Is there some unwritten rule where nothing's allowed to be harder than 8b on slate? This "8b, hard 8b, top end 8b" etc bollocks sounds like it is just that. I would wager that both these amazing looking routes are at least 8b+. In fact wasn't The New Slatesman described as a 7c with a 7C+ boulder problem on top of it? That doesn't sound like 8b to me. It was also mentioned as being "considerably harder" than other 8b routes - so that'll be 8b+ then. I get why people dont want to be seen to be overgrading but there has to be a point when you move things up a grade or it just gets silly. Great to see stuff like this getting done, whatever the grade.
Well this much more like it, proper debate.8b? I can't say much about that personally (close on t/rope one time...but not enough). How many 8b's on slate are there? 2 confirmed: Bungle's Arete, T V B & T V S (oddly Dawes used to say that this was 8b+ in pinks, 8c in any other boot; but it's settled @ 8b+). Then there's The Serpent's Vein 8b (another voice suggests differently) & now Sauron 8b (both unrepeated) and of course, New Slatesman 8b. So whilst the first two routes have seen fair action, by the pair doing the moving and shaking (Pete/Caff), no-one has touched the rest.
Now this is a style of photography that I really approve of. The climber has less opportunity to use it to massage his ego (striated muscle tissue etc..) as he is shown w/ in the context of his greater environment. The best example of this is a liitle more extreme and it's one of the shots in One for the Crow. It's of JR on the main wall or pinnacle and he is barely there. It's not real of course, it's a set up on an ab' rope but nevertheless one would find it hard to see it as a posed image.(I'll break some CP in a mo' and provide the pic, JR won't care and if he moans I'm give him a Chinese burn later )
Quote from: Houdini on March 06, 2008, 03:32:32 pmNow this is a style of photography that I really approve of. The climber has less opportunity to use it to massage his ego (striated muscle tissue etc..) as he is shown w/ in the context of his greater environment. The best example of this is a liitle more extreme and it's one of the shots in One for the Crow. It's of JR on the main wall or pinnacle and he is barely there. It's not real of course, it's a set up on an ab' rope but nevertheless one would find it hard to see it as a posed image.(I'll break some CP in a mo' and provide the pic, JR won't care and if he moans I'm give him a Chinese burn later ) It doesn't really tell you much about the climbing though does it? I prefer pics that show you the style or type of climbing that the route has to offer, that way its inspring.
but unfortunately, much climbing photography now is a totally bastard hybrid of the staged masquerading as reportage, having the worst faults of both and little of that which makes either valuable.
It doesn't really tell you much about the climbing though does it? I prefer pics that show you the style or type of climbing that the route has to offer, that way its inspring.
Quote from: Paul B on March 06, 2008, 04:45:51 pmIt doesn't really tell you much about the climbing though does it? I prefer pics that show you the style or type of climbing that the route has to offer, that way its inspring.Your quote seems out of place w/ what this picture depicts. A man making moves on an arete/wall climb on classic mountain Cloggy rock. What could be more obvious?I know what you mean though Paul_ as I know what is more obvious: you mean shots that show the cross-through into the high-step to the undercut.Arithmetic as opposed to poetry? Fair do's. Different strokes . . .
My apologies too Paul, I thought you meant the Cloggy pic. Still like the sense of scale in the Sauron shot tho'.
You pair are bumming my brain