (cheaper) with oranges (more expensive .. maybe  ).

I think it's a good thing to try to develop.

I'm a big fan of Matt, and find what he's been doing really refreshing. Andy F, I'm referencing your post from earlier, but being really lazy. Sorry. I'll try to post up a reply properly.

What's more important, is that people don't start claiming Woodology at the school, with "any feet", then the bottom really would drop out of the market.

[DAVETHOMAS90]

Further more, and to hopefully keep on topic with Significant Repeats, ascents of routes like Hubble with the pad, ARE significant, because that's what's being traded currently.

I don't think Significant Repeats should be just about usurping the old, with something harder (or, er .. easier  ), but about being more conscious of what's going down out there; it should be less of a competition about what's significant/insignificant.

[HaeMeS]

James Pearson repeats Tribe in Cadarese: https://www.planetmountain.com/en/news/climbing/cadarese-tribe-repeated-by-james-pearson.html

[Fiend]

Nice - https://www.instagram.com/tv/CGpZ1CEn5ce/?utm_source=ig_embed

Tribe - The world’s hardest trad climb?

 

[petejh]

Tribe - The world’s hardest trad climb?

I thought that was on Dyer's Lookout?

[Fiend]

Nah isn't it the thing up on the Ben that's "ungraded but definitely harder than Rhapsody E11" and F8c with death potential or something or other and regardless quite conveniently in the most unlikely setting / orientation / climate location to actually be repeatable by people who don't live in Fort William. Or that thing on Hoy that Caff downgraded by several French grades. Or something or other....

[Doylo]

He’s done that quick considering it’s 9a+ on trad ... Could he onsight Indian Face tho?

[JamieG]

Not 100% sure why you're throwing shade at Dave Mac Fiend. He always seems to have been very up front and honest about his climbing, grades, ethics and motivations. Isn't that all you can really ask for in a climber?

Or have I missed something? Have many of his routes been downgraded? Has been accused of exaggerating things? Not that I'm aware of, but maybe i'm out the loop.

[Wood FT]

I was hoping Tribe would have put up more of a fight if I’m honest although Pearson does say it’s the hardest set of moves he’s done on a trad route. He must be on form! Such a world away from when he left the UK.

[Duncan campbell]

Yeah it does seem to have gone down quite quickly... Pearson is on good form having climbed his second 9a this year but if this is supposed to be knocking on for 9a+?

In many ways I think this is very much Pearson’s style though? More on the Boulder you end of the spectrum?

I guess it doesn’t matter a great deal but I am surprised how quick it has been repeated

[Fiend]

Not 100% sure why you're throwing shade at Dave Mac Fiend.

Because it's fun, and because he plays "the game" just as much as James did with Walk Of Life E12 or this repeating the hardest trad route in the world (which I've already bestowed the can-of-worms upon) - except DMaccy does it sometimes in a more subtle way, professing to not be interested in grades after making a film called E11 (blame the marketting team, maybe ), and letting the audience draw their own conclusion from then Ben thing being "even harder than a route graded E11". So he's up there to have a bit of fun poked at the hyperbole just like anyone else.

I can't recall the exact details but Caff and crew did downgrade the Longhope route yes.

[petejh]

I've always thought Dave Mac to be the monarch of the humblebrag, but it probably stems from the tension inherent in him being seemingly a genuinely modest quiet guy who's made a career choice that almost completely relies for income on constant self-promotion. Bit like Ste Mc in a kilt, with ice-axes.

[Fiend]

Well put Pete. Compare to Ryan P, etc etc.

[Will Hunt]

I've got massive respect for Dave McLeod. He does what very very few do which is to perform very close to the highest level in all disciplines and does it in a fairly modest and unshowy way. Not only that but he's done more (IMO, Lattice employees may disagree) than anybody else to understand the science around training for climbing and distill that knowledge into simple, accessible training advice. All whilst living in the rainiest place on the globe. Humblebrag on, Dave.

[nai]

I can't recall the exact details but Caff and crew did downgrade the Longhope route yes.

From memory...
Went and worked it after he'd been training for something hard, said it was piss somewhat easier than DMac graded it but didn't climb it for some reason.
Went back the following year and found it be harder than he remembered and more like the grade.

[teestub]

I've got massive respect for Dave McLeod. He does what very very few do which is to perform very close to the highest level in all disciplines and does it in a fairly modest and unshowy way. Not only that but he's done more (IMO, Lattice employees may disagree) than anybody else to understand the science around training for climbing and distill that knowledge into simple, accessible training advice. All whilst living in the rainiest place on the globe. Humblebrag on, Dave.

Word.

[remus]

(IMO, Lattice employees may disagree)

 

I've got a lot of time for Dave. He puts out a lot of good stuff on youtube and generally offers very sound advice.

In many ways I think this is very much Pearson’s style though? More on the Boulder you end of the spectrum?

I was under the impression he was much more of a route climber now? I imagine he's still pretty sharp on the boulders but he's been doing a lot of route climbing these last few years...

[Duncan campbell]

In many ways I think this is very much Pearson’s style though? More on the Boulder you end of the spectrum?

I was under the impression he was much more of a route climber now? I imagine he's still pretty sharp on the boulders but he's been doing a lot of route climbing these last few years...

Yeah good point. Can imagine he still favours boulders stuff though? Think that 9a he did recently was more bouldery/power endurance than an all out Stam Route.

Tribe is obviously bigger than most grit routes but is it maybe more of that style? Looks like techy, tricky, but not desperate compared to the top, lower wall. Bit of a rest then gun it up the prow?

Could be well off the mark there obviously.

[cheque]

professing to not be interested in grades after making a film called E11 (blame the marketting team, maybe ),

It’s a British climbing film Fiend, there wasn’t a marketing team involved. The guy who made it (not Dave Mac) shot it on sick days from his job and posted the DVDs out from his flat.

[Johnny Brown]

I can't recall the exact details but Caff and crew did downgrade the Longhope route yes.

I can. Having discussed a downgrade they went for taking the grade while letting the extremely quick, casual nature of their repeat speak for the epic burn. Ben even found time to make a little film while swinging leads on-sight.

I'd echo what others have said about Dave Mac though, that all the 8s in a day thing has my total respect and is what British climbing should be all about.

[submaximal gains]

Re. the long hope route.

James McHaffie initially felt it was E8 when doing the final pitch of the route after inspection.

"The next day we make the pilgrimage back to St Johns head. Abseiling down the face is sheltered from the strong Southerlies giving perfect climbing conditions. I spend half an hour on a grigri playing on the moves and checking the protection. Adam goes down for a look and when its my turn for a top rope I’m keen to do the longest link i can and manage to link it 1st go with plenty of good shakeouts it felt about 8a+. As the gear appeared excellent I was keen to lead it immediately as this is essentially the Salathe Wall crack pitch of the UK.  I abbed in and as evening looked like it was coming in thought better of it and jugged back out again. We were keen for GMB on the Old Man but with the Squalls that had been passing this pitch appeared the better idea.

The day after we arrived there again, I rechecked the gear and warmed up mincing about on the nice E5 wall to gain the gear and the crackline. It’s quite windy but as it was our last day i knew it would give me confidence to come back to try the full link if i led this pitch. The lead went smoothly and as a locked the 2 crimps to reach for the jugs before a hands off and the e4 6b finishing crack my foot popped off. Although I fell on the biggest runout on the pitch I had a good rock 11 and rock 2 at foot height. I was going to pull back on and go to the top as I’d learned what I wanted to about the pitch but Adam said to give it another go. After a good rest huddling from the wind on the belay we pulled the ropes and I set off up. I’d asked Adam about how he did the crux high step about halfway up which I’d felt a little sloppy on. I attempted it his way and promptly fell off that move. Pissed off I came down pulled the rope and after afew minutes climbed it and this time it felt steady. I abbed and stripped it and Adam jugged out near hypothermic for his belay efforts. As i took out the last of the belay and swung out on the Abb rope I felt I was going to die, swinging out 15/20 m with the wind taking me towards Big John I start to jug up the rope as fast as I can feeling dizzy.
The pitch would way in at E8 7a, with good protection after the initial E5 start. It’s a great achievement by Dave Macleod to do it after all the other pitches as climbing an E8 7a when tired is hard.

The pitch itself is not E9 because it’s lacking in any form of runout with many E6/7s being much more serious propositions than this. Once you’ve done the E5 start you could fall off any move and not go very far and even the E5 you’d just take airtime.  It also has only 1 move that would warrant 7a, and 2 of 6c. "
http://www.jamesmchaffie.com/caffs-blog/team-no-hope-head-to-hoy

In his write up of doing the whole route with Bransby he says "I was impressed with Dave Maceods ascent as it was fall free and the top pitch is a slippery devil which when placing loads of kit will feel 8b, to do similar we would've probably needed another session and a rest day as well as the fact that me and Ben were swinging leads. Drummond and Hills effort hanging out in the land of the birds for a week back then left me dumbfounded, a stunning effort. The crag feels like it belongs to the Fulmars and the less time spent on it for me the better. "
http://www.jamesmchaffie.com/caffs-blog/longhope-report

The video is here