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Will Hunt said:
To me, grades generally make complete sense. As a way of comparing problems with other similar problems I think they generally work really well. Grades make less sense when obvious outliers aren't robustly challenged. These tend to be newer problems or things where there's been a sequence change/altered holds/cleaner holds etc. Things like Renaissance at Baildon - if that was left at 7B+ then everything else starts to fall apart because similar climbs of 7A or 7A+ feel about the same.
Trying to make sense of grades by thinking about how hard they feel to you (instead of how hard they feel compared to other similar problems) leads to confusion. People have so much knowledge about their physical strength ("I can do X% BW on a Y mm edge so I'm strong for grade Z") that it makes them feel entitled to a particular grade - if they then struggle it leads them to assume that the problem should be upgraded. I cannot touch Crystal Method, but that doesn't mean it isn't 7B+. I'm just shit at shouldery rock-overs.

Maybe this just makes me a bad grader then, but I cba trying to grade problems on how hard I think a move is going to feel for someone else, I just grade on how hard something feels for me. I find even among problems that on are on paper in the same style and in a similar grade range there is still a significant amount of variance in how much effort me and my friends spend on each individual problem.
 
JamieG said:
Maybe it would be better if they weren't called 'grades' and called something like 'guides' or 'estimates' or some other word that better represents their inherent fuzziness. Grades gives the impression of something more quantifiable.

This is genuinely not a bad idea you know, maybe the language we use around grades is what needs to change instead of the grades themselves
 
crimpinainteasy said:
Will Hunt said:
To me, grades generally make complete sense. As a way of comparing problems with other similar problems I think they generally work really well. Grades make less sense when obvious outliers aren't robustly challenged. These tend to be newer problems or things where there's been a sequence change/altered holds/cleaner holds etc. Things like Renaissance at Baildon - if that was left at 7B+ then everything else starts to fall apart because similar climbs of 7A or 7A+ feel about the same.
Trying to make sense of grades by thinking about how hard they feel to you (instead of how hard they feel compared to other similar problems) leads to confusion. People have so much knowledge about their physical strength ("I can do X% BW on a Y mm edge so I'm strong for grade Z") that it makes them feel entitled to a particular grade - if they then struggle it leads them to assume that the problem should be upgraded. I cannot touch Crystal Method, but that doesn't mean it isn't 7B+. I'm just shit at shouldery rock-overs.

Maybe this just makes me a bad grader then, but I cba trying to grade problems on how hard I think a move is going to feel for someone else, I just grade on how hard something feels for me. I find even among problems that on are on paper in the same style and in a similar grade range there is still a significant amount of variance in how much effort me and my friends spend on each individual problem.

Yes, isn’t this the point of consensus? Everybody gives an honest opinion, you get a vague idea overall. Then most observers know what sort of experience they will have on it.

Looking at what factors seem to cause individual variation in grade feel might just help you narrow down expectations a little further for when you try it. Like the whole Spectre can you keep the foot on or not thing.

Or you just go and try it anyway and find out for yourself.
 
Dingdong said:
Dexter said:
Dingdong said:
Mammut have a hitlist

Sleepwalker - $10k sit $15k

Alphane - $15k

Burden of dreams - used to be $20k but you only get $15k now

West side story - $25k

Can someone please put out a $100k contract on Shadowplay

Surprised Bosi/Aidan havent put some time into it

even though I assume this was tounge in cheek I believe they've both had a play on it.
 
joe-m said:
Dingdong said:
Dexter said:
Dingdong said:
Mammut have a hitlist

Sleepwalker - $10k sit $15k

Alphane - $15k

Burden of dreams - used to be $20k but you only get $15k now

West side story - $25k

Can someone please put out a $100k contract on Shadowplay

Surprised Bosi/Aidan havent put some time into it

even though I assume this was tounge in cheek I believe they've both had a play on it.

I was being sort of serious, would be good to see them work it properly and see if it can be “repeated”
 
Bradders said:
Andy's Problem Sit

Sorry to drag this back a page or two but, Nick, do you mean the sit to Desert Island Arete climbed on it's right? Can't be worth more than 7A surely?
 
Finger lock rest on Return of the Sleepwalker:

https://www.instagram.com/p/C2cvZQQxOR6/

Mellow crew now in hiding.
 
Sounds like RotSW is close, stuck the slot a few times last session and missed getting the intermediate properly a few times.
 
On the 8a.nu comments of their news piece, there is the following:

I believe the whole ground eroded/washed away from the rain last season so the ground is now much lower. Compare the DW video at 12:02 with WB at 6:43 and seems like the angle of their arms is pretty similar upon pulling on.
 
Bradders said:
Is it just me or could it go from a much lower start?

does anyone know if anyone got round to climbing the original version of the sitter yet? Supposedly adds 8A+ into Sleepwalker, whereas Return adds 8B.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BtoE2SNlv4r/

Bosi should have had a bash after ROTSW, could have been a quick 8C+/9A FA.
 
36chambers said:
Bradders said:
Is it just me or could it go from a much lower start?

does anyone know if anyone got round to climbing the original version of the sitter yet? Supposedly adds 8A+ into Sleepwalker, whereas Return adds 8B.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BtoE2SNlv4r/

Bosi should have had a bash after ROTSW, could have been a quick 8C+/9A FA.

I assume people lost interest after the big block under ROTSW was moved, as I guess the left start is a bit contrived as you're starting pretty close to/in Squoze.
 

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