[dobbin]

Let me be really clear that I absolutely do not want Scott to feel persecuted or under attack (although am sure that's how it will be percieved), anyone we've never heard of claiming 8b and who noone can vouch for his ascension would be facing similar requests for proof. You're absolutely right, he doesn't need to provide proof - for some of you that will be good enough, but there will always be a question if he doesn't. And if he is the real deal that's a shame. As has been said already, the truth will out, and indeed it will. Sooner or later someone will see him climbing and hopefully I will be proved a doubter - I don't want him to be lying, I would love it if he really is crushing this hard, the other outcome is that he'll continue to do these amazing things and there will still be no videos, no witnesses etc and he will be dismissed as another Si o Connor fantasist. Which is a shame. Britain - a nation of liars?


I would be absolutely psyched out of my mind to learn that Scott is the real deal and that he has done all he has claimed, so I would like to offer him the open ended offer of a lift out at a mutually convienient time so I can witness the fitness with my own eyes. Scott, pm me - this is an invite to burn me off!

[Jim]

It is right to question as outlined above.

However Scott might not give a toss what people think and is just psyched that he's done what he knows he has done.
If it was me tho, I'd be out there busting some moves and screaming 'look at me'
I hope he does

[r-man]

The internet has gone mad. I'd love to see a video as much as anyone, just because it would make me very psyched. But expecting that people make videos to prove themselves is ridiculous. Why on earth would he be shouting "look at me"? If I was him I'd be thinking "This is brilliant, I can climb 8b - what next...?"

Nice one Scott!

[Adam Lincoln]

If I was him I'd be thinking "This is brilliant, I can climb 8b - what next...?"

I'd be getting psyched out of my mind to get on Voyager!

[Drew]

I believe that Ty is always filmed, so that he can prove to people later on. That is a sorry state of affairs if you ask me. Fair enough, people will always want proof, but can't we just have a little faith. I'd rather believe Si o'C and find out later on that I was wrong, than to always say "no way, he must be lying". It's hard to do I will admit, but that's just my thoughts.

For what it's worth, a friend of mine knows Scotty, and he says he will be telling the truth, and he's a fucking beast, so I am convinced.

[account_inactive]

It's a shame that climbing has come to this, but a necessity when money in the form of sponsorship is at stake.  This ascent is worthy of many companies sitting up and taking notice of a strong kid.  Now maybe he's not bothered about recognition or sponsorship and this comment is irrelevant, but if he is then I don't think it's unreasonable that evidence is shown. 

I'm sure his spotter will come forward and vouch for him anyway.  Nice work!

[Carnage]

I don't see whats wrong with asking for proof. Surely if you can knock it out that quickly you can do it again for the cameras. A fast tick of famously hard problem is a big deal.

*note* I am an Insurance Wanker and it goes against the grain to believe anyone about anything until they prove it!  

[dave]

I don't think that its too much to ask that when someone who's until now only done a few 8as, and no 8a+s, does a very saught after 8b that some "proof", for want of a better word, be supplied. even if its just spotters coming forward to verify etc. afterall you're talking about a problem that took jerry years of work to do, no-one else has repeated it quickly, and even dave "possibly the best climber in the world" graham has been here at the same sorta time that scott was on it and not done it.

lets just clear this up. we're talking a lad who looking at his scorecard prior to july this year had never done an 8a. he's just done the ace in a session. having flashed the joker with presumably a different sequence from what you'd have to use on the ace, that means its more or less the same as doing the ace in a single session without having done the joker first. this is an acheivement so monumental that it makes moses parting the red sea look like a party trick. also having flashed deliverance, brad pit and the joker. Frankly this guy is the biggest thing happening in british bouldering right now, you don't just fluke your way up 8b, its massive massive massive news, so no its not a lot to ask for some backup from mates, spotters, whatever.

(i would like to say i've never met scott and have no reason especially to doubt him or otherwise).

[Carnage]

We are also talking about someone who has apparently only been climbing for two years. Two years to 8B, fuck me. I'd like to know his secret!

[Fiend]

Hmmm. This doubting is all a bit unsavoury but Dave does put it in a fair perspective. However it's not the same as Si O'Bollox, hell I see Scott around every other wall session.

Incidentally from my uninformed perspective, Paul B seemed to come out of nowhere when he climbed something pretty damn hard. How things seem from the outside and all...

[a dense loner]

for what it's worth i'm sorry but your post saying a friend of mine is a beast and he says scott must be telling the truth is at best the most pathetic argument i have ever heard. as the advert says "trust is earnt". you guys can't even post nonsense logically.

if tyler was to say i've just done this 8b in a session any sane person would say nice one ty, he already has the track record to say it's entirely plausible and he probably found it completely piss

r-man what are you talking about with regards to people videoing themselves? that was merely one way of proving a point. the internet has not gone mad, it's entirely sane in asking a person with no track record for a bit of proof

this is only going to begin to look like a witchhunt if you people who don't actually know anything keep posting gibberish. there is no argument here, just something that can be put to rest with a few sentences by the man involved. i have heard tonight that scott is a bit upset by some things that have been said on the web, well why not nip them in the bud? welcome to the machine

if scott doesn't feel it necessary to get a lift out with dobbin i will buy a tandem so that we are both warm by the time we get there

 

[a dense loner]

i'm sorry fiend but your post on paul b coming from out of nowhere is not true. maybe you didn't know of him but paul was always very strong. that's coming from a witness who has seen a few strong people. ok he's really weak as a kitten on laxatives, but climbing wise he was/is strong

[Fj]

oh so because you didnt know Scott when he 'came out of nowhere' we have a witchhunt, but because you knew Paul when he was an underground beast its different?

[nik at work]

That's precisely Fiends point Dense. As far as he knew Paul came out of nowhere cranking big numbers from his perspective. You saying he's a beast is just the same as Drew a few posts back who said Scott was a beast and you just totally discounted him. Why shouldn't Fiend do the same to you? From my perspective Paul came out of nowhere also, but I don't doubt anything he's done. Paul I'm sorry I hope you don't think I'm singling you out again (along with my various training jibes ) I could just have easily used 90% of the posters on this forum it's just that Fiend mentioned you.

Anyway fucking awesome effort Scott I am totally staggered by this performance.

Lets not have this turn into the same bitter rubbish we've had in the past it does nobody any favours...

[Carnage]

There's coming from nowhere and then theres coming from nowhere in 2 years. I think in climbing we take  alot on trust but but occassionaly when circumstances dictate I think it perfectly acceptable to ask for proof. Call it quality control if you like.

I'll be perfectly honest and say I'm gobsmacked that that anyone can go to such a standard in such a short time and this is the stuff of zero to hero movies. For me, I'd love to know how it was done.

[Drew]

There's coming from nowhere and then there's coming from nowhere in 2 years.

From here

Dave Graham... started climbing in 1997 at the age of 16. Within a year he had climbed the US grade of 5.14a (F8b+)

Whilst UKC may not be the World's authority, it's possible they got it right.

[Carnage]

Fair enough - Maybe he's one of the anomalies - A 'natural' if you will.

I still want to see 2 years of training squeezed into a montage on youtube.   

[account_inactive]

Was Dave climbing Font 8b in 2 years?

[sasscotty]

OK guys! this really isn't cool 

I did do the ace in a 3 hour session, I have pictures, but no videos. I'm just not sure what to do with them yet?!? I'm not really down with the whole promoting myself thing. I haven't been climbing 2 years, I have been climbing 3 years next month. My recent ticks are massive achievements for me and I have never felt so good about myself or my climbing. I didn't think there would be so much bad karma knocking about.

but anyways thanks for the positive comments 

[Carnage]

Its not bad karma - Simply that when something extraordinary happens (and I would class this achievment so), people will ask for proof.

Good on ya for the send and for standing up and responding.

[andy popp]

If we can't maintain trust as our default position then I think we're a little bit fucked.

Well done Scott.

[BenF]

If we can't maintain trust as our default position then I think we're a little bit fucked.

Well done Scott.

Well said Andy.  "Trust as a default" is I think how we'd all prefer climbing to stay.  So let's trust Scott and hope he continues to make such amazing ascents (even if for no other reason than to give people faith in trust as the default).

[nik at work]

If we can't maintain trust as our default position then I think we're a little bit fucked.

Well done Scott.

My sentiments expessed much better than I could manage.

[dave]

the problem with trust as the default position is that its open to abuse, and that has been exploited in the past. Thus people are reticent to take everything on face value anymore. its not ideal but its the world we live in. Aside from sponsorship etc theres still the matter of historical accuracy which I think is crucially important. I'd rather have the situation where questions are asked and queries are cleared up even if it might cause some short-term faceache, it'll all be water under the bridge eventually and those up for scrutiny will pass through the eye of the trust needle unscathed. The alternative is either have our guidebooks' history sections full of phoney ascents, or just loads of mistrust simmering under the surface for months and years. I'm sure everyone would agree that repeats of the john dunne and ben heason episodes are something we don't want to see played out again every few years.

Hopefully scott can take this in and see there's no ill feeling, its just the nature of the game these days. I'm sure in 6 months time after a winter of verifiable big ticks it'll become clear that this is all above board and the was nowt to worry about, but at least we know then that questions were asked and answered, and everyone can hold their heads high.

As a final note, I'm sure everyone will recall the hysteria when scouse came from nowhere and claimed a world #2 on the powerball. The guys on the powerball forum wanted to see video and validate the speeds. this is the same thing.

[nik at work]

There's nothing wrong with seeking some evidence. Perhaps it is the manner in which it is undertaken. Compare and contrast:

"I'm not saying X hasn't done this ascent but I saw him at the start of summer and there was no way he was 8b crush strong. Is there any evidence, photos, videos, witnesses. I hope this guy is straight up."

or

"Great effort X, that is a seriously impressive tick. Did you get any photos?"

Both are asking the same question, but one plants the seed of doubt whilst the other doesn't. The latter takes a standpoint of trust, the former doesn't.

Just to reiterate I am totally blown away by these amazing efforts, well done.