Things Rich Simpson Actually Did

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Being strong at basic power problems and being good at rock climbing are not quite the same thing. Reading this thread it’s hard not to wonder if RS found that deeply frustrating to the point of being prepared to rationalise failure.

It’s much easier (and more certain) to just lie than get better, after all.
 
cowboyhat said:
Ive climbed and trained with Tyler and Mickey, I've seen euro wads and etc; no one is as strong as Rich on a board.

So why did he lie? I ask

Keith shrugs. I don't know.

This is the strangest part for me, was he impatient? What? Bonjoy has said the most illuminating things here, obviously RS was a troubled chap, searching for something through which climbing was a conduit. And where is he now, a lot older. Perhaps he's had therapy and improved as a human.

Perhaps he knew that where it really matter, on the rock, he was a wannabe? Maybe deep down he realised he didn't have the skills, or the motivation to actually become world class. (or not in the timeframe he wanted?)
 
mrjonathanr said:
Being strong at basic power problems and being good at rock climbing are not quite the same thing.

To go back to the original question of this thread, I find it really difficult to understand how someome who was so strong on a board didn't manage to get up something on rock. Surely he managed something or other of even moderate difficulty? Anyone?

Board strength does transfer to rock after all, it's just not the only factor. Unless he just never actually went rock climbing, which I suppose would be believable.
 
I think you are going to have to be really, really strong to get up something like Action Directe with mediocre technique.
 
Bradders said:
[
To go back to the original question of this thread, I find it really difficult to understand how someome who was so strong on a board didn't manage to get up something on rock. Surely he managed something or other of even moderate difficulty? Anyone?

The frustrating thing is that he probably did a lot of the hard stuff what he said he did, i.e. Liquid Ambar, A Muerte, even Action Directe for all we know. However, credibility counts for a lot and in the absence of proof or witnesses vouching for ascents and in light of the controversy, we may never know. Granted a few bits have come to light in this thread re Liquid Ambar in regards to email exchanges with his belayer but they are nothing substantially new or game changing as far as I can see.
 
I'm a bit surprised this is still being discussed but I guess there remains so much mystery. This post won't help resolve any of it.

I climbed with Rich quite a bit. Indoors at the school, at his home board, my home board, etc etc. I've also been lucky to climb with a number of other strong climbers, although never with anyone from the new breed of superwad. I can honestly say that Rich was a level above anything I'd ever seen on a board. I can't remember exactly which problems he did or didn't do on which board, but I do remember his level. I do remember being on perky pinky with him and I can remember him not being able to do it in a oner but he could piss the moves. I hear this is pissed all over these days by the young superwads but it's still an ok benchmark relative to everyone else who was climbing in Sheffield at the time.

I also climbed with Rich outdoors. In fact, I was with him for most that fateful trip in Frankenjura where we wrote off a car, he littered his jizz tissues all over my bed, and he probably didn't do Action Direct. I belayed him on lots of different routes. I did see him warm up on 8b routes (as in, actually doing them). I belayed him on some 9a's which he later claimed although I didn't see him do them. One of those was action direct. I belayed Rich for several sessions on Action Direct. I remember how bad conditions were some days with holds turning black instantly. I remember some days he was really struggling on the route and couldn't do the moves. Other days he would link sections consistently. I also saw him climb from just after the first jump to the top. That's when I realised Rich could definitely do it and it was a case of conditions and a good go. But then I left to go the UK for a week of exams and when I came back he'd ticked off a bunch of stuff... including Action Direct.

From experience, I know the gap between climbing from one move in to the full ascent can be massive, sometimes it's infinite. Most people have experienced that to some extent. I don't know the truth of the Rich situation, or his ascents, but he was a very strong climber, both indoors and on rock. I also think he was probably a bit troubled due to a bunch of personal/family reasons and I don't think they should be discussed publicly (and I don't know about them either but speak as an observer).

It's a shame that anyone should feel the need to lie but ultimately lying about climbing a piece of rock is pretty low impact. It's nothing compared to Lance Armstrong and even that is basically nothing compared to someone like Trump/Bolsonaro/Jong-Un etc where the lies are genuinely costing lives.
 
Ted - What makes you say probably re A Muerte and AD? Belayers/witnesses were never identified let alone came forward. You seem to be assigning equal probability to his claim for Liquid Ambar with the other two. Given a belayer was happy to respond to my messages and corroborated the Liquid Ambar (and Hubble) ascents the likelihood he redpointed those is substantially higher. I’d say the other two were improbable by comparison.
 
shark said:
Ted - What makes you say probably re A Muerte and AD? Belayers/witnesses were never identified let alone came forward. You seem to be assigning equal probability to his claim for Liquid Ambar with the other two. Given a belayer was happy to respond to my messages and corroborated the Liquid Ambar (and Hubble) ascents the likelihood he redpointed those is substantially higher. I’d say the other two were improbable by comparison.

Nothing other than that he was prepared to say he did them and was operating at a level where people at the time were prepared to believe him. I know nothing more than anybody else does
 
mrjonathanr said:
I think you are going to have to be really, really strong to get up something like Action Directe with mediocre technique.

Well I'm almost not interested in the AD claim. The whole point of the thread was things which others can verify he actually did, and I would include slightly easier things than AD. Uncle's mention of witnessing him warming up on 8bs is a perfect example. At that point in time that's a pretty high level no?

I was also struck by Bonjoy's mention of seeing him struggle on a 6b or something. For someone as clearly strong as he was on a board, the idea he would find something that easy anything other than a path just doesn't make sense to me!
 
What grade someone "warms up on" is not, and never will be, a measure of how good someone is. It's total ego driven bollox and is merely an indication of what grade they are willing to do as their first route of the day. Presumably in full view of lots of people.
 
unclesomebody said:
I also climbed with Rich outdoors. In fact, I was with him for most that fateful trip in Frankenjura where we wrote off a car, he littered his jizz tissues all over my bed, and he probably didn't do Action Direct. I belayed him on lots of different routes. I did see him warm up on 8b routes (as in, actually doing them). I belayed him on some 9a's which he later claimed although I didn't see him do them. One of those was action direct. I belayed Rich for several sessions on Action Direct. I remember how bad conditions were some days with holds turning black instantly. I remember some days he was really struggling on the route and couldn't do the moves. Other days he would link sections consistently. I also saw him climb from just after the first jump to the top. That's when I realised Rich could definitely do it and it was a case of conditions and a good go. But then I left to go the UK for a week of exams and when I came back he'd ticked off a bunch of stuff... including Action Direct.

Thanks for that Uncle, exactly the sort of thing I was hoping might come up when I started the thread (maybe not the jizz tissues bit though).

cowboyhat said:
Bradders said:
Uncle's mention of witnessing him warming up on 8bs is a perfect example. At that point in time that's a pretty high level no?
No. Ben and Jerry were warming up on 8bs in 1990.

I think it's kinda harsh to suggest warming up on 8bs in Frankenjura isn't "high level", maybe not world class but I bet there wasn't many people in the UK performing at that level at that time (Steve Mc, Malc, Dunning, Ben Moon...probably missing a few but it's a pretty select group). I was hoping to eek out some harder stuff that unequivocally happened and this is a decent example.

Ged said:
What grade someone "warms up on" is not, and never will be, a measure of how good someone is. It's total ego driven bollox and is merely an indication of what grade they are willing to do as their first route of the day. Presumably in full view of lots of people.

For me whether it was really a warm up kinda misses the point. The impression I get from Uncle's post is that he did some 8bs in the Jura and made them look piss. Obviously not evidence that he actually did any of the harder stuff, but it's a starting point for establishing what he's actually done.
 
Nike Air said:
Anyone know where he is nowadays?

Turns out I do. He now frequents a wall near me that a few of my friends go to on the regular. Seems he wants to keep a low profile now, but from what I can gather he's still fairly strong but not wad strong.
 
Sorry Simon I have just looked at the entry for Hubble and Liquid Ambar on the Climbing History site and see the witness confirmations. I must admit I hadn't fully mentally processed this yesterday or since I saw it earlier on in the thread, having been a sceptic for years. However, perhaps it is time to add him to the definitive list for both ascents? I see the disclaimer but surely a witness is a witness? Who are we to analyse the credentials of the belayer when we don't know them?
 
This "warming up on 8b" thing is disingenuous bollocks, since Ben and Jerry have never onsighted the grade and Rich only a few ( :worms: )
 
Jerry did chuck 5 laps on La Rose at the end of Buoux sessions though according to Buoux 8c... :)
 
Bradders said:
I was also struck by Bonjoy's mention of seeing him struggle on a 6b or something. For someone as clearly strong as he was on a board, the idea he would find something that easy anything other than a path just doesn't make sense to me!

Have you met Bojan?
 

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