[Kingy]

Could someone please clarify whether you get holds L and K in the roof with your right hand off the low jug Q on Rack and Ruin and Armbandit respectively. It looks an unfeasible move to slot I for both problems but do you get your left foot in the footjam to do it? I couldn't seem to make any headway, that little hold K is tiny! For hold L, how do you hold it, as a backhander, as its a sort of wierd press?

I have all three bouldering guides and they seem to say conflicting things although I put most faith in Ru's one.

Cheers in advance.

[r-man]

Yeah, toe-heel is the key on Rack and Ruin. Here's the way for the holds described in Ru's book. Fun moves, but probably not 7c, to be fair.

[Kingy]

Wow, that looks pretty funky! Cheers for that R-man, nice swing at the end. That just leaves Armbandit then, I guess that is stiffer proposition as I suppose you can't lean off crimp K in the same way?

[Andy B]

To follow the description of Rack and Ruin in the Rockfax guide would require a terrifying backwards dyno over the abyss, which if you held the hold but not the swing would leave you at the bottom of the crag in a broken mess. (unless you are Dave Thomas apparently). You can do this using Ru's holds, but without the full pirouette, by either pressing off the side or the back of L (back is easier) and reaching through.

I found the crux of armbandit to be swinging my feet across to the side wall. (First to Q then walking down to the footlock). If you get the footlock secure then the rest is steady. Pull in on your foot to reach down to Q with your left, K with your right and brace off your other leg to reach I with your left.

[Kingy]

Cheers, nice one Andy, yes the monster dyno from the footlock to Jug H did give me pause for thought Certain death would be the result if you blew it!

I now see how to do Rack and Ruin. Armbandit may require a bit of working out but I will try bracing off my LF on the low foothold and RF in the footlock next time I'm up there. In fairness, most of the holds were mingingly wet so its probably not surprising I could not pull on em.

The start to Armbandit looks a bit feisty, u got to hold the edge with one arm and then swing ur feet around the cave, massive amounts of core strength needed I reckon! This is why the cave has its attractions at times even tho its not the most salubrious of venues...

[fatboySlimfast]

Is that rack & ruin? For some reason i always thought it used a  different sequence???? That sequence showed there actually partially dislocated my shoulder when i over rotated on the undercut....ouch

[Kingy]

I dunno man if that ain't it then I don't know what is! There's got to be only a certain number of ways that press hold L can be used. 

[Andy Harris]

Afraid the video aint Rack & Ruin. The 1st move is the crux but starts of completely different holds to the one in the vid. You do the same style fast jump but your LH is in a small 2 finger pocket on the rib to the right (12 inches right) and your LH pinches the rib. I'd say this is significantly harder.

The original guide didn't make sense on a few problems so having chatted with Jerry came up witha  few changes for the new guide.

[abarro81]

Whilst we're on Tom's roof, where exactly does the womb start? 'the back of the hole' isn't very specific and it goes a long way back... Also, anyone been bored enough to think of an approx equivalent french grade for jerryatricks?

[Paz]

Also, anyone been bored enough to think of an approx equivalent french grade for jerryatricks?

I don't think you can tick 8a+ for it before you get excited ;-).

[Andy B]

Afraid the video aint Rack & Ruin. The 1st move is the crux but starts of completely different holds to the one in the vid. You do the same style fast jump but your LH is in a small 2 finger pocket on the rib to the right (12 inches right) and your LH pinches the rib. I'd say this is significantly harder.

Oh yeah. I hadn't noticed that in the vid. I followed your numbers from the guide, but personally thought that the gaston press was the crux.

[Andy B]

Whilst we're on Tom's roof, where exactly does the womb start? 'the back of the hole' isn't very specific and it goes a long way back.

I started on the furthest back break in the roof that allowed carefully placed jams (towards the left), but have subsequently seen a vid of Jerry doing a version of a Jerryatricks style link up starting a few moves out from there. (He might not have been starting the womb properly in that mind you).

[Kingy]

Also, anyone been bored enough to think of an approx equivalent french grade for jerryatricks?

The Womb 6c
Swing Thing 7b+
Tom's Roof Reverse 7a
Power Allowance 7b
Punker Bunker 7a+

= F8b at least? Maybe not 8b+ but that's a fair bit of climbing and you can hardly even chalk up its so intense. Who knows, bit long for a boulder problem but Font 7c+ seems a bit miserly! Compared to La Terrace, surely this would warrant Font 8a?

[abarro81]

Ru's has it stopping after power allowance... do you really have to do punker bunker too? Better get myself a long-term bus pass. Or go do some proper routes...

[r-man]

Afraid the video aint Rack & Ruin. The 1st move is the crux but starts of completely different holds to the one in the vid. You do the same style fast jump but your LH is in a small 2 finger pocket on the rib to the right (12 inches right) and your LH pinches the rib. I'd say this is significantly harder.

What!? Guide says LH small pocket right of D, RH pinch rib right of D. D being pocket at base of rib. I scrutinised carefully and thought I was on the right holds. Ah well. Couple of years ago now, so I don't remember what they looked like anymore. Pffft. 

[Kingy]

Ru's has it stopping after power allowance... do you really have to do punker bunker too? Better get myself a long-term bus pass. Or go do some proper routes...

Fraid so! I think the guide is wrong if you watch One Summer, Jerry defo finishes on Jug H and then says "my lats are totally pumped" or summat. He has done Power Allowance before this as well. If I had a bit of time on my hands I might look at this, its a good test of endurance, but got totally boxed trying to link Power Allowance into Tom's, oh well!

[Kingy]

  i am now confused as have just thought that maybe the guide is right, as Jerryatricks is described similarly in all 3 guides which leads me to think that Jerry was doing Jerryatricks + Punker Bunker in One Summer?? I think I wrongly assumed that One Summer showed Jerryatricks being climbed but maybe it was an established problem even before the vid came out and Jerry was merely adding to it?

[dave]

maybe you have to achieve a certain level of lat-pumpedness before you're allowed to step off.

[Kingy]

  yes maybe that's the case! One has to question how much value all this is for real climbing but its quite fun swinging around in there!

[Andy B]

One has to question how much value all this is for real climbing but its quite fun swinging around in there!

How dare you Ted!

Tom's roof is as real as it gets! Believe.

I've heard that doing Jerryatricks plus Punker Bunker will take you into a seperate reality.......Jerryality.

[(woz)]

I love this thread.

Robin: get back there and do it properly! I'm ashamed of you.

I started the womb like jerry and Andy B i.e. jams in and left. If you watch one summer you should get the picture.

Re: Jerryatricks. I thought that the guide had this wrong (sorry Andy H) so I did it as per jerry, finishing up punker bunker (in my cycling shorts). I thought 7c+ was fair for this. Oh, and yes, my lats were totally pumped.

[Andy B]

I started the womb like jerry and Andy B i.e. jams in and left. If you watch one summer you should get the picture.

I started the Womb a few more moves into the cave than Jerry starts in one Summer. I only did Womb into punker bunker mind.

[(woz)]

Damn, now I have to do Jerryatricks double extension next time...

[Andy B]

Damn, now I have to do Jerryatricks double extension next time...

Nah. I'd trust Jerry's numbers a lot more than mine. I just wanted to make sure I got the womb tick.

[(woz)]

...I just wanted to make sure I got the womb tick.